The Sun - And Its Pile Of **** Apology.

[SkemLad]

By Mottman

April 15th 1989, saw the worst disaster in the history of English football; 96 Liverpool fans

attending their team's FA Cup semi-final against Nottingham Forest at Sheffield Wednesday's

ground, Hillsborough, were crushed to death on the Leppings Lane terrace, and English

football would never be the same again.

The disaster was basically caused by the failure of South Yorkshire Police to control a large

crowd of Liverpool fans outside the Leppings Lane End, and the poor state of the ground,

but it was also clear that football's total failure to learn from the numerous disasters that had

afflicted it during the twentieth century, and a police force conditioned to view supporters as

potential hooligans and so always expecting violence, contributed significantly to the 96 deaths

and many hundreds of injuries.

WHAT HAPPENED ON THE DAY?

Liverpool had been allocated the Leppings Lane End of the ground, and it was outside this end from, about 2.30pm that a large crowd of fans had built up. Fans were also delayed on their way to the game by roadworks on the M62 motorway. Warnings issued as far back as 1927 about the need to prevent a large build-up of supporters were ignored, and a sizeable crowd of thousands of Liverpool fans was allowed to build up outside the Leppings Lane End, leading to increasing congestion and then crushing at the front. Stewarding was also described as poor at this end of the ground. The police later claimed that fans had been drinking excessively.

The Leppings Lane gates led into a concourse: from this, fans could enter a main tunnel that

fed into pens three and four of the terrace. Additionally, there were access points to the left and right of the tunnel that led to the other pens on the Leppings Lane terrace. As the sections

immediately behind the goal, pens three and four were the most popular and were already full

over twenty minutes before kick-off, a fact noticed by BBC commentators in their build-up to the game, and by match commander Chief Superintendent David Duckinfield watching events from the police control box. Meanwhile, the crowd outside continued to build, with little effort made to prevent the numbers outside the gates swelling any further: the crushing outside was becoming progressively worse, police horses were becoming agitated, and 2.47pm, thirteen minutes before kick-off, police officers outside the Leppings Lane End radioed to Duckinfield (in charge of his first major match), informing him that the crushing was becoming severe, and that people were going to die if the gates were not opened to relieve the pressure. After a brief delay, Duckinfield ordered that Gate C be opened, and close on 2,000 Liverpool fans were directed through the gates into the concourse.

By now however, pens three and four were already over-congested; fans streamed into the tunnel, and then into pens three and four, creating a massive crush and trapping supporters at the front of the pens against the steel perimeter fence. Some estimates claim that there were twice the number of supporters in pens three and four than they were designed to cope with. The resultant crush became unbearable, with the fans at the back unable to see that the pens were already full, and the fans at the front already starting to show signs of distress and asphixiation.

Fans started to try and climb the fences to escape the pens, and some were lifted out of the pens by supporters in the tier above the terrace, but the crushing was becoming fatal as the game kicked off. Fans tried to attract the attention of police officers, but were unable to do so, and later complained that some supporters trying to escape the pens had been pushed back into the crowd by officers who seemed to think they were dealing with an attempted pitch invasion. Other fans reported shouting to police officers to open the gates, but simply being ignored. By 3.05pm, fans managed to alert Liverpool goalkeeper Bruce Grobbelaar, who in turn pointed out the problem to the referee, as fans were already making their way over the fences before collapsing on the side of the pitch. The players were taken off at 3.06, and the emergency operation began, with Liverpool fans ripping

up advertising hoardings to use as stretchers. It was becoming clear that this was going to be a major disaster, and there was later criticism of police officers who stood in a line across the half-way line, apparently to prevent any "charge" by Liverpool fans against the Forest supporters at the other end of the ground. Other junior officers climbed from pen two into pen three in an effort to help the victims by now piled up everywhere inside the pen, while others desperately tried to pull down the perimeter fence.

The game was abandoned at half-time, with fans, junior police officers and the emergency services still trying to get the injured to hospital, with some people still being admitted as late as 4pm. But in total, 95 fans died in the next couple of days, young, old, male, female. One more supporter, Tony Bland, died after spending four years on a ventilator machine.

At 3.15pm, Graham Kelly, chief executive of the Football Association, had gone to the police control box, where he was told by Duckinfield that Liverpool fans had rushed the gate into the ground, creating the fatal crush in pens three and four, despite the fact that he had ordered the gate opened.

At 4.15pm, Kelly was interviewed by the BBC, and he told them the police had implied to him that the gates had been opened unauthorised. The story flashed around the world that drunken Liverpool fans had forced the gates open, and it was splashed all over the newspapers the following morning. The suggestion that Liverpool fans were responsible for the disaster was picked up most strongly later that week by the 'Sun' newspaper, who ran maybe their most infamous headline on the personal instruction of editor Kelvin McKenzie. Acting on information from unnamed police officers, and entitled "The Truth", the 'Sun' claimed that drunken fans had forced the gates open because they did not have match-tickets, that they stolen from the corpses lying on the pitch, assaulted police officers and the emergency services, stolen cameras and other equipment from press photographers, and urinated on police officers helping the victims. Months later, the "Sun" admitted that the allegations were totally false, but it had already generated headlines all over the world, and the damage had been done.

THE TAYLOR REPORTS

The failure to close or block the tunnel leading into the already full pens three and four once the police had ordered Gate C to be opened was the immediate cause of the disaster, but the public inquiries set up by the Thatcher Government under Lord Justice Peter Taylor found, more generally, that football had simply not learned anything from the numerous disasters in its past, that it and the police were so obsessed with the threat of violence that they were unable to spot people in genuine danger of their lives, that police fundamentally lost control of the situation, and did not demonstrate the leadership expected of senior officers, that safety procedures were inadequate, that the ground was badly maintained and dangerous, that fans were routinely treated with contempt by football, and that fans had been the victims

rather the guilty party. His reports, published in August 1989 and January 1990, dismissed the allegations against Liverpool supporters for the disaster, and called instead for a total rethink in the industry's attitudes towards fans, and on the issue of safety. It also highlighted the failures by local authorities to check safety certificates for stadia (Sheffield Wednesday had redeveloped parts of the ground without obtaining a new safety certificate, or telling the emergency services: the result was that the safety certificate was outdated and useless, and that plans Sheffield Wednesday had developed with the local emergency services could not be put into practice, as the layout of the ground had changed).

Specifically, Taylor recommended the closure of terraces at all grounds, new safety measures on exits and entrances, and a new advisory committee on stadium design to ensure that best practice was followed. Crucially, Taylor also recommended that the Government's Identity Card scheme (whereby all fans would have to have a membership card to get into a ground) be dropped, on grounds of safety, a suggestion that the Government reluctantly carried out. Taylor's report did not have the force of law, and not all his recommendations were carried out, but his work in identifying the wider reasons for the disaster has been

acknowledged as one of the most significant turning points in the history of English football. The result was the total transformation of British stadia, paid for in large part by tax-payers' money, with terraces at grounds in the top two divisions closed by May 1994, and new safety regulations and regimes put in place at every stadium.

WHAT HAS HAPPENED SINCE 1989?

The controversy over the disaster has not subsided: Thatcher's Press Secretary, Bernard Ingham, has frequently repeated the allegations made by the 'Sun', as did Brian Clough (Nottingham Forest manager on the day of the disaster) some five years later; a boycott of the 'Sun' on Merseyside (that still goes on to this day) has cost its parent company News International tens of millions of pounds in lost revenue;

new Government enquiries were ordered to see if there was a case for criminal prosecutions (undertaken by Lord Justice Stuart-Smith); television documentaries and academics have alleged a systematic police cover-up (written evidence from junior officers to the Taylor enquiry was altered by superiors, for instance); and until 1999, Sheffield Wednesday refused to erect a memorial at the ground to the victims (leading to Liverpool fans boycotting Hillsborough in season 1998-99). Finally, in 2000, families of the victims brought

a private, civil prosecution against Duckinfield and his deputy Bernard Murray, for manslaughter.Murray was acquitted, but the jury were unable to reach a verdict in the case of Duckinfield, and the judge prevented a re-trial. Nonetheless, the Hillsborough Justice campaign remain determined to pursue the truth of what happened that day. Over a decade later, Hillsborough remains a highly controversial issue, with its effects most obvious at every stadium in the country.

[SkemLad]

Gary was 17 at the time of Hillsborough. He remembers it as if it were yesterday. Gary's account of what happended in pen 4 is very graphic. He tells it how it was, including the reaction of people outside Liverpool, based upon the crap they read in the Sun. By clicking on the audio buttons you can hear Gary recounting his experiences.

How old were you?

17 years old.

Did you go to most games?

Yeah, home and away. I was living near Northampton and we went on the supporters coach. We went to the semi-final the year before but I had a seat that year.

Caught the coach at 11.00am,relaxed mood everyone quietly confident of a good game. Sun shining, not too hot, a little overcast in places. Had already received my £6 ticket for the Leppings Lane terrace and watched as the other tickets were distributed on the coach. I noticed that there were two spare seat tickets. I thought about changing my ticket for a seat but decided not to because the atmosphere would be better standing and that I would save the £2!

Arrived at the ground about 1.45pm. Seemed busy around the entrance of Leppings Lane, as the coach passed, so decided to stay on the coach and get off further away from the ground. Coach went back up the hill, I got off with Geoff and his son Ryan. We walked down, warm day, seemed to be Liverpool fans everywhere. We were surprised that there was no police cordon stopping anyone who didn't have a ticket, as they did the year before at the previous semi-final. Stopped at a newsagent just outside the ground, met another lad off the coach joked about the shop having no change. Walked through the blue gates towards the turnstiles.

Did you notice any difference from the year before?

When you walked down, there was a hill towards the ground and they had metal barriers like a cordon with police on it, you had to show them your ticket before you could pass through the cordon. There was none of that from the year before. There was no filtering. When we were there, there wasn't that many people outside, there was no queuing or control. There was just a crowd of people trying to find their own way in., milling around trying to get near to the turnstiles.

Everyone was good-humoured, many supporters began to sing, I joined in. I can remember a mounted policeman sitting there not really knowing what to do for the best. Liverpool fans started joking with him, he joked back.

The whole scene was stupid, the flow through the turnstiles was very slow because of the lack of definite queues for each turnstile. People were eager but not desperate to get in but at least when you are in a queue at least you can see the end and you feel that you are actually going somewhere but not here. Finally the mounted policeman started to look worried, his horse turning one way then another, he shouted across to another policeman who was stood by the far turnstile. He then started to try and sort things out, he shouted for people to move back, forwards, sideways but it was too little too late.

Eventually I was close to the turnstiles and finally got myself into a position in front of one of the turnstiles, I then noticed that one supporter had entered the turnstile but was involved in a conversation with the bloke on the gate. Suddenly the policeman who was stood next to the turnstile turned and entered the turnstile and started talking to the gateman. The policeman then grabbed hold of the supporter by the arm and tried to push him out of the turnstile entrance but with the crowd there was nowhere for the policeman to go, so he turned said something to the gateman and let the supporter enter through. What the problem was I don't know because I couldn't hear anything, but it was obvious that even at this early stage the police had no control.

I finally entered the ground through turnstile three, third from the left near a big blue gate. Police officers were on the other side randomly searching people, they didn't search me and I stood and waited for the others. They finally came through moaning that the horse had nearly stood on Ryan's foot. We walked across a courtyard and towards a toilet, which was on the right of the tunnel. As we did I mentioned to Geoff that if it was like that outside what would it be like inside. We bought a programme and made our way through the only obvious entrance to the terracing, through the tunnel.

The tunnel was a strange design, long, narrow but dark with no light's at all and the floor sloped upwards as you walked through but with the darkness you never noticed the slope. There weren't many other people walking through the tunnel as the three of us did but I can remember half stumbling because you couldn't see the slope in the darkness. Then as you got closer to the end and came into the daylight you were suddenly confronted by the dividing fence separating pen's 3 and 4. We went to the left side of the fence into pen 4

How full was it at that time?

We walked down into pen 4 and stopped about half way down the terracing. The top half of pen 4 was packed but there was space further down and with Ryan only being small we moved so that he could see. As we stood settling into our vantage point I kept glancing behind towards the top half of the terrace where all the singing was starting. I wanted to move backwards, I wanted to be where all the atmosphere would be. I asked Geoff if he minded if I moved, he said he didn't, "Go and stand with the young ones," he said.

I made my way back and tried to make my way into the singing throng. I can remember a beach ball being thrown around, the large multi-coloured ball bouncing off unexpected heads who weren't watching, cheers from all round. The ball was now being thrown between the two pens. Everyone having a good time, very good humoured with the atmosphere building, the buzz of anticipation as we looked forward to another semi-final win.

I tried to stand in my new spot for about five minutes but it was packed, the crowd swaying one way then another. I was used to standing, I'm over six foot, had a season ticket for the Kop and had learnt the art of watching football amongst the best footballing crowd there was. But this was boisterous, it was getting packed so I decided to move back down and stand with Geoff and his son. I found them and said that it was too busy up there and joked that I was knackered already!

;A tall bloke came and stood right in front of us so we had to move again. We moved further down the pen, towards the front of the pen, towards the fencing. The middle of the pen down to the bottom was fairly empty, there wasn't many people stood in front of us. There was big, wide open spaces but behind us was busy. We stayed there for a while. We kept looking round for somewhere the Geoff's son could see and we looked across at the corner pen (pen 5) and we thought it would be a good view if we could get up there but we didn't know how you'd get up there. We'd come through the tunnel to get into the ground, there wasn't any other obvious entrances. We thought you might have to have a specific ticket or that bit's not open. We couldn't see any immediate way of getting to it so we thought we'll stay where we are. The ground started filling up a bit more, nothing untoward. It must have been about 2.30 p.m., it was beginning to fill up but again nothing out of the ordinary and again you got the feeling that the pens were full and you couldn't get anymore in. In front of us there was still space, it was obviously filling up behind but you don't really look behind

Could you distinguish they were pens?

Yes because when we came through the tunnel you had the separating fences right in front. We knew we were in pens. As we came through the tunnel it was a case of left or right so we went left, which is probably how we ended up in pen 4.

Did you notice anything about pen 3 - that it was worse?

When we got in, pen 3 was probably fuller than pen 4. That's probably half the reason why we went into pen 4 subconsciously. It seemed to be filling up but nothing out of the ordinary but then suddenly it seemed really busy.

You were suddenly aware of people stood around you or next to you or behind you. Then the space in front filled up but even then you thought it's just filling up - it's getting close to the kick-off. All of a sudden it seemed a bit tighter, people were standing on your feet and still trying to come past you, still trying to find some space to stand and they were coming past and seeing there wasn't really anywhere to go. People were trying to level out trying to find somewhere to stand. Suddenly you realised that you couldn't really move that well. You were pinned up against other people. You thought surely there can't be many more people coming in or if there are there couldn't be much space. I couldn't see where my mates were. I shouted out but I couldn't see them at all. There was still people trying to move down and people in front were shouting 'move back' and people were shouting back 'there's nowhere to move to.'

Then it started to get uncomfortable, I suddenly realised that I couldn't move, I was pinned, sandwiched in place. I was separated from the others, I shouted Geoff's name but heard no reply. I began to try and look around but I couldn't move my shoulders to turn, so I moved my head left and right but I still couldn't see them. I thought the pressure would ease as the crowd would find space but the pressure slowly increased. I now found myself so close to the fence at the front of pen 4 that, if I'd been able to, I was close enough to touch the fence. I was now to the left of the goal (as you looked at the goal from the pens)."

Were you aware of the gates onto the perimeter track where you could have got out that way?

No. I can remember everyone cheering as the two teams came out onto the pitch but I couldn't see much and was too concerned about what was happening around me. You kept thinking people would move into a different pen or they would open another pen up or this is as busy as it's going to get, they're not going to let any more in.

There was a woman in front, I couldn't see her, she started screaming, she was shouting out 'let me out.' She was somewhere to the right of me, I couldn't see who it was but this plea for help turned into a full wrenched scream, one long continuous scream. I can remember thinking to myself "Please stop screaming you'll be alright, please stop." I kept thinking if someone's screaming like that, if there's something, someone can do they're going to do it.

But it continued, she started pleading for someone to help her. Everyone it seemed was shouting at anyone who walked past on the running track, but nobody took any notice. I can remember a steward walking along, how could he ignore all the noise especially the woman screaming. From behind someone shouted, "Hey ###### open the gate, there's people dying in here!" The steward kept walking past pen 4 and then across the front of pen 3, he then suddenly stopped turned and faced pen 3.Surely he can't ignore us now, open your eyes, do something I thought. I could hear others shouting at him pleading, but he gazed into pen 3 for a second and turned away face expressionless. Don't walk away do something.

I then noticed that a couple of photographers who were positioned on the running track behind the advertisement boards, had turned around and now had their cameras focused towards pen 4 taking pictures, I shouted, "Put the ###### camera down and help us!" But still they crouched moving their cameras to get a better picture. Surely if they had noticed that something drastic was happening it was worth taking pictures of why had no-one else noticed and helped.

Was the atmosphere one of panic?

People in front were shouting. People were shouting out behind but you couldn't turn your head to look round. Every so often you would get someone yelling out in agony, then it would stop. Then they would yell out again. There was a lot of noise but every so often you would hear someone shouting out louder above the noise.

I couldn't see behind. I felt something by my leg. If you were stood on the Kop, you'd get little kids crawl through your legs. I couldn't see a kid but the voice was low down and right behind me. He was half crying and panicking saying 'I've got to get out, get over the fence' but I said 'I can't.' He said 'reach out and get over the fence.' This lad was really panicking. I could feel his chin half way up my back, he sounded young so I thought he can't be that big. I thought I can't have this lad screaming in my ear, so I said 'grab my shoulders, climb up my back and you can get out.'

He started doing this. I thought as long as my legs don't buckle, I'll be fine. There was nowhere to move sideways or forward or backwards. I told him to try and free his arms, to grab hold of my shoulders to pull himself up and climb up my back. From the position of his head I guessed he couldn't be that tall so he'd be quite easy to support. His hands reached up and grabbed my shoulders, he started to try and scramble himself up, his fingers dug into my shoulder blades. My legs almost buckled under the weight as he started pulling down on my shoulders but I knew that he would soon be there. He was so close I could feel his belt scraping on my back, then he pulled himself up, his feet searching for upwards leverage dug into my back.

I couldn't take much more of this but I could feel his knees on my shoulders, one final effort and he reached forward and grabbed hold of the top of the spikes. Feet swinging up, scuffing my ears as he placed his feet either side of my head, he leapt forward and he was on the fence and gone. Never saw his face, I can remember his trainers though, he must have been about 12 or 13. He said 'thanks mate.'

I selfishly thought I'd have a bit more room and I quickly moved my arms down to protect my rib cage, ran my arms straight down and bent them across to try and protect my ribs. That was the last time I was able to move my arms.

I thought now I've got more room. So I put my arms down to protect my ribs. The woman had stopped screaming. There was pressure but every so often it got tighter. When it wasn't tight, you were trying to gulp and get air. I strained my neck. There was a layer of hot air above your head, it was like a sauna. You'd gulp the air in but then you couldn't breathe out. You were taking sort panting breaths.

I never saw the game kick-off. There were too many people in front. There was a young lad on the perimeter fence who said 'Beardsley's hit the bar.' You heard a groan from the crowd. This lad started singing 'Liverpool.' Someone shouted 'shut up, this is serious.' The lad got over the fence and went.

It was still tight, you couldn't see anyway out. There were people who had got out who were on the fence trying to pull people up but if you looked at pen 3 there was more on that fence. But the fence was so high it was difficult. The blue metal mesh of the fence that seemed to reach high above your head, which then met the spiked top that reached back and pointed inwards towards the pens. The design of the fence made it difficult for the un-official rescuers, you could see them as they tried to try and stretch over and beyond the spikes and then find the strength to grip and hold one of the flailing arms, trying desperately, frantically all they could do. Where's the help, its only our own who are trying to help.

People were shouting 'coming down' and you knew someone was being passed down. Anyone who had been on the Kop knew and had seen the practice of someone injured being passed down to the front for treatment. It was football supporter's unofficial emergency exit. I looked to my right and saw a bloke being passed down. I managed to get my arms up. I had hold of his head and shoulders. We couldn't move him forward. I looked in his face and his eyes were shut. I never thought it would be possible for a person to turn that colour, he was white, seemed as if he'd been bleached in the sun, his lipsand his nostrils were blue. It was as if he was wearing blue lipstick but this was real.

He opened his eyes, his pupils were dilated and dark but he opened his eyes and looked as though he was slowly trying to focus at me. I started to cry, "It's alright mate your getting out, it's over!" I tapped his face at first then slapped him harder. Some lads got up on the fence. We started to lift him up and he opened his eyes. He looked at me. We lifted him up and I said 'you're getting out.' He didn't blink. His pupils were getting larger. The lads on the fence grabbed him and he was gone.

It was the strangest, surreal feeling of being in the open air, underneath a perfectly blue sky but not being able to breathe. Choking in the open air. It seemed that a foot above everyone's head there was this layer of hot stale air, no fresh air, no breeze, like an invisible roof above your head. I tried stretching my neck muscles upwards to try and find fresher cool air. It was also hot how but it was the aroma in the air that I had never smelt before or since. I could smell vomit, urine etc but this was something unknown. It smelt similar to other things but at the same time smelt nothing like them. It filled your nostrils, I could taste it, I tried to swallow to get rid of the taste but this was impossible because there was no moisture inside my mouth.

I used to wake up in the middle of the night and I could smell that aroma. I can only describe it as the smell of fear, a pungent substance that is produced deep down from inside the human body and filled the air around me.

Minutes seemed like hours, people still screaming, pleading begging for help. I could see glimpses of the pitch, through the metal blue mesh of the fence, the beautifully green grass. Looking through the mesh it seemed as though I was looking at a television picture of the outside window, almost like looking through a viewfinder. Everything was in place in front of you, the other side of the fence but somehow you were detached from all this. Five foot in front of me was safety, the normal world where you could breathe normally not like a fish out of water. It had might as well been a thousand miles away. My brain kept telling my lungs to breathe but you couldn't

Did you see police at the front of pen 4?

The only people I can remember was the steward that walked past, the photographers and a policewoman but that was it. People patrolling up and down just oblivious to what was going on

Do you remember people in front you?

No. There was so many people but no room in front for any people.

How did you get out?

Then I noticed that some fans in front of me to the left had managed one by one to climb the dividing railings that separated pens 4and5.Above the heads of the crush you could see them scrambling over the fence. Then the people to the side of me started to move slowly sideways, gaps started to appear, crumbled up figures that had remained jammed unable to move for an eternity started to move.

Gradually as more people climbed over the fence I saw the first glimpse of concrete terracing strewn with litter, but the first signs of escape. My head nearly exploded as I was released from the iron grasp of the crush, I rushed forward a few steps towards the dividing railings. A man was stood there he put his hand out to slow me down, "Slow down lad, take your time." He was stood there acting like a marshal for people climbing the fence, calming people down and helping anyone who was struggling. Selfishly I just wanted to get out.

It was only when I was stood next to the railings that I realised how daunting they looked, long,tall and topped by large pointed blue spikes. They must have been 7 foot tall, designed for containment not escape like all the fences that surrounded the Leppings Lane terracing.

I don't know how I jumped over but I can't honestly remember my feet touching the fence, I remember being on the way over and looking down the other side. I dropped down, my programme fell out of my pocket so I picked it up. I found myself in a gangway (which was lower than the terracing) that separated pens 4 and 5 about 2 foot wide flanked on either side by metal railings. The entrance to the pitch was blocked by a small gate, I walked up a couple of steps and I ducked down but still banged my back as I made my way through the small opening.

I got onto the running track. The fresh air hit me. I went down on my knees. I then sat at the edge of the pitch because I thought I'd get nicked for a pitch invasion. You still thought 'I'm somewhere I shouldn't be.' It was only then I realised the teams had gone off.

I fell to my knees and realised how hot I was. My clothes were soaking wet, I was breathing heavily. Someone asked me if I was alright and if I was to move back out of the way. A lad carried another lad out who was wearing a bright white jacket. His hands were the same colour. The other lad shouted 'help me, someone help me.' There was a St John's ambulance man. He got down on his knees and pulled his chin down and started giving him mouth to mouth. He stopped and bent down and put he ear to his mouth and just shook his head. The lad said 'where are you going?' because the ambulance man was walking away.

I turned round and there was more people being laid out on the ground. Motionless, they looked as though they were asleep in surroundings of crazed perpetual motion.

I knew people had died. Before that I'd never seen a dead body. I though you would see blood or wounds or some type of injury but these people looked like they fainted. I though I don't want to see this anymore. I can't look at this anymore. I moved to the edge of the penalty area. I remember looking for my mates. I was walking around. I saw them and I remember hugging them. We didn't say a lot.

There was more people being treated, more people being given mouth to mouth. A lad said he heard there were 12 dead, another lad said 17. I thought, yes, there is that many dead. We stood there in shock. I didn't seem to have the energy. I think now, why didn't I help, go back to the fences. I noticed there was lot of activity on pen 3. There were people off the coach who spotted us on the pitch. People weren't chatting, they were quiet.

The Forest fans started singing something. There were groups of police moving towards the halfway line. It looked like there were containing fans. All the people trying to help were supporters, the only people doing something. Frantic fans trying to resuscitate friends, loved ones, total strangers, it didn't matter, shouting for help. It wasn't like a scene from a Hollywood film there was no blood, no wounds, no visible signs of injury, just white pale faces, blue lips.

Then groups of lads started running past carrying the injured on advertisement boards ripped of their hoardings used as make shift stretchers. . We thought it best to get out of the way. Some lad had a bucket, he was giving people water. People were looking after each other. Out the way, let us through," they shouted on mass, anxious, worried frantic expressions on their faces as they sped past, flanking the person lying on the board. Occasionally an arm would drape over the side of the board, hanging limbless, bouncing around with each step of the carriers. Other lads would come rushing past shouting, 'Hurry up, he's alive, out of the way.'

The majority of these 'stretchers' were being supported by other supporters, apart from the young St. John Ambulance man I saw I can't remember seeing that many other uniforms helping in the rescue, many of them stood around, talking into radios which blurted out all of many of incomprehensible garbage. I can remember suddenly numbers of policeman running towards the half way line to form a cordon, silly clueless @#/?s even now they didn't know or appreciate what was going on. The logic's simple, Liverpool fans on the pitch, must be a pitch invasion, stop them attacking the Forest fans at the other end of the ground at all costs. Ignore all rumours of people dying or needing attention. This is a public disturbance.

Someone asked me for a ciggie but my hands were shaking that much I couldn't get one out so I gave him the packet. The three of sat still not saying a word until the pens were empty, a steward or a policewoman asked us to make our way out of the ground. Dazed in a state of shock we left by an entrance at the bottom of the corner terracing that we had previously wanted to stand. It seemed like we were the last people to leave. We remember seeing the lad in the pen with his head in his hands.

We walked out towards the banking straight out on the street. I couldn't believe how many ambulances there were. It was like a taxi rank. We walked towards the coach then I thought - telephone.

We saw a massive queue for the phones. A slow patient queue, a pensioner stood in the doorway telling all these strangers were the phone was, embarrassed not knowing what to say or act, he kept saying 'sorry mate.' One by one people ringing loved ones, short messages all the same, excuses saying that they couldn't speak for long because of the queue. Lads leaving change on the table next to the phone, so much that it started falling onto the carpet, thanking the elderly couple and then leaving. I rang home, my dad answered, my mum was screaming in the background.

We were the last 3 people back to the coach, so they'd sent people out looking for us. We were going down the M1 an stopped at a service station. I went to the toilets. There were skinheads, Forest fans, who were saying 'what's the score, 26-nil or is it 37-nil. No it must be 42-nil by now.' I couldn't do anything. The police ran it and got them out.

I got back to my car at about 9.30. It used to take me 40 minutes to drive home but it took me 1 hour 10 minutes. I got in and explained what happened but not about the lad I held in my arms.

The next day, my dad asked if I wanted to go to mass. I didn't really want to go. My body was bruised. I said I'd go but wanted to go straight in, not stand outside talking. The priest said a prayer for all those who'd died. I started crying. It was the last place I wanted to be but they kept me in there.

I watched the service on the Sunday. People kept coming round to ask what happened. We went to the ground on the Thursday. We put our flowers down on the pitch and I just broke down. A steward come over and took us into the players lounge. Someone gave me a Liverpool shirt and said 'we'll get it signed.' John Aldridge came over to talk to us. I thought it was wrong. Everyone in the lounge was a bereaved family.

I went to school on the Friday. I was doing my A levels. One lad saw me and said 'we thought you were dead.' The following Saturday, mum and dad took me to watch rugby. We went into the club house and a lad came and sat at the table going on about scousers killing each other. I said 'what do you know about that?' He said 'haven't you read the papers, didn't you see what The Sun said, robbing scousers.' I said 'what do you know?' He said 'what's up with you, what do you know about it?' I said 'I was there.' He said 'I know what I read, I spoke to police I trained with and they said the same, they know what they saw.' I got up and grabbed hold of him. Some lads got hold of him and said 'leave it.' He said 'why can't he take the ###### truth?'

I went to school on the Monday. My eyes would fill up, I was thinking, what am I doing here? A lad walked into the common room and said 'have you heard what's going round? What's Liverpool fans favourite song? Take my breath away.' One teacher said I should go to Liverpool. I found it hard. I felt like I wasn't part of it, people didn't expect me to have been there. I wanted to speak to someone who was there. A lot of people outside of Liverpool didn't hear consistent accounts, so when the papers were out they believed them. I felt guilty. If I could have died but someone else got out, I'd have been happy with that.

For a long time I wanted to go round bereaved families and say 'sorry I'm here. I survived and I'm sorry.' I wanted to find out if the bloke I helped had died or survived. I'd study pictures looking for him. My dad had asked a solicitor about suing someone but they said I hadn't got a claim because I hadn't died.

I started work in a bank in November 1989. I thought I was fine at the time. When I went into the safe I was sweating. I'd make excuses so I wouldn't have to go down there. No-one knew how to cope. I told my gran I'd sat in the seats. I wasn't doing very well at work. Reports said I was in a daze, that I was distant.

It came to the first anniversary. Me and a lad were going to drive up and stay in a bed and breakfast. I went to work and said I wanted the time off. The manager said no. I told him I was at Hillsborough. He still said no. He said 'why do you want to remember it.' I said if I didn't get the day off, I would be ill.' He said if I did, I wouldn't be working there much longer. I got a mate to do a solicitors letter saying I was suing the club and I had to up and see the solicitors. The manager said he didn't believe the paper it was printed on but I could have the day off but to take it off next year's holiday. One lad at work said 'The Sun said you were pickpocketing, they don't print lies.' A year on, the only thing he could remember was The Sun.

[FourLaneBlue]

While not wanting to talk about whether or not those fans should 'move on' or not...(it's their choice and I don't know how they feel)

does nobody else think that 'The Sun' equating themselves with Rooney (pictured in England shirt of course to make it seem that those who disagree with them are being unpatriotic) is nothing more than cynical emotional blackmail?

[colin]

does nobody else think that 'The Sun' equating themselves with Rooney (pictured in England shirt of course to make it seem that those who disagree with them are being unpatriotic) is nothing more than cynical emotional blackmail?

I've already said it. Yes.

BTW Skem Lad, thanks for the refresher. I needed that.

No doubt it may be new to some. It needs reading by all.

[joey_big_nose]

The people who are responsible for this cancer on our society are not the editors or journalists but the idiots who buy them.

That's a very "superior" of viewing the situation , Joey ! The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of tabloid readers aren't stupid - they know exactly what they're reading and how seriously to take the contents . However , if you've only 5 minutes break at work , you don't feel like getting out the Times and doing the crossword , you want a bit of light reading.

However , 15 years ago the Sun didn't just put a bit of a spin on a story or stretch the truth a little to make a point ; it deliberately and maliciously printed lies that accused fellow Brits of being complicit in this most tragic of accidents - the fact that they are "scousers" is absolutely irrelevant , they may well have been Scots , Geordies or whatever . Only the completely stupid (and unfortunately we have a few of those on here) make any distinction.

For treating good , honest fellow citizens like that , the Sun must pay - for as long as memories remain of that day . It must pay as much as possible in lost revenues for as long as possible , if only for the sole reason to deter the other rags from even contemplating treating our people in such a callous manner ever again .

My point is that the kind of reporting so massively repulsive in the case of the sun's handling of Hillsborough is just built upon basic tabloid culture. This grows out of what people want to read.

Im not trying to be superior but the fact of the matter is that journalsim which actively hopes to exploit, wound, anger and insult only occours because people want to read it.

You can blame the sun if you want and castigate the people who wrote the story as evil but in truth the mirror is no better, the daily mail certainly isnt. Misrepresentation and slander is how they sell newspapers because that is the literary diet most want or at least find preferable to such maligned things as objectivity and discussion.

[dave birch]

JBN, whatever story they print, there is absolutely no excuse for not printing the truth.

When they have been sprung for lying, there is absolutely no excuse for not issuing an apology. In fact, by not apologising they are compounding the problem. All it does is, when they do print the truth, fewer people believe them.

I think what you are saying is that the type of person that reads this paper will read it regardless of whether anything printed within it is true or otherwise.

I can't remember which board memeber has a sig which says something like

" When a liar tells the truth, who believes him"

[Ninjathunder]

For treating good , honest fellow citizens like that , the Sun must pay - for as long as memories remain of that day . It must pay as much as possible in lost revenues for as long as possible , if only for the sole reason to deter the other rags from even contemplating treating our people in such a callous manner ever again .

We agree completely Blue Phil (and who'd have ever thought it!)

The forgive and forget brigade must understand that the purpose of a continued boycott is for The Sun to face the concequences of printing the unforgivable.

A million complaints to the newspaper every year will ever achieve this - money talks at News Corp and low sales on Merseyside will serve as a continued reminder that they should NEVER do this again.

[FourLaneBlue]

'The Sun' also appeals on behalf of Wayne Rooney, saying he doesn't deserve to be put in this situation.

Then making it ten times worse for him by using him in a PR tactic to attempt to regain it's good name (if it ever had one) by resorting to patriotism (I never really agreed with the saying of patriotism being the last refuge of the scoundrel but it's certainly apt when applied to 'The Sun'). If they are truly sorry for previous actions then I'm sure using a teenager to bludgeon their critics with doesn't seem to be the best way to show it.

In fact, if this was about showing any respect to those affected by the tragedy and the reporting of it after the event...surely they should be keeping a dignified silence rather than feverishly grasping any national teenage hero that comes along to restore their reputation?

Good to see Jim representing the tabloid industry in as morally upstanding a way as ever. 'The Sun' attempts to build bridges...Jim uses the appearance on the board of someone intimately connceted with 'The Hillsbrough Justice Campaign' to insult Liverpool and its citizens.

Whether people should 'move on' is a debatable point. That they should never forget what was printed is most certainly not.

Edited July 9, 2004 by FourLaneBlue

[dave birch]

FLB, your last sentence says it all

[joey_big_nose]

JBN, whatever story they print, there is absolutely no excuse for not printing the truth.

When they have been sprung for lying, there is absolutely no excuse for not issuing an apology. In fact, by not apologising they are compounding the problem. All it does is, when they do print the truth, fewer people believe them.

I think what you are saying is that the type of person that reads this paper will read it regardless of whether anything printed within it is true or otherwise.

I can't remember which board memeber has a sig which says something like

" When a liar tells the truth, who believes him"

What I am saying Dave is that the reason such groundless filth as the Hillsborough story appears in the newspapers in the first place is to sate the thirst for sensationalism, acrimony and blame in the public at large. No matter how much the Sun apologises and how far their circulation falls other newspapers will just take up the slack. Lies of a similarly breath taking slanderous nature will continue to be peddled every day and people will not only consume them but take great pleasure in doing so.

To merely say the story was a product of a few evil editors and their minions is to miss the point. Our culture created that kind of reporting and we love reading it.

Edited July 9, 2004 by joey_big_nose

[roversactive]

Still it hasn't been answered, what do Liverpool fans ultimatley want to happen.

I'm too Young to remember the day but know enough about what happened and don't get me wrong, it was a true footballing disaster but theres a time when you must move on and 'the sun' can see this and move on with the event carved firmly into their name. Lets remember what happened but why bother holding grudges now, just let thoose who fell R.I.P, surely they deserve that!

Some of the topics I've seen on this board include essay's about 'The Kop', How great Liverpool Are, 'The Sun' and how much they dislike Souness. Together it is quite a collection of Liverpool fans writing longer essay's then i've ever submitted for an English exam.

I think that this thread, may I point out on a Blackburn Rovers Forum shows how much too many of our friends are living in the past.

If I went onto the Liverpool website writing how brilliant Souness and Rovers are in 5,000 words, you can be sure that they will tell me where I can go!

Jim, RevridgeBlue, Colin and Tris have together said everything else that I think needs saying on the matter of the topic title.

Edited July 9, 2004 by roversactive

[Anti Euro Smiths Fan]

It was a Jimmy McGovern Docu-drama. It was extremely hard hitting, and hard to watch...

We have been trying for years since to get it re-screened to no avail...even this years 15th anniversary went on deaf ears.

Sadly it doesn't surprise me that TV companies aren't willing to re-screen the programme.

There were some unpleasant home truths in the programme about the police and the legal authorities in this country, which people in high places wouldn't want us to dwell on too much.

I think I'm right in saying it was only broadcast once - in 1996 on ITV. The docu-drama was very well written by McGovern - focusing on three families, from their initial excitement as they get tickets for the Cup semi-final, to the agonising turmoil and legal struggle that followed the disaster.

McGovern said in an interview with the New Statesmen recently that there was "a cover-up, and a judge who was a disgrace and created a denial of justice", while the families of the victims were forced to defend their dead.

The programme didn't paint a favourable picture of the police and the legal process in Britain - hence why it probably hasn't been re-screened.

"You should have been at the shoot," McGovern says. "Utter commitment from everybody involved. Money didn't come into it at all. That was the first time I'd ever experienced something like that. We had teams of lawyers though saying 'you can't say this, you can't say that'. Even the most simple speech, I would have to write it 12 times to satisfy the lawyers."

McGovern argues that "white working class males are a neglected group. They are not a sexy cause these days to champion," he says.

The decision of Jack Straw, then Home Secretary, not to re-open the inquiry into the events of that terrible day still leaves a bitter taste in the mouths of many. "Some on the left of the political spectrum often despise those they claim to represent," says McGovern.

I can fully understand the bitterness that the bereaved families still feel. The South Yorkshire Police on April 15th 1989 were guilty of grossly negligence and there has been a strong sense of injustice since that day. There is also a feeling in Liverpool that there has been a lack of compassion displayed by Sheffield Wednesday football club. For years, the club failed to mark the stadium with any memorial.

This report was in Liverpool's Daily Post newspaper:

"Anyone in any doubt whether to forgive the host club for it's shameful behaviour in the wake of the Hillsborough Disaster need only take a trip to Sheffield to see the memorial unveiled before Saturday's game. Squeezed between a piece of waste strewn riverbank and a pedestrian crossing, the memorial has all the respectful and reflective atmosphere of a multi storey car-park. Neither the word Hillsborough or the words Sheffield Wednesday are mentioned on the sandstone block.

The club is still desperate to keep what happened in 1989 at arms length, preferably even further. A fast flowing river separates the memorial from the ground, only a few yards of water but it may as well be an ocean."

The memorial is below:

In the 1981 FA Cup semi-final between Spurs and Wolves at Hillsborough, 38 people were injured at the stadium. Sheffield Wednesday FC were strongly criticised for the failings of their ground that day.

But tragically, the lessons were not learned. Eight years later 96 people lost their lives at the same stadium.

Back in 1981, Wolves fans were given the large open bank while Spurs, despite having the bigger following, were allocated the much smaller West Stand area.

It seems to me that as well as South Yorkshire police, both the FA and Sheffield Wednesday football club also have to take their share of the blame too for the stadium inadequacies.

Typical Merseyside, living in the past with a chip on its shoulder. Scousers Against The World is their motto; no wonder Liverpool has been in decline for years and its population leaving in droves.

Disappointed by that post Jim. You can do better than that.

This isn't an issue about Scousers - it's about a terrible tragedy and an injustice that took place.

It's easy to say 'Forget about it. Move on. It's in the past.' But time doesn't always heal the bitterness of the wounds.

Put yourself in the shoes of the bereaved families and those that witnessed the tragedy. They feel that a deep injustice happened. Whether it was 15 weeks ago or 15 years ago, the wounds are still deep today.

Thousands still remain traumatised by the Hillsborough experience, and a number of suicides since that day can be attributed directly to the 1989 tragedy.

[1864roverite]

.......and still....

the idiots or clowns that forged the tickets remain at large having never been identified

now thats the saddest thing about the whole scenario as whoever he/she or they be they are probably still living off the earnings of that fateful day and making money out of simialr ventures as we speak

[SkemLad]

roversactive....The only reason that your 5000 word essay wouldnt go down well on the liverpool site is for 2 reasons:

1 - The official Liverpool FC forums are a disgrace, and are full of people who dont know jack about our club. Other forums such as YNWA, and RAWK are where you would definately get a fair crack of the whip, and balanced arguements - not blatant ranting.

2 - Cos of the Souness part. People still havent forgiven Souness for the way he sold his soul to the s*n [albeit he was also conned by the paper] for what he wrote. Even if you dont agree with the ongoing protests/boycotts by Liverpool fans...this is still an issue we are sensitive too, and the Souness stories just inflamed that.

With regards to What the people of Liverpool are trying to achieve in all of this......

Justice?

15th April 1989 is a date that indelibly emblazoned across the hearts of every man, woman and child on Merseyside. A day that started with all the joy and expectancy of an FA Cup semi-final but which ultimately ended with ninety-six football fans losing their lives, for the support of their club.

Whilst Liverpool fans lay dead and dying on the Hillsborough turf, as trained police officers looked on, the cover-up into the causes of the disaster began. Gordon Taylor falsely claimed that Liverpool fans had forced open a gate. The Hillsborough disaster was a catalogue of calamitous events- the incompetence of Sheffield Wednesday Football Club, the ineptitude of South Yorkshire police, the ineffectiveness of Sheffield City Council (the club never even had a valid safety certificate) and the arrogance of the Football Association. The Association that chose to give Nottingham Forest considerably more tickets than Liverpool, despite having considerably fewer fans, citing traffic logistics as a reason.

The events served to bond the people of Liverpool closer than ever before as fans of all clubs paid their respects to the dead at Anfield. It was difficult not to be moved by the sight of a Manchester United fan sat crying and bewildered in the Albert pub next to Kop.

In the days that followed the disaster and despite all evidence being to the contrary The S*n newspaper decided to publish an article entitles “The Truth”, in which it claimed that Liverpool fans had robbed and urinated on the dead and had attacked the police, apparently our saviours. The investigations and evidence were to prove this to be lies. The police had chosen to open an exit gate at the Leppings Lane end of the ground, at the other side of the gate was the entrance to a tunnel leading to the central pens. There was no stewarding or policing at the tunnel, nor was there any signs to indicate alternative entrances to the terracing. At the end of the tunnel lay closed pens from which there was no way out for the ninety-six fans who lost their lives.

Since that day the S*n newspaper has been reviled on Merseyside and remains the subject of a mass boycott. We would urge all football fans of all clubs to consider how The S*n portrayed fellow football fans, in the days while we were all grieving, and would ask them to join our boycott of this vile rag. A recent media week study into the boycott on Merseyside estimated that the boycott had cost the S*n around £25 Million since the article.

Please Do Not Buy The S*n.

The Lord Justice Taylor inquiry into the events found the main cause of the disaster to be “The breakdown of Police control”. No court of law in this land has ever considered events after 3.15 on that day. Events such as the police refusing entry to the Stadium for Ambulance-men on the grounds that “People were fighting on the pitch”, events such as the Police sending for dog-handlers rather than emergency services with fence-cutting equipment. Anne Williams, who lost her fifteen year old son, Kevin, at Hillsborough describes the actions of the Liverpool fans that day as “heroic”, young untrained men trying to save the lives of the dead and injured, whilst trained Police Officers formed a cordon to keep fans off the pitch, and turned away ambulance-men armed with life-saving equipment.

Nobody has ever been held accountable in a British Courtroom for the events of that day, and the cover-up around Hillsborough continues. Anne received £3500 compensation for the loss of her young son whilst former police sergeant Martin Long received about one hundred times that amount for the Post Traumatic Stress he received whilst carrying out his duties.

In the fifteenth season since the disaster, the dead, bereaved and survivors of Hillsborough still fight for Justice. There has to be some accountability for the death of ninety-six people, even if the authorities see them as merely football fans, in 1989 the lowest of the low. It appears increasingly likely that the fight for Justice will never be resolved in a British Courtroom and will reach its ultimate destination in the European Courts, but the people of Merseyside and the fans of Liverpool Football Club will not let the fight for “The Truth” go away.

Justice is a complex notion, it can mean so much on so many different levels. It is not something which is black and white, justice is the truth of Hillsborough and Justice is a struggle. It will not be achieved overnight, but it will be achieved, and it is only through truth and accountability that it can be achieved.

The Hillsborough Justice Campaign represents bereaved families, survivors and supporters campaigning for justice for the 96 people who died at Sheffield Wednesday's Hillsborough football ground on 15th April 1989. The truth about Hillsborough is still denied by the authorities.

The campaign is situated at 178 Walton Breck Road, facing the Albert Pub and behind the Kop. All football fans are more than welcome to call in when you are at Anfield and have a look around our shop and premises, your support would be greatly appreciated, the group meet at 8pm every Monday evening at the premises.

[SkemLad]

.......and still....

the idiots or clowns that forged the tickets remain at large having never been identified

now thats the saddest thing about the whole scenario as whoever he/she or they be they are probably still living off the earnings of that fateful day and making money out of simialr ventures as we speak

.......and still....

the idiots or clowns that forged the tickets remain at large having never been identified

now thats the saddest thing about the whole scenario as whoever he/she or they be they are probably still living off the earnings of that fateful day and making money out of simialr ventures as we speak

Unbelieveable.....

This is EXACTLY what I mean about The S*n influencing what peoples ideas of what happened at Hillsborough really are.

Forged/fake tickets wasnt the issue mate. Never has been, never will be. This has been proven by the findings of many many people.

This IS why is happened....

Background to the Disaster

Liverpool had reached the semi-final of the FA Cup and were to play Nottingham Forest at the Hillsborough Stadium, home to Sheffield Wednesday Football Club. It was an identical scenario to the previous year when Liverpool had beaten Notts Forest at the same ground.

Tickets are always in short demand for such a game but in this instance Liverpool fans had even scarcer resources to draw from. They had been located the Leppings Lane end of the ground - the smaller end. Given the level of support this was a woefully inadequate allocation of tickets. Although there was general disquiet about this decision by the FA's, fans nevertheless resigned themselves to the fact. After all they had been through it all the year before and therefore many justifiably felt that they knew what to expect.

Fans set off early and full of optimism on that sunny Saturday morning. Whether they had travelled by road or rail, having left their transport at designated sites they were escorted by police towards the ground. One bereaved father described the areas around the ground as having a 'carnival atmosphere'. Sadly, this atmosphere would soon change.

The build up of fans around the Leppings Lane area increased dramatically around 2p.m. as people began to arrive in greater numbers. It also became known that many coaches were only just arriving having experienced delays from road works and police searches along the way. Clearly a crowd safety issue was emerging. Yet police records indicate little real concern at this stage.

From 2.30p.m. the number of people at the turnstile area was immense and orderly queuing was an impossibility. Fans being searched as they went in to the ground exacerbated this growing problem. Fans were entering a bottleneck. 10,000 fans, three gates, and seven turnstiles - this was the disastrous situation that people with tickets for the Leppings Lane end were walking into. Add to this the number of people with tickets for the West Stand (located above the terracing) who also had to enter by the same three gates and the recipe for disaster increases even further.

[SkemLad]

The Police Response

Superintendent Marshall was in overall command outside the ground. His record of the day reveals a heavy emphasis on the amount of alcohol being consumed by Liverpool fans. This emphasis was to become the main observation of the police version of events of the day and was the opposite of fans recollections and subsequent forensic evidence.

As conditions worsened fans were increasingly distressed. Those on the inside were struggling to breathe as the numbers swelled. Whilst on the outside the volume of those trying to enter at the Leppings lane end increased by the minute. An officer requested that the kick - off be delayed in order to reassure the crowd that there was no urgency. The request was denied. An inspector asked that the exit gates be opened in order to relieve the pressure outside. Marshall was reluctant to take this course of action because it would allow uncontrolled access to the stadium.

Fans accounts of the scenes outside the Leppings lane area point almost universally to a lack of organisation and control. Trapped in a bottleneck, quite literally, they had nowhere to go except where the momentum of the crowd led them. The fear of fans caught in this situation outside can only be matched by those struggling to survive on the inside.

Eventually Marshall radioed through to Chief Superintendent Duckenfield who was in overall command on the day (despite the fact that he had minimal experience of policing football and absolutely no experience of such a big game) and requested that the exit gates be opened. Duckenfield hesitated (he would later give evidence stating that he 'froze') but eventually gave the order: 'Open the gates'.

The Consequences of Opening Gate 'C'

Once gate C had been opened police directed fans through the gate. The most obvious entrance to the terraces was through the tunnel opposite into pens 3 and 4. Evidence would later be given that in previous years police and/or stewards would stand at the entrance to the tunnel if these central pens had reached capacity and would direct fans to the side pens.

In 1989 however, no such direction took place as fans headed innocently into already overcrowded pens. It is quite incomprehensible that Duckenfield, failed to follow up the order to open gate C with instructions to allow for the swift increase in the volume of people entering that end of the ground. Indeed the reasoning capacity of Chief Superintendent David Duckenfield has to be seriously challenged when one considers his response to the situation in pens 3 and 4. Logic would inform the average person that the volume outside would be replicated inside once entrance was allowed and that therefore swift monitoring and control would be necessary if a catastrophe was to be averted. Logic however, does not seem to figure large in the consciousness of David Duckenfield. His response to seeing people spill out onto the perimeter track from the crushing in the pens was to call for reinforcements (including dog handlers) as he thought there was a pitch invasion!

This response of Duckenfield is even more obscene when it is realised that from his position in the control box he could clearly see the Leppings Lane end. Moreover, he had the advantage of CCTV with zoom facilities. His later testimony that he was unaware that people were suffering and dying becomes totally unbelievable to those of us who have visited that control box and know that it is possible see the colour of a persons eyes in pens 3 and 4 such was the power of the zoom facilities on the cameras. On the basis of his response given the carnage that could clearly be seen several theories have been postulated:

Duckenfield lacks the ability to reason at a very basic humanitarian level and therefore one has to ask does this reflect on the general standard of senior policing in Britain today.

Duckenfield was totally indifferent to the situation he was witnessing in the pens and ignored the plight of dying people.Duckenfield was not in the control box at all, in which case where was he?

[SkemLad]

Inside The Pens

Inside the pens people were dead and dying. Faces were crushed up against the perimeter fencing, the vomit and blueness a clear sign of their condition. Fans were packed so tightly that many were dead standing up. Many still conscious were trying to break down the fencing with their hands. Those who had managed to climb over the fencing or escape when a perimeter gate was briefly opened also struggled to free their fellow fans. This was the sight that met the 'reinforcements' that had responded to Duckenfields' call to stem the 'pitch invasion'.

on the right, empty pens, centre packed pens 3 and 4

Clearly aware of the gravity of the situation many of these officers began to assist in trying to get people out. It has to be stated at this point that this is in stark contrast to many of the police officers positioned initially at the perimeter fencing who ignored the obvious signs of distress and the screams for help even though they were literally an arms length from those dying. It also contrasts with the actions of those other officers who pushed fans back inside the pens when from which they had momentarily escaped when the perimeter gate opened. These actions more than anything else illustrate graphically the prevailing attitude to football supporters by the police as an organisation. The only rational explanation for the actions of these officers was, that deep within their psyche, police training had conditioned them to view crowds in terms of crowd control rather than crowd safety. Their actions during the Miners Strike of 1984 and the Trafalgar Square Poll Tax demonstrations support this view. They had also been conditioned to inextricably link football supporters and hooliganism. As we now know this 'conditioning' had the disastrous consequence of leading to the biggest sporting disaster in British history.

The pitch soon resembled a battleground as bodies were laid out on the ground and the injured wandered around dazed and confused. Fans sought desperately to save lives. Apart from pleading with police to recognise the seriousness of the situation, they tore down advertising hoardings to act as stretchers and ferried fans to the far end of the pitch in the hope that they would receive treatment. Although ill - equipped to do so many fans attempted to resuscitate people themselves in the absence of professional medical assistance.

The Cause Of Disaster

The official cause of the Disaster was given as the failure of police control (see the Taylor Inquiry).

Football games in general were organised in the context of crowd control at the expense of crowd safety. Football supporters were defined within the context of hooliganism.

With specific reference to South Yorkshire Police and Hillsborough, it is obvious that they adhered to this framework and operated with a measure of complacency given that 1989 was a re-run of the semi-final of 1988.

However, many argue that Hillsborough was a Disaster waiting to happen. Also there were changes in 1989 - the senior police officer in overall command had very little experience of such an event. Also there was no process of filtering fans from outside the ground. Most importantly once gate C had been opened there was no attempt at directing fans away from the tunnel and to the side pens where there was still empty spaces. This situation when combined with the failure of the police to recognise and respond to the obvious visible signs of distress of the injured and dying, resulted in the 'Hillsborough

www.contrast.org/hillsborough

[roversactive]

This is getting worse, why are you all posting extracts from books and websites, I've read all of these before. You obviously came on here because you wanted our opinions, and you don't think that we should give them - infact I feel that you are telling us what is right.

The day will never be forgotten but again, let thoose who fell RIP, they deserve that if nothing else. Hold a grudge against the sun forevermore, I don't have a problem with that - its just that every 6 months you have to come and tell us all about it again!

I know what happened and as a football fan that day will never be forgotten, I understand how bad it really was but there is a time surely when these should be just memories rather then a vendetta against anyone. I'm sure that if any football fan could change anything in history it would be this event but its impossible to do so.

I really am taking an even bigger dislike to the fans of Liverpool Football Club. not just because of this, but everything - how I always have to skip through essay's of the Kop, anti Souness and Hillsbrough Threads. If I wanted to talk about these topics seriously or in depth I would honestly visit one of your many websites.

These are some of them...

www.brfcs.biz/mb/index.php?showtopic=7926

www.brfcs.biz/mb/index.php?showtopic=8341

Edited July 9, 2004 by roversactive

[SkemLad]

Thanks.

Maybe, just dont read mine or Mottman's posts in the future? Seems simple!

[Ricky]

roversactive, If you don't like the content of the thread then Dont bloody read it. Its fairly obvious from the title what its all about.

You've got your own messageboard, please feel free to ban any scousers from there if you want to, we however understand how serious a subject this is. This topic has stimulated some moving posts, just read Tris' post (he's not a Liverpool fan) for evidence.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

''An officer requested that the kick - off be delayed in order to reassure the crowd that there was no urgency. The request was denied''

That action alone is totally scandalous...unbelievable.

Now then,your vitriol against Souness needs to be laid to rest Skemlad..the fella offered a full apology long ago.We have ALL said and done thing's(many without thinking of the consequences) that we come to deeply regret and Souness made that known about the interview and has continued to do so.

What do you want him to do FFS? what is done is done,anybody who believes Souness DELIBERATELY set out to hurt the feeling of Liverpool's fan's need's to have their head examined.

REMEMBER HIM FOR THE GOOD TIMES HE GAVE YOUR CLUB AS A PLAYER AND THE NUMEROUS TIMES HE PROUDLY LIFTED THE EUROPEAN CUP.

Edited July 9, 2004 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[roversactive]

Your vitriol against Souness needs to be laid to rest Skemlad..the fella offered a full apology long ago.

A sincere apology means nothing to a Liverpool fan.

[SkemLad]

Are you back on this thread? Thought you were sick of it all?

Do us a favour lad...if you dont agree, or dont care then fine...or if you dislike us as people, and as a club then fine as well...but dont bring down the good posts made by other fans from yer own club with sarcastic and humourless posts like that.

I hope that there is never a point in your life where you have to experience any of the things some of the families/survivors of Hillsborough had to endure. Yeah, maybe there are things bigger and worse in the world...but when something effects your little corner of the world, it doesnt half make things hit home - dont agree, but at least have some respect!!!

[LeChuck]

I've decided to post in here when almost everything has been said that needs to be said, so I'll just some up my own feelings on it:

I can fully understand why any Liverpool fan, or football fan for that matter, would choose to boycott The Sun. What I don't find acceptable is that Wayne Rooney's name is being dragged into it, that is where this whole vendetta starts to reflect badly on Liverpool. He is not the first Scouser to talk to The Sun, nor will he be the last, he just happens to be the most high profile for some time and his fame is being used be those who just want to open up old wounds.

[1864roverite]

you forget one thing skem lad

the pen WAS overcrowded was it not ?

therefore

either the club sold more tickets than it had actually been allocated

or

somebody produced forgeries to sell beforehand

and please please dont tell me that this one subject has never been mentioned before.

i have had the opportunity to read both the Police investigation AND the individual accounts held on file from over 1830 people who were spoken to and that includes LFC fans in fact they are the majority. Some of those persons have already admitted as much they were in possession of tickets NOT supplied by the club.

Whatever the outcome of that is totally irrelevent anyhow.

Those poor supporters lost their lives and loved ones suffered, all decent football fans feel strongly about the loss.

Anyhow I am closed on the subject. but please please please remember this

where this is ANY football match there are TOUTS, always have been and always will be