v Cardiff City (a) 10/4/21 - Into the Valley(s)

[Sparks Rover]

2 minutes ago, Roverinbelfast said:

Probably another ban coming my way lol

I think there is a bit of provocation involved to be fair..

Free the Belfast One....

Edited April 11, 2021 by Sparks Rover

[Roverinbelfast]

Back to the game. Something struck me at full-time today. We will definitely loose arma in the summer. Fee probably 15 - 20 million. How the hell do we replace his goals. Gally up top at long last maybe? Or big Ben to finally show his worth 

[Sparks Rover]

Just now, Roverinbelfast said:

Back to the game. Something struck me at full-time today. We will definitely loose arma in the summer. Fee probably 15 - 20 million. How the hell do we replace his goals. Gally up top at long last maybe? Or big Ben to finally show his worth 

Depends who the manager is i suppose.  My worry is how many subs we make each game....like, he virtually changes the front 4 and the right back every game.....I checked, other teams we have played recently haven't made as many as us.  

Its completely the wrong way to manage 

[AllRoverAsia]

I'm here because it's 8.10 am and I slept through the match.

Question: is it worth watching in full or just extended highlights.

[Aqualung]

1 minute ago, AllRoverAsia said:

I'm here because it's 8.10 am and I slept through the match.

Question: is it worth watching in full or just extended highlights.

It depends on if you are obtuse or not..... Feck me it seems the in phrase tonight. 

[Roverinbelfast]

9 minutes ago, Sparks Rover said:

Depends who the manager is i suppose.  My worry is how many subs we make each game....like, he virtually changes the front 4 and the right back every game.....I checked, other teams we have played recently haven't made as many as us.  

Its completely the wrong way to manage 

So true. Change the full attacking midfield and the RB every single game. 

The manager issue is the million dollar question. If TM goes who do we replace him with. My heart says Hughes my brain says another Coyle cheap option 

[Butty]

8 hours ago, BlackburnEnd75 said:

Rhodes was certainly not hated. Not rated by some but never hated.

He was a very limited player, just so happened that the thing he was limited to was the thing that wins you games.

I agree, Rhodes will always hold a place in Rovers fans hearts for the sheer amount of goals he scored here. A top professional and a top man. 

[OldEwoodBlue]

7 hours ago, Roverinbelfast said:

The manager issue is the million dollar question. If TM goes who do we replace him with. My heart says Hughes my brain says another Coyle cheap option 

Well that's exactly what we have now. In fact he's far worse than Coyle. 8 points vs 16 points worse.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

13 hours ago, Exiled_Rover said:

I wish our other strikers were allowed to play centrally.

He's ruined Brereton an Gallagher by shoving them out wide. 

The fact he'd rather play Dolan / Buckley / Elliot as a false 9 then either of our 6'+ strikers says it all about Mowbray.

I think it says more about the goal scoring abilities of Brererton and Gallagher.

[Dreams of 1995]

3 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I think it says more about the goal scoring abilities of Brererton and Gallagher.

In fairness Tyrone Gally got 17 goals for us playing up top in a shite Coyle squad. He hasn’t had a decent spell up top with traditional wingers under Mowbray. 
 

As for Brereton well I don’t think he’s a striker but he’s not a winger either is he. Unsure what he’s bringing at the moment but he’s shown glimpses of a player earlier in the season. A better manager might get a tune out of him. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

That was a while back, Gally’s not done much since wherever he’s been. If you had a time machine would you still go back and sign him ? I agree if you are going to play him it’s right up front or nothing, asking him to play out wide is crazy, he hasn’t got the tools. I’d like to see him and Armstrong together up front just once with somebody out wide who can put a ball in and a midfield player who can pick an incisive pass now and again.

I don’t hold out any hope for Big Ben.

[Sparks Rover]

14 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

If you had a time machine would you still go back and sign him ? I .

Fook me no chance.  Nobody in their right mind would 

[Richard Oakley]

9 hours ago, Roverinbelfast said:

So true. Change the full attacking midfield and the RB every single game. 

The manager issue is the million dollar question. If TM goes who do we replace him with. My heart says Hughes my brain says another Coyle cheap option 

Remember, it's When Mowbray goes ...

If results don't go our way, next Sunday at 5pm, we could find ourselves involved in the scrap for the final relegation spot and Mowbray's already failed to do that once, so you'd think he'd have to go and Venkys bring forward their review. That assumes they don't want us in League 1, of course.

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

That was a while back, Gally’s not done much since wherever he’s been. If you had a time machine would you still go back and sign him ? I agree if you are going to play him it’s right up front or nothing, asking him to play out wide is crazy, he hasn’t got the tools. I’d like to see him and Armstrong together up front just once with somebody out wide who can put a ball in and a midfield player who can pick an incisive pass now and again.

I don’t hold out any hope for Big Ben.

No you wouldn't espicsally that Mowbray would play him out wide most of the time. Why not sign a wide player instead? 

But Mowbray messed up massively on his 2 biggest signings. He wanted Gallagher in our 1st season back at this level but he couldn;t agree terms so he looked at other options like Brereton. He should have bought a quality centre back, left side midfielder and back up striker. Mention 3 players we could have got for the same money as we paid for Brereton. 

I would like to see Gallagher and Armstrong up front together but Mowbray will never do it as its against his preferred way of playing.

 

15 hours ago, Exiled_Rover said:

I wish our other strikers were allowed to play centrally.

He's ruined Brereton an Gallagher by shoving them out wide. 

 

He isn't ruined Brereton by playing him wide as I think hes played a wide role in a front 3. 

But Gallagher he has deffo ruined him completely by playing him wide

[Sparks Rover]

37 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

But Gallagher he has deffo ruined him completely by playing him wide

Not really, the lad has a very poor first touch, no technical ability from what i see and for someone his size doesn't win many headers.  His decision making is very poor.

Mowbray should take the flak for signing him, but he was already shit.

[@roverseas]

A good point, is it enough?  Not yet.  But getting closer.  Just want our status secure.  Happy to see Arma score some goals as they equal $$$$$ right now!  The more goals the more moola!

 

 

[roversfan99]

1 in 15, pathetic as we all know.

Most of the criticism again towards the only reason we got a point, and the only reason that we arent destined for relegation. Makes no sense to me.

[joey_big_nose]

14 hours ago, AllRoverAsia said:

I'm here because it's 8.10 am and I slept through the match.

Question: is it worth watching in full or just extended highlights.

I just watched back the full 90.

Definitely out best performance in a while. Hit the woodwork 3 times, dominated the ball. It's ridiculous we didn't win based on the chances we created.

But then again we gave away the second goal for nothing and looked brittle on the rare occasions Cardiff did come forward. We could easily have lost.

So I guess watch the full 90 as it's good to see us actually play some decent football. But also you won't learn anything new as it's basically the same approach.

 

 

 

Edited April 11, 2021 by joey_big_nose

[roversfan99]

22 hours ago, Stuart said:

It’s not hate, it’s his strike rate combined with our awful form and league position.

He plays for himself. If you can’t see that you must not be watching.

If we are to progress we need Mowbray gone and a different remit to, or sale of, Armstrong.

Ideally we will get a large fee before he ends up injured or able to run his contract down. Not sure Mowbray has made a fee on a single player though? Was the Raya fee ever published?

Thankfully, him playing for himself has consistently benefitted us throughout the season with goals that wouldnt have been scored otherwise by the sorry supporting cast. 

[tomphil]

17 hours ago, Boroblue said:

The worst about him he complains that a state of the art category one academy is not good enough for his ideas. ( the guy who couldn’t convince the owners of chesterfield to employ him). He then wants to play a-possession game but to prove his point re the training facilities fucks the ewood pitch up by training on that. 

I cant wait to see the next job he gets because he as moaned about cat 1 facilities let’s see how he does at port vale or Northampton because if he’s lucky that’s where he’s heading.

Hes is not an unpleasant fella great for a pint on a Friday for s chat football but a bag of shite manager. Four years and can’t find a best 11. Even with great facilities,money and a youth academy complains about luck.

In the old adage a bad workman always blames his tools.

Best description yet, the man would blame the air quality if he could get away with it. He's moaned about just about every facet of the club as a reason for never pushing the team on.

God knows how he coped at Coventry with naff all.  Even his beloved Boro where he's well thought of saw through him after a few years.

[AllRoverAsia]

1 hour ago, joey_big_nose said:

I just watched back the full 90.

Definitely out best performance in a while. Hit the woodwork 3 times, dominated the ball. It's ridiculous we didn't win based on the chances we created.

But then again we gave away the second goal for nothing and looked brittle on the rare occasions Cardiff did come forward. We could easily have lost.

So I guess watch the full 90 as it's good to see us actually play some decent football. But also you won't learn anything new as it's basically the same approach.

Thanks for the guidance.

I didn't have time today but we have Songkran coming here so will then instead of getting wet.

I did watch the short highlights to see the goals.

[bazza]

16 hours ago, Aqualung said:

It depends on if you are obtuse or not..... Feck me it seems the in phrase tonight. 

The word "obtuse" always reminds me of "The Shawshank Redemption"; an important moment in the film.

[Stuart]

59 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Thankfully, him playing for himself has consistently benefitted us throughout the season with goals that wouldnt have been scored otherwise by the sorry supporting cast. 

I’d prefer he was a team player. Maybe if just 10% of those other 140 one-eyed shots that didn’t result in a goal had been assists or at least looked up for an option. He just keeps his head down and shoots.

Looking at the stats...

Armstrong’s goals making a difference:

v QPR turned a draw into a win +2

v Barnsley draw to win +2

v Millwall draw to win +2

v Rotherham draw to win +2

v Luton draw to win +2

v Cardiff defeat to draw +1

v Forest missed penalty cost us a point -1

Only one of those matches (Luton) was a 1-0 win which means a team mate also scored.

Total +10

 

Points with Armstrong’s goals disallowed:

v Wycombe we still won +3

v Derby +3

v Coventry +3

v Preston +3

v Birmingham +3

Total +15

Of course these stats are as oversimplified as the argument that we have been totally reliant on his goals but it goes to show that we are not devoid of hope without Armstrong’s goals. He scores when the team is playing well and when the team is playing well we still score without him, and none of his penalties have been decisive - except one of the three (in the league) he missed.

We are devoid of hope because our manager cannot get the best out of any of his players but his pet project.

A different striker may even have been a better asset to the team all round, as other players would not have been moved around and dropped to the detriment of the team and their own development. Although I accept this would have needed a different manager.

Armstrong has been good for Armstrong (and to a lesser extent Mowbray). He direct influence on our league position assumes that nobody else could have scored decisive goals.

[roversfan99]

3 minutes ago, Stuart said:

I’d prefer he was a team player. Maybe if just 10% of those other 140 one-eyed shots that didn’t result in a goal had been assists or at least looked up for an option. He just keeps his head down and shoots.

Looking at the stats...

Armstrong’s goals making a difference:

v QPR turned a draw into a win +2

v Barnsley draw to win +2

v Millwall draw to win +2

v Rotherham draw to win +2

v Luton draw to win +2

v Cardiff defeat to draw +1

v Forest missed penalty cost us a point -1

Only one of those matches (Luton) was a 1-0 win which means a team mate also scored.

Total +10

 

Points with Armstrong’s goals disallowed:

v Wycombe we still won +3

v Derby +3

v Coventry +3

v Preston +3

v Birmingham +3

Total +15

Of course these stats are as oversimplified as the argument that we have been totally reliant on his goals but it goes to show that we are not devoid of hope without Armstrong’s goals. He scores when the team is playing well and when the team is playing well we still score without him, and none of his penalties have been decisive - except one of the three (in the league) he missed.

We are devoid of hope because our manager cannot get the best out of any of his players but his pet project.

A different striker may even have been a better asset to the team all round, as other players would not have been moved around and dropped to the detriment of the team and their own development. Although I accept this would have needed a different manager.

Armstrong has been good for Armstrong (and to a lesser extent Mowbray). He direct influence on our league position assumes that nobody else could have scored decisive goals.

You place too much on the assumption that a sorry list of players would step up and score those goals. I see no evidence that they would or could, either from their Rovers career or their career prior.

I just find it strange that in a match thread of a game in which he scored 2 goals, there are so many posts from yourself and others solely criticising him, never acknowldging his value or how his goals earnt us a point. You cannot bring yourself to admit that even if his goals benefit himself or indeed the manager, they benefit us too. Hes the only striker who is criticised for his misses more than praised for his goals.

The manager needs replacing but to make out that his sole game plan is to get Armstrongs goals tally up even if that is in spite of points is just agenda driven nonsense. Armstrong is far from perfect but his goals are a positive in a shitty season. 

[Stuart]

1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

You place too much on the assumption that a sorry list of players would step up and score those goals. I see no evidence that they would or could, either from their Rovers career or their career prior.

I just find it strange that in a match thread of a game in which he scored 2 goals, there are so many posts from yourself and others solely criticising him, never acknowldging his value or how his goals earnt us a point. You cannot bring yourself to admit that even if his goals benefit himself or indeed the manager, they benefit us too. Hes the only striker who is criticised for his misses more than praised for his goals.

The manager needs replacing but to make out that his sole game plan is to get Armstrongs goals tally up even if that is in spite of points is just agenda driven nonsense. Armstrong is far from perfect but his goals are a positive in a shitty season. 

I can only speak for myself but that’s because I see his ‘promotion’ to CF as being a direct cause of our lack of shape, team ethic, performances and results.

It’s also sorry excuse for Mowbray’s failure to recruit well and subsequent failure to develop the two strikers that he did buy.

The fact it is the match thread is just an organic thing rather than a deliberate attempt to undermine his two goals yesterday.