England

[LDRover]

There's a lot of revisionism on El Tel the England coach and this mythical total football we played under him.

He only managed us in 5 competitive games, all played at Wembley, prior to that he presided over some of the most insipid friendlies ever seen against generally poor opposition.

We only won 2 competitive games in 90 minutes under him, one against the Jocks with a penalty save and Gazza special to thank for it plus a rout against a poor in-fighting Dutch side. The other 'victory' was against an average Spain side on penalties in the QF where they could count themselves unlucky to have a perfectly good goal disallowed in normal time. 

Added to that a poor draw against the Swiss in the group and a penalties defeat against an average German team in transition and it wasn't the new dawn some seem to claim.

However what I will remember him fondly for was the utter disdain he had for Jimmy Hill when they worked on the BBC together. He'd forgotten more about football than Hill knew...and he certainly let him know that.

[Mattyblue]

For me it was always unfinished business, he was obviously building something both on and off the pitch. The players loved him.

I think we’d have gone far in France 98 with him, alas not to be.

[oldjamfan1]

7 minutes ago, LDRover said:

There's a lot of revisionism on El Tel the England coach and this mythical total football we played under him.

He only managed us in 5 competitive games, all played at Wembley, prior to that he presided over some of the most insipid friendlies ever seen against generally poor opposition.

We only won 2 competitive games in 90 minutes under him, one against the Jocks with a penalty save and Gazza special to thank for it plus a rout against a poor in-fighting Dutch side. The other 'victory' was against an average Spain side on penalties in the QF where they could count themselves unlucky to have a perfectly good goal disallowed in normal time. 

Added to that a poor draw against the Swiss in the group and a penalties defeat against an average German team in transition and it wasn't the new dawn some seem to claim.

To be fair, that shouldn’t be used as a stick to beat him with, particularly when rigor mortis has barely set in.  
 

When the likes of Lineker and Shearer are saying he was the best coach they worked under I think you have to take that at face value. 

[Norbert Rassragr]

My memory may be wrong, but I seem to remember Venables using Shearer as a big lump on his own before Euro '96, and then stumbled upon the Shearer and Sheringham combination that worked so well. He also seemed determined to put Spurs players in the team when other players were better. Then there were no places for Wilcox when we had no left wingers, and Sutton and Le Tissier were constantly over looked. He only won two games in Euro '96 in normal time, but we're great wins.

He was a pretty decent manager but not this amazing genius some have made him out to be, prior to his death. He was better than Taylor and Hoddle but he was no Ferguson, Wenger or Pep.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

We wouldn’t be tip tapping around like we are now if Venables was in charge. He’d do more with this group of players.

Edited November 27, 2023 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[DeeCee]

Venables could have been the best England manager since '66 but he had too many other interests. 

[wilsdenrover]

Euro ‘24 draw…

Group C Slovenia, Denmark, Serbia, England

Edited December 2, 2023 by wilsdenrover

[K-Hod]

Appreciate it’s a divisive topic, but decision is to discuss anything re the flag on the England shirt in ICBINF or WDWY, so it doesn’t take things off topic in the football section.

[AllRoverAsia]

1 hour ago, K-Hod said:

Appreciate it’s a divisive topic, but decision is to discuss anything re the flag on the England shirt in ICBINF or WDWY, so it doesn’t take things off topic in the football section.

So, you just delete and give no chance to move?

Thanks a lot.

[Silas]

3 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

So, you just delete and give no chance to move?

Thanks a lot.

Ask and you shall receive. 

Can all England flag chat be done in the News Thread Attempt 394 in WDWY please. 

[AllRoverAsia]

1 minute ago, Silas said:

Ask and you shall receive. 

Can all England flag chat be done in the News Thread Attempt 394 in WDWY please. 

Thanks, top lad.

[Silas]

5 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

Thanks, top lad.

I'm sorry you broke the resolution, you've been doing so well. 😉

[AllRoverAsia]

1 minute ago, Silas said:

I'm sorry you broke the resolution, you've been doing so well. 😉

Yes, me too, but just the one time so back to it ... to year end ... hmmmm, I hope.

[jim mk2]

Dear Gareth loses another when faced with top class opposition

Nothing changes

[roversfan99]

This whole international window is totally pointless, no one really wants to be there and you have players at the business end of the season at club level risking injury for no reason.

Not really much will be learnt. If we go into games with the best playing Chilwell, Gallagher and Maguire, we will struggle to win.

[DE.]

Brazil weren't even particularly good, but had all of the good chances in the game. England were largely boring and listless. Not sure I can recall us creating much if anything of note. A shame for the fans who went expecting to see a decent match, but then, it's England under Southgate. Functional but rarely exciting. 

[den]

Never seen such negative football from an England team. So poor tonight.

[Exiled_Rover]

Southgate has to go I'm afraid. 

We've just lost to an awful Brazil team. He's wasting these players we have. 

[simongarnerisgod]

for a friendly,it was a good game,england got tested and found that the better teams are a different proposition,like iv`e stated before,we won`t win anything with southgate in charge,which is a bit of a footballing crime with the players he has

[AllRoverAsia]

I messed up on timings, thought it was a 3 am KO Bkk time, so missed the 1st half.

Almost fell asleep in the 2nd half.

Maguire replaced by Dunk, stopped watching.

We will win no trophies whilst Southgate is the manager.

 

[roversfan99]

The thing with the current squad aswell is that we have Bellingham, Foden, Saka, Kane, Stones, Walker and Rice, those 7 are the ones (especially the front 4) that has us down as favourites to win tournaments.

But then beyond that, theres a massive drop and we are weak in a number of positions. In midfield besides Rice, its either convert a RB in Trent, play a young player in Mainoo who has barely played any football or what Southgate will do, stick with a player in Henderson who is long past it or someone like Phillips or Gallagher who are clearly absolutely nowhere near the standard of challenging for tournaments. At centre back, beside Stones there is a huge drop off again. Maguire, Dunk, Konsa, none of these again are of the level to challenge. And at left back, it will either be go with a rusty Shaw and rush him back which never works, go with the useless Chilwell or stick someone out of position. 

Even with some world class players doing heavy lifting, im not sure you can have 3 players that arent up to standard. And thats before you consider the manager.

[RevidgeBlue]

Only Southgate could make such a talented bunch of players look so insipid.

Coming the day after he didn't have the cajones to say the right thing about the new England shirt and toed the FA/Nike party line instead.

Another opportunity will go to waste again this summer. As one or two others have said we'll win nowt with him in charge. Criminal he wasn't potted after the World Cup but then he always says the right thing as far as his employers are concerned so unfortunately the job is probably his as long as he wants it.

[Gav]

Gareth Southgate is the most successful England manger since Alf Ramsey, but he's won nothing. But what he has done is take his England side to European Championship final, something that every other England manger has failed to do in the history of the competition, think about that.

That statistic alone means he deserves to be in his current position and all this nonsense about "once in a generation talent pool" is something we've been hearing for decades, usually with the same outcome, failure!

Friendly internationals against Brazil mean nowt, its what happens in a few months time that really matters.

[Upside Down]

In my entire life I've never seen England have a good manager that picks a squad based on performance.

It's always been a nepotistic little club and you have to have your snout in the trough with all the other piggies to get a chance to be the top man.

There's a reason they never gave the job to Clough.

[AllRoverAsia]

2 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Only Southgate could make such a talented bunch of players look so insipid.

Coming the day after he didn't have the cajones to say the right thing about the new England shirt and toed the FA/Nike party line instead.

Another opportunity will go to waste again this summer. As one or two others have said we'll win nowt with him in charge. Criminal he wasn't potted after the World Cup but then he always says the right thing as far as his employers are concerned so unfortunately the job is probably his as long as he wants it.

Brazil, as ever, were good to see.

England, as ever, boring.

Dunk replaces Maguire.....OMdearG......

RoI v Belgium a better game to watch and not just because Sammie had a decent debut.