[Archived] David Thompson?

[T4E]

If Emerton were a defender. If he were stuck in defence he wouldn't be able to go on one of his magical runs,

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAA

Are you available for parties?

[The Harwood Yankee]

I know it makes for an interesting discussion point for the pragmatists out there, but defining players' roles within the team as if they are set in stone is fairly pointless. Over the course of the season we'll play 19 teams (+ Cup games - we usually manage about 3 of those!) and each will require different things of the team. On top of that it is inevitable that injuries will creep in. Hopefully fewer suspensions with Todd on his way out, Flitty out of favour and Neill promising to behave. However, having a squad of versatile players is far more important than 11 clearly defined roles.

Thommo may well start in the middle against WBA, but its inevitable that Souness will call on his versatility should either of the first-choice wide players become unavailable (or just crap, like Emerton at the end of last season).

[MancRover]

I don't think we need to worry too much about Thommo. Come October and he'll be out for the rest of the season with a recurrance of his knee injury (again).

[joey_big_nose]

The interesting comment for me though in Souness's LET piece is where he mentions that playing Thompson in central midfield may force a tactical change.  Does this mean we might play a 5 man midfield?  I can certainly see Thompson being effective "in the hole" with Ferguson and Flitcroft/whoever behind.  But that would mean we'd either have to only play one up front or start with 3 at the back.

If he wants a 5 man midfield the sensible thing would be to play a 3-5-2, as any of our forwards would be lost on their own up top. Having Emerton/Neill/Douglas on one side Gray/Gresko on the other as wing-backs wouldn't be too bad. Matteo, Short, Amo in the middle at the back, could work, useful having two reliable if unspectacular players to cover Amo's mistakes and all or nothing play.

I dont think we will be playing five in the middle, we did not sign De Pedro to leave him out.

Im really not sure how Graeme can adequately accomodate both Thompson and Ferguson in the middle, it is an interesting conundrum. The only way I can see it working is if Ferguson drops into the deep role and sharpens up his tackling- this is not neccesarily a bad thing as he has a very good range of passing which he can use to pull the strings a la Tugay.

ps. Ferguson is not a naturally attacking midfielder- indeed at Rangers he was famed for his affinity for the centre circle, Souness has been trying to get him to be come more "box to box" in his time here.

[LeChuck]

Thompson to play central!!!

I'm quite interested to know what this change of tactics will be. I can't see it being a 3-5-2 because we wouldn't have needed to sign De Pedro if that was what Souey was planning...I can't see it being a 4-5-1 either because he has said he would like an experienced 5th striker, again I don't think we would need one of those if we were planning to play just one up front.

The only thing I can think of that seems feasible is a 4-4-2 diamond with Thommo at the top, like this:

               Friedel

Neill     Amoruso    Matteo   Gray

             Ferguson
     Emerton           De Pedro
             Thompson

          Stead     Dickov

I can't see Souey doing anything drastic, it would be far too a big a risk. Maybe he's taken a liking to the more compact midfield that we used at the end of last season and is thinking of the above...

Edited July 23, 2004 by LeChuck

[Presty On Tour]

the dimond thing didnt really work for england tho did it??

still a few more friendly matches to go so lets see how thompson preforms if he is picked in the cm role?

[LeChuck]

the dimond thing didnt really work for england tho did it??

Well no, but that's because England didn't do it properly and had at least two players out of position.

Czech Republic used the diamond formation and it worked well for them, as long as you play with a disciplined holding player and wide players who won't stay too narrow then it can be a very effective formation.

It's just my guess anyway, to me it just seems to most feasible out of the lot considering the players we have and the signings we've made.

[Lathund]

Could be a 4-4-1-1 (Which is basicly a 4-5-1 though) like Man Utd used to play with Scholes supporting RvN. Although I don't think that'd work very well with any of our strikers. At least not yet, Stead could become a player that could do well in such a role in the future though.

I've never liked playing three at the back, so I really hope we don't.

[T4E]

Thompson to play central!!!

I'm quite interested to know what this change of tactics will be. I can't see it being a 3-5-2 because we wouldn't have needed to sign De Pedro if that was what Souey was planning...I can't see it being a 4-5-1 either because he has said he would like an experienced 5th striker, again I don't think we would need one of those if we were planning to play just one up front.

The only thing I can think of that seems feasible is a 4-4-2 diamond with Thommo at the top, like this:

               Friedel

Neill     Amoruso    Matteo   Gray

             Ferguson
     Emerton           De Pedro
             Thompson

          Stead     Dickov

I can't see Souey doing anything drastic, it would be far too a big a risk. Maybe he's taken a liking to the more compact midfield that we used at the end of last season and is thinking of the above...

Doing that would waste Ferguson in the exact way that England wasted Gerrard in that role. As you say, if youplay everyone in position then it can work - that isnt Ferguson's position.

[est990]

ok so i think its clear that we don't want to play ferguson deep so how about playing a 4 3 1 2?

Friedel

Neil Amoruso Matteo Gray

Emerton Ferguson De Pedro

Thompson

Stead Jansen

then that would allow de pedro and emerton to run up the flanks ferguson is around the centre circle, then thompson is can be up behind the forwards and drop back to ferguson and ferguson can really be in the midfield. then its just the matter of keepin discipline at the back which hopefully matteo can help amo do

maybe that could work? just a thought, you can rip it apart now!

[LeChuck]

Doing that would waste Ferguson in the exact way that England wasted Gerrard in that role. As you say, if youplay everyone in position then it can work - that isnt Ferguson's position.

I agree....but the only way around that would be to play with 3 central players...and from the following comment I don't think that's something we'd do:

We might have to tinker with the system a little bit

Changing to a 3 in midfield, either by 3-5-2 or 4-5-1, would be more than tinkering a little bit I think. I'm convinced it will be a 4-4-2 with Thommo and Ferguson in the middle...

He's (Thompson) got an eye for a goal and the nearer you can get him to the opposition's goal, the more dangerous he becomes.

...and after reading that, it's fairly obvious that Thommo is going to be the forward running player. Even if it's not a diamond, Ferguson is still going to be the holding player.

And anyway...doesn't he play a holding role for Scotland?

Edited July 23, 2004 by LeChuck

[T4E]

Barry Ferguson has way too much to his game to be purely a "holding player". The simple fact is, we dont have to choose. It doesnt always have to be the same player that gets forward and the same that stays back. We need to play a very simple 4-4-2 just like every other team thats ever been successful in this country. Flat midfield 4, thats all we need. No fancy diamonds, no specified holding players, no libero's, no 5 man midfields.

[LeChuck]

I'm not doubting the qualities of Ferguson, I'm just trying to guess at what this tactical change will be. The system you talk of is the one that we've played for the last few years, both Flitty and Tugay were allowed to go forward as long as the other sat, so if that were to be the formation then it wouldn't require any tinkering at all...

[T4E]

Precisely. Which brings us full circle and both against the diamond. Which was my point in the first place.

Although I could quite easily pick you up on the thing about Flitcroft going forward........

[chris]

there's no reason why Thompson can not cover Ferguson sometimes, Ferguson naturally stays deep a lot and makes the "sherwood" style runs, but he can't hit a ball from 25 yards like Thompson.

Thompson always has a lot of energy, so the two players can switch but Ferguson will be mainly the deeper of the two and look to switch the ball around.

At the moment I think 10 players of the team are picked, tthem being in LeChuck's selection, i just hope we find a better player then the ageing Dickov soon in the bargin basement or Gallagher hits his potential early.

[roversWASmylife]

I think eventually Thommo will be picked to play in the centre of midfield.

Thommo has all the qualities of being a quality midfielder. He has the skill, strong player and isn’t frightened of getting his foot in.

Thommo could be a very influential player if he was to be played just behind the front two. He loves running at players, which is what we didn’t have last season. Not only can he create goal scoring opportunities for others, but he can himself.

I’m not sure what position Thommo started against Gencler at Ewood. But I remember he was everywhere in that midfield, really worked his socks off that game.

But on the other hand it also creates a problem for Barry. I see Barry as the complete midfielder. He can run with the ball, pass, shoot, cross, tackle and defend a lot better than Thompson in my opinion.

I would like to try out, possibly in remainder of our friendly games the midfield that could look like this:

Thompson Douglas Barry De Pedro

With both Thommo and De Pedro getting forward, it would also see Barry getting forward as well, who can back also with Douglas sitting in as the holding player.

People seem to forget, FourLaneBlue pointed it out that Douglas was the main reason why we were keeping Bolton’s attack quiet until he got taken off and other players messed up things.

I wouldn’t say yes straight away, but I wouldn`t rule it out as a possibility.

[Philly Rover ®]

Barry Ferguson has way too much to his game to be purely a "holding player".

Perhaps being a bit pedantic, but the holding midfielder role isn't necessarily reserved for low-skill grafters. Players such as Vieira, Keane, Makelele and Davids have been world class playing in that central holding role, and they certainly have (or at least had, at the height of their career) more to their respective games than our Fergie. That is no disrespect to Barry Ferguson... just pointing out that he could play a quote/unquote holding role and still have the freedom to get forward at key times as Keane and Vieira and company do.

That being said, if Thompson proves fit enough I wouldn't disagree with reverting to the classic 4-4-2 formation you proposed as the best option.

[joey_big_nose]

Ahhhh.... I would partially disagree there.

Viera does not really play in a holding role- indeed Gilberto was signed to free him of that responsibility. To allow a player to get forward you need to be able to share defensive duties between the two players often in more of a territorial way than tackling and so forth. Both players cannot go forward at the same time and I think the principle problem would be that Thompson ould be the forward player virtually all the time merely due to his nature.

Also it is seriously worth considering the impact of having our dave in the centre upon the wide players. If Thompson goes forward not only would Barry have to sit back but both Emerton and De Pedro would be limited in how far up the pitch they wentas Ferguson would need additional protection. However this may actually suit us as our two 'wingers' are not really wingers at all afraid of (As Mr Pringle would put it) the 'touchline monster'. There inclination to tuck in and try and penetrate from deep could well close the midfield enough to allow Thompson freedom.

On the other hand this is effectively a Diamond formation..... not pretty most of the time.

[BRFC4EVA]

Looks like Souness agrees with me if you've seen that article in the Let. Thommo for centre mid next year!!

[den]

Can't for the life of me see thomo making a central midfielder. Away from home especially, a C.M'r has to be able to drop back and give the back four good cover. Some games he will have to do little else. Can't see him being able to do that. tracking back and tackling, just isn't in his vocabulary.

Also remember him playing the C.M. role once or twice. He didn't impress me.

On top of that, you need to be an excellent, passer of the ball, with vision. He aint that either. What Thomo is all about is running with the ball and trying to put people under pressure.

[1864roverite]

riml

forget douglas in that quartet.

flitty and tugay would be in front of him in any team/formation. JHC I would even pick reid ahead of him in that position.

[roversWASmylife]

Why forget Douglas in that courtet?

All I’m saying is at least try that midfield out in one of the three remaining pre-season games that we have left, to see if it might work for us.

I can’t see what the problem is with Douglas? He has played there before and did very well, actually we were winning when he was substituted, and eventually we lost at home to Bolton, which FourLaneBlue pointed out earlier on in the thread.

Douglas I think could be the player for the holding player to allow Barry to get forward.

Douglas may not be the most talented player in the world, but as he proved last season in the games that he played in he does the simple things better than most.

THOMPSON SET FOR CENTRAL ROLE

[chris]

douglas is a right back, I have a feeling that Souness will now allow him to compete with Neill, whether he's good enough I don't know, Douglas filled in the left midfield position meeting the MINIMUM requirements to fill that position, its not the way forward and he does not have the ability we are looking for in a midfielder, but I would like to see him at right back, I doubt he would be brilliant but like to see it.

[John]

If we can get a fit Thompson back we will have a very good midfield pool to pick from.

Below are some comments about David Thompson made on Friday by Liverpool academy director Frank Skelly.

"I also look at someone such as David Thompson, and I think it's sad we never saw the best of him at Liverpool. He was definitely an England player in the making.

"He's someone I look at and think we should have been patient and given him time to develop, he has had bad injuries of late at Blackburn but he will come back."

[Ewood Dream]

Thompson is the man we need (Of course a reliable defence that isn't as penetrable as soaked paper would be nice as well).

The majority of us have been waiting a very long time now to see a Ferguson-Thompson midfield combination. With Brett Emerton on the right-hand side and once more I'll reiterate in another topic about how either Morten-Gamst Pedersen or De Pedro deserve a proper run on the left-midfield.

Edited October 17, 2004 by Ewood Dream