Premier League

[roversfan99]

1 minute ago, chaddyrovers said:

Ex pros have a greater understanding of the game of football so maybe it will help making decisions. 

VAR isn't accuracy and football is a game of opinion for decisions and not like Cricket where it is deffo decision like has he hit the ball as the ball gone through to the Keeper. 

Never wanted VAR in, fans are fed up with it, takes far too long for decisions to be made. Get rid and allow the ref to actually make their decisions

Ive seen today that it wont be scrapped as not enough teams will vote in favour.

But this idea of ex pros being referees has been suggested for decades and clearly there isnt the desire from ex pros to go into refereeing. But even if they did, the idea that it would suddenly and massively improve accuracy of decisions is totally unsubstantiated.

Using technology (admittedly with tweaks) is by far and undoubtedly the way to make more accurate decisions. Its unarguable. There are subjective areas but even then, technology at least gives officials more evidence to make their decisions.

[chaddyrovers]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Ive seen today that it wont be scrapped as not enough teams will vote in favour.

we see when the vote happens what the vote is. Wolves and Forest are 2 of it. Its not improving the game and if anything its making worst every time, fans are feck off with it

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

But this idea of ex pros being referees has been suggested for decades and clearly there isnt the desire from ex pros to go into refereeing. But even if they did, the idea that it would suddenly and massively improve accuracy of decisions is totally unsubstantiated.

We are taking about pros who don't make pro like 20 years old players, etc, not players at 35 years old

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Using technology (admittedly with tweaks) is by far and undoubtedly the way to make more accurate decisions. Its unarguable. There are subjective areas but even then, technology at least gives officials more evidence to make their decisions.

what tweaks? 

The game is being slow down by VAR taking ages? have you been in stadium when VAR is used or spoken to fans who are? 

[roversfan99]

7 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

we see when the vote happens what the vote is. Wolves and Forest are 2 of it. Its not improving the game and if anything its making worst every time, fans are feck off with it

We are taking about pros who don't make pro like 20 years old players, etc, not players at 35 years old

what tweaks? 

The game is being slow down by VAR taking ages? have you been in stadium when VAR is used or spoken to fans who are? 

Why would a 20 year old player who hasnt made professional levels have judgement better than his peers to the extent where it would make any significant difference? And even if it did, are there a pool of these that would want to become referees?

The stuff about the game being slowed and/or losing the spontaneous nature is a seperate argument. But using technology is the only way to considerably increase (not to 100%) the accuracy of decisions.

[chaddyrovers]

3 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

The stuff about the game being slowed and/or losing the spontaneous nature is a seperate argument. But using technology is the only way to considerably increase (not to 100%) the accuracy of decisions.

No its not a separate argument at all, but its part of the overall reason why VAR need scraping, no communicate to fans inside the stadium, 

I asked what tweaks you want to make and no answer to that question 

[wilsdenrover]

8 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Why would a 20 year old player who hasnt made professional levels have judgement better than his peers to the extent where it would make any significant difference? And even if it did, are there a pool of these that would want to become referees?

The stuff about the game being slowed and/or losing the spontaneous nature is a seperate argument. But using technology is the only way to considerably increase (not to 100%) the accuracy of decisions.

The below is part of what Howard Webb said - so not ‘failed’ 20 year olds as Chaddy suggested was the case:

 

 

[chaddyrovers]

11 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

The below is part of what Howard Webb said - so not ‘failed’ 20 year olds as Chaddy suggested was the case:

 

 

The 20 years old was example of who might be interest in refereeing as staying in the game. Why not try it. Can't be any worse can it? 

[roversfan99]

13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

No its not a separate argument at all, but its part of the overall reason why VAR need scraping, no communicate to fans inside the stadium, 

I asked what tweaks you want to make and no answer to that question 

Semi automated offsides would be a big one. Communication is hard because the only way of truly doing that is to show it on the screen but that risks adding pressure to decisions. 

If you want accuracy, you keep VAR. If you want a quicker game/players able to freely celebrate etc then you scrap it. As far as I am concerned, if it is scrapped, people in favour cant then keep moaning about bad decisions.

Pie in the sky ideas about former players are not going to make much difference even if they are willing to do it, but I dont see how failed footballers could be able to profess to "know the game" anyway.

[wilsdenrover]

1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

Semi automated offsides would be a big one. Communication is hard because the only way of truly doing that is to show it on the screen but that risks adding pressure to decisions. 

If you want accuracy, you keep VAR. If you want a quicker game/players able to freely celebrate etc then you scrap it. As far as I am concerned, if it is scrapped, people in favour cant then keep moaning about bad decisions.

Pie in the sky ideas about former players are not going to make much difference even if they are willing to do it, but I dont see how failed footballers could be able to profess to "know the game" anyway.

Does that not work both ways though?

ie. If the clubs vote to keep it they can’t keep moaning when they feel VAR has gone against them.

[roversfan99]

25 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

Does that not work both ways though?

ie. If the clubs vote to keep it they can’t keep moaning when they feel VAR has gone against them.

The argument Wolves put forward was specifically about how it affects the game, apparently anyway. Not about its accuracy or the decisions.

[chaddyrovers]

20 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Semi automated offsides would be a big one. Communication is hard because the only way of truly doing that is to show it on the screen but that risks adding pressure to decisions. 

If you want accuracy, you keep VAR. If you want a quicker game/players able to freely celebrate etc then you scrap it. As far as I am concerned, if it is scrapped, people in favour cant then keep moaning about bad decisions.

Pie in the sky ideas about former players are not going to make much difference even if they are willing to do it, but I dont see how failed footballers could be able to profess to "know the game" anyway.

Communicate is vital for fans inside a stadium. who have zero communicate

If clubs vote for VAR stay in place then don't moan about still poor decisions. 

For me, I was against it coming in the first place cos we knew fans wouldn't get communicate with within stadium, still decisions are wrong when they are clear and obvious to give, etc. 

I hope they scrap it personally and go back to the old system which was much better 

[roversfan99]

Surely if the main issue is communication then that is something that could be fixed?

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

The argument Wolves put forward was specifically about how it affects the game, apparently anyway. Not about its accuracy or the decisions.

Wolves reasons

wolves - Search / X (twitter.com)

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

Surely if the main issue is communication then that is something that could be fixed?

It hasn't so far 

[wilsdenrover]

4 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The argument Wolves put forward was specifically about how it affects the game, apparently anyway. Not about its accuracy or the decisions.

Their (9) reasons included the following one:

 

 

[roversfan99]

18 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

Their (9) reasons included the following one:

 

 

I dont doubt that it can improve, but maybe that is partly based on unrealistic expectations that no errors will ever be made using VAR. At the end of the day, technology is just a tool, still being used by humans.

I appreciate there could be potential bias in such a statement, but they believe that decision accuracy has/had gone up from 82% to 96%. Obviously with more help decisions will be more accurats though:

https://www.premierleague.com/news/3886013#:~:text=Tony Scholes has said that,figure is 96 per cent.”

[wilsdenrover]

1 minute ago, roversfan99 said:

I dont doubt that it can improve, but maybe that is partly based on unrealistic expectations that no errors will ever be made using VAR. At the end of the day, technology is just a tool, still being used by humans.

I appreciate there could be potential bias in such a statement, but they believe that decision accuracy has/had gone up from 82% to 96%. Obviously with more help decisions will be more accurats though:

https://www.premierleague.com/news/3886013#:~:text=Tony Scholes has said that,figure is 96 per cent.”

96% seems high but obviously errors will be highlighted (by managers/media etc) more than the occasions when VAR gets it right.

Personally I’d scrap it but that’s mainly because I’m old fashioned 😄

[roversfan99]

8 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

96% seems high but obviously errors will be highlighted (by managers/media etc) more than the occasions when VAR gets it right.

Personally I’d scrap it but that’s mainly because I’m old fashioned 😄

I do get the arguments about the spontaneous game that has been somewhat left behind. But if we scrap it we are accepting a massive decrease in accuracy. So its whatever people feel is the lesser of two evils. There is no non VAR alternative that will significantly turn the dial in terms of correct decisions.

[chaddyrovers]

Fans opinions on whether to drop or continue with VAR or not.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5498633/2024/05/17/fans-want-clubs-to-scrap-var?source=user-shared-article

[arbitro]

De Zerbi is leaving Brighton they have announced. Interestingly I read a few days ago this was going to happen and that Brighton would be trying to bring Kompany in. It makes sense to me given the way they want to play.

[Oldgregg86]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

De Zerbi is leaving Brighton they have announced. Interestingly I read a few days ago this was going to happen and that Brighton would be trying to bring Kompany in. It makes sense to me given the way they want to play.

Strange one. I thought de zerbi was highly regarded, unless it’s his choice , but even then it’s a risk. Kompany would be perfect for Brighton and I honestly think he would thrive there 

[KentExile]

1 hour ago, Oldgregg86 said:

Strange one. I thought de zerbi was highly regarded, unless it’s his choice , but even then it’s a risk. Kompany would be perfect for Brighton and I honestly think he would thrive there 

Brighton have only won twice in the league in the last 3 months.  But that being said, he did look impressive, I've not checked this but from memory , their dip in form seemed to coincide with Mitomo getting injured

[BRFC4EVA]

Whenever I think about VAR, I always think about 'that' Berg decision against United at Ewood. 

The whole point of VAR is to remove the blantly obvious/howler/borderline cheating decisions that cost teams titles, relegation, promotion. 

We could have done with VAR at the end of 22/23 season with the cov and Dingle debacles. 

Keep it, reduce its use, speed it up and get the decisions right.

[M_B]

8 hours ago, arbitro said:

De Zerbi is leaving Brighton they have announced. Interestingly I read a few days ago this was going to happen and that Brighton would be trying to bring Kompany in. It makes sense to me given the way they want to play.

Keiran Mckenna in the frame apparently 

[chaddyrovers]

14 hours ago, arbitro said:

De Zerbi is leaving Brighton they have announced. Interestingly I read a few days ago this was going to happen and that Brighton would be trying to bring Kompany in. It makes sense to me given the way they want to play.

I wonder if De Zerbi is leaving to take over a club in Italy and that's why he is leaving. 

No surprised already Brighton have idea who they want like McKenna and Kompany 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

I wonder if De Zerbi is leaving to take over a club in Italy and that's why he is leaving. 

No surprised already Brighton have idea who they want like McKenna and Kompany 

McKenna or Kompany ? Give me a mili second to think about that one.