January Transfer window

[Admiral Nelsen]

 

Just now, Wegerleswiggle said:

Bucko needs a run of games. No point bringing him on for 20 mins when we're chasing a game because that's not what he brings. If he gets his head down and puts in 75% of the effort Trav does then he's a decent player. 

However I don't think he suits playing as a 2 man midfield and there are better options further forward. 

 

 

Don't want to be making excuses for Buckley - without question he's been a very disappointing player thus far - but I get the sense that he's a player who suffers a lot more than most by not having  some rhythm in his game. And he's not had a proper run of starts in ages. 

 

[RevidgeBlue]

4 minutes ago, Wegerleswiggle said:

However I don't think he suits playing as a 2 man midfield and there are better options further forward

I'd take 2021 Buckley over Cantwell every day of the week.

Whether we ever see that version again though I very much doubt.

[onlyonejackwalker]

40 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

The Court case doesn't affect Rovers - they just seemingly don't want to fund us properly anymore - the legal proceedings would appear to have been  a very convenient excuse over the last couple of years. Maybe initially they were prevented from sending funds over without obtaining the permission of the authorities but that doesn't seem to be the case any longer and the excuse is wearing extremely thin now.

Even Waggott admits there's no impediment to them funding us.

19 out of 20 premier league clubs lose money. They rely on owner top ups or player sales. The exception being West Ham largely because their stadium is subsidised. The average weekly loss in the Championship is 400k per week. 120k a week in League One.

The Venkys pay all the bills and prevent us going bust. In business terms that is classed as proper funding. What you class as proper funding is chasing their debts, gambling even more to get to the promised land.

When they bought the club we were losing circa 3 to 4m per year in the PL turning over roughly 50 million. 

A succession of disastrous decisions, the first being sacking Allardyce, resulted in relegation wiping 30 million off our turnover. Fourteen years later, with the current PL income that equates to north of 100 million turnover lost per year.

It's a situation of their own making, so there can be no excuses.

I just imagine now, having trusted a million and one managers and coaches, directors, executives, recruitment specialists, consultants, agents and supposed knowledgeable sporting folk and having watched these charlatans oversee huge losses in company turnover, the unforgiveable use of the parachute payments, two relegations etc whilst spunking huge money at all stages of this venture that the owners are well and truly LOST.

Some state their is a cunning Venky plan to keep us marooned at this level. Really? 

That doesn't make any sense to me or probably to many others.. I just think they hate everything they have to deal with concerning the Rovers and regret the purchase immensely. And they have no choice but to fund the operating costs whilst hoping and praying we magically get promoted to help relieve the nightmare.

They don't have a clue what they are doing. Or what to do. Or who to trust. Being good in one business doesn't make you good in all businesses.

 

[joey_big_nose]

14 minutes ago, J*B said:

Buckley having 134 minutes this season and 500 odd minutes last season tells me one thing - neither JDT nor Eustace thought he was good enough. 

And I agree - in my opinion it looks like he can play, but only if it’s on his terms. If he isn’t allowed to stroll around and attempt to dictate play he’s in trouble. He can’t tackle, can’t beat the press, can’t shoot and doesn’t have an outstanding engine on him. 

I'd say he can tackle and press quite well - that was one of his major assets when he got a good run a couple of seasons ago. He would win the ball high up the pitch nicking it off opposition players. He has lost that for some reason. Hopefully he can bring it back. In terms of shooting and goal scoring his numbers are equivalent to any other centre midfielder we have had (i.e. pretty abysmal - Travis, Rothwell etc good for 2 to 3 goals a year which is where Buckley is at over a full season). And I would say he can cover a decent amount of ground for a midfielder too...

He has looked demotivated and off it, but he's got those ingredients imo.

[RoversClitheroe]

3 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

I'd take 2021 Buckley over Cantwell every day of the week.

Whether we ever see that version again though I very much doubt.

2021 Buckley and 2021 Cantwell? 

[RevidgeBlue]

9 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Pre Wharton, Buckley was internally revered as the ‘next big thing’. In truth, he has all the ingredients and in spite of what is said on here, his attitude is not in question.

It’s been re-written in here (more times than I’d care to say), but 6 months after he broke in, the season he was ‘Young player of the year’ there were literally scores of Premier League clubs coming to watch him. He was being touted as the next big thing. I posted in here that I was in the players lounge at half time and I spoke to the Everton scout who said there were “a dozen or so PL clubs looking at Buckley” and that Rovers had intimated it would be £10m to even start a conversation.

To qualify this, I also stated at the time that I didn’t actually rate Buckley ‘that’ highly… (A bit which is often left out by the dullards who bring this up, year after year 🤣).

Ultimately, Buckley had all the promise of Adam Wharton and never kicked on. It’s sad and he’s literally sat in last chance saloon. Weirdly, if he just showed some fuckin urgency and desire, I think he’s a FARRR better player than Baker and he’d have a career in the Championship, no problems.

Is it a contradiction in terms to say "his attitude is not in question" but then "if he just showed some fucking urgency and desire"?

I agree with the second bit. I look at him now and think the fire has gone out of his belly. He just doesn't look like he's enjoying being out there these days.

[RevidgeBlue]

1 minute ago, RoversClitheroe said:

2021 Buckley and 2021 Cantwell? 

No,  2024-5 Cantwell. Obviously.

[joey_big_nose]

I

16 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Pre Wharton, Buckley was internally revered as the ‘next big thing’. In truth, he has all the ingredients and in spite of what is said on here, his attitude is not in question.

It’s been re-written in here (more times than I’d care to say), but 6 months after he broke in, the season he was ‘Young player of the year’ there were literally scores of Premier League clubs coming to watch him. He was being touted as the next big thing. I posted in here that I was in the players lounge at half time and I spoke to the Everton scout who said there were “a dozen or so PL clubs looking at Buckley” and that Rovers had intimated it would be £10m to even start a conversation.

To qualify this, I also stated at the time that I didn’t actually rate Buckley ‘that’ highly… (A bit which is often left out by the dullards who bring this up, year after year 🤣).

Ultimately, Buckley had all the promise of Adam Wharton and never kicked on. It’s sad and he’s literally sat in last chance saloon. Weirdly, if he just showed some fuckin urgency and desire, I think he’s a FARRR better player than Baker and he’d have a career in the Championship, no problems.

I am curious about how both the bits in bold can be true??

[Exiled_Rover]

7 minutes ago, onlyonejackwalker said:

19 out of 20 premier league clubs lose money. They rely on owner top ups or player sales. The exception being West Ham largely because their stadium is subsidised. The average weekly loss in the Championship is 400k per week. 120k a week in League One.

The Venkys pay all the bills and prevent us going bust. In business terms that is classed as proper funding. What you class as proper funding is chasing their debts, gambling even more to get to the promised land.

When they bought the club we were losing circa 3 to 4m per year in the PL turning over roughly 50 million. 

A succession of disastrous decisions, the first being sacking Allardyce, resulted in relegation wiping 30 million off our turnover. Fourteen years later, with the current PL income that equates to north of 100 million turnover lost per year.

It's a situation of their own making, so there can be no excuses.

I just imagine now, having trusted a million and one managers and coaches, directors, executives, recruitment specialists, consultants, agents and supposed knowledgeable sporting folk and having watched these charlatans oversee huge losses in company turnover, the unforgiveable use of the parachute payments, two relegations etc whilst spunking huge money at all stages of this venture that the owners are well and truly LOST.

Some state their is a cunning Venky plan to keep us marooned at this level. Really? 

That doesn't make any sense to me or probably to many others.. I just think they hate everything they have to deal with concerning the Rovers and regret the purchase immensely. And they have no choice but to fund the operating costs whilst hoping and praying we magically get promoted to help relieve the nightmare.

They don't have a clue what they are doing. Or what to do. Or who to trust. Being good in one business doesn't make you good in all businesses.

 

So why haven't they cut their losses and sold us then?

[Emerald Isle Rover]

1 minute ago, joey_big_nose said:

I

I am curious about how both the bits in bold can be true??

Was wondering the same thing myself 

[Exiled_Rover]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

No,  2024-5 Cantwell. Obviously.

Cantwell has been good this year, he's just got very little to work with. No pace / trickery out wide and no real pace up front. He's fluffed a few opportunities with Gueye recently, so hopefully they start operating on the same wave length soon. 

[roversfan99]

Theres no way that Buckley is a decent player putting in 75% effort. Im sure he is putting in more than that now.

How highly rated he was as a kid is total conjecture but there are loads of players who are highly rated before theyve really emerged and do not go on to have anything like the career people may have thought. Standing out in young age groups doesnt equate to going on to having a career at the top.

I think putting questions about his attitude aside, he isnt as talented as some people still seem to think. Maybe its his style (which maybe also increases perceptions about his lack of effort) that makes people think he better than he is. When you first see him he appears smooth on the ball. But he is too slow of thought, lending himself to being dispossed and he often resorts to fairly aimless lobs forward to no one in particular. He loves a lofted pass forward where even if it was accurate, its very difficult for an attacker to do anything with.

He had a couple of good months in Mowbray's last season in a position where he was predominantly there to win the ball back, he wasnt receiving the ball in tight areas and his lack of goal threat during that period was not costly because it was during Brereton's purple patch. Since he has never really sustained any sort of form, he went on loan to a poor side and couldnt get a kick and 2 managers havent fancied him since. 

[LeftWinger]

9 minutes ago, Exiled_Rover said:

Cantwell has been good this year, he's just got very little to work with. No pace / trickery out wide and no real pace up front. He's fluffed a few opportunities with Gueye recently, so hopefully they start operating on the same wave length soon. 

Exactly this. Half the time when Cantwell has the ball there is zero movement around him. I've seen a few examples recently where several players will only play the ball to Gueye as a last resort.

[Paul Mani]

17 minutes ago, joey_big_nose said:

I

I am curious about how both the bits in bold can be true??

As in, not in question amongst the coaches etc.

[roverandout]

Shame Tom cannon has been recalled because that means Nathan Lowe gone back to stoke.  I was going to suggest seeing if Stoke would be interested in an offer for lowe. He's only just turned 19. 6'4. He's got 15 goals in 22 games for Walsall.

Edited 11 hours ago by roverandout

[RoversClitheroe]

28 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

No,  2024-5 Cantwell. Obviously.

True.

I've not rated Cantwell, not sure what he's contributed this season?

He's no Dack that's for sure and I thought Cantwell would deliver like Dack did for us

[joey_big_nose]

10 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

As in, not in question amongst the coaches etc.

Ah so the coaching staff don't think he has an attitude problem? But you, me and everyone on this board does?

[RevidgeBlue]

11 minutes ago, onlyonejackwalker said:

The Venkys pay all the bills and prevent us going bust. In business terms that is classed as proper funding. What you class as proper funding is chasing their debts, gambling even more to get to the promised land

That's nonsense and I'm sure you know it. Running a successful professional  football Club is not simply covering the bills.

If the sole aim is indeed to get the Club to be largely self sufficient and "wash it's own face" as even Jack stated was his ultimate wish once upon a time, then anyone who's been watching the game for a long time such as you or I know full well that you have to recruit well and sell at a profit, rinse and repeat. 

The vast majority of the time this requires a reasonable amount of investment in the playing side because as a general rule of thumb quality doesn't come cheap.

This lot seem to think that we can just churn out an Adam Wharton every year to pay the bills and if anyone else is sold you don't have to reinvest anything into new players. Again an experienced observer such as yourself will know that genius's like Duff and Adam Wharton probably only come round once every 20 years or so and even finding a big profit maker like Szmodics can't be relied upon on an annual basis. And if you don't speculate to accumulate with your players in general the well is likely to eventually dry up as seems about to happen soon.

At the end of the day, if your recruitment is good, you will never lose out anyway - if you make a good signing you'll break even at worst and if it's really good as a whole you might actually achieve that dream of promotion.

[Mashed Potatoes]

59 minutes ago, roverblue said:

Have you got a source for this? I thought the last cash sent to the club was the court authorised payment in late 2023?

Yes - if you look on the Venkys London Limited company information service website you will see on the filing history tab that there was an allotment of shares on 18 March that took the company's capital from £219m to £230m.

[Torgeir]

15 minutes ago, roverandout said:

Shame Tom cannon has been recalled because that means Nathan Lowe gone back to stoke.  I was going to suggest seeing if Stoke would be interested in an offer for lowe. He's only just turned 19. 6'4. He's got 15 goals in 22 games for Walsall.

Would think Stoke will want to test him at L1, like we're doing with Markanday.

[RevidgeBlue]

7 minutes ago, Torgeir said:

Would think Stoke will want to test him at L1, like we're doing with Markanday.

If he's scored 15 in 22, they probably want to test him themselves. Or they should do.

[KentExile]

1 minute ago, RevidgeBlue said:

If he's scored 15 in 22, they probably want to test him themselves. Or they should do.

Stoke will be ok without him, they have the colossal goalscoring talents of Ennis and Gallagher to rely on 😉 

[RevidgeBlue]

5 minutes ago, KentExile said:

Stoke will be ok without him, they have the colossal goalscoring talents of Ennis and Gallagher to rely on 😉 

Exactly.

[...]

5 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Exactly.

Who are they?

[BankEnd Rover]

Not the best source but