Venky’s v Indian Government (a) - 5/8/25 - Perennially Re-Arranged Challenge Match

[tomphil]

  On 06/09/2023 at 12:27, JohnD said:

No more than tax and other guesses that have been made.

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You didn't sit on the OJ Simpson trial did you ?  🙂

[Herbie6590]

  On 06/09/2023 at 11:10, RoversClitheroe said:

@Mike E got a link to the new Nicko article on Venkys Patreon?

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https://www.brfcs.com/magazine/articles/new-venky's-tax-twist/451

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

A statement from Venkys.....we are confused???🤪

Get this Shower out of our great Club for good...their aquisition of Rovers never felt right from day one.

Edited September 6, 2023 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[RoversClitheroe]

  On 06/09/2023 at 12:46, Herbie6590 said:

https://www.brfcs.com/magazine/articles/new-venky's-tax-twist/451

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 Cheers mate! 

Interesting times.

What will have to our great club

[Dreams of 1995]

I am filing this one under 'storm in a teacup'

[Mattyblue]

I’m with you Dreams, presumably it all has to reach a tipping point (unless this ownership outlives me) at some point in the medium-ish term, I just don’t think it’s yet.

Edited September 6, 2023 by Mattyblue

[wilsdenrover]

Having had a very cursory look at the Indian law in question (FEMA) it appears the issue is:

- This law requires any resident of India to get permission to acquire immovable            property (amongst other things) outside of India.

- Such permission, if granted, comes with conditions attached.

Given Venky’s extensive overseas operations, I can only assume they do have this permission - but that buying Alexander House wouldn’t have met the conditions imposed on this.

They’d need to be pretty stupid to have used the same tactic for the high profile purchase of a Premier League football club…

 

[wilsdenrover]

  On 06/09/2023 at 12:46, Herbie6590 said:

https://www.brfcs.com/magazine/articles/new-venky's-tax-twist/451

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Why is he calling it a tax twist when it’s nothing to do with tax??

[wilsdenrover]

  On 06/09/2023 at 12:42, tomphil said:

You didn't sit on the OJ Simpson trial did you ?  🙂

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Well if the glove fits…

[Crimpshrine]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:00, Dreams of 1995 said:

I am filing this one under 'storm in a teacup'

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It may blow over, but it has directly affected the budget over the past month or so.

Its the sort of thing that can affect the future of the club. We Don't need it. What's going to crop up next?

[JohnD]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:00, Dreams of 1995 said:

I am filing this one under ANOTHER 'storm in a teacup'

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There you go ...

[tomphil]

In no particular order......

 

Origin of money to buy the club

3rd party running the club

Steve Kean contract/bonuses/pay off

Monumental contract pay offs

Henning Berg sues

Derek Shaw sues

Money owed to Barclays / Samba sold to dodgy outfit after transfer window shuts

The highly questionable signings of Murphy/Etuhu/Portugeezers

Spurs game away and assorted others

Team meddling from India or elsewhere

3rd party owned players

Owen Coyle/firesale/relegation

Several failure managers from same agency in succession 

Embargo's

200 million plus in a decade but managed decline

Cattle prods

Lavassa

Akon investment via VLL

Several underfunded business schemes going bust elsewhere

Vaccine plant 100 mill that never materialised

Training ground

Taps turned off on TM BEFORE covid

No investment in players despite TWO legitimate top 6 placings in succesive Januarys

Taps off again

Tax issues

Investigation

Yeah just another storm in a teacup, place your bets on what the next one will be because it is guaranteed there'll be one !

[bluebruce]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:20, wilsdenrover said:

Why is he calling it a tax twist when it’s nothing to do with tax??

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Maybe because it's the tax authorities doing the seizing, as it will be tax forms that were filled in incorrectly?

[JohnD]

[wilsdenrover]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:34, bluebruce said:

Maybe because it's the tax authorities doing the seizing, as it will be tax forms that were filled in incorrectly?

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I’m not sure I’d call them the tax authorities - from their own website:

1. The Directorate of Enforcement or the ED is a multi-disciplinary organization mandated with investigation of economic crimes and violations of foreign exchange laws

I think it’s far more serious than the incorrect filling out of forms - from their press release:

 

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I get the feeling that in India if you get on the wrong side of the ruling party, for whatever reason, they can and will make life very hard for you. Stay in their good books and they’re quite happy to look the other way.

[Dreams of 1995]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:23, tomphil said:

Yeah just another storm in a teacup, place your bets on what the next one will be because it is guaranteed there'll be one !

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Most definitely

The Venkys are multinational business people, with hands in an industry that is typically 'dirty' anyway, without even factoring in the locations they operate in. They are clearly not afraid to rub shoulders with the wrong kinds of people

I just can't see this particular event being anything major to them. £7m is nothing money really; assuming they still own Alexander House it is probably worth more than that now, meaning any loss of Indian assets is really inconsequential to their personal wealth

I hope it is a bigger sign of a rift with the Indian government but personally think it will be another one to add to your long list without any real significant benefit to Rovers

[bluebruce]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:47, wilsdenrover said:

I’m not sure I’d call them the tax authorities - from their own website:

1. The Directorate of Enforcement or the ED is a multi-disciplinary organization mandated with investigation of economic crimes and violations of foreign exchange laws

I think it’s far more serious than the incorrect filling out of forms - from their press release:

 

 

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I don't know what they are, just going off the terminology Nixon used in his article. If he believes them to be tax authorities, that would be why he has used that title.

Ok, illegally filling out forms then. I didn't mean to imply it was just a 'whoopsy daisy'.

[Waggy76]

  On 06/09/2023 at 13:22, Crimpshrine said:

It may blow over, but it has directly affected the budget over the past month or so.

Its the sort of thing that can affect the future of the club. We Don't need it. What's going to crop up next?

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It probably will blow over now the transfer window is closed...

Come January, something else will crop up...

[J*B]

Here's my opinion - which of course, is all fairytale, hearsay and speculation.

This issue in itself is part of an ongoing biggue issue Venkys have with the Indian Government (has there been a change in Government recently? Or is there an election coming up which the current party needs to get people on board for?), like all big business it revolves around money. The house buy in the UK has some question marks against it and they're being investigated. Like all good accountants, they're working the system into their favour. 

This issue with the Government isn't just about the house, it involves them in other departments too. This is linked to the budget cut this season i.e. "We're not just going to pay you extra because you ask for it" and not just rolling over when sanctions which effect them economically are brought against them. 

The house purchase, from what I can see equates to less than 1% of Madame Desai's personal wealth, never mind the full family. The valuation of the Venky's brand/business is much harder to actually work out.

[1864roverite]

It’s probably noting more than mortgage fraud over in the UK!

[wilsdenrover]

  On 06/09/2023 at 14:13, 1864roverite said:

It’s probably noting more than mortgage fraud over in the UK!

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That would make it pretty serious then.

[lraC]

  On 06/09/2023 at 14:13, 1864roverite said:

It’s probably noting more than mortgage fraud over in the UK!

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If found guilty of mortgage fraud, a defendant faces up to 12 months in jail and a fine on summary conviction, or, on indictment, to imprisonment for a maximum jail term of 10 years and/or a fine.

I am a professional mortgage broker, so know this inside out. 

Edited September 6, 2023 by lraC

[tomphil]

No wonder they haven't been over here for years !

[1864roverite]

  On 06/09/2023 at 14:22, lraC said:

If found guilty of mortgage fraud, a defendant faces up to 12 months in jail and a fine on summary conviction, or, on indictment, to imprisonment for a maximum jail term of 10 years and/or a fine.

I am a professional mortgage broker, so know this inside out. 

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I doubt the sentencing guidelines in India do not reflect the UK’s!

UK law is far different than India’s or anywhere else for that matter! 

Edited September 6, 2023 by 1864roverite