v QPR (h) - 28/09/24

[47er]

1 hour ago, Hasta said:

Considering they brought only about 800, 13k+ wasn’t too bad.

However it felt much less than that. My two season ticket holding buddies didn’t go and I suspect quite a few others.

 

They'd have been counted present though!

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, Neal said:

 

A little harsh I think. If you think back to the Bristol game, we created hardly anything for Ohashi, first chance we gave him he battered in the top corner and then he created another for himself out of nothing. We've created little for our forwards but given us a fantastic return on not much supply. 

 

We can round and round about it but let's be honest, nothing needs to change at all. Eustace has us set up not to get beat and we're unbeaten and 2nd in the league, keeping clean sheets and scoring goals. It's pointless nit picking about this and that whilst we're picking up points. When the results turn then perhaps it's time to talk about our creativity (or lack of) but right now things are as good as they possibly can be and despite our league position we can still improve. 

I suppose all of what we say is nit picking, thats part of being a fan analysing everything.

But its not a criticism of Eustace necessarily as his hands have been tied with players not up to speed having signed late. We should always look to improve and especially with Cantwell managing 45 yesterday, he is an obvious solution to our lack of creativity. There are signs that defensively we are certainly looking stronger and the midfield 2 is certainly a good partnership whereas the attack still I think can be improved. Hedges is not good enough to be starting every week, and we have struggled to find a solution in general especially out wide. Cozier-Duberry can also hopefully help to give us pace which again might help to create chances more regularly.

[tonyoz]

4 hours ago, cesus said:

I think we are currently reaping the rewards of actually having a bench this season.

In the 5 sub game, the opponents can sink you with the ability to freshen up with quality. 

I think that absolutely killed us last season.

One of Eustace’s priorities seems to be keeping everyone involved via his use of subs. As well as adding fresh quality and variety at the appropriate time, more players are getting the chance to impress. I like it.

[Hasta]

1 hour ago, 47er said:

They'd have been counted present though!

I know. Just making the point it looked to me like quite a lot of season ticket holders sacked it off, possibly because of the kick off time.
 

If we did therefore get 4000 walk-ons who wanted to come on a Saturday lunchtime against uninspiring opposition when it’s available on Sky  that’s pretty good.

Edited September 29 by Hasta

[Mattyblue]

4,000 walk ons is plenty. But say we had 12k ST holders instead with 4k walk ons, all of a sudden Ewood is pretty busy, especially if a decent away following rocks up.

Until we substantially grow our ST base Ewood will never feel particularly full. The dreadful ST pricing/campaigns are completely the issue. Sort those out and crowds increase. Simple as that, as Bolton are showing. 

[Forever Blue]

3 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

4,000 walk ons is plenty. But say we had 12k ST holders instead with 4k walk ons, all of a sudden Ewood is pretty busy, especially if a decent away following rocks up.

Until we substantially grow our ST base Ewood will never feel particularly full. The dreadful ST pricing/campaigns are completely the issue. Sort those out and crowds increase. Simple as that, as Bolton are showing. 

You might want to let Rudy know. The king of communicators was blaming the fans the other week. 

[wilsdenrover]

4 hours ago, arbitro said:

Experience taught me to back my gut reaction to serious incidents. I don't like it when referees are slow to issue red cards as to me it looks like they are in doubt. The incident where the Nobber was sent off last week was 51 seconds from the challenge to the red card being shown. I honestly thought he was going yellow given the time lapse. It also acts as a pacifier to any players looking for retribution. I have heard commentators praising this by saying the referee was taking their time. I disagree and like to see decisive refereeing.

Is that what the ‘higher ups’ said you should do or did you start to ignore their guidance?

[bluebruce]

6 hours ago, Rochdale_rover said:

So strange how people see the game .

I thought first half by his standards was the best he'd played in a long time.

Second half way back to same old dolan. 

Cwe could have had another 2 or 3 goals but he holds on to the ball too long . Loses it or does a poor pass and another attack breaks down 

 

Second half when he assisted the first goal?

[arbitro]

23 minutes ago, wilsdenrover said:

Is that what the ‘higher ups’ said you should do or did you start to ignore their guidance?

Experience taught me. Everyone is different but I found that worked for me and in flashpoints it had a calming effect on any players who wanted to seek retribution. 

[Herbie6590]

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

6 hours ago, Rochdale_rover said:

So strange how people see the game .

I thought first half by his standards was the best he'd played in a long time.

Second half way back to same old dolan. 

Cwe could have had another 2 or 3 goals but he holds on to the ball too long . Loses it or does a poor pass and another attack breaks down 

 

That’s his biggest failing, he want’s that extra touch too often. That’s what made Sammi the threat he became in and around the penalty area. He just took the minimum of touches to set himself up for a shot or a pass.

[WacoRover]

We were in Canmore, Banff, & Lake Louise during the last two games. I will say, I am very pleased with our run to start the season, and the way Eustace has handled the team.

I don’t have the time to look back through every page, but is it true Eustace might be looking elsewhere for employment?

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I suppose all of what we say is nit picking, thats part of being a fan analysing everything.

But its not a criticism of Eustace necessarily as his hands have been tied with players not up to speed having signed late. We should always look to improve and especially with Cantwell managing 45 yesterday, he is an obvious solution to our lack of creativity. There are signs that defensively we are certainly looking stronger and the midfield 2 is certainly a good partnership whereas the attack still I think can be improved. Hedges is not good enough to be starting every week, and we have struggled to find a solution in general especially out wide. Cozier-Duberry can also hopefully help to give us pace which again might help to create chances more regularly.

Who is benchmark for Gueye and Ohashi to be judge by? 

Aren’t we Championship joint top scores? 

Defensively we are much stronger with Travis and Tronstad protecting the back 4 but we don't get hit on the counter either. 

Why isn't Hedges a starter for you? 

[roversfan99]

40 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Who is benchmark for Gueye and Ohashi to be judge by? 

Aren’t we Championship joint top scores? 

Defensively we are much stronger with Travis and Tronstad protecting the back 4 but we don't get hit on the counter either. 

Why isn't Hedges a starter for you? 

Because Hedges isnt good enough. He doesnt do enough to justify repeated selection.

Regarding the benchmark for Gueye and Ohashi, its hard to say, just that it shouldnt be the pitiful goals tally from our strikers last year.

My point was simply that both have not played well in the last 2 games, so commenting on that is valid. And simply that its hard to figure out exactly how good they are at this level so far. The question marks on Gueye are around how many goals he is capable of scoring. The question marks about Ohashi are about his ineffectiveness aside from in front of goal where he seems really composed. If he somehow maintained his goals per minutes ratio or even got close to across 46 games, he would be right up there for the golden boot which would be incredible.

I would like to see a minimum target of maybe 20 between them?

[doctorryan]

7 hours ago, wilsdenrover said:

See below for full list of tie breakers:

Sorry Wilsden, well done: but you & I are quoting from 2 different bibles (you the EFL Handbook & me the FAPL one (see below)).

It's my understanding that promotion up to the PL would need to meet the requirements below. In other words, no one would get an automatic promotion spot (to the PL anyway) based on penalty points. but I do agree that the EFL Handbook states what you say it does.  Since the scenario below has never happened going back to 1888, we're probably spending more time than necessary here, but for what it's worth: 

From this year's PL handbook:

C.4. The position of Clubs in the League Table shall be determined by the number of points
scored in the Competition during that Season; the Club having scored the highest
number of points being at the top of the League Table and the Club having scored the
lowest number of points being at the bottom.

C.5. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points their position in the
League Table shall be determined on goal difference, that is to say, the difference
between the total number of goals scored by and against a Club in League Matches
in the Competition during that Season (“Goal Difference”), and the higher or
highest placed Club shall be the Club with the higher or highest Goal Difference.

C.6. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points and have the same
Goal Difference the higher or highest placed Club shall be the Club having scored
the most goals in League Matches in the Competition during that Season.

C.7. Subject to Rule C.17, if any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of
points, have the same Goal Difference and have scored the same number of goals in
League Matches in the Competition during that Season, they shall be deemed to
occupy the same position in the League Table.

C.17. If following the completion of the Competition
either the League Champions or the Clubs to be relegated or the question of
qualification for other competitions cannot be determined because two or more
Clubs are equal on points, Goal Difference and goals scored, the relative position in
the League Table of the Clubs will be determined by the following means:

C.17.1. the total points scored by the relevant Clubs in the League Matches in that
Season’s Competition contested by those Clubs (“Head-to-Head
Matches”), with the Club having scored the highest number of points in
Head-to-Head Matches occupying the highest position in the League
Table and the Club having scored the lowest number of points in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the lowest position in the League Table;

C.17.2. if the Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1, the Club
scoring the higher number of goals whilst the Visiting Club in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the higher position in the League Table; and

C.17.3. if two Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1 or C.17.2, a
play-off on a neutral ground, the format, timing and venue of which shall be
determined by the Board.

 

In my book we're level....& if anybody ever gets promoted or relegated (between any of the divisions) based on anything after 9.3.2 in your post above it will be a scandal.  The Premier League & the Football League should really be on the same page in this case & The FA should require it.

But that's going down a whole other rabbit hole........

[wilsdenrover]

3 hours ago, doctorryan said:

Sorry Wilsden, well done: but you & I are quoting from 2 different bibles (you the EFL Handbook & me the FAPL one (see below)).

It's my understanding that promotion up to the PL would need to meet the requirements below. In other words, no one would get an automatic promotion spot (to the PL anyway) based on penalty points. but I do agree that the EFL Handbook states what you say it does.  Since the scenario below has never happened going back to 1888, we're probably spending more time than necessary here, but for what it's worth: 

From this year's PL handbook:

C.4. The position of Clubs in the League Table shall be determined by the number of points
scored in the Competition during that Season; the Club having scored the highest
number of points being at the top of the League Table and the Club having scored the
lowest number of points being at the bottom.

C.5. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points their position in the
League Table shall be determined on goal difference, that is to say, the difference
between the total number of goals scored by and against a Club in League Matches
in the Competition during that Season (“Goal Difference”), and the higher or
highest placed Club shall be the Club with the higher or highest Goal Difference.

C.6. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points and have the same
Goal Difference the higher or highest placed Club shall be the Club having scored
the most goals in League Matches in the Competition during that Season.

C.7. Subject to Rule C.17, if any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of
points, have the same Goal Difference and have scored the same number of goals in
League Matches in the Competition during that Season, they shall be deemed to
occupy the same position in the League Table.

C.17. If following the completion of the Competition
either the League Champions or the Clubs to be relegated or the question of
qualification for other competitions cannot be determined because two or more
Clubs are equal on points, Goal Difference and goals scored, the relative position in
the League Table of the Clubs will be determined by the following means:

C.17.1. the total points scored by the relevant Clubs in the League Matches in that
Season’s Competition contested by those Clubs (“Head-to-Head
Matches”), with the Club having scored the highest number of points in
Head-to-Head Matches occupying the highest position in the League
Table and the Club having scored the lowest number of points in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the lowest position in the League Table;

C.17.2. if the Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1, the Club
scoring the higher number of goals whilst the Visiting Club in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the higher position in the League Table; and

C.17.3. if two Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1 or C.17.2, a
play-off on a neutral ground, the format, timing and venue of which shall be
determined by the Board.

 

In my book we're level....& if anybody ever gets promoted or relegated (between any of the divisions) based on anything after 9.3.2 in your post above it will be a scandal.  The Premier League & the Football League should really be on the same page in this case & The FA should require it.

But that's going down a whole other rabbit hole........

The worst bit of rule 9.4 (in my opinion) is the penalty points are taken after 42 games and not at the end of the season.

 

Edited September 29 by wilsdenrover

[chaddyrovers]

37 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Because Hedges isnt good enough. He doesnt do enough to justify repeated selection.

Ok thanks for the reply whilst we have disagree on this 

37 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Regarding the benchmark for Gueye and Ohashi, its hard to say, just that it shouldnt be the pitiful goals tally from our strikers last year.

My point was simply that both have not played well in the last 2 games, so commenting on that is valid. And simply that its hard to figure out exactly how good they are at this level so far. The question marks on Gueye are around how many goals he is capable of scoring. The question marks about Ohashi are about his ineffectiveness aside from in front of goal where he seems really composed. If he somehow maintained his goals per minutes ratio or even got close to across 46 games, he would be right up there for the golden boot which would be incredible.

I would like to see a minimum target of maybe 20 between them?

Its still early for both and they have been working with Keith Downing on finishing and movement. 

I think ten goals from each of them is fair target. Both have very different set of attributes and allow us to play different way which is what you want. Both have impress me so far.  

[roversfan99]

4 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Ok thanks for the reply whilst we have disagree on this 

Its still early for both and they have been working with Keith Downing on finishing and movement. 

I think ten goals from each of them is fair target. Both have very different set of attributes and allow us to play different way which is what you want. Both have impress me so far.  

Of course its important to work on finishing, but I do think that Ohashi is a naturally composed finisher whereas Gueye is technically poor in front of goal and will never be a natural finisher. Whereas Gueye offers more outside of goalscoring.

As it stands now, I think I would be pleasantly surprised if Gueye gets to 10. Whereas I would be disappointed if Ohashi only gets 6 more.

[bluebruce]

1 hour ago, doctorryan said:

Sorry Wilsden, well done: but you & I are quoting from 2 different bibles (you the EFL Handbook & me the FAPL one (see below)).

It's my understanding that promotion up to the PL would need to meet the requirements below. In other words, no one would get an automatic promotion spot (to the PL anyway) based on penalty points. but I do agree that the EFL Handbook states what you say it does.  Since the scenario below has never happened going back to 1888, we're probably spending more time than necessary here, but for what it's worth: 

From this year's PL handbook:

C.4. The position of Clubs in the League Table shall be determined by the number of points
scored in the Competition during that Season; the Club having scored the highest
number of points being at the top of the League Table and the Club having scored the
lowest number of points being at the bottom.

C.5. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points their position in the
League Table shall be determined on goal difference, that is to say, the difference
between the total number of goals scored by and against a Club in League Matches
in the Competition during that Season (“Goal Difference”), and the higher or
highest placed Club shall be the Club with the higher or highest Goal Difference.

C.6. If any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of points and have the same
Goal Difference the higher or highest placed Club shall be the Club having scored
the most goals in League Matches in the Competition during that Season.

C.7. Subject to Rule C.17, if any two or more Clubs have scored the same number of
points, have the same Goal Difference and have scored the same number of goals in
League Matches in the Competition during that Season, they shall be deemed to
occupy the same position in the League Table.

C.17. If following the completion of the Competition
either the League Champions or the Clubs to be relegated or the question of
qualification for other competitions cannot be determined because two or more
Clubs are equal on points, Goal Difference and goals scored, the relative position in
the League Table of the Clubs will be determined by the following means:

C.17.1. the total points scored by the relevant Clubs in the League Matches in that
Season’s Competition contested by those Clubs (“Head-to-Head
Matches”), with the Club having scored the highest number of points in
Head-to-Head Matches occupying the highest position in the League
Table and the Club having scored the lowest number of points in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the lowest position in the League Table;

C.17.2. if the Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1, the Club
scoring the higher number of goals whilst the Visiting Club in Head-to-
Head Matches occupying the higher position in the League Table; and

C.17.3. if two Clubs cannot be separated by operation of Rule C.17.1 or C.17.2, a
play-off on a neutral ground, the format, timing and venue of which shall be
determined by the Board.

 

In my book we're level....& if anybody ever gets promoted or relegated (between any of the divisions) based on anything after 9.3.2 in your post above it will be a scandal.  The Premier League & the Football League should really be on the same page in this case & The FA should require it.

But that's going down a whole other rabbit hole........

Isn't that just the rules for within the Premier League though rather than to get promoted to it? I may have missed it but I only see reference to qualification for competitions, nothing about promotion. So they seem to be the rules for getting into Europe. The EFL as its own entity has a right to totally different rules as to who it decides gets promotion.

[chaddyrovers]

29 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Of course its important to work on finishing, but I do think that Ohashi is a naturally composed finisher whereas Gueye is technically poor in front of goal and will never be a natural finisher. Whereas Gueye offers more outside of goalscoring.

As it stands now, I think I would be pleasantly surprised if Gueye gets to 10. Whereas I would be disappointed if Ohashi only gets 6 more.

All fair points but I do feel you can improve the finishing attribute of players. Gueye's strengthen is his heading finishing which is why I want to crosses into the box when he is playing, plus more of his movement around the box. 

We also have to created chances for them firstly which we don't enough for me. 

[roversfan99]

6 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

All fair points but I do feel you can improve the finishing attribute of players. Gueye's strengthen is his heading finishing which is why I want to crosses into the box when he is playing, plus more of his movement around the box. 

We also have to created chances for them firstly which we don't enough for me. 

We dont create enough chances, I would agree. I have mentioned a few times that I am hopeful that once everyone is up to speed, that we figure out a better combination in the attacking areas. Cantwell is better than everyone else and has the ability to create. Hopefully Cozier Duberry's pace can help to create more chances. 

[chaddyrovers]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

We dont create enough chances, I would agree. I have mentioned a few times that I am hopeful that once everyone is up to speed, that we figure out a better combination in the attacking areas. Cantwell is better than everyone else and has the ability to create. Hopefully Cozier Duberry's pace can help to create more chances. 

We are joint top goal scorers in the league were we aren't creatively loads of chances but being more clinical than previous seasons. We look a good team with a great team ethic and Eustace has build a team full of spirit but confidence. 

Cantwell in our team playing wide left or in 10 role. I wouldn't start him on Tuesday but would at Plymouth on the left side of the attack. 

Edited September 29 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

We are joint top goal scorers in the league were we aren't creatively loads of chances but being more clinical than previous seasons. We look a good team with a great team ethic and Eustace has build a team full of spirit but confidence. 

Cantwell in our team playing wide left or in 10 role. I wouldn't start him on Wednesday but would at Plymouth on the left side of the attack. 

I wouldnt start Cantwell on Wednesday but I would on Tuesday. And in the middle, he is our best player, he can make a third midfielder with his quality on the ball and some of the others are better off the ball, the position behind the striker is where you can get away with that a bit more.

[RoversTilliDie]

24 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I wouldnt start Cantwell on Wednesday but I would on Tuesday. And in the middle, he is our best player, he can make a third midfielder with his quality on the ball and some of the others are better off the ball, the position behind the striker is where you can get away with that a bit more.

I would definitely consider starting with Cantwell, he had an excellent game when he came on, and put a fantastic cross into the box for Danny Batths goal, and  he's still not 100% match fit.Its competition for Andi Weiman. It will keep players on their toes, with competition for places.

[RoversTilliDie]

The great thing so far this season, goals are coming from all over the pitch. I thought  Rovers  were a bit scrappy in the first half yesterday, until Q.P.R. (who could have took the lead) had a man sent off. After saying that Q.P.R. were decent opposition, teams dont let you win. I thimk Cantwell and Duberry were bright sparks, when they came on. We have still got our 100% home record intact and are still unbeaten in the Championship.