Souness must go ?

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Any quotes from our leader Souness tonight?

[RoverDrake]

Yeah he's a got page on the official site talking about today. However I can't seem to copy and paste it so go yourself!

He just mentions how we got well and truly hammered and the players have to stand up like men and be counted for...

[FourLaneBlue]

You know what - I can't, off the top of me head, think of many managers who have been sacked and seen their team's form get even worse in the short-term.

Peter Reid.

Howard Wilkinson.

Jim Smith.

Colin Todd.

Peter Taylor.

Those are from the last few years and their form (of the team they left) either didn't improve or got worse in the Premiership. Compare that to keeping faith with the boss to the end of the season when it looked as if the team would go down- again, Peter Reid at Sunderland in 01-02 when they just managed to get enough to stay up, at Bradford they looked dead and buried before Paul Jewell led them to safety (and then sodded off to Sheff Wed, but that's another story). In the season we went down Southampton kept faith with Dave Jones after his previous good work and they won their last three matches to survive. They didn't support him next season though when he was unfairly accused of sex offences and got their just desserts when Hoddle later went on to walk out on them.

There are quite a few examples of the sacking of a manager leading to a downturn in form if you turn off your selective memory switch. The Forest comparison isn't really fair either- Forest have underacheived so badly this season they make us seem like we aren't doing so bad! They've more quality in their squad than almost every other team in their division. We haven't, our squad is average which you can blame Souness for but I think you should really be leaving the blame game for the summer.

If we sack Souness we need to bring someone in, not Parkes. Parkes didn't do anything the last time he got the caretaker job except continue to have us performing at Bryan Kidd-levels of inadequacy. I've only ever been to Oakwell (the home ground of Barnsley) once and that was to see a Parkes-managed side thrashed 5-1. Parkes ain't the answer- he's been there all through the Souness regime. If the Assistant Manager has little responsibility for the performance of the team then he shouldn't be there at all!

Just as everyone is worried, so am I. Sacking Souness now however is not the answer. It's time to finally win at home. This is the most imprortant game of the season come, we are in more trouble now than we have been all season. At least when we were in the drop zone briefly we were only in the autumn. Now...we're near the finishing line. It's down to Souness to keep us up.

Edited April 4, 2004 by FourLaneBlue

[rover6]

You make a lot of good points 4LB but I think the comparison between us and Forest is valid.

We aren't much better than those around us (as Forest are in Division One) but we definitely have a higher quality team than Leicester, Leeds, Wolves and Portsmouth imo.

But our supposed 'quality' players - Cole, Emerton, Friedel, Neill are not performing or injured Ferguson and Thommo.

In the final days of Paul Hart's regime at Forest, good players like Gareth Williams, Andy Reid and Marlon King were bordering on woeful. But the change of manager has given these guys a new lease of life.

[FourLaneBlue]

You make a lot of good points 4LB but I think the comparison between us and Forest is valid.

We aren't much better than those around us (as Forest are in Division One) but we definitely have a higher quality team than Leicester, Leeds, Wolves and Portsmouth imo.

But our supposed 'quality' players - Cole, Emerton, Friedel, Neill are not performing or injured Ferguson and Thommo.

In the final days of Paul Hart's regime at Forest, good players like Gareth Williams, Andy Reid and Marlon King were bordering on woeful. But the change of manager has given these guys a new lease of life.

I'm not disagreeing with that rover6 as they have markedly improved since Kinnear took charge.

However, when Forest sacked Hart it meant that his replacement would have enough time to really give it a go. If we sack Souness now we'd either have to rely on Parkes or give the new manager about a month or so (that's if we found him in extra quick time) to turn us around and get the points. We have left it too late. It's Souness or nothing now. The last game of the season is 15th May- about five weeks off. It's simply too late to sack the manager now. We need Souness to stay positive and get us out of it, he's our only hope for the end of this season. It isn't over yet- we are still clear of the relegation zone and our destiny in still in out own hands (to use a crap cliche).

[philipl]

I have calmed down but I am now firmly in the Souness out NOW camp.

To those who disagree, let me ask what confidence you have that Souness will have the selection, tactics and motivation to beat Leeds next Saturday?

Right now, I am absolutely certain we will lose that game with Souness in charge.

In those circumstances, the arithmetic is not the cost of buying out his remaining contract but a gamble to avoid losing £20m in income from a relegation which we should NEVER have been in any danger of suffering this season.

How can Souness motivate his players now?

His selection and tactical ineptitude has reduced the defence to a shambles.

Craig Short implicitly criticised Souness for saying the wrong things last week.

The decision to drop Neill because the Anfield crowd would have a go at him was mindbogglingly stupid. Drop Neill for bad performances but not in a way that was tantamount to Souness saying the lad deliberately broke Carragher's leg.

Johansson had an excellent game to re-establish his career and was promptly dropped.

Gresko is probably suffering a massive crisis of confidence because of Souness' failure to play anyone who can operate effectively at left midfield.

Cole and Yorke- two senior pros you would ordinarilly look to provide backbone at this stage are so @#/? off that Souness chose to play too extreme youngsters at Anfield just at the moment their form was beginning to falter- MADNESS

I could go on...

Half the squad would spit in Souness' face gven half the chance. I know its not professional but players are young egocentric individuals with enough "f" you money not to need to give a damn about the shirt and the club and to be supremely indifferent to Souness.

In case anyone hasn't noticed, Liverpool are rubbish. There was nothing magical about their performance today. We just rolled over and died AGAIN.

So to Charlton, Fulham, Villa home, Brum in the Cup, Bolton home, Pompey home we add LIverpool away as performances which fall off the scale of being dire.

Edited April 4, 2004 by philipl

[rover6]

In case anyone hasn't noticed, Liverpool are rubbish. There was nothing magical about their performance today. We just rolled over and died AGAIN.

Disagree.

We were shockingly inept. But Liverpool played very well and would probably have won even if we had performed to our potential - although it would have been a lot closer.

[Hanks]

souness won't walk away before the end of the season,there is no one within the club who could plausably take over anyway.

are the board capable of sacking him? probably not. have they considered a replacement? probably not. its too late for any change of personel.

if we go down then hopefully he will fall on his sword if we stay up i would be in two minds about it.it would all depend on how well he did in the transfer market but i wouldn't be too surprised if he chucks it in.the strain of having to manage todays multi-millionaires is probably getting to him.there are no sticks big enough to balance out the 24ct. gold carrots so managing them seems to be becoming increasingly frustrating for souey hence the continued public spats

[neophox]

We were crap today as we have been all season.

I can't believe that the board react on this, sack Souness now!

There are plenty of good managers in Division One.

Look at Nigel Worthington at Norwich or why not bring in MARK HUGHES as a manager, he has the right fighting spirit!!!! He can also learn the strikers to shoot.... when he was 37 and played for us he played better than anyone of our strikers is doing now.

The players worth keeping is:

Friedel, Fergy, Emerton, Gray, Thompson, Babbel, Stead.

The players have not performed really but should get another chance to stay:

Gresko (where's he, he can score, should be on the left)??,

Gallacher (indifferent form)

Neill (indifferent form)

Nissa (does all he can when he plays)

Amoruso (why isn't he playing??)

Jansen (keep faith)

Cole (can be a an old Les Ferdinand or Sheringham, wast experience)

###### (donkeys) totally waste:

Andy Todd (stupid donkey)

Craig Short (too slow)

Yorke (lazy overpaid looser)

Flitcroft (time to go now flitty)

Tugay (time to retire and be a manager or something)

Andresen (rubbish)

Reid (what a waste, not near to Duff)

These players are donkeys and we should get rid of.

I should play this team:

Friedel

Neill, Babbel, Amoruso/Nissa, Gray/Gresko

Emerton, Ferguson, Thompson, Gresko/Gray

Stead, Cole/Gallacher

A very creative team!

Agree?

[LeChuck]

Neophox that post was rubbish the first time you posted it, it's not going to look good no matter how many times you do it.

Thommo and Ferguson? I believe crutches are against FA regulations.

[chris]

well unless we can get Kenny then best stick with Souness untill the end of the season, but i am wondering whether players need a change, something has to change, do we transfer half the team, i mean we have spent 40 million on the team in three years and our best three players once Jansen, Dunn and Duff are not here to save us, or do we change the manager

Maybe its better to burn out then to fade away, ofcourse then again Souness could completely turn it around next season(if we stay up), who knows, its a difficult one.

[tchocky]

I dont imagine he will Chris.

(Long live the memory of Kurt Cobain though. 10 years ago today (5th april) - for those who dont know, he said in his suicide note: "its better to burn out then to fade away")

[Jan]

Sacking's too good for him after this "performance". He should be gutted- literally.

Anyone who thinks he has the slightest chance of getting it right against Leeds or Leicester is living on cloud cuckoo land- he's picked dross teams all season and changed them at the drop of a hat so they haven't had the chance to GEL- injuries causing all the changes, my behind!

My view is that none of the players want to play for him (why would they? He's an obnoxious arrogant git and those are his best characteristics) so he should go. You all thought he was more important to the club than Dunn and Duff (Jim and Rover6 may be the honourable exceptions). How does it feel to be SO wrong?

[Exiled_Rover]

Souness has got to go, but there is no-one we can put in to replace him. How long is his contract? Got to be at least 2 years left on it, so the board would have to pay him £2m they don't have to get rid - and you know he's not going to resign.

Today was a shambles, the back four were competent (except for Babbel) - people will blame them for the four goals, but do you have any idea how hard it is to defend when the opposition's midfield is given the run of the park?? Countless times today Gerrard and Riise breezed through our midfield like it wasn't there, and they popped up all around the box unmarked. Whoever has coached these fellows not to track back needs to be thrown out on the street, it's schoolboy. The Liverpool midfield could pick any pass they damn well wanted today.

Stead and Gallagher chased everything, but had no service - midfield again I was surprised to see how many goals we'd scored this season on recent performances

One thing I'd like to add - why is Tugay still on the pitch . We're in a dogfight people, one where every player has to pull their weight defensively - Tugay couldn't tackle or shadow me, and I'm a decidedly average attacker even at my level. Sure he can pick that beautiful pass now and again, but that's not enough anymore.

My team (I know you guys don't give a flying expletive):

Neill (at least he adds some steel) - rb

Gresko (competent defender when he has cover) - lb

Todd (player of the season, reads the game well) - cb

Short (old, but his experience makes him a better option that Nissa) - cb

Emerton (unfortunately we have no other options, I'd tell him to play defensively here) - rm

Gray (competent going forward, has a left foot, can cover for Gresko - our best option here) - lm

Andresen (neat, tidy player who does his fair share of work) - cm

Douglas (not the most talented individual, but will die for the cause. Puts himself about more than Flitcroft) - cm

Cole (attitude stinks, but the talent is still there) - sc

Stead (a goal poacher, we hope, and works his socks off - defending starts from the front) - sc

[mjs]

The people running the club are the ones in the know. If GS has lost the support of the players then the Chief Exec, chairman etc. will be well aware and I am sure will take whatever action necessary, even if that means the sack. Unfortunately we can't sack the players at this stage.

If the manager still has the backing of the players then it would serve no purpose getting rid of Souey, in fact it would only rock the boat even further.

Lets trust those in the know. In the meantime the rest of us have to get fully behind the team between now and the end of the season and hope that we can get the wins we need to stay up.

Edited April 4, 2004 by mjs

[DavidMailsTightPerm]

You can blame tactics, the manager etc. - but ultimately it is down to the players. With the exception of Duff (and to a lesser extent Dunn) these are the players that got us into sixth position. I still beleive that our alround team is better than the current position - it is time for them to pull their fingers out and starting putting in some effort - if not for the manager, then the club, - if not for the club then their pride, and if not for their pride, for their next contract - because if this carries on, their next contract won't be with Rovers because we won't be able to afford it in the 1st Div !!!!

[Morph]

My view is that none of the players want to play for him (why would they? He's an obnoxious arrogant git and those are his best characteristics) so he should go. You all thought he was more important to the club than Dunn and Duff (Jim and Rover6 may be the honourable exceptions). How does it feel to be SO wrong?

Pretty wretched to be honest. The club we love is struggling badly and we are in danger of being relegated. Most of the people on here are hurting as a result, given that we desperately want our team to do well. You on the other hand seem to be loving every minute. I can only assume from the crowing tone of your post that the icing on the cake for you will be if we do go down, so you can come on here and brag about how you were SO right. Nothing like a little humility is there? Pathetic.

[Jan]

All those calling for Gresko and Gray- I'm sorry-If you want that, you'll need a new manager first. Souness doesn't have the wit, tactical acumen or foresight to actually play people who would balance the side- he hasn't all season so why would he try now?

Let's get behind the team, but get rid of the dead wood manager first.

And by the way- I'd rather have Mickey Adams (fed up with Leicester) Mark Hughes (might have some fondness for the club) or Mike Newell (Ditto) than That *******. This is one time I REALLY wish I could swear on here. He deserves it.

[Jan]

Pretty wretched to be honest. The club we love is struggling badly and we are in danger of being relegated. Most of the people on here are hurting as a result, given that we desperately want our team to do well. You on the other hand seem to be loving every minute. I can only assume from the crowing tone of your post that the icing on the cake for you will be if we do go down, so you can come on here and brag about how you were SO right. Nothing like a little humility is there? Pathetic.

I'm torn. If we were in a sound financial position, I'd see us go down to get rid of him and get someone else in. We're not, so I'm crossing fingers and toes and turning up to every game in the hope we win.

I've hated him forever, but tolerated him as our manager until his behaviour with Dunn- I even supported him initially with that. I knew he'd lost it when Dunny came back from his injury and was obviously putting the effort in, but Souness (and consequently most of the Souness-lovers on here who were SO jealous of a local boy doing well and "getting above himself") didn't recognise it and kept bleating on.

I knew then he was gone in the eyes of the players (who'd want to work under a manager who takes such violent dislikes and cannot change his mind when he's obviously in the wrong), and I think that's been proven since. He should have been physically gone then too, but people were still blinded by his luck in previous seasons, so chose Souness over morale.

The state of our club is VERY sad.

[chris]

the problem i have now is I don't see how things are going to improve in future, we are in the same position now we were at the start of the season, who are the best back four? should Nissa, Amoruso, Gesko play, will Souness play Babbel again, who the F**k is the starting midfielders, Tugay, Douglas, Anndresingtonson, Flitcroft, Yorke, Ferguson, Reid, Emerton and who is the starting attackers Cole, yorke, Gally, stead, Jansen

So next season we have no money and Souness still does not know his best team, can't motivate the players and has a bad relationship some players.

I just don't see how we can correct these problems and Souness himself this week said he was clueless as what to do next.

Maybe if Coleman is stupid enough (which he is) to buy Cole for 3 million and we get ride of some dead wood we can get replacements.

Players like Forsell, Zenden, Campo, Mendieta, Berger cost nothing this season, its not impossible but Souness will have to achieve the greatest task of his life to turn it around. This time its his mess, he does not have Jansen, Duff, and Dunn together and he does not have 40 million again.

[tcj_jones]

Sacking's too good for him after this "performance". He should be gutted- literally.

Anyone who thinks he has the slightest chance of getting it right against Leeds or Leicester is living on cloud cuckoo land- he's picked dross teams all season and changed them at the drop of a hat so they haven't had the chance to GEL- injuries causing all the changes, my behind!

My view is that none of the players want to play for him (why would they? He's an obnoxious arrogant git and those are his best characteristics) so he should go. You all thought he was more important to the club than Dunn and Duff (Jim and Rover6 may be the honourable exceptions). How does it feel to be SO wrong?

what?! with respect, shut up! did we all think souness was more important then dunn and duff to the club? in my opinion souness came out the better in the dunn/souness clash. dunn did live an extravagant lifestyle. now hes moved to the big city of birmingham, plays nothing more then average much of the season and gets injured.duff?.... please explain how we thought souness was more important to the club then duff? so did souness mistreat duff? did they have arguements of any importance/severity? duff is offered 17 million for - unrefusable to a club of our size, simultaneously triggering his release clause and all the long rovers supporters were dreading his exit. "how does it feel to be SO wrong?".... well that depends on what you are referring to as what you are saying is too stupid to admit defeat to. also interesti g to note that all you ever seem to post on is anti-souness threads or to criticise him.

now onto my opinions of souness... i was probably his biggest fan at the start of the season and had huge belief and respect for his managerial ability and credentials. but what are credentials and where is the ability in his tactical ineptitude? i was shocked but at the same time expectant of reid being on the bench. SURELY what we need is balance and width?!

neill - ok if he was substitute because of his indifferent form this season then ok. but because it was liverpool?! NONSENSE graeme, have you lost ALL your bottle?! i think neill would have relished the chance to play and perform against liverpool.

souness very much OUT this summer! not now. give him the chance to save us and warrant his contract next season. parkes is in part to blame for this crisis and he isnt the man to take over. he will not improve and the squad will only be unsettled more.

[FourLaneBlue]

My view is that none of the players want to play for him (why would they? He's an obnoxious arrogant git and those are his best characteristics) so he should go. You all thought he was more important to the club than Dunn and Duff (Jim and Rover6 may be the honourable exceptions). How does it feel to be SO wrong?

WOW! How does it feel it to be so right Jan? You're loving this aren't you??? You love seeing Rovers on the brink of relegation. Anything so long as you can have a go at your own personal bete noire.

What you gonna do if the club ever goes bankrupt? You gonna pee on the grave? Or you gonna be the last one to stick in the knife?

Good to see that all you naysayers whether you or Jim mk2 (as you mentioned) are so wonderfully pleased to see our club thrashed and humiliated.

At least some posters on here are happy tonight- eh Jan?

[Morph]

I'm torn. If we were in a sound financial position, I'd see us go down to get rid of him and get someone else in. We're not, so I'm crossing fingers and toes and turning up to every game in the hope we win.

I just don't understand that logic. Wishing ill on the club you support in order to get rid of a manager you dislike makes no sense to me at all. Regardless of how you or I feel about a manager, a chairman, a player, whoever; we follow the club first and foremost. To me this means that the success of the club takes precedence over everything else, including personal emnities. There are many odious people in football (take a look at the average NUFC starting XI), but no individual is bigger than the club they play for or manage.

Whether Souness goes now, at the end of the season or in ten years time, chances are we will both be supporting Blackburn long after he has gone, just as we both supported them long before he came here. What gets my back up most is your use of the label "Souness-lovers" and similar, as if we follow the man himself rather than the team. We wanted Souness to do well because, by extention, it meant the club was doing well. When this happened we gave him our support not because of who he was, but because of what he had given us - success. Given the season we are having it is only fair to ask whether or not the club would benefit from a change of management - not because we like / dislike Souness any more / less than we have done in the past, but because it is in the best interests of BRFC to do so.

[FourLaneBlue]

I knew he'd lost it when Dunny came back from his injury and was obviously putting the effort in, but Souness (and consequently most of the Souness-lovers on here who were SO jealous of a local boy doing well and "getting above himself") didn't recognise it and kept bleating on.

SO jealous? Of all the players who have ever appeared at Rovers he was my favourite of the lot (well, apart from Scott Sellars) precisely because he was a local lad, maybe also as I'd met him quite a few times and he'd always seemed a good lad.

I'm a Rovers supporter though so support the club. I'm not a Souness supporter or a Duff supporter or a sodding Sean Curry supporter....Souness had taken us to sixth and so had to be trusted. No, I wasn't happy then. Nor am I now. Most likely I got it wrong. Hey, maybe I'm even human. Just like Souness, not that I'd expect you to admit to him being human.

However, I wouldn't come on here rubbing it in the faces of everyone else if i had been right. Not with you around to do it instead. Well done for being right, football genius. Well done to Celtic for fluking a draw at the weekend as well. Life's perfect for you isn't it?

Look Jan- I'm sure you are a committed Rovers fan in reality. However that would mean supporting the team more than wishing for the end of a manager. Would relegation not be so bad if it meant ridding the club of Souness??? Sod Souey...it's the position of the club that matters, always has been.

Edited April 5, 2004 by FourLaneBlue

[Tris]

I'm torn

I'm @#/? torn as well.

I've just spent most of the money I was saving for a 3 week sunshine break in the states on tickets for Leeds and Leicester at Ewood, travel, Fulham ticket and I'll get the rest if needed.

If this lot are going down, I'M @#/? WELL GOING DOWN WITH THEM