Makhtar Gueye

[47er]

1 hour ago, DE. said:

BBC credited him with the assist.

Yeah i know! That's where I read it! He completely missed the ball. Assist? No way!

[Mattyblue]

Modern football data compiled by folk who don’t understand the game.

[roversfan99]

The assist stat in general is not the most meaningful. He also (admittedly he at least did this one on purpose) got one for winning a header at Burnley before Weimann thumped one in from 30 yards on the half volley. Hardly on a plate for him.

[DE.]

57 minutes ago, 47er said:

Yeah i know! That's where I read it! He completely missed the ball. Assist? No way!

Certainly wasn't an intentional assist, but I suppose the distinction isn't made between intentional and unintentional! On the other hand he would have been credited with the goal if it'd bounced into the goal off his arse unintentionally, so... it is what it is. 

[TugaysMarlboro]

15 hours ago, Bohinen1983 said:

To think people called, and still do, Jason Roberts a donkey..  Gueye is such a likeable guy.  Has some great attributes, I do hope it clicks for him..  He seems pretty decent running with the ball which suprises me a lot..

I think there's a lot to be said for character. The lad appears to actually be proud to wear the shirt. He's aggressive, wants to win, has a relationship with the fans. I love him.  A welcome, addition.  We've had much worse.  We've had better. For me, seeing someone wear the shirt that wants, and is proud to wear it is brilliant. 

I don't mind Gueye at all. I think his attitude and work rate are questionable when the chips are down and things aren't going his way, but he is a nuisance when up for it and is a presence in both boxes.

My issues are with his overall ability and goalscoring prowess. Imo, we can't hang our hat on him scoring the goals we'd need to sustain a promotion push.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

3 minutes ago, TugaysMarlboro said:

I don't mind Gueye at all. I think his attitude and work rate are questionable when the chips are down and things aren't going his way, but he is a nuisance when up for it and is a presence in both boxes.

My issues are with his overall ability and goalscoring prowess. Imo, we can't hang our hat on him scoring the goals we'd need to sustain a promotion push.

His temperament worries me, he seems to have a very short fuse.

[Rogerb]

16 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

His temperament worries me, he seems to have a very short fuse.

Volatile. But it can work both ways if someone presses the wrong buttons he could be an absolute beast.

[Exiled_Rover]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

The assist stat in general is not the most meaningful. He also (admittedly he at least did this one on purpose) got one for winning a header at Burnley before Weimann thumped one in from 30 yards on the half volley. Hardly on a plate for him.

But without winning the header, Weimann wouldn't have had the opportunity to 'thump one in from 30 yards on the half volley'.

It's a team game, innit. 

[...]

Only thing extra aside from more goals is pushing on a little more just applying more pressure, if he's been told to stay off fair e ough but just think there's occasions there's times he could of pressurised in certain moments. But his confidence is growing which is good

[Roverthechimp]

I like him, think he contributes a lot to the team ethos, is useful on the ball (at times), get in the right places for the opportunities and can actually win a header/flick on from a goal kick.

Fortunately we, so far, aren't relying on him to bang in 20 goals because his finishing is absolutely dreadful but he genuinely does cause problems for defenders creating chances for others. Without his "charisma/cheerleading" i'd be way more critical but every time he has come on with 10 to go to see the game out then we have achieved that objective. 

If, on the other hand, we needed a goal with 10 to go then i would still consider him an option. Not to actually score himself but in some way to create the opportunity for someone else to score...

[M_B]

Whether an assist is intentional or not is immaterial, if he wasn't there the goal wouldn't have been scored.

I don't know if the figure includes the one for Dolan against Derby, but if not that's another one really. We wanted an effective centre forward, the stats say we've got one.

[DE.]

Big Mak is your typical 'cult hero' player. Not the most talented, some obvious flaws in his game, but works hard, charismatic and does genuinely contribute on some level. People often compare him to SG, but we didn't pay £5m for Gueye and he presumably isn't one of our top earners, so expectations between the two will clearly be different. 

Not saying the fee or wages are SG's fault, for the record - that was solely down to the stupidity of those in charge of recruitment at the time - but nonetheless it does make a difference how how the two are judged, whether fair or not. 

[roversfan99]

49 minutes ago, M_B said:

Whether an assist is intentional or not is immaterial, if he wasn't there the goal wouldn't have been scored.

I don't know if the figure includes the one for Dolan against Derby, but if not that's another one really. We wanted an effective centre forward, the stats say we've got one.

Yesterday, he missed an absolute sitter, lets be honest. His knock down for Weimann was a good one but I was just highlighting how assisting x amount isnt as linear as that.

The main stat for a striker is goals scored and he is sorely lacking there.

[Tom]

A goal and an assist in his last game and a half, even discounting the shocking miss that turned into another assist it’s a good return especially considering his all round influence in those games.

If he could keep up that level of performance he’s an asset.

Failing that he’s still one of the best celebrators I’ve seen, I’d like to see him as a hype man at other events, although rumours that Donald Trump has tapped him up for the inauguration are wide of the mark 

[47er]

7 hours ago, DE. said:

Certainly wasn't an intentional assist, but I suppose the distinction isn't made between intentional and unintentional! On the other hand he would have been credited with the goal if it'd bounced into the goal off his arse unintentionally, so... it is what it is. 

"assist" clearly implies you did something positive. Anyway we move on....

[M_B]

22 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Yesterday, he missed an absolute sitter, lets be honest. His knock down for Weimann was a good one but I was just highlighting how assisting x amount isnt as linear as that.

The main stat for a striker is goals scored and he is sorely lacking there.

Players at our level of investment will always miss chances, he missed the sitter against Stoke. Then again the "assist" against Derby was ridiculously taken away from him.

I don't know why accepting that he's been effective is such a struggle. His goal involvement per time on the pitch is excellent.

If you want, for whatever reason, to try to argue it away, the figures will still be there.

Long may it continue as far as I'm concerned.

[roversfan99]

5 minutes ago, M_B said:

Players at our level of investment will always miss chances, he missed the sitter against Stoke. Then again the "assist" against Derby was ridiculously taken away from him.

I don't know why accepting that he's been effective is such a struggle. His goal involvement per time on the pitch is excellent.

If you want, for whatever reason, to try to argue it away, the figures will still be there.

Long may it continue as far as I'm concerned.

Because in the main, he hasnt been. The stats show the 2nd yesterday as a positive contribution, missing a tap in but it hitting his foot slightly and a team mate cleaning up his mess.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

I must have watched the incident 10 times and I still can’t figure out how he missed his shot.

[M_B]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Because in the main, he hasnt been. The stats show the 2nd yesterday as a positive contribution, missing a tap in but it hitting his foot slightly and a team mate cleaning up his mess.

The stats show his proper assist against Derby wasn't an assist when it clearly was.

Is he quality, obviously not. But if we'd signed a, "quality" forward with Gueye's numbers in front of goal,however they came about, we'd be happy.

I'm surprised by the figures, but pleasantly surprised.

It should also be noted, those figures are playing in a team which doesn't exactly score freely.

 

Edited December 15 by M_B

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, M_B said:

The stats show his proper assist against Derby wasn't an assist when it clearly was.

Is he quality, obviously not. But if we'd signed a, "quality" forward with Gueye's numbers in front of goal,however they came about, we'd be happy.

I'm surprised by the figures, but pleasantly surprised.

It should also be noted, those figures are playing in a team which doesn't exactly score freely.

 

Assist stats clearly arent concrete enough to base an opinion as to whether a striker has been effective overall, thats the key.

Goals is a bit different because you are the one getting them, but assist is such a sliding scale of involvement, whether its putting one on a plate, merely happening to play a 5 yard pass to someone who then scores a wonder goal or an accidental touch.

He has 5 assists, but I think you have to judge assists beyond just the number. His first yesterday was good play but Cozier Duberry has scored a goal by stopping, turning and then shooting and obviously the second was an embarassing miss. The one for Sigurdsson v Oxford was turned from nothing much into something by a clever turn. And the header v Burnley was well won but its a 30 yard half volley. The one against Norwich was where he slipped Hedges in on goal so a bit different. But those 5 contributions are in the main quite minor in terms of the actual goal or in one case, actually an example of terrible play, so I dont think personally that they change the narrative to his work being a pleasant surprise or being effective overall.

A striker who has 1 goal with 1 game left before christmas having missed numerous sitters is not good enough. There have been some occasions of bits of good play and signs of good hold up, but im not having that he overall has been anything other than poor.

[Commondore]

16 hours ago, Exiled_Rover said:

But without winning the header, Weimann wouldn't have had the opportunity to 'thump one in from 30 yards on the half volley'.

It's a team game, innit. 

It was a good header as well, and if Weimann hadn’t pulled off that volley he’d still be in a great position to advance on their goal. Great contribution from Gueye.

[Ossydave]

Whilst I hope Gueye continues to improve and its good to see him at least contributing a bit, he's still very much a liability risk.

His miss that people are claiming an assist for could have cost us the game the other day, likewise his stupid red against Burnley. He always seems to be at risk of a booking, pretty sure that was the case at his last team too.

I could just imagine him in a play off final having a Gazza moment in the first minute and getting sent off for a horror tackle or diving to save a shot with his hand.

[arbitro]

11 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I must have watched the incident 10 times and I still can’t figure out how he missed his shot.

I thought he got slightly ahead of the ball. Yuki's ball across was excellent but Gueye got a bit excited and misread the weight of the pass for me.

[Exiled_Rover]

48 minutes ago, arbitro said:

I thought he got slightly ahead of the ball. Yuki's ball across was excellent but Gueye got a bit excited and misread the weight of the pass for me.

He was calling for it much earlier.

Still no excuse for missing it, but I think the timing was all wrong for him.

He's actually made several good runs in the last couple of games where, if our players had seen him, he beats the offside trap and is through on goal. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

His timing was all wrong, Ohashi did everything right. He put it on a plate. I could have hit the target from that pass, bad knee or not. The only other point is Kaminski did really well to get down to spread himself for the shot that he thought was coming. Maybe that put Guyere off.