England

[roverandout]

2 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

We didn’t create one real goal scoring chance in 90 minutes. The Kane goal was a bolt from the blue from 35 yards out. We had plenty of ball but the Poles were happy to let us play in front of them, we just kept running up blind alleys out wide. I take my red, white and blue glasses off when I watch England.

We were camped in their half for the whole second half.  Yes the final ball could have been better but we had chances. Grealish effort.  Philips.  They weren't clear cut but we completely controlled the half

[roversfan99]

5 minutes ago, roverandout said:

We were camped in their half for the whole second half.  Yes the final ball could have been better but we had chances. Grealish effort.  Philips.  They weren't clear cut but we completely controlled the half

Was a little similar to what happened numerous times last season when Rovers had plenty of the ball in the opponents half yet never threatened.

[AllRoverAsia]

Poland would make a decent American football team, much better with their hands and arms and body checks than with their feet.

I cannot fault their passion though which earned the equaliser.

Mind you Pickford tried his best to gift them one. That lad always has an accident in him and his hoofball clearances especially late on just gifted the ball back to Poland.

I did however enjoy what was a competitive game.

[roverandout]

Maybe I was too generous with the chances created side but we did control the game 

[Wheelton Blue]

I generally find England a dull team to watch. It's effective, but attritional in the main.

Against Poland, who would do well do finish mid table in the Prem, we didn't look like scroring and it took Kane's speculative effort to score.

We still don't possess a truly world class player.

[Oldgregg86]

Really enjoyable game and a disappointing way to finish it but overall england played really well against a good Poland side. Gaz is doing a great job and long may it continue 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Their goal showed the advantage of getting to the by line and putting in an early cross. If that had have been Sterling he would have tried to beat another defender and the chance would have gone.

[roverandout]

1 hour ago, Wheelton Blue said:

I generally find England a dull team to watch. It's effective, but attritional in the main.

Against Poland, who would do well do finish mid table in the Prem, we didn't look like scroring and it took Kane's speculative effort to score.

We still don't possess a truly world class player.

Kane is truly world class.  Walker is a top class fullback. Maguire stones are top class.  Sterling is world class.  We have plenty of young players who are potentially world class.  What is a truly world class player then? Messi? Ronaldo? If kane isn't then the likes of mbappe lukaku etc certainly aren't 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

23 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Kane is truly world class.  Walker is a top class fullback. Maguire stones are top class.  Sterling is world class.  We have plenty of young players who are potentially world class.  What is a truly world class player then? Messi? Ronaldo? If kane isn't then the likes of mbappe lukaku etc certainly aren't 

Sterling will never be world class until he develops a football brain. How many times did he lose the ball trying to take on one man too many last night ? 

[jim mk2]

29 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Kane is truly world class.  Walker is a top class fullback. Maguire stones are top class.  Sterling is world class.  We have plenty of young players who are potentially world class.  What is a truly world class player then? Messi? Ronaldo? If kane isn't then the likes of mbappe lukaku etc certainly aren't 

All these "world class" players who are never quite good enough to win anything

Club class is a better description

[benhben]

2 hours ago, Wheelton Blue said:

I generally find England a dull team to watch. It's effective, but attritional in the main.

Against Poland, who would do well do finish mid table in the Prem, we didn't look like scroring and it took Kane's speculative effort to score.

We still don't possess a truly world class player.

The first part of the post is purely down to Southgate. He has all the attacking talent he could wish for....players who in general play for progressive attack minded club sides. They well and truly have the shackles placed on them when with England. Effective in the main, but the better sides will eventually break through after which Southgate hasnt shown much of an ability to adapt mid game. 

Disagree with the last point. We have some of the worlds top players in this squad, champions league and league winners. Southgate needs to be more dynamic and use them. 

[roverandout]

2 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

All these "world class" players who are never quite good enough to win anything

Club class is a better description

By that reasoning kane isn't club class either as he's won nothing at spurs 

[K-Hod]

I’m a great defender of Sterling, but last night he regressed and went back to trying to do too much in good positions. 
Mount hasn’t had a good start to the season, but he ended the last one on fire for Chelsea.

I’d rather see Grealish where Mount is and an actual wide player out wide. 
I’d also have Foden in above anyone else (when fit, of course!)

[RoverDom]

Sterling proved me wrong a bit at the euros but is not world class. Too often he makes the wrong choice or fluffs his lines. Acting on instinct he is class but as soon as you can see he's thinking about what to do next, 9 time out of 10 it'll come to nothing. Rule of thumb is if I can see a pass you should make its already a second or two late but sterling takes another 5 seconds to make a decision after even I've seen the pass. 

[jim mk2]

14 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

I’m a great defender of Sterling, but last night he regressed and went back to trying to do too much in good positions. 
Mount hasn’t had a good start to the season, but he ended the last one on fire for Chelsea.

I’d rather see Grealish where Mount is and an actual wide player out wide. 
I’d also have Foden in above anyone else (when fit, of course!)

 Yes, Grealish in the centre all the time. I don't see what Mount has to offer to be honest

[AspRover]

Controlling the game is all well and good, but it's very safe. Pass it sideways, make a triangle and pass it between the three of you a dozen or so times, drop deep to get a touch and pass it back to the guy who passed it to you...

If you watch the highlights of, for example, Italy slaughtering Lithuania (very different calibre of opposition I know) and look at how much movement there is - forward runners, players willing to run with the ball, forward passes. England very rarely do it, even against weaker teams.

Without belittling Poland, this England team have players that they could only dream of (Lewandowski aside) and yet with however much possession we never really created a clear chance. Kane's strike was wonderful, but it came out of nothing. If he hadn't scored with a moment of individual brilliance then there is a very real chance we lose that game to a stoppage time goal, domination or no.

England need to learn to attack a bit more, or else this will become another 'golden generation' who can mix it with the best in the world but will never win a tournament.

Edited September 9, 2021 by AspRover

[roverandout]

2 hours ago, AspRover said:

Controlling the game is all well and good, but it's very safe. Pass it sideways, make a triangle and pass it between the three of you a dozen or so times, drop deep to get a touch and pass it back to the guy who passed it to you...

If you watch the highlights of, for example, Italy slaughtering Lithuania (very different calibre of opposition I know) and look at how much movement there is - forward runners, players willing to run with the ball, forward passes. England very rarely do it, even against weaker teams.

Without belittling Poland, this England team have players that they could only dream of (Lewandowski aside) and yet with however much possession we never really created a clear chance. Kane's strike was wonderful, but it came out of nothing. If he hadn't scored with a moment of individual brilliance then there is a very real chance we lose that game to a stoppage time goal, domination or no.

England need to learn to attack a bit more, or else this will become another 'golden generation' who can mix it with the best in the world but will never win a tournament.

Agree completely with the second part. But I watched Italy's previous two qualifiers.  In those games they were bereft of ideas at times. They only look impressive against teams that they've worn down.  That's there strength pressing teams to submission.  Bulgaria and Switzerland didn't lose any of their energy so they struggled to beat them.  Italy don't really have a plan b. That's why I think they struggled to beat us in the final as, even though we sat back, we never lost any energy in our performance 

[AspRover]

That's fair, I had just watched the highlights and was struck by the contrast in the moment. I hadn't really been playing very close attention to their last few games.

[USABlue]

20 hours ago, jim mk2 said:

 Yes, Grealish in the centre all the time. I don't see what Mount has to offer to be honest

I can't recall Mount really doing much for England.

[USABlue]

19 hours ago, AspRover said:

England need to learn to attack a bit more, or else this will become another 'golden generation' who can mix it with the best in the world but will never win a tournament.

We tend to be a bit like Wengers Arsenal teams at times by looking to walk the ball in.  We need to just get the ball in the middle at times, bit less of the passing around the box.  Kinda like Poland did when they scored.

  That ssid this team does show some real promise and but for 3 diabolical penalty attempts would be European champs. 

 

 

 

[Armchair supporter supremo]

and all of those memes doing the rounds of chilleni and co. getting physical..... with headings along the lines of 'at least we didn't cheat' (seriously what kind of wet wipe carrying wussies come out with this rubbish) 

 

🐂💩 i'd have loved to have seen us get stuck in like that as we used to pre 2000! then maybe at least we'd go down fighting. 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Armchair supporter supremo

[m1st]

My two pennyworth:

I agree that Southgate should have checked the team before they went out of the dressing room at the start of each half to make sure they weren't wearing a vest with a message underneath the shirt. Arguably, it's the most stupid yellow card to concede.

Also, if I can see that we needed substitutes - and I was shouting, "Get some bloody subs on!" at the TV for the last 15 minutes of the game - why couldn't Southgate? Poland were much the stronger team in that period of the game and a goal from them looked almost inevitable. Which it turned out to be.

I know that last Sunday's game was only the equivalent of a 3rd Round FA Cup-tie between the Premier League Champions and a non-League team, but I thought Bellingham was magnificent in that game. He was one of the subs I'd have introduced to Wednesday's game.

If it had been a League game with a limited number of substitutes to choose from, I'd always have him on the bench, especially when the Referee was, imo, conned into issuing an early yellow card to one of our midfielders.

[AspRover]

2 hours ago, USABlue said:

  That ssid this team does show some real promise and but for 3 diabolical penalty attempts would be European champs. 

 

Possibly, but honestly it shouldn't have come down to it. With 90 mins played the Italian centre halves (wonderful players though they are) had a combined age north of 70 and we had a bench full of fast, energetic, attacking players that could have come on and run at them for half an hour. We could (should) have tried to win that game. Southgate wanted the penalties (as proved by the eventual subs purely for the shootout), Southgate got the penalties, we lost. For all the credit he was rightly due to get a team to a final he should have faced a lot more questions about the decisions he made in that final, and if the Poland game shows anything it is that he hasn't learnt from the experience.

I stand by what I said in my previous, if we don't learn to attack a bit more when warranted we might reach semi finals, we might reach finals but we wont win them.

I think if anything the fact that this squad has so much promise and so much depth is what makes this particularly frustrating for me. Southgate is managing as though he has a very limited pool that he needs to hammer into a consistent 11 around one or two key players, it's unnecessary and stifles one of our main strengths.

Goes without saying that I'd love to be proven wrong on all of this, roll on the world cup.

Edited September 10, 2021 by AspRover
bad wording implied Southgate wanted to lose the final, edited for clarity.

[USABlue]

9 hours ago, AspRover said:

 

Possibly, but honestly it shouldn't have come down to it. With 90 mins played the Italian centre halves (wonderful players though they are) had a combined age north of 70 and we had a bench full of fast, energetic, attacking players that could have come on and run at them for half an hour. We could (should) have tried to win that game. Southgate wanted the penalties (as proved by the eventual subs purely for the shootout), Southgate got the penalties, we lost. For all the credit he was rightly due to get a team to a final he should have faced a lot more questions about the decisions he made in that final, and if the Poland game shows anything it is that he hasn't learnt from the experience.

I stand by what I said in my previous, if we don't learn to attack a bit more when warranted we might reach semi finals, we might reach finals but we wont win them.

I think if anything the fact that this squad has so much promise and so much depth is what makes this particularly frustrating for me. Southgate is managing as though he has a very limited pool that he needs to hammer into a consistent 11 around one or two key players, it's unnecessary and stifles one of our main strengths.

Goes without saying that I'd love to be proven wrong on all of this, roll on the world cup.

His other mistake was bringing on the 2 penalty.takers he intended to use way too late.  He should have given them more time to get into the game, he out a lot on their shoulders with them knowing all they were on for was to score a pen.  Massive pressure.  I think Southgate was trying to exorcise his own demons from his historic pen miss.

[roverandout]

The real positive is the majority of this squad is very young. We have about 3 players over 30. Compare that to teams like Italy Germany etc. We haven't even seen Bellingham or Greenwood bedded into this team yet and they're generational talents. Plus sancho foden yet to get a run.  I hope guardiola takes over from Southgate at some point