Holding the management to account

[47er]

2 hours ago, Beafo said:

I know of people who have stopped using this site for thst reason.

And i know people who've followed Rovers for decades and don't go anymore.

You'd be better concentrating your concern on them.

[Armchair supporter supremo]

2 hours ago, MCMC1875 said:

...and which group do you belong to?

as my board name suggests! im just one of those knobheads that rarely goes to games these days and just likes to criticise from afar🙈🙈 (well not that far, i live just minutes walk from the ground) 

[Tom]

3 hours ago, Herbie6590 said:

FWIW This viewpoint has also been shared with me on many occasions. 

Whilst I agree to a degree (I decree), there is also an element on Twitter where there is an almost passive aggressive element of hyper positivity and sneering at anyone who questions things (the London based journo for example but I’m not convinced it’s not intended to be a wind up)

There is a middle ground which I imagine most people fall into 

[RevidgeBlue]

10 hours ago, steelcityblue said:

Context is everything. Read it back. For what it’s worth I think the manager is honest, speaks from the heart, loves football and does his best for the club. He is also flawed, hampered by his circumstances and makes mistakes. Would I be devastated if he left? No. Am I agitating for him to be removed? No. And I think that probably puts me roughly in the middle of Rovers fans opinion overall, which I read a lot of because I love anything to do with the Rovers. Obviously that doesn’t sit well on here but is nonetheless true ( as you pointed out) and all I was aiming for was a degree of humility and recognition of the fact on here. ASS rather made the point for me in terms of the prevalent attitude to alternative opinions. 

Drives me crazy when people say Mowbray has been "hampered by his circumstances."

They're ENTIRELY of his own making!

How many football league managers would have given their right arm for the sort of backing Mowbray's had since he's been here? The majority I'd guess.

Also whilst it's not a competition, how long have you been supporting the Club? I doubt many pre Jack Walker supporters who have seen the Club perform well on the pitch under far more testing financial circumstances would be that impressed by the last three seasons.

 

 

 

[RevidgeBlue]

3 hours ago, Herbie6590 said:

FWIW This viewpoint has also been shared with me on many occasions. 

However, on the pitch we continue to flounder, the recruitment appears to be a joke and most of our better players look set to walk out for nothing at the end of the season.

Someone must be right and someone must be wrong.

[rigger]

22 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

However, on the pitch we continue to flounder, the recruitment appears to be a joke and most of our better players look set to walk out for nothing at the end of the season.

Someone must be right and someone must be wrong.

Einstein was right, and was then proven wrong.

[RevidgeBlue]

2 minutes ago, rigger said:

Einstein was right, and was then proven wrong.

Wasn't aware of that, I'll bow to your knowledge of quantum physics.

[rigger]

21 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Wasn't aware of that, I'll bow to your knowledge of quantum physics.

He said that the universe was a constant size and always had been. It is now been proved that it is constantly getting larger. Therefore it used to be smaller, ( the basis of the big bang theory ). 

[Hasta]

As a generalisation, I think the older you are the more you have seen of a well-run football club at Ewood. Therefore the more of a shambles you think we currently are.

If you've only got into Rovers in the last 12 years we've either been for sale with little investment, or under Venky ownership. This younger generation haven't witnessed the decline. The currrent level we are at is as good as they have known, and they want to spend more time watching, travelling and supporting the club and not bitching about managers and management. 

 

Edited September 4, 2021 by Hasta

[Ulrich]

1 hour ago, rigger said:

He said that the universe was a constant size and always had been. It is now been proved that it is constantly getting larger. Therefore it used to be smaller, ( the basis of the big bang theory ). 

So he got one wrong, how many did he get right?

[Armchair supporter supremo]

2 hours ago, Hasta said:

As a generalisation, I think the older you are the more you have seen of a well-run football club at Ewood. Therefore the more of a shambles you think we currently are.

If you've only got into Rovers in the last 12 years we've either been for sale with little investment, or under Venky ownership. This younger generation haven't witnessed the decline. The currrent level we are at is as good as they have known, and they want to spend more time watching, travelling and supporting the club and not bitching about managers and management. 

 

Great point tbf. there is now pretty much a whole generation of fans that will have no personal memories from the pre Venky era/s

I was spoilt myself as a child-teen by growing up right through the Jack walker Era and only having a couple of vague memories from before that. 

But I did also see the 'inbetween era' when the walker trust and John Williams was keeping us afloat with excellent club management right throughout the club and on a minimal budget! although they did have the best foundations to work from thanks to Jack walkers investments. 

Edited September 4, 2021 by Armchair supporter supremo

[matt83]

4 hours ago, Hasta said:

As a generalisation, I think the older you are the more you have seen of a well-run football club at Ewood. Therefore the more of a shambles you think we currently are.

If you've only got into Rovers in the last 12 years we've either been for sale with little investment, or under Venky ownership. This younger generation haven't witnessed the decline. The currrent level we are at is as good as they have known, and they want to spend more time watching, travelling and supporting the club and not bitching about managers and management. 

 

This is a very good point.

Generally I think if people look at the last 10 years and think the owners have been good for rovers, waggott is going ok and Mowbray is solid then they’re either thick, don’t think about what’s happening to rovers or don’t care beyond filling 3-5 on a Saturday afternoon.

But there probably is a solid swathe of fans who have grown up only knowing it’s shambles and merely want to support their local club as passionately as possible. 👏👏👏 to them I suppose. (That said I didn’t witness or have grown up after historical events such as an extreme example of Hitler to know they were an abomination). But to those of us of an age and level of intelligence to know better about the terminal decline of rovers and yet still peddle the everything is great line. FUCK YOU. 

Edited September 4, 2021 by matt83

[Bad Boy]

21 hours ago, steelcityblue said:

So maybe some humility about the prospect that BRFCS doesn’t have a monopoly on attitude would be appropriate?

 No? I didn’t think so 

Exactly.  Sadly alternative views like yours are dissed.  So much for a democracy 🙈

[K-Hod]

There is room for everyone’s views on football here, no matter what people say.

If people choose not to post, because they felt ‘hounded out’ or whatever, then tbh, whilst it is a real shame that people feel that way, ultimately, that’s on them.
‘You can’t please all the people all of the time’ as a famous Jamaican singer once said.
To me, if you believe in the strength of your beliefs, then what does it matter if lots of strangers disagree on a forum?

 

[matt83]

16 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

There is room for everyone’s views on football here, no matter what people say.

If people choose not to post, because they felt ‘hounded out’ or whatever, then tbh, whilst it is a real shame that people feel that way, ultimately, that’s on them.
‘You can’t please all the people all of the time’ as a famous Jamaican singer once said.
To me, if you believe in the strength of your beliefs, then what does it matter if lots of strangers disagree on a forum?

 

Absolutely. People should feel free to express their opinion in all walks of life. No matter how stupid they are. But I stand by if people can’t see the destruction the Venkys and co have done and are doing over the last decade. They are either:

1 thick

2 ignorant

3 don’t care

But I certainly don’t want anyone hounded out or insulted. By all means anyone out there who feels the Venkys et al have been great and don’t consider themselves thick, ignorant or ambivalent to rovers’ plight feel free to enlighten me?

 

[booth]

12 hours ago, Beafo said:

I very rarely comment on here but read a lot.

Most of what is written aligns with my views.

However, it often comes across to me that any other opinions in the fan base are sneered at as though they are from less intelligent/clued up supporters.

I know of people who have stopped using this site for thst reason.

A bad thing?

It's not really clued up to see that Mowbray has done a poor job.

Praise him all you like for steadying the ship but he's done a good job of unsteadying it. At any other club, after spending the money he's had, and the quite frankly baffling decisions he's made on and off the pitch, he'd be out of a job.

I've seen some daft comments about us getting promoted to the Premier League since we signed a league 1 full back. Am I really unkind saying that's "daft". It's just common sense that losing a 29 goal striker and bringing in only one permanent signing, a league 1 full back who is being paraded around like a star signing, isn't going to turn us into play off candidates overnight. But for some that's all it takes, it's daft talk.

I hope we get lucky but history and basic sanity would tell me otherwise.

[RoversClitheroe]

48 minutes ago, booth said:

A bad thing?

It's not really clued up to see that Mowbray has done a poor job.

Praise him all you like for steadying the ship but he's done a good job of unsteadying it. At any other club, after spending the money he's had, and the quite frankly baffling decisions he's made on and off the pitch, he'd be out of a job.

I've seen some daft comments about us getting promoted to the Premier League since we signed a league 1 full back. Am I really unkind saying that's "daft". It's just common sense that losing a 29 goal striker and bringing in only one permanent signing, a league 1 full back who is being paraded around like a star signing, isn't going to turn us into play off candidates overnight. But for some that's all it takes, it's daft talk.

I hope we get lucky but history and basic sanity would tell me otherwise.

Spot on, and in regards to different views I think they are accepted, however in my opinion Mowbray and Waggott are doing an awful job.

Hats off to people like @Bigdoggsteelwho initially got a lot of back chat stayed strong and now has views that are largely accepted.

[Bigdoggsteel]

1 minute ago, RoversClitheroe said:

Spot on, and in regards to different views I think they are accepted, however in my opinion Mowbray and Waggott are doing an awful job.

Hats off to people like @Bigdoggsteelwho initially got a lot of back chat stayed strong and now has views that are largely accepted.

Thanks ,but I backed him up until about half way through last season. There were a good few that wanted him out before that, but then again some wanted him out after the League 1 season! 

[Darrenbot]

If people don't like people disagreeing with them on here then instead of leaving the board just put everybody on ignore like Chaddy has done with me and many others 😀 

[DE.]

During my time as a mod here I've never seen anything to suggest alternative views are censored or in any way discouraged by the people in charge of the site or by the moderators. I also can't recall many posters suggesting BRFCS has "a monopoly on attitude". I think it's generally accepted that the forum represents a minority view when compared to the wider fanbase. In fact a lot of the frustration expressed on here stems directly from that fact being largely acknowledged.

From what I've seen on FB/Twitter there is quite strong pushback on opinions that are critical of the club in any form. I think it's important that a place exists which allows for more critical views to be aired in a reasonable fashion, which also offers some anonymity for people uncomfortable with their real names/identities being disclosed as is generally the case on the likes of Facebook. 

I wouldn't want anybody on here to feel discouraged about posting a reasonable alternative view or opinion about the way the club is run, and if a poster feels like they are being hounded or being made to feel uncomfortable about posting their views (assuming those views are well expressed and not deliberately antagonistic) then personally I'm always willing to talk about it via PM. As far as I'm concerned any view on the club, expressed in a civil manner, is welcome on here. 

[booth]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Thanks ,but I backed him up until about half way through last season. There were a good few that wanted him out before that, but then again some wanted him out after the League 1 season! 

It was the year after being promoted for me. He deserved his time in the championship but I could see he was sleepwalking through the job. The Brereton signing was mystifying at the time as we badly needed a defence. And he was holding onto players that were clearly league 1 standard. Frustrating times and at the time people were saying, well he's building for the future... The future is here and it's still frustrating being a Blackburn Rovers fan.

Ps, that was 2018, the defense is still wobbly and we're heading towards 2022 without a striker that he's willing to play in the correct position. How much has he spent?

Edited September 4, 2021 by booth

[lraC]

On 01/09/2021 at 14:07, Miller11 said:

I’ve recently rejoined the Rovers Trust board. We had a board meeting last week were all these things were discussed, amongst other issues. Clearly the Trust needs to be a lot more active and visible - this will come. We are working on a number of things, and this thread and the ideas are now being shared with the board.

Trust hat off, this is me speaking personally… I’m infuriated by the clubs total disregard for the rules around fan consultations, and I’m going way back before COVID here. They have never fully met the standards set out by the EFL, and it’s only the toothless nature of, and reluctance to accept any responsibility by the EFL that has prevented punishment against the club for their failings.

As a start, fans could individually pressure the club into holding the proper, inclusive meetings with the owners or their representatives twice annually as they are duty bound to do. Of course the second part is getting organised and enough people there willing to ask tough questions, rather than being happy to be regaled by Mowbray (who shouldn’t even be there).

 

Trust hat back on… there are moves taking place. I don’t want to sound like Waggott with the whole “we will look into it”, but the ideas outlined here will be taken on board. We need to be far more open in our activities and let our members know exactly what’s going on - I’ll strive to ensure that happens.

It’s great to know you are back on the Trust Duncan. It needs someone like you to really make a difference and it feels like, this could now start to make a difference.

The owners have been getting away with killing the club for far too long and it is about time, the gloves came off and there were involved in a real fight. 

[Gone to seed]

21 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Drives me crazy when people say Mowbray has been "hampered by his circumstances."

They're ENTIRELY of his own making!

How many football league managers would have given their right arm for the sort of backing Mowbray's had since he's been here? The majority I'd guess.

Also whilst it's not a competition, how long have you been supporting the Club? I doubt many pre Jack Walker supporters who have seen the Club perform well on the pitch under far more testing financial circumstances would be that impressed by the last three seasons.

 

 

 

I'm firmly in this group, having been brought up on regular visits to Ewood Park under Bobby Saxton, Howard Kendal, Jim Smith, Gordon Lee, Don Mackay and the like. The key factor for me is the dismantling of any real local interest or affinity within the local senior management team. The arsehole currently masquerading as Chief Executive wouldn't have had a nanosecond's attention from anyone under the likes of Bill Fox, or John Williams, and would be nowhere near the top table (except maybe to sweep up after a game). Until there is a locally oriented, Rovers-obsessed and committed management structure back in place, I'm afraid the club will remain in the doldrums and supporters will continue to be treated like an inconvenient afterthought, akin to a verruca, by the shameful morons who are running our club into the ground.

Nearly vomited when I saw this... https://www.walmsleywilkinson.com/news-and-insights/interviews/inspiring-leaders-steve-waggott-ceo-blackburn-rovers/ 

UN FUCKING BELIEVEABLE!!

[Gav]

12 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Thanks ,but I backed him up until about half way through last season. There were a good few that wanted him out before that, but then again some wanted him out after the League 1 season! 

I've long given over caring who the manager and CEO are, but I did have a particular dislike of Coyle who told porkies in his very 1st press conference about SEM and it never improved from the day on, that man was robbing a living. I don't think its any coincidence he's now managing in the Indian Super League either.....

Coyle was appointed because he was cheap, cheaper than Warnock who won promotion with Cardiff the year after I think it was.

Mowbray is here because he's cheap, Waggot is here because he's also cheap in football CEO terms, I know plenty of local CEO's on more money than he is, you pay peanuts you get monkeys.

We signed no strikers in the window because we're skint and the owners want to do it on the cheap. Players are out of contract because we're skint and we want to do everything on the cheap. We have no European scout because we're skint, we want to do everything on the cheap, the ground looks neglected because we're skint, we want to do everything on the cheap. The club shop is closed a week before the season kicks off, full of new shirts, because we're skint and they want to everything on the cheap, I could go on......

Venkys out.

Edited September 5, 2021 by Gav

[Blue blood]

To me I think the biggest issue regarding supporter split is positive/negative outlook, a philosophy of stand by the club no matter what. Why? Because most critical voices have left. We have lost about 10k regular fans, presumably the majority of whom weren't happy with things. Sure there will be some glory hunters, some personal circumstances but the former probably would have left beforehand and the latter won't have seen such large numbers all in one go. 

And, imo, it's been a shower over the last 10 years, so logically a significant amount of the more critical or demanding type of fans will have gone. That leaves a significant majority with a ahem, positive outlook. 

I'm sure there must be some fans who have only known the Vs reign of terror who also shout criticism down but again I imagine a lot of these would have been connected to "positive" fans. They would be the ones most likely to bring new people along and accept the status quo. Can't remember who said it about being born after WW2 but knowing about it - think they are right and it's that principle. I imagine they would be more critical if being brought into Rovers by the BRFCS fans view. Also I can't see many coming in off their own bat - poor form, divided fan base, relegations and a huge amount of incentive to support the big 6. No, can't see too many fans coming in from a neutral view point, albeit there may be a few contributing towards this category. 

The third category of fans who may be easier on TM are distant fans. Armchair fans or those who only have a passing interest in the club. If that's the case I can imagine that they probably don't feel too hostile to TM if only taking a surface view. Listen to a few of his comments, glance at the table and it doesn't appear too bad. Lots of the issues are only when you look a bit deeper. Imagine they would have a more positive view of TM too. 

Ultimately though we need all fans, no matter our views. We have lost a ton already and if the Vs reign of terror continues I imagine it will only get worse.