Transfer Window - COMPLETE. Where’s Gregg?

[Mattyblue]

Brfcs posters don’t draw up and offer contracts, so it doesn’t matter one iota what any of us on here thought 18 months ago! 

The club however does, and they have once again not protected their assets.

By reading ‘well a load of the few dozen posters on brfcs.com said he was crap’, ‘this obscure internet page would’ve been really really mad if he signed up’, is luckily not how professional football clubs make decisions on new deals .

So a few of you trying to absolve the club of any blame because ‘DaveyBlue69’ and his message board pals thought he was a bit shit is all a bit of a stretch.

Edited June 28, 2022 by Mattyblue

[ben_the_beast]

4 minutes ago, Gordon Ottershaw said:

From my recollection there were a few sage posters that recognised some green shoots of what was to come from BBD. Most of us were expressing regret that we had spunked 7 mill and would not have been particularly well disposed to the club compounding the error with an extended (and likely improved) contract.

My recollection is that an extended contract protects the investment rather than compounding it. 

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

I don't care whether it has or not. Changes nothing. Discussions are free and easy. Getting business done is the benchmark.

The key to managing this is getting players tied down early before the vultures start hovering.

We can spend all January talking to Assombalonga. End result is he doesn't come.

We can spend years talking to Lenihan, Nyambe, Brereton, Armstrong. End result is no contract extensions and a massive loss to the club.

We can talk about good budgets, grand plans and exciting players. End result is those things cost money and need getting over the line.

 

You are or appear to absolving the players part in contract negotiations, the club can do loads but if the player declines then that’s it !

[Danny O.Brien]

It just seemed to click for him last season. I don't think he was ever a million miles away from the player he became. It was his touch or finish that was the most frustrating because he was getting in decent positions. If he'd of got ten goals I'd of been impressed, using the confidence he'd gained being away with Chile.

It makes the new deal for Gallagher make sense. If he gets ten goals say by new year, clubs would be looking at him. Look at Andy fucking Carroll. He got three or four goals at reading and suddenly he was being linked with a return to the premiership 😂.He just needs it to click aswell as in that final ball, first touch or knowing where to put the ball for it to go in. 

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

Meanwhile over on fantasy island we get the 'cannot criticise the club in any shape or form' angle.

Even if you are right does it matter or change anything? Simple fact of the matter is that we are losing valuable assets at reduced or zero fees. Millions and millions down the drain that is irrefutable fact and unacceptable for a club in any position let alone one with our FFP obsession.

End result is what matters. We can debate how we got here but you can't paint this situation as good or desirable however hard you try.

No one is flowering or painting it up, it’s reality. If rovers offered the world and more and the player declines there’s faff all else can be done and no one repeat no one is to blame

[Gordon Ottershaw]

7 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

You are or appear to absolving the players part in contract negotiations, the club can do loads but if the player declines then that’s it !

.

Edited June 28, 2022 by Gordon Ottershaw

[Gordon Ottershaw]

15 minutes ago, ben_the_beast said:

My recollection is that an extended contract protects the investment rather than compounding it. 

One man's recollection is another man's hindsight

[Ossydave]

Regardless of if we think he'll stay or go, surely we can't ignore the fact that Salernitana's record transfer stands at 5.8M, prior to that it was 4.2M in 1998!!  Do we really see them smashing their transfer record to sign Diaz after narrowly avoiding relegation last season?  Doesn't add up to me for 1 minute.

[unsall]

33 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I remember a lot of people questioning the fee paid for him, particularly given the massive imbalance compared to lack of investment in other positions of the team.

To be fair to Mowbray and co. after 4 years the investment has been vindicated. It took a long time but we got there in the end.

I don't remember any talk about giving him away or being happy for him to leave for nothing.

 

Short memory, this MB was awash with folk slagging him off, when it was tough going with plenty saying get rid.

The problem is you think we can sign everybody on 4 year contracts and then renew every 2 years, you don’t seem to care about FFP, if nothing happens you think there hasn’t even been contact to renew, if players don’t want to commit there’s not much we can do about it. It happens at all clubs, even Stoke who you seem to compare with us. They want Joe Allen to renew but he’s run his contract down and is leaving.

We all need to criticise the club when needs be, but relentless criticism when we don’t have the full facts is wrong IMO.

 

[MarkBRFC]

20 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

No one is flowering or painting it up, it’s reality. If rovers offered the world and more and the player declines there’s faff all else can be done and no one repeat no one is to blame

So what you are saying is, "The Club has done all it can"?

Never mind "One Of Our Own", that appears to be the real tagline at play here.

[Eddie]

10 hours ago, Fraserkirky said:

There is no way he stays, we will be cashing in as we have just had our trousers yanked, losing three of our better players for free.

In spite of their many flaws, I don't think Venkys have ever shown themselves to be overly concerned by the thought of losing money on transfers. 

If someone at the club tells them that he might make the difference and if he doesn't force a move, I think we could well see him stay until at least January. 

Given the current economic markets I don't think that there will be too many clubs in a rush to spend 15m+ on what still represents a massive gamble. 

[arbitro]

8 minutes ago, unsall said:

Short memory, this MB was awash with folk slagging him off, when it was tough going with plenty saying get rid.

The problem is you think we can sign everybody on 4 year contracts and then renew every 2 years, you don’t seem to care about FFP, if nothing happens you think there hasn’t even been contact to renew, if players don’t want to commit there’s not much we can do about it. It happens at all clubs, even Stoke who you seem to compare with us. They want Joe Allen to renew but he’s run his contract down and is leaving.

We all need to criticise the club when needs be, but relentless criticism when we don’t have the full facts is wrong IMO.

 

It's about protecting our assets sometimes and clearly age and usually experience come into play. It's good that the likes of Travis and Kaminski have signed but ultimately three players walking away and potentially Brereton too effectively could cost the club £25m. Whilst Stoke would like Allen to sign a deal if that was Ayala for us I wouldn't be too concerned given he has very little financial value to us. Last summer when Armstrong left Waggott alluded to the club offering him the best contract they have ever done. Was it breaking the newly found pay structure?

[unsall]

4 minutes ago, arbitro said:

It's about protecting our assets sometimes and clearly age and usually experience come into play. It's good that the likes of Travis and Kaminski have signed but ultimately three players walking away and potentially Brereton too effectively could cost the club £25m. Whilst Stoke would like Allen to sign a deal if that was Ayala for us I wouldn't be too concerned given he has very little financial value to us. Last summer when Armstrong left Waggott alluded to the club offering him the best contract they have ever done. Was it breaking the newly found pay structure?

Totally agree, but the point I am saying if we have tried to renew, say Breretons contract last year and he won’t there’s nothing we can do, and if doesn’t want to move, again nothing we can do, it’s the folk on here saying we haven’t done anything when they haven’t a clue what’s been said

 

[Mattyblue]

15 minutes ago, Eddie said:

In spite of their many flaws, I don't think Venkys have ever shown themselves to be overly concerned by the thought of losing money on transfers. 

 

Yep, what’s a few million here and there ay?

Yet, supposedly Swag has had to beg them to extend out a ST deadline by two weeks and the £30 surcharge that goes with it.

Only in the penny wise, pound foolish VenkyWorld…

[pomster]

57 minutes ago, K-Hod said:

I think it was proven that never actually happened?

Thats good to know, but there is also a mental as well as physical side

But lets be honest, a fan base can easily decimate a players confidence.

Either way, as much as i’d prefer him to stay we also need to sell as soon as

Good luck to him though, i hope he has a bright future. And there’l be no hard feelings from me

[Mattyblue]

3 minutes ago, pomster said:

 

But lets be honest, a fan base can easily decimate a players confidence.

 

Certainly can, so it’s testament to our fans that at games he has been so well supported throughout his time here .

[arbitro]

8 minutes ago, unsall said:

Totally agree, but the point I am saying if we have tried to renew, say Breretons contract last year and he won’t there’s nothing we can do, and if doesn’t want to move, again nothing we can do, it’s the folk on here saying we haven’t done anything when they haven’t a clue what’s been said

 

As a players contract runs down their position is strengthened without doubt. Using Armstrong as the yardstick the offer to Brereton should be the best ever contract we have offered a player. I know that I was amazed when I was told how little one of our first team was offered in a recent deal. The wages went up after so many appearances and the bonuses were commensurate with the increase but on signing the deal the wages were a relative pittance.

[roverandout]

3 hours ago, martonrover said:

Were the drinks free? 

Free for the girls 

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, arbitro said:

You are right but when he proved the majority of us wrong by January new contract negotiations should have been the absolute priority.

contract's negotiations were happening well before that 

[1864roverite]

38 minutes ago, MarkBRFC said:

So what you are saying is, "The Club has done all it can"?

Never mind "One Of Our Own", that appears to be the real tagline at play here.

What I am saying is that the club appears to offered a very good deal to both Dl and RN both have turned it down. Do you expect Rovers to break their salary structure ? I don’t and I am sure others won’t. DL stated he has premier league ambitions and signed for a club that finished 2 place above us in the league ! Nyambe thinks he is a PL player in the making I like many disagree again he is only worth what the club think in terms of salary there is no need to break limits. So on the basis of the above added to lengths of contract then yes the club have done what they can it is the players who have declined the offers and who have all the cards in their favour - DL going to Boro wont change my mind about them being an awful club  however it’s worth noting that it appears not one other club bigger or better than Boro have come in for him! Likewise RN, led to some fans think in he was leeds bound however once again there is little sign of any big clubs coming in for him and if he thinks Stoke is his future ambition wise then good for him another shithouse club shit fans and most certainly not a club with bigger ambition than Rovers

[pomster]

Some news would be nice!

(awaits sly comments🤪)

[Mattyblue]

In what way are Stoke ‘a shithouse club’? They are a historic, founder member, just like us. 

You are obviously of ‘mature’ age, due to mentions of the 70s and 80s, but you really don’t post like it.
 

 

 

 

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

You are or appear to absolving the players part in contract negotiations, the club can do loads but if the player declines then that’s it !

It's not as simple as that. The key scenario you miss is the potential to sell to retain some value. Rothwell is the obvious one and you had people on the ground wanting to sell and replace, but internal conflict with our idiotic owners. The Lancashire Telegraph I think reported that Nyambe was subject to bids from Stoke last summer, again, should we have accepted, and was everyone on the same page?

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

I will criticise the club when it right to do and I do not blame the club for 3 players not renewing their contract. They were made good contracts and not signed them and now gone elsewhere. 

I know Ben Brereton was made a new contract offer and he has decide not to sign it. So we can either sell him or make him another contract offer. I would try to keep him here, but if he wants to leave then sell him

I've always thought the talent was there and he needed someone to unlock that. He seem a very different player when he returned after the first lockdown. Always let someone had switch him on. 

I remember him having a good game in the FA cup against Arsenal for Forest and I thought he looks a good player. 

 

How do you know that they were good offers? I am not convinced that we are offering competitive wages to be honest.

Also, see above on potential sales.

[JHRover]

26 minutes ago, unsall said:

Totally agree, but the point I am saying if we have tried to renew, say Breretons contract last year and he won’t there’s nothing we can do, and if doesn’t want to move, again nothing we can do, it’s the folk on here saying we haven’t done anything when they haven’t a clue what’s been said

 

There clearly is or certainly was an issue with extending contracts. Armstrong, BBD, Nyambe, Rothwell and Lenihan are living proof of that. The only reassurance since then is the commitment of Travis, Kaminski and Gallagher which suggests something changed later on last season.

But prior to that we had gone circa 2 years without getting any senior player tied down to new terms.

That suggests to me something wrong at the clubs end. Whether that be budgets, negotiators, timings, who knows, but for ALL of those players to turn down the offers after so long tells me there's a problem with how the club went about it.

'Nothing we can do about it' is precisely the attitude Waggott wants us all to take. Of course there are other things the club could have done, as is the case in every contract negotiation - offer more money, increase the budget, come to the table much earlier

[Jimmy612]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

I will criticise the club when it right to do and I do not blame the club for 3 players not renewing their contract. They were made good contracts and not signed them and now gone elsewhere. 

 

Unless I've missed something, no-one on this messageboard knows that for a fact.  The only facts we do know are the following;

• Rothwell has signed for a PL club
• Lenihan has signed for a Championship rival who finished 1 place and 1 point above us last season.
• Nyambe has decided to walk away with no immediate destination decided.

We also know as you rightly point out that Brereton has also refused a contract offered by Rovers.  That's not a good strike rate. 

Factor in Gally, Travis and Kaminski and there has seemingly been an improvement, hopefully enabling us to avoid this absurd situation in the future. Lessons learnt perhaps... try to avoid the players (and their agents) holding all the aces.