v Luton Town (h) - 1/5/23

[Herbie6590]

 

[M_B]

11 hours ago, Sweaty Gussets said:

I think it's slightly more nuanced than that.

Up to about January we would play out from the back and run out of ideas on halfway. It was embarrassing to watch at times and I commented on it on here before Christmas. 

We now cut through teams quite easily and get to the edge of their box and then run out of idea...or try to walk it in. The improvement in how well we 'play through the lines', to use that awful term, is quite stark. JRC has been a massive part of that improvement because he's very good at dropping into space where a RCM would normally be and spraying passes out wide or playing through the oppositions midfield. Wharton will also become central to that when he finds more consistency.  

So, I think comparisons with Mowbray's possession football are a long way wide of the mark. The football is much quicker now. If you compare the teams yesterday we were like Barcelona compared to them in the way we moved the ball around. They looked like a pub side in that first half. 

As for counter-attacking, that's also improved. We'd have never scored the goal at home to Sheff Utd under Mowbray. 

JDT doesn't get the credit he deserves for the way he's transformed the way the team plays. The fitness levels are also frightening. 

He knows where the problems are. His constant remarks about missed opportunities and quality in the final third tell you where he knows the team needs to improve.

Nothing is certain, but I'm excited about next season.

The booing when passing it around at the back has all but stopped, because we are now seeing reward for the risk. It's a shame Morton got injured, he was linking up well with Wharton, and his injury has also meant that Szmodics has had to drop deeper to fill in. 

Last few games I think we've played well, it's the obvious lack up front that has let us down. Put Armstrong up there, and we're a dangerous team. 

[Mattyblue]

Indeed, Luton have far more heritage than the likes of Bournemouth.

[roversfan99]

7 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

I just don't think it would have work. Suits them more than us.

Who would he come on for? BBD? JRC? 

We have created chances in games but also he would help us attacking wise with his movement and link up play hence created more chances. 

Like I said I think overall play as improve since the World Cup break in terms of passing and more comfortably as possession based team

Our possession has increased but it hasn't made us any more threatening in my opinion. We are the type of team that creates a couple of decent chances a game. Coventry, Burnley, Luton and even Preston, keep the ball well enough but not manifesting into much of substance. Hull, Birmingham, not even that. Often come off games thinking we wouldn't score if we played all night, therefore whilst I appreciate that everyone knows that we need attackers, I can't judge us as progressing much when we create little and are so dull. We have even lost some of that control we had earlier in the season whereby we equally struggled to create but we could see out games with far more control, Tomasson has hindered us numerous times in recent weeks by inviting pressure with a 3rd centre back.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

18 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Our possession has increased but it hasn't made us any more threatening in my opinion. We are the type of team that creates a couple of decent chances a game. Coventry, Burnley, Luton and even Preston, keep the ball well enough but not manifesting into much of substance. Hull, Birmingham, not even that. Often come off games thinking we wouldn't score if we played all night, therefore whilst I appreciate that everyone knows that we need attackers, I can't judge us as progressing much when we create little and are so dull. We have even lost some of that control we had earlier in the season whereby we equally struggled to create but we could see out games with far more control, Tomasson has hindered us numerous times in recent weeks by inviting pressure with a 3rd centre back.

Any game were you’re winning 1-0 with 10 minutes to go you’ll come under pressure. 1-0 is never enough. The answer - score more bloody goals ! Of course bringing on more defenders doesn’t actually help in that endeavour.

[martonrover]

41 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Indeed, Luton have far more heritage than the likes of Bournemouth.

if they’re good enough for Eric Morecambe……. 🙂

[ruggles1995]

I know Diaz is woeful atm. But what frustrates me and it also is not probably helping him, is he is left wing. We don't want him tracking back to help because he is a danger defensivley to us! and when the ball is out wide for him hes having to cross the ball or set others up. His all round game play is dire!, but with his goal record you need that numpty in the 18 yard box. Hes woeful because hes in a position that if he cant cut in and shoot then hes pointless. Playing him out wide makes him a 1 trick pony, soon as the option to shoot is not on, you just know he will give the ball away. If you give the ball to him around the middle of the goal in the 18 yard box he might get a shot off. Dolan is lightweight,, he is not a 9. It pees me off when JDT said before the game we are playing without a striker. Are you mental?! we have a striker thats our top scorer going to la liga who you are putting left wing! Hes woeful with the ball put him around there 18 yard box so hes in around the box not giving the ball away in our own half or on the left wing when we get the ball in the final 3rd. He gave it away countless times saturday, all because he was having to pass or cross to others, not his game. Hes a dreadful footballer, but theres no doubt he can score. 

[Sparks Rover]

33 minutes ago, ruggles1995 said:

I know Diaz is woeful atm. But what frustrates me and it also is not probably helping him, is he is left wing. We don't want him tracking back to help because he is a danger defensivley to us! and when the ball is out wide for him hes having to cross the ball or set others up. His all round game play is dire!, but with his goal record you need that numpty in the 18 yard box. Hes woeful because hes in a position that if he cant cut in and shoot then hes pointless. Playing him out wide makes him a 1 trick pony, soon as the option to shoot is not on, you just know he will give the ball away. If you give the ball to him around the middle of the goal in the 18 yard box he might get a shot off. Dolan is lightweight,, he is not a 9. It pees me off when JDT said before the game we are playing without a striker. Are you mental?! we have a striker thats our top scorer going to la liga who you are putting left wing! Hes woeful with the ball put him around there 18 yard box so hes in around the box not giving the ball away in our own half or on the left wing when we get the ball in the final 3rd. He gave it away countless times saturday, all because he was having to pass or cross to others, not his game. Hes a dreadful footballer, but theres no doubt he can score. 

I just think defenders have sussed him out.  He hasn't got good close control or a burst of pace.  Very easy to defend against when you know where he wants to take the  ball.

[rigger]

2 hours ago, ruggles1995 said:

I know Diaz is woeful atm. But what frustrates me and it also is not probably helping him, is he is left wing. We don't want him tracking back to help because he is a danger defensivley to us! and when the ball is out wide for him hes having to cross the ball or set others up. His all round game play is dire!, but with his goal record you need that numpty in the 18 yard box. Hes woeful because hes in a position that if he cant cut in and shoot then hes pointless. Playing him out wide makes him a 1 trick pony, soon as the option to shoot is not on, you just know he will give the ball away. If you give the ball to him around the middle of the goal in the 18 yard box he might get a shot off. Dolan is lightweight,, he is not a 9. It pees me off when JDT said before the game we are playing without a striker. Are you mental?! we have a striker thats our top scorer going to la liga who you are putting left wing! Hes woeful with the ball put him around there 18 yard box so hes in around the box not giving the ball away in our own half or on the left wing when we get the ball in the final 3rd. He gave it away countless times saturday, all because he was having to pass or cross to others, not his game. Hes a dreadful footballer, but theres no doubt he can score. 

At the moment Diaz is more of a 1 trick donkey.

[chaddyrovers]

13 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Our possession has increased but it hasn't made us any more threatening in my opinion. We are the type of team that creates a couple of decent chances a game. Coventry, Burnley, Luton and even Preston, keep the ball well enough but not manifesting into much of substance. Hull, Birmingham, not even that. Often come off games thinking we wouldn't score if we played all night, therefore whilst I appreciate that everyone knows that we need attackers, I can't judge us as progressing much when we create little and are so dull. We have even lost some of that control we had earlier in the season whereby we equally struggled to create but we could see out games with far more control,

Well we just have agree to disagree here

13 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Tomasson has hindered us numerous times in recent weeks by inviting pressure with a 3rd centre back.

Did the right thing against Coventry and Preston by bringing on another centre back? Preston had 4 strikers on the pitch so it's natural you want an extra centre back on the pitch

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Well we just have agree to disagree here

Did the right thing against Coventry and Preston by bringing on another centre back? Preston had 4 strikers on the pitch so it's natural you want an extra centre back on the pitch

No he didnt do the right thing in my opinion. And we lost leads in both following those changes so hardly an unjustified opinion. We invited pressure and lots of late corners v Coventry and a rusty Wharton slipping didnt help v Preston.

[chaddyrovers]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

No he didnt do the right thing in my opinion. And we lost leads in both following those changes so hardly an unjustified opinion. We invited pressure and lots of late corners v Coventry and a rusty Wharton slipping didnt help v Preston.

Coventry were attacking us and pushing us back. Let's not forget that Coventry's equaliser was handball and Preston's goal was very lucky deflection shot. Plus Hedges should have scored. Those are the facts

[roversfan99]

5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Coventry were attacking us and pushing us back. Let's not forget that Coventry's equaliser was handball and Preston's goal was very lucky deflection shot. Plus Hedges should have scored. Those are the facts

Lucky or not, the subs invited further pressure and we conceded in both. They may have been accompanied with bad luck and/or individual decisions but they didn't work. If we were winning and then didn't see it through, they weren't the "right" moves.

[Blue blood]

5 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Coventry were attacking us and pushing us back. Let's not forget that Coventry's equaliser was handball and Preston's goal was very lucky deflection shot. Plus Hedges should have scored. Those are the facts

The third sentence clearly isn't a fact, especially when you consider his general composure in front of goal. 

Equally that both teams equalised is also a fact. So I don't think facts support that it was the right decision. 

Bare in mind too that they can only score - lucky or otherwise - if they are near our goal! Our third of the pitch. So if they hadn't been sitting so deep inviting pressure they'd have struggled to get lucky. 

[Sparks Rover]

9 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Preston had 4 strikers on the pitch so it's natural you want an extra centre back on the pitch

Not at all.  That shows a severe lack of football knowledge.  Does it not occur to you that we may have taken advantage elsewhere on the pitch with them going so heavy up top?  Arguments for the sake of it with you.

Edited May 4, 2023 by Sparks Rover

[Mattyblue]

Refer you back to my Chadster decision making tree…

Did the manager/the club make the decision = Yes - so it’s the correct decision.
End of tree.

[tomphil]

10 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Well we just have agree to disagree here

Did the right thing against Coventry and Preston by bringing on another centre back? Preston had 4 strikers on the pitch so it's natural you want an extra centre back on the pitch

We conceded against Sheff U, PNE and Coventry after he'd done that so no it turns out it wasn't the right thing to do it doesn't work for us.

However their goals came about they ALL came mins after changing shape so it's impossible to say it was the right thing to do.

[Upside Down]

On 03/05/2023 at 20:40, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Any game were you’re winning 1-0 with 10 minutes to go you’ll come under pressure. 1-0 is never enough. The answer - score more bloody goals ! Of course bringing on more defenders doesn’t actually help in that endeavour.

I've always hated that mentality. Why not bring on another striker and put them under pressure even more. 

You can't concede when the ball is in the other teams half.

[Upside Down]

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

We conceded against Sheff U, PNE and Coventry after he'd done that so no it turns out it wasn't the right thing to do it doesn't work for us.

However their goals came about they ALL came mins after changing shape so it's impossible to say it was the right thing to do.

I do wonder sometimes if he's ever watched a full football match. 

[tomphil]

It's possible to counter an opposition change with what you already have on the pitch even if it's only for a few mins.

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, Sparks Rover said:

Not at all.  That shows a severe lack of football knowledge.  Does it not occur to you that we may have taken advantage elsewhere on the pitch with them going so heavy up top?  Arguments for the sake of it with you.

Sometimes you’ve got to back your players and go 4 v 4 in defence. Then there’s got to be gaps in other areas of the pitch. When you end up defending your own 6 yard box unless you’re really lucky and your goalkeeper has the game of his lifetime you’re going to be in trouble sooner or later.

[Sweaty Gussets]

2 hours ago, Sparks Rover said:

Not at all.  That shows a severe lack of football knowledge.  Does it not occur to you that we may have taken advantage elsewhere on the pitch with them going so heavy up top?  Arguments for the sake of it with you.

We did, and Hedges chipped the ball into the keeper's arms when clean through. 

So not the manager's fault at all. 

 

[booth]

Let us not forget that Coventry's keeper had to use basketball and NFL moves to get the ball in the net. I'm surprised he didn't take out a fecking baseball bat to get a final touch on it.

I've seen them disallowed for barging the keeper alone.

Very unlucky recently with decisions.

[Tricky]

13 minutes ago, booth said:

Very unlucky recently with our players decisions.

fixed

[booth]

Just now, Tricky said:

fixed

Can it not be both?

Notably, Brereton was asleep for the Coventry goal.