v Blackpool (a) - 2/10/21

[lraC]

19 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

If you know a bit a bit about business then take a look at their profits per quarter and you will see £20m appears to be very small in relation to a multi billion dollar operation.

I follow that all the time. Have a quick look at the Glazers business and tell me if they would throw money away every year? I suspect they get far more kudos owning them, then VH ever will. It makes no sense throwing this money away every year, despite their wealth.

Quick question, if I asked you for £20 per week to feed my dog, as I lost my job, would you do it?

[PLJPB]

4 hours ago, 1864roverite said:

The real way forward to successfully build a base structure and progress. For me that is the immediate removal of Mowbray and a total restructure of the board, putting in place a competent football knowledgeable CEO alongside a board that has vision, creativity and that can think outside of the box, putting its support at the very heart of the club, rebuilding trust and getting the fans to buy into that strategy.

 

And you believe that Venkys are going to do this?

[lraC]

8 minutes ago, PLJPB said:

And you believe that Venkys are going to do this?

They aren’t going to do this and that’s why they need to go.

[bluebruce]

56 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

 

8. Would like to see a new indoor football centre open behind the Darwen stand where the club can open for community use and have schools come to play a few games before going to a game to watch the Rovers. I remember doing this when I was at Primary School back in the 90's. I still memories from those days now. 

I'm confused, has the BRIC been shut down? Sorry if this is old news, but I don't live in the area anymore and it's the first I've heard of it.

[JHRover]

3 hours ago, 1864roverite said:

Still some are missing a valid and important point. Where does the £20m a year come from in addition to servicing a debt to the current owners if they decided to leave?

Here's another valid and important point - how come most other Championship sides, many of them smaller clubs than Rovers, can accomplish the same mid table mediocrity that we can on a fraction of the losses?

This is an important point because it comes back to how the club is run and how quickly and relatively easily that huge figure of £20 million could be substantially reduced whilst still sustaining the same as we have now.

It is one of the biggest myths going that the only way we can survive at this level is by having owners willing and able to pump in £20 million each and every year. The reason these owners are doing that is because of their ongoing negligence and mismanagement. If employing Steve Waggott and Tony Mowbray for nearly 5 years is the sum total of your interest and investment in the club then you deserve everything you get. These two no-hopers left Coventry City in ruins and walked into this job after being overlooked at clubs like Chesterfield, Southend and Gillingham. 

Employ better and get better results. Not just on the pitch but off it also. 

Anyone tell me how much the Blackpool owner is set to lose this year on his club? Or Hemmings at Preston? Or Berylson at Millwall, or whoever owns Luton?

Halve that £20 million and then knock another chunk off. Why can't we do that and still finish mid-table?

And no - the answer isn't facilities or the academy. At most the Category A academy costs us an extra million or two a year to run and it more than covers its outlay on the players we've developed through it. As far as I can tell all those other clubs also have grounds and training pitches most of which are better maintained than Ewood. 

If anyone can explain the above then maybe I'll accept that we need £20 million a year benefactors. Until then I simply don't accept it.

And the debt figure is another myth. That figure isn't debt - it is their tab for their 'management' of the club over the last decade. They've chosen to do it that way which is entirely their right but it isn't debt and they aren't having it back. Nobody is paying it and the Club certainly can't.

[lraC]

3 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Here's another valid and important point - how come most other Championship sides, many of them smaller clubs than Rovers, can accomplish the same mid table mediocrity that we can on a fraction of the losses?

This is an important point because it comes back to how the club is run and how quickly and relatively easily that huge figure of £20 million could be substantially reduced whilst still sustaining the same as we have now.

It is one of the biggest myths going that the only way we can survive at this level is by having owners willing and able to pump in £20 million each and every year. The reason these owners are doing that is because of their ongoing negligence and mismanagement. If employing Steve Waggott and Tony Mowbray for nearly 5 years is the sum total of your interest and investment in the club then you deserve everything you get. These two no-hopers left Coventry City in ruins and walked into this job after being overlooked at clubs like Chesterfield, Southend and Gillingham. 

Employ better and get better results. Not just on the pitch but off it also. 

Anyone tell me how much the Blackpool owner is set to lose this year on his club? Or Hemmings at Preston? Or Berylson at Millwall, or whoever owns Luton?

Halve that £20 million and then knock another chunk off. Why can't we do that and still finish mid-table?

And no - the answer isn't facilities or the academy. At most the Category A academy costs us an extra million or two a year to run and it more than covers its outlay on the players we've developed through it. As far as I can tell all those other clubs also have grounds and training pitches most of which are better maintained than Ewood. 

If anyone can explain the above then maybe I'll accept that we need £20 million a year benefactors. Until then I simply don't accept it.

And the debt figure is another myth. That figure isn't debt - it is their tab for their 'management' of the club over the last decade. They've chosen to do it that way which is entirely their right but it isn't debt and they aren't having it back. Nobody is paying it and the Club certainly can't.

It’s a lot isn’t it and you have to wonder, if someone is still getting a nice little earner?

The supply of brown envelopes can only cost peanuts, but it’s what stuffed inside them perhaps, that could provide the answers.

[1864roverite]

Blackburn rovers is not a self sufficient club due to major mismanagement of funds over the years. Huge wages against turnover is the main contributor to this. The academy is the lifeblood of the club if we unearth a gem every 2/3 years and sell t a huge profit then that is his business and one Rovers will aspire to. I am sure the current ambition of better value for cash spent is sensible because that is what it seems to me to be happening. People cry cutbacks where there is no evidence for this. I don’t believe the owners have suddenly become over caring I do think they have changed fact somewhat. I don’t know what the end result will look like, will it succeed or fail ? Who knows ? Other mid table clubs are running losses just not as big as ours because on paper we have better players. As I said I want to see what results the so called changes bring

[chaddyrovers]

50 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

I'm confused, has the BRIC been shut down? Sorry if this is old news, but I don't live in the area anymore and it's the first I've heard of it.

well I haven't see it open for years now. I can understand the last 18 months with the pandemic we have to deal with it being close. Maybe someone on the fans forum can asked the question about the BRIC and is it still open and used. 

But I was talking modern indoor facility which Schools, local football clubs, a group of friends could used during the week aswell on Match days. I posted the story of when we went the BRIC and the evening game with my Primary School. But I haven't seen that many years before the pandemic from what I can remember 

[tomphil]

Whilst they continue to be happy to sit in midtable,  chucking 10/20 mill per year at it then those in the middle will be happy to sit there drawing their few million per year out of it.

No boats will get rocked and the club will continue to go nowhere. Quite why people are happy with this because the so called only other option is going bust is bizarre.

Some of these same fans will be moaning in the real world that this govt has scared everybody into accepting their controlling ways. We've all been conditioned to accept this bollocks over the last ten years yet Mowbray & Waggot are Rovers very own Johnson & javid.

Vs are the bank of England allowing millions on lost causes whilst holding nobody to account.

Edited October 4, 2021 by tomphil

[1864roverite]

Who is David? 
 

At some point it has to break either by then changing their ways in owning the club or leaving it’s as simple as that. If their plan is put into action and done correctly then it might work but I suspect if they retain the current manager the team will regress further which will hurt after a relatively bright start. Let’s just hope any new appointments bring value to the club

[arbitro]

20 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Blackburn rovers is not a self sufficient club due to major mismanagement of funds over the years. Huge wages against turnover is the main contributor to this. The academy is the lifeblood of the club if we unearth a gem every 2/3 years and sell t a huge profit then that is his business and one Rovers will aspire to. I am sure the current ambition of better value for cash spent is sensible because that is what it seems to me to be happening. People cry cutbacks where there is no evidence for this. I don’t believe the owners have suddenly become over caring I do think they have changed fact somewhat. I don’t know what the end result will look like, will it succeed or fail ? Who knows ? Other mid table clubs are running losses just not as big as ours because on paper we have better players. As I said I want to see what results the so called changes bring

A serious question. Why do you think they are still here after eleven years?

 

[lraC]

This how to become a millionaire joke has got to apply to Venky’s.

What’s the quickest way to become a millionaire? Become a billionaire and buy a football club!!

[tomphil]

15 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Who is David? 
 

At some point it has to break either by then changing their ways in owning the club or leaving it’s as simple as that. If their plan is put into action and done correctly then it might work but I suspect if they retain the current manager the team will regress further which will hurt after a relatively bright start. Let’s just hope any new appointments bring value to the club

Sajid, i was going to say Sunak but i think he has a brain cell or two.

[1864roverite]

26 minutes ago, arbitro said:

A serious question. Why do you think they are still here after eleven years?

 

A serious answer my friend I have absolutely not a bloody clue! I am sure this is the same answer thousands of times over and over 🤬

[arbitro]

2 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

A serious answer my friend I have absolutely not a bloody clue! I am sure this is the same answer thousands of times over and over 🤬

Somebody somewhere must know. We can all hypothesize but there has to be a reason why they haven't upped sticks and gone. 

[Gav]

A mate of mine sent me this a few weeks ago, Salgado was brilliant for us and was just discarded like chicken shit on the bottom of Balajis shoe, same with Nelson and many more.

Dont tell me this lot will ever change, they’re hiding to much ‘dark magic’ to just walk away.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2307133/Michel-Salgado-blames-Venkys-Blackburn-Rovers-demise.html

Edited October 4, 2021 by Gav

[joey_big_nose]

7 minutes ago, arbitro said:

Somebody somewhere must know. We can all hypothesize but there has to be a reason why they haven't upped sticks and gone. 

It's genuinely one of the most obscure mysteries I've ever encountered. I can't think of anything similar.

They should have left ages ago. I guess maybe they think about walking away every year but then - kind of like a gambling addict - they think if we can fluke it into the prem they get all their money back? Who knows.

Anyway personally I am now at the point even if they were happy to burn £20M per year indefinitely it's better if they just go.

If we have to take administration we just take that on the chin and build back under fan ownership.

Weve got a pretty competitive team in parts atm, and a pretty good manager despite his many faults, undoubtedly when we go into admin we will get much worse of both and spend a decent amount of time in League One, but without a proper owner who can align everything properly we are not going to move forward. 

It's got to get worse before it gets better.

[Gav]

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

People cry cutbacks where there is no evidence for this. I don’t believe the owners have suddenly become over caring I do think they have changed fact somewhat. I don’t know what the end result will look like, will it succeed or fail ? Who knows ? 

No evidence of cutbacks?

We have a threadbare squad that’s relying heavily on academy players and loans. 

We have a number of 1st team regulars not being offered anywhere near decent offers to stay.

We have just sacked the European scout and we’ve lost coaches to the lower leagues, it’s a shambles.

As for not knowing the end result?

You’ve done a 360 degree turn on Venkys for some reason, but let me tell you, It’s been failure after failure 1864 - This doesn’t end in success, it’s doomed to fail, no doubt about that.

 

[Crimpshrine]

50 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Who is David? 
 

At some point it has to break either by then changing their ways in owning the club or leaving it’s as simple as that. If their plan is put into action and done correctly then it might work but I suspect if they retain the current manager the team will regress further which will hurt after a relatively bright start. Let’s just hope any new appointments bring value to the club

I agree, one way or another something will change at some point  - but what is the highlighted section all about ?

Is there really any plan other than to pay the bills, ignore the fans and plod on until they get totally bored?

I know you have been talking about positive signs recently but I can't see any.

[1864roverite]

2 minutes ago, Gav said:

No evidence of cutbacks?

We have a threadbare squad that’s relying heavily on academy players and loans. 

We have a number of 1st team regulars not being offered anywhere near decent offers to stay.

We have just sacked the European scout and we’ve lost coaches to the lower leagues, it’s a shambles.

As for not knowing the end result?

You’ve done a 360 degree turn on Venkys for some reason, but let me tell you, It’s been failure after failure 1864 - This doesn’t end in success, it’s doomed to fail, no doubt about that.

 

What you have Gav is speculation and no evidence about contract offers and supposed salary offers.

I have  not done any about face my views remain and I want change. I am allowed to have opinion on other matters and from what I have learned or been told whether it be from the horses mouth or from mine and others research and investigation I also reserve right to judge on whether anything changes.

Ultimately the proof will be in the pudding and if change isn’t made then there is a lot more answers to be given. 
In relation to contract offers all of those offered deals would attract significant wages and aside if clubs with parachute money I doubt they would be offered more! Rovers pay good money and stick to their structure. The problem with 2 of them is that they believe they are premiership players and that clubs will be in for them. I can also tell you that if Rotherll went to rangers his salary there would not be on a par with what he is offered at Ewood

[broadsword]

11 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

It's genuinely one of the most obscure mysteries I've ever encountered. I can't think of anything similar.

They should have left ages ago. I guess maybe they think about walking away every year but then - kind of like a gambling addict - they think if we can fluke it into the prem they get all their money back? Who knows.

Anyway personally I am now at the point even if they were happy to burn £20M per year indefinitely it's better if they just go.

If we have to take administration we just take that on the chin and build back under fan ownership.

Weve got a pretty competitive team in parts atm, and a pretty good manager despite his many faults, undoubtedly when we go into admin we will get much worse of both and spend a decent amount of time in League One, but without a proper owner who can align everything properly we are not going to move forward. 

It's got to get worse before it gets better.

You'd think that someone had something on them aka perpetual blackmail, or they're worried that DD will take some skellingtons . 

Think that's a little far fetched though

[chaddyrovers]

13 minutes ago, Gav said:

No evidence of cutbacks?

We have a threadbare squad that’s relying heavily on academy players and loans. 

Yes we have cut the wage bill this season but at the same time invested in our young players like Buckley, Dolan, Wharton being key players for us in the coming years. Was were wrong for clearing the deadwood Gav? 

15 minutes ago, Gav said:

We have a number of 1st team regulars not being offered anywhere near decent offers to stay.

They have been offered new improve contracts according to Waggott. How do you know they aren't decent offers to stay? 

16 minutes ago, Gav said:

We have just sacked the European scout

We didn't sack him. Just not renewed his contract. 

17 minutes ago, Gav said:

we’ve lost coaches to the lower leagues, it’s a shambles

 

Apart from Billy Barr going to Salford what other coaches have we lost to the lower leagues Gav?

[jim mk2]

This is how you deal with managers if a better one becomes available 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58778757

Ranieri is the 14th managerial change under Watford's owners, the Pozzo family, since they took over in 2012.

His predecessor won promotion last season

[Leonard Venkhater]

51 minutes ago, arbitro said:

Somebody somewhere must know. We can all hypothesize but there has to be a reason why they haven't upped sticks and gone. 

A Because they are honourable people with integrity?

B Because there is a big stinking rat beneath the floorboards?

C Because losing money hand over fist at Rovers is a convenient strategy for something else?

A season ticket to Purgatory!

[1864roverite]

15 minutes ago, jim mk2 said:

This is how you deal with managers if a better one becomes available 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58778757

Ranieri is the 14th managerial change under Watford's owners, the Pozzo family, since they took over in 2012.

His predecessor won promotion last season

Spot on jim positive action taken without any other issues.