v Sunderland (h) - 26/12/2024

[arbitro]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Not sure why you are being sarcastic or condoning his fairly obvious lack of fitness.

I responded to you being obtuse. Clearly his fitness levels satisfy the sports scientists otherwise he wouldn't play but to repeat myself he struggles to play a full match in a really high tempo. If you were observant you would have noticed players from both teams looking really tired in the last ten minutes which was due to the intensity and effort they put in. Nothing at all wrong with that in my view.

[chaddyrovers]

33 minutes ago, arbitro said:

Sunderland played a really high line in the first half and several times we played the ball in behind. We used the long diagonal pass to good effect too I thought. In the second half I thought the Sunderland defence dropped off more so we couldn't get in behind. Similarly we dominated the midfield in the first half and they did in the second. Both managers were tactically astute yesterday which certainly added to the quality of the game.

Could agree more. Both head coaches should be praised for the tactical changes 

[Rogerb]

12 hours ago, Neal said:

Really? Stats show he's 3rd in assists in the league, another good knockdown to rescue us a point and came on against Wednesday to win us 3 points... 

 

Not having a go at you here but seeing the stick he gets and the hearing the stick he got today is starting to wear a bit thin. 

 

We paid 1.5 million for him which in the grand scheme of things is absolutely peanuts in today's market. 3 goals and 6 assists in all competitions isn't a bad return at all. The guy wins headers, feeds off scraps and somehow manages to win us a points here and there without starting regularly. 

 

Granted it took him too long to get off the mark but because of that, a few misses and his awkward style, seems to be an easy target to be made a scapegoat. 

 

We would be far worse off in the table without the big man. He's not even played half a season folks, don't be so keen to write him off and give him time... The big man is a problem for teams in this league! 

Some weeks ago Porky produced a chart showing Makhtar is the 48th worst under performing striker in the world 2017-2024 it's on his own thread. I agree with you he didn't deserve stick yesterday the Sunderland centre halves had it all their own way until his arrival. I can see a role for him as an impact sub when we are chasing the game but as a goal scoring no9 I am not seeing it so far.

[Paul Mani]

3 hours ago, Cherry Blue said:

Does he play him or does he loan him out?

JE most have said when he came if anyone can score its Leonard. He did which now means he's got to start against Hull. 

 

I think JE will cautiously play Leonard and integrate him to manage his fitness and make an impact. But I don’t see him starting games necessarily and bearing in mind we’re publicly in the market for a striker, IF we get one, I think we’ll loan Leonard.

2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Gueye for me is starting at Leeds as long with Tronstad and Hedges. I would play the same way as we did at home to them

I think there’s a good player in Gueye. He’s isn’t getting much in terms of opportunities but he feels like a player who could hit a purple patch. Plus, he is real handful. 

2 hours ago, Forever Blue said:

We did it against Millwall and shoved Cantwell out wide left….we were poor and lost the midfield as a result. 
 

Cantwell is hit and miss, but we played well the first half yesterday because  Cantwell has the quality to look after the ball and keep play progressing. 

I think there’s an argument to go to a 433 and play Sonny at the base with Cantwell and Baker either side of him. Cantwell is class but he doesn’t get enough assists or goals. I think he’s better a bit deeper.

[Tom]

On the topic of own goals, that scramble in the first half looked close to being volleyed into our own net off Hyams shin, was it really close?

[Neal]

12 minutes ago, Rogerb said:

Some weeks ago Porky produced a chart showing Makhtar is the 48th worst under performing striker in the world 2017-2024 it's on his own thread. I agree with you he didn't deserve stick yesterday the Sunderland centre halves had it all their own way until his arrival. I can see a role for him as an impact sub when we are chasing the game but as a goal scoring no9 I am not seeing it so far.

Fair, I guess stats can skewed in many ways to make certain points. I guess part of the point I'm making is as far goal involvements go, he's doing a better job than the likes of attacking midfielders like Hedges and Cantwell, granted he's a number 9 and I won't argue with anyone that his goals scored needs to improve. 

[Mashed Potatoes]

6 minutes ago, Neal said:

Fair, I guess stats can skewed in many ways to make certain points. I guess part of the point I'm making is as far goal involvements go, he's doing a better job than the likes of attacking midfielders like Hedges and Cantwell, granted he's a number 9 and I won't argue with anyone that his goals scored needs to improve. 

That's right. According to the whoscored.com web site Gueye is well ahead of our other players for goal involvements(goals scored plus assists) per minutes on the pitch. For players with more than 500 minutes played in the EFL this season the numbers this season are :

Gueye       812 minutes played    7 goal involvements   116minutes per goal involvement

Weimann  756                             4                                  189

JRC            816                            4                                   204

Dolan       1360                           5                                   272

Ohashi      1402                          5                                   280

Cantwell    1195                          4                                   299

Travis         1725                         3                                   575

Hedges      1363                         2                                   681

 

[M_B]

Gueye played well at Wednesday and scored the winner. He came on yesterday and without doubt helped to change the flow of the game and set Leonard up for the equaliser.

He's getting better, he's affecting games in a positive way, and the opposition are very wary of him.

Six assists and one goal, plus his aerial presence when we're defending corners is a good start over half a season.

[Penwortham Blue]

3 hours ago, Neal said:

Just watched the extended highlights. I was sat in the Jack Walker so didn't have a good view but... Didn't Gueye have a low shot late on that was going in that a Sunderland player threw himself in front of? Keeper didn't look like he was moving. 

He did indeed, a really smart turn and hit it really well and was goal bound but for hitting the defender.

[roversinmyblood]

2 hours ago, arbitro said:

I responded to you being obtuse. Clearly his fitness levels satisfy the sports scientists otherwise he wouldn't play but to repeat myself he struggles to play a full match in a really high tempo. If you were observant you would have noticed players from both teams looking really tired in the last ten minutes which was due to the intensity and effort they put in. Nothing at all wrong with that in my view.

Plus we don’t know if any of the players have been ill and still played as that can affect their energy levels significantly. 

[MarkBRFC]

8 minutes ago, Penwortham Blue said:

He did indeed, a really smart turn and hit it really well and was goal bound but for hitting the defender.

Although if he had left it ACD has a free shot at goal.

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, arbitro said:

I responded to you being obtuse. Clearly his fitness levels satisfy the sports scientists otherwise he wouldn't play but to repeat myself he struggles to play a full match in a really high tempo. If you were observant you would have noticed players from both teams looking really tired in the last ten minutes which was due to the intensity and effort they put in. Nothing at all wrong with that in my view.

Cantwell didn't just fade during the last ten minutes (which would be understandable)  though did he? Might as well leave it there as we obviously won't agree on this.

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, M_B said:

Gueye played well at Wednesday and scored the winner. He came on yesterday and without doubt helped to change the flow of the game and set Leonard up for the equaliser.

He's getting better, he's affecting games in a positive way, and the opposition are very wary of him.

Six assists and one goal, plus his aerial presence when we're defending corners is a good start over half a season.

I wouldn't really say he's made  "a good start"  he doesnt score enough, but he's got a bit of potential, at his best he's a real nuisance for the opposition defence.

I'd contrast that with Gallagher who similarly didn't score enough and wasn't a nuisance either.

[RevidgeBlue]

2 hours ago, Mashed Potatoes said:

That's right. According to the whoscored.com web site Gueye is well ahead of our other players for goal involvements(goals scored plus assists) per minutes on the pitch. For players with more than 500 minutes played in the EFL this season the numbers this season are :

Gueye       812 minutes played    7 goal involvements   116minutes per goal involvement

Weimann  756                             4                                  189

JRC            816                            4                                   204

Dolan       1360                           5                                   272

Ohashi      1402                          5                                   280

Cantwell    1195                          4                                   299

Travis         1725                         3                                   575

Hedges      1363                         2                                   681

 

Hedges, 2 goal involvements in 1363 minutes of play and some people think he should still get a new deal.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

15 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Cantwell didn't just fade during the last ten minutes (which would be understandable)  though did he? Might as well leave it there as we obviously won't agree on this.

Cantwell is a luxury player. He’s not out there to do a “ Travis “. He’s there to do the unexpected and create chances. As I’ve said before players come in two groups. The group that get you on top in the game and the group that will murder the opposition once the first group have got you on top. Cantwell belongs in the second group. Like somebody once about Bobby Charlton. “ A team of Bobby Charlton’s would never win anything because they’d never have the ball. “. They need other players to get them the ball.

I didn’t see yesterday’s game but I saw the Millwall game and playing out wide he was hardly involved at all. I don’t think he’s set the world on fire so far, I was expecting a bit more demanding of the ball like Eyal Berkovic used to do. Maybe  he never will never set the world on fire but I think we need to persist with him.

Edited December 27, 2024 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Hedges, 2 goal involvements in 1363 minutes of play and some people think he should still get a new deal.

That attempted shot yesterday was really pathetic. I’d be shocked to see a school boy try a shot like that.

[RevidgeBlue]

11 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

I didn’t see yesterday’s game but I saw the Millwall game and playing out wide he was hardly involved at all. I don’t think he’s set the world on fire so far, I was expecting a bit more demanding of the ball like Eyal Berkovic used to do. Maybe  he never will never set the world on fire but I think we need to persist with him.

That's exactly how I'd like him to be. He has the talent to be far more influential imo. He ought to be dictating games.

The table posted above is fairly telling - pro rata he's behind the likes of JRC and Weimann (who have played far fewer minutes) and the much maligned Dolan.

Edited December 27, 2024 by RevidgeBlue

[Gamst]

Is it just me or was Ohashi in an offside position when the ball ricocheted off Dolan’s head for the goal yesterday?? 

[riverholmes]

Owen Beck's defending for the goals looked suspect - albeit, some are saying he wasn't fully fit at the time. He was concerned about Roberts cutting in but seemed to give him too much space to go down the line. It could be a blessing in disguise if Liverpool were looking at that (and the fact it seems Robertson and Tsimikas are both back for them).

And probably mentioned already, but Dolan's miss when through looked appalling. You might miss but there seemed no excuse to sky it, except, for terrible technique. That said, Dolan looked very positive in the highlights. You can see why his performances fluctuates - he relied a lot on chancey toe pokes and runs. When they come off, they look great but a lot of the times, he'll give it away - and in the middle of the park, it's high risk.

Edit: To add, on Harry Leonard, I wasn't too sure about him. However, having seen a few more glimpses, I'm a bit more hopeful. He lacks pace and is still developing physically, however, he does have good positioning and promising touch and vision. I just wonder if he has the mentality and potential to develop as a target man forward, in the mould of a Harry Kane. There's a very long way to go, though. Ideally, he'd go on loan but the squad is short of strikers.

Edited December 27, 2024 by riverholmes

[Penwortham Blue]

1 hour ago, MarkBRFC said:

Although if he had left it ACD has a free shot at goal.

Big Mak did everything right, more often than not, the keeper is picking that out from the onion bag.

[booth]

58 minutes ago, Gamst said:

Is it just me or was Ohashi in an offside position when the ball ricocheted off Dolan’s head for the goal yesterday?? 

[aletheia]

18 hours ago, den said:

you know full backs are always coached to push the winger wide, no matter which is their stronger foot.

Beck did but wasn't close or quick enough -looked jaded to me.

On this inverted v traditional winger thing -don't see it has to be either/or. Both offer options. I do think that the pendulum has swung a little too far with recycling -early crosses in the old style can cause havoc. BUT in the old days you would always have at least 2 strikers in there (little and large). These days, often only 1 up top and if you have a slow side trying to play on the counter, a full back/winger will often look up on a break only to see one player in there.

[Gav]

Loved the game yesterday, Ewood rocking, we played like Brazil 1970 for 10mins in the first half and a 90min equaliser, tremendous stuff. 

Dolan was unplayable at times, the lads so exciting to watch when it clicks, worth the admission price on his own. 

I thought we’d struggle this season, I’ve been proven wrong and all credit to Eustace who has built from the back like all good managers do.

Onwards and upwards.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

4 minutes ago, Gav said:

 We played like Brazil 1970 for 10mins 

Lay off the Shandy Gavlar!😊

[Gav]

3 hours ago, SIMON GARNERS 194 said:

Lay off the Shandy Gavlar!😊

Did you go SG?

Some of that football for 10mins, turns on a sixpence, flicks and movement was superb and led to the first goal, it was outstanding. 

Edited December 27, 2024 by Gav