World Cup 2022

[ben_the_beast]

14 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

If Foden were playing for say Brighton or Leicester he would be getting the valuable experience in the middle of the field and learning how to run the game. As it is he’s a bit part player at City. Same goes for Grealish and Phillips. From a player development point of view signing for City was a backward step.

I agree with this. Foden has the potential to be an Iniesta. He can play as a wide forward, as Iniesta did for parts of his career because he has the ability to play anywhere. However if England want to see a generational talent hit his potential, he needs to learn how to run a game which would only happen with regular playing time in a central position.

[Dreams of 1995]

10 hours ago, riverholmes said:

I think Foden is the closest we have had in recent memory to a top level No.10. Any other club than City, and he would always play central, I would guess, and thereby be England's main man.

Guardiola's embarrassment of riches has sidelined Foden as a support act, often, to likes of De Bruyne and Silva. 

You might say, but for City stockpiling, Kalvin Phillips and Grealish would be in better form, match fitness. If City sign Bellingham, you might see him start once every 3 games, at least initially.

The arrival of petrodollars and billionaires is going to damage England's chances, I suspect, with new recruits prioritised over regular football for young players.

Then again, with the Champions' League expanding yet further in 2024, international football might well be in decline, at least, for Europeans and European-based players.

I don't think there is any chance of international football declining

It is still the pinnacle of a football players career. The Euros and the World Cup are the most watched football tournaments in the world

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 hours ago, ben_the_beast said:

I agree with this. Foden has the potential to be an Iniesta. He can play as a wide forward, as Iniesta did for parts of his career because he has the ability to play anywhere. However if England want to see a generational talent hit his potential, he needs to learn how to run a game which would only happen with regular playing time in a central position.

Foden’s got his age in his favour but he needs to be playing more centrally soon. You can only have one conductor in an orchestra. As long as DeBruyne is there he’ll never get the chance.

[rigger]

22 hours ago, Mellor Rover said:

That was in the past? So yeah my point still stands it won’t be seen again.

Until, it is. 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, rigger said:

Until, it is. 

It won't.

Messi's career, the way he plays and numbers he produces won't be seen again in my opinion. 91 (NINETY ONE!!!!!!) goals in a calendar year.

For comparison, Mbappe is currently on 41 in 2022.

[rigger]

2 hours ago, Mellor Rover said:

It won't.

Messi's career, the way he plays and numbers he produces won't be seen again in my opinion. 91 (NINETY ONE!!!!!!) goals in a calendar year.

For comparison, Mbappe is currently on 41 in 2022.

The quality of the opposition is also a factor. But again I am not putting into doubt Messi's ability. What I am saying is that no-one can say for certain that it never will be beaten. I remember the four minute mile being the be-all and end-all of athletics. Nowadays it probably wouldn't qualify you for an international meet

Edited December 20, 2022 by rigger

[sabino]

But special mention to Mbappe.

The 1st man to to score a hatrick in a world cup final.

Where they all cross the line:)

[oldjamfan1]

1 hour ago, sabino said:

But special mention to Mbappe.

The 1st man to to score a hatrick in a world cup final.

Where they all cross the line:)

Congratulations on being the 1000th person to regurgitate Ally McCoist's well-rehearsed 'ad lib'.

[sabino]

1 hour ago, oldjamfan1 said:

Congratulations on being the 1000th person to regurgitate Ally McCoist's well-rehearsed 'ad lib'.

Thanks. Although methinks your raw nerve is exaggerating. 

[oldjamfan1]

42 minutes ago, sabino said:

Thanks. Although methinks your raw nerve is exaggerating. 

I'm a big fan of Ally - I work in his home town and he is loved here even by the Celtic fans. It was a very funny line, one that he has waited quite some time to use. But its only really funny the first time you hear it mate to be fair.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, rigger said:

The quality of the opposition is also a factor. But again I am not putting into doubt Messi's ability. What I am saying is that no-one can say for certain that it never will be beaten. I remember the four minute mile being the be-all and end-all of athletics. Nowadays it probably wouldn't qualify you for an international meet

Better teams than play in the French league currently…

[riverholmes]

On 20/12/2022 at 10:15, Dreams of 1995 said:

I don't think there is any chance of international football declining

It is still the pinnacle of a football players career. The Euros and the World Cup are the most watched football tournaments in the world

I would hope not, as I think international football tournaments bring players and fans together like no other football tournament. However, I read that the Champions League will expand from something like 125 games to 189 from 2024. Who will precisely be playing these extra games, I'm not sure but the tournament is expanding in size and might well be accompanied by greater fatigue and injuries for players.

The World Cup, I think is, or might be, expanding too, and the toll might well see more of the top players absent literally or not able to perform. I got the sense from Kevin De Bruyne's recent comments about the Nations League and Belgium's World Cup that he was disillusioned with the sheer number of games and international football was, to him, a lesser priority. This could be just him but I wonder how far it might spread.

Then, there is the fans. I just wonder whether the club v country debate is moving increasingly towards club, as each match, especially, in the top flight and Championship, becomes so financially crucial and the Premiership and Champions' League becomes like Super Leagues. I have no evidence for this but it'll be interesting to see how it pans out.

Edit: I wonder if there is something in the fact that the winning Argentina side was made up of a significant number of players from outside of the elite European sides of recent years.

On a separate note, or maybe, not so separate, I wonder where the mercurial African talents have gone - the Kanu, Okocha, Obafemi Martins, Moustafa Hadji type players. I stand to be corrected, as I didn't watch much of the earlier rounds of the World Cup, but it would seem to me that there has been a Europeanisation of African players, with flair and risk taking being trained out of them. There's still some like Mahrez and Benrahma, but, especially, West Africa doesn't seem to produce them in the abudance of before. But, I'm far from an expert on this, so may well be wrong and, perhaps, being nostalgic about former players.

Edited December 22, 2022 by riverholmes

[speeeeeeedie]

6 hours ago, riverholmes said:

On a separate note, or maybe, not so separate, I wonder where the mercurial African talents have gone - the Kanu, Okocha, Obafemi Martins, Moustafa Hadji type players. I stand to be corrected, as I didn't watch much of the earlier rounds of the World Cup, but it would seem to me that there has been a Europeanisation of African players, with flair and risk taking being trained out of them. There's still some like Mahrez and Benrahma, but, especially, West Africa doesn't seem to produce them in the abudance of before. But, I'm far from an expert on this, so may well be wrong and, perhaps, being nostalgic about former players.

An interesting point. Add in George Weah. Drogba. Eto'o. 

Of the current crop neither Salah or Mane made it to Qatar.

It seems odd saying this when Morocco got to a World Cup semi-final but African football does seem to have hit a plateau. Certainly sub-Saharan Africa has. 

Ghana once had a midfield of Essien and Appiah. They were a real pair of talents. Now 

I think big club scouting networks now have the ability and resources to find African talent early and bring them in. The Red Bull conglomerate of clubs does a very good job of it. 

South Americans are also leaving for Europe earlier too, Maybe that is blocking some of the African players?