[Archived] Rovers 1 - 1 West Brom

[1864roverite]

perhaps Kamy can enlighten us to the rumours that yesterday flitty met the wigan manager for talks !

[Paul Mellelieu]

A strange match this one. The first thing to say is that WBA never looked like scoring, bar from a dead ball situation. Although that has as much to do with Albion's lack of desire to get forward and lack of abiity, as Rovers' defensive acumen. They were a very poor team, if fairly solid at the back.

The first half was characterised by a lack of shape from the Rovers, with three players de Perdo, Gresko and Gray, hugging the left touch line at times. Although the passing was neat enough, too many long balls were thrown up to the front two, who struggled to create anything. In particular Stead looked out of sorts and shot from range when a short ball to Yorke would have seen my man of the match in on goal. I was worried by Dedro's lack of mobility, but I understand he's been victim to an injury in pre-season.

Second half and the introduction of Tugay and Dickov transformed the blues. Albion found it impossible to pick up Yorke who played as well as I've seen him at Ewood for a long time. Dickov was excellent, but Stead was still a bit quiet. Possession wasn't tuned into chances though, although Emerton missed a sitter.

Two points dropped. We msut do better.

Still don't like the blue shorts.

[bob fleming]

Welcome back Paul.

OK - I've had a few - and no review of the game here. This is how I see it...

There was one or two who thought it was a good idea to try players out of position this pre-season. There were one or two who thought it would be a good idea to try different formations in pre-season.

Bollards.

Same old same old - welcome to the last game of last season.

Play Four Four fecking Two and be done with it. (come on bob - next thing you'll be talking about stuff like "building an understanding" between the players - it's madness)

If the manager can't decide on his best 11 or isn't brave enough to pick his first 11 or isn't prepared to pizz people off for the sake of the team - then we may well struggle. And this poster might just change his mind and decide that it's time for a change at the top.

And I really don't want that.

Sorry but that's the way I feel right now.

[Scotty]

For those of you who don't like negativity look away now!

I'd love to tell you what formation we played in the first half but I'm afraid I haven't a clue. All I can tell you is where everyone played - you make a formation out of it if you can - good luck. We lined up Freidel (gk), Gray (lb), Short (cb), Amoruso (cb), Emerton (rb/rwb/rw - who knows?), Ferguson (cm), Gresko (cm!), Matteo (cm), De Pedro (lw), Yorke (cf), Stead (cf).

I guess the idea was to load the play down our left knowing that West Brom had precious little attacking threat down their left. Unfortunately though, De Pedro had one of the worst debuts I've ever seen. He doesn't look fit and his crossing was appalling. Obviously it's early days and I'm sure he'll get better but he was shocking today. On top of that, too many of our players didn't seem to know what they were doing or what spaces they should take up.

As a result, our first half display was crap. We lacked any sort of cutting edge and failed to get behind the West Brom defence, despite the amount of possession we had. Our forwards lived off scraps and long balls, our midfield lost possession too frequently, and our right side was non-existant.

In contrast, when West Brom had the ball they looked threatening - especially Kanu who was a class above anything else on the pitch imo. Fortunately though we defend well - right up until the referee awarded them a dodgy free-kick about 25 yards out.

First of all it was never a free-kick. I've not seen it on tele yet but it looked like Matteo got the ball to me. Secondly, the ref marched our wall back at least 12-13 yards, if not more. Finally, and crucially, the wall was bobbins. Clement didn't curl the ball round the wall, he didn't put it over the wall, he simply put it straight through and our ######-poor, ######-scared defence wimped out. Pathetic goal to concede.

We never looked like getting a goal back and half-time was a blessed relief.

Souness made a couple of changes after the interval - Dickov and Tugay replaced Gresko and De Pedro. We switched to 3-5-2 with Short, Matteo and Amo at the back, Gray, Ferguson, Tugay and Emerton in midfield, and Yorke playing just behind Stead and Dickov. We looked a lot better. Everyone knew what they were doing and we were much more threatening than in the first half. Yet again though, just like last season, we failed to convert our possession into chances.

Before we equalised we almost gifted West Brom a second. A routine backpass from Amoruso was under-hit and Friedel had top make a sharp save to recover the situation.

For the most part though, West Brom put 9 men behind the ball and we couldn't break them down. We camped outside their area for long periods, with Tugay and Yorke pulling the strings, but we lacked the necessary guile, skill and class to get behind them. In fact, our goal came a bit out of the blue. A long cross from the left was met by a fantastic, determined run from Short, and the ball went in off his shoulder I think. Who cares, he deserved the goal for the run he made alone.

We continued to make all the running but created very little. We had a couple of half shouts for penalties but I didn't see anything really clear-cut. Emerton did seem to get through towards the end but he failed to get his shot away in time. That's about all the attacking threat I can remember.

I've been one of the more negative posters on this board for the last six or seven months or so. I don't enjoy doing this, I'd much rather the Rovers were brilliant and I had nothing to complain about, but I don't believe that's been the case for a while now. However, I was looking forward to today's game and was fairly positive beforehand. Sadly, I find it hard to take many positives from today.

De Pedro was awful, Emerton is so lacking in confidence it's untrue. He's not a bad player but he's playing badly. Stead was anonymous today, Dickov was lively but didn't show any quality imo, Ferguson and Tugay were neat on the ball but never opened up West Brom's defence, Matteo wasn't as immpessive as he has been in pre-season, Amoruso was solid but then nearly gave a goal away with a dodgy backpass.

Only Yorke and Short really emerged with any credit for me today. Short's second half display was the picture of determination and he, more than anyone, looked like he wasn't prepared to get beat. Yorke was class. He was my man of the match, especially in the second half when he linked up play between midfield and attack superbly. He also worked his socks off.

It's early days obviously and far too early to make any serious judgements about the team yet, but I was looking for some encouragement today to show me that we'd improved on last season. I didn't get any. We drew, at home, against a team that are almost certain to be relegated.

[broadsword]

Hmmm ... on balance having read these reports, and not having been at the game ... I get the feeling we have a season of struggle ahead of us.

And maybe it doesn't matter who we have in charge because we're so small we shouldn't be in the top flight.

But ... early days!

[bob fleming]

Bryan - you're better than that middle paragraph.

[Glenn]

Hmmm ... on balance having read these reports, and not having been at the game ... I get the feeling we have a season of struggle ahead of us.

And maybe it doesn't matter who we have in charge because we're so small we shouldn't be in the top flight.

But ... early days! 

I rarely comment on football on here, but all this negativity has forced it out of me. I feel compelled to try and level this out a little.

I felt we looked really good for the first 20 minutes, every 50-50 ball was challenged for, and more often than not won. I've not seen so much fight and spirit in the midfield for such a long time. Sadly things started to slow a little as the first half went on, but I guess by the huge amount of liquids some players were taking on during the game that fitness may still be an issue.

Upto the WBA goal I'd thought we'd had the run of the game, certainly WBA didn't seem to have any real threat. The wall looked weak for the free kick, not that us being susceptable for set pieces is anything new. Wd then simply rode out the storm until half time. De Pedro looked ineffective and off the pace, but souness warned us of this as he did last season with Barry Ferguson (ok ... and Baggio .... and Grabbi)

The second half we looked a different team, I can't imagine how people are finding much to criticize about the second half display (with the possible exception of the infuriating Emo). Souness could see his team selection for the first half wasn't working, so he changed it and it worked.

Tugay had a great second half, but I wouldn't expect it too often, last season everyone learnt that giving him room was a dangerous game to play and so he was man marked out of every game. It seems nobody told WBA about him and the Tugay of old returned. The problem I see now is that either Souness will pick him for Soton, he'll be marked out of the game and the fans will have a downer on him again or Souness won't pick him and the fans will have a downer on Souness for not picking one of the last games top performers.

A couple of silly lazy mistakes at the back towards the end by the back 4 (or was it 3 or 5 .... fair play to the nay-sayers, it was hard to tell) put pay to what otherwise would have been a good solid performance (weak wall excepted) but we kept pushing forward and I thought my 25/1 HT/FT bet on WBA/Rovers looked safe and when Shorty scored from a class cross I was already working out what my winnings were going to be spent on.

Sadly the second goal never game, but you always felt like it could. Not a feeling I came across much last season.

Running through the team.

Friedal - Can't be blamed for the goal, the reason you have a wall is so the keeper can watch a smaller area of the goal. Made a great save towards the end when a WBA player was one on one after a sloppy back pass.

Mickey Gray - Looked solid in defense and threatening going forward, seemed to overlap with whichever player happend to be playing left wing at the time very well. He can also cross a ball pretty well.

Matteo - Looked solid, perhaps a little to "argicultural" once or twice. Couple of silly mistakes, but overall a good game. I still think we've got a good buy here.

Short - Great game. Even without the goal it was just what you'd expect from him. Reliable.

Amo - See Matteo !

Emo - First half made a decent stand in right back (or was he just a right winger that played deep in the first half), maybe we've found a use for him after all. Second half was typical Emo (unable to take players on or cross). We need either Tommo fit again or give his second half replacement (Gally) a run in his position.

Gresko - After looking a very promissing midfielder in the pre seasons seemed somewhat anonymous. Linked up well with Mickey Gray for the bit where he was on the left wing.

Ferg - Chased, battle, tackled, deployed. Everything a battling CM should be. Unlike Peter Jackson I wouldn't have given him MoM but a good performance al the same

De Pedro - Half a yard off the pace, in effectual and still some way to go. But then we said that for Barry's first few games.

Stead - Playing like someone plucked from D3 and whilst talented is struggling to live up to the hype in the Prem. Not a bad performance, but we've seen better,

Yorke - Excellent. Fought, battled, chased, jinked, dinked and looked dangerous. My man of the match, long may this level of effort continue

Subs

Dickov - Did what we bought him for, got in there and made a nuisence of himself. Not keen on his blatent dives in the area.

Tugay - Bossed midfield, the Tugay of old, but will he get that much room again this season ?

Gally - Looked far better as a winger than Emo. Maybe we've found a new role for him.

All in all, not a bad performance. Sure it should have been 3 points, but it's not like the muppets on Talk Sport were making out, that WBA were a better side. We played some good football, nothing too much was wrong and on a different day we'd have won 3-0. Cut out some of the silly mistakes and we'll easily get a result and Soton and I even fancy out chances at Man Utd.

As for the Boo boys. IF YOU GOING TO BOO THE REF YOU DO IT AS HE WALKS OFF THE PITCH NOT AS SOON AS HE BLOWS HIS WHILSTLE. It sounded today very much like large sections of the Blackburn End booed the first half performance today of the team, that must had done the team a world of good. Nice One !

Rant Over, Football Talk Over, I'll go back to my technical stuff again now and leave all you doom and gloom merchants to rueing the loss of Andy Cole.

[AJConroy]

My first post, so treat me gently boys.

I live in London and didnt make today's game. However I have just seen the game on Sky. How good was the edit - did the roughly 60minutes of highlights fairly reflect the game?

If it did, then the first half looked iffy. I was reassured to see Ferguson in the middle: we need a big season from him this year. He clearly has the talent. The half looked half-baked. If you are going to stand there, dont turn your back or move. Please. Matteo seemed to give away quite a few free kicks.

Second half was much better. It seemed an altogether more passionate performance. I like to see Tugay pick up the ball and spread it around but I wonder whether how often he'll get that space this season? Compare him to say JJ Ok at Bolton - he seems to be able to make the space as well as use it. I am not sure about Dickov. He feels like a supersub to me. Something to keep on the bench, just in case.

So all in all, not too bad. Looking forward to seeing the real thing at St Marys and Highbury in the next ten days.

Still confident we'll be mid-table.

[ABBEY]

glenn as i said before only boos i heard were for the numpty in black.

[philipl]

Just watched Sky Sports full 90 minutes of the Rovers WBA game.

Souness lost us two points today and boy did he know it from his reaction at the end of the game. Whatever the formation was and wherever people were supposed to be playing, we had three central defenders, two left backs, another left footer further up the line and no right back. No wonder we were one down at half time.

Second half we looked more like a football team but still a rather disjointed one. Neither side looked Prem class.

Some random observations:

Neil Clement can still hit them.

I thought Brad looked very leaden footed for their goal. That said, the wall failed badly.

de Pedro was not match fit according to Souey so it was a rank bad decision to play him.

From the Sky camera angle on the gantry, Ewood looked very empty. Were the crowd hiding?

Tugay is sheer class. As is Fergie. Keep them together.

Sky Sports stats showed Rovers had 64% possession and more than twice as many goal attempts as WBA. Unfortunately for chances on target, both sides had the same number- 3 each.

Edited August 14, 2004 by philipl

[Tom Pringle]

Right, short and quick post.

Emerton doesn't run at people, still.

Yorke was excellent, stead didn't look interested, Dickov was also excellent.

Start with Dickov, drop Emerton NOW and let Tommo replace Gallagher when he's fit.

As for the rest, not that convinced we should be so negative. Thought we played well at parts and looked very good.

[LeChuck]

I don't see why some people have singled out Emerton for criticism (well I do, but that's for later). Yes, on occasions his crossing was poor and he was sometimes but reluctant to take on his man, however...did Michael Gray do any of that? Did he take on his man down the outside? Did he whip in dangerous crosses every time? No of course he didn't, but he's not the easy target is he? (edit: not saying Gray is bad here, he wasn't, it's just he's the comparison)

Emo supplied good width in a game where we desperately needed it and was solid in defence. He's obviously low on confidence but the quality is there and, on todays showing, he's worth persevering with because he's certainly no worse than anybody else. On the subject of being poor, how many fouls did Matteo commit today? As for that pass he attempted before their goal...someone should pin a note on his locker: "We don't play in red at home".

Edited August 14, 2004 by LeChuck

[ABBEY]

clement !read flukey

empty?bullshit!

brad?lead footed?bollllox ...no chance!

tugs...i love him!!!

[Glenn]

glenn as i said before only boos i heard were for the numpty in black.

My point exactly, having spent most of the last five minutes of the first half on my feet swearing at the ref and linesman *I* knew it was aimed at the ref, however someone not watching from where we were (i.e. from the pitch, press box, tv gantry, away end etc) they would have heard the boos as the whilstle was blown and would have assumed it was aimed it the team (normally done on the whilstle) not the ref (normally done as he's about to enter the tunnel).

I wasn't saying people were wrong to boo, just that by doing it at an inapropriate time it will probably be picked up on (by the press) as us booing the team.

[Blackpool_Rover]

Now i know it seems silly to moan about highlights after the excellent coverage we got from sky tonight but i taped MOTD at the same time so i could watch the rest. Linekar made a point of saying they will show decent highlights of every team. So i go through the recording and hes right! Everyone getting some good highlights! Even every team getting a view from lawro after the highlights, but hold on, its now 11:55 and rovers still arent on! Here we go, show the goals and about 2 chances, totally miss our early 2nd half pressure showing amos mistake first, then absolutely nothing said from all 3 of them after it! SAME OLD SAME OLD! EVERYONE HATES US!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[greggyk]

Neither side looked Prem class

######!! Worst statement I've heard in a long time!

That second half performance was as good as the 02/03 season

Them sky cameras must be showing a whole different game as I've heard from the official MB that chris kamara was saying WBA were all over us for the whole first half.

Im more encouraged now than I was before the match.

It just shows what chaos Lucas Neill being injured can create.

Maybe hes our most important player

[cn174]

Well a couple of points I took from the game. As has already been said, first half wasn't the best. We weren't that poor, just seemed as though we were still playing a friendly.

The first goal was very silly. First of all Matteo lost the ball in a daft position, and although he did take some of the ball I think it was probably a foul. Then our wall - wtf was going on?! But apart from that, WBA didn't really cause us any problems.

The second half and change of formation, we looked a lot better. Thought Yorke was very good and Dickov was also good. Stead wasn't too good but did put in an excellent cross for the goal.

One thing that has definately not changed though is freekicks!! Why do we shift freekicks? IT DOES NOT WORK!!! If we just hit it first time, we'd stand much more of a chance of scoring.

I'm quite happy with a 1-1 draw, we came close on several occasions and some solid defending from wba kept us out. Should get something out of the Saints game - they looked quite poor today on the highlights, then we need to get ready for the big boys the following week!

[tashor]

Heysus l. Xristus or whatever phrase this tree-hugging forum now allows....

Same old same old over and over again.....

Disjointed, lethargic, unambitious, arrogant poseurs who thing we are better than we really are.......and that is just the majority of the contributors to this messageboard!!

Who do you all think we are?? Still the glorious northern @#/? creation of His Holiness Jack the Magnificent??

At very best we now represent the upper end of the third faction of the four divisions of the premiership. Comfortably beating those in the lowest reaches is no longer our Jack given due. Wake up and smell the true scent of our blessed red rose....

After leaving Ewood today I was cursing Emerton, Matteo and Amoruso....

But after watching the 50 minute highlights on Sky and the pitiful I.T.V. like - match of the day, combined with several beers ( not at work tonight for a change - thanks for your concern dave B. gamma G.T. all over the place I am sure ) I have become saddened by the spoiled ranting of those here who's post match posts I used to respect...

Stead worked hard to little effect, Yorke looked a class act, Tugay ran the show in the second half, Ferguson is improving all the time, Short is still a man mountain and Gray was our best player as usual.

OK - 2 points dropped - but shyite happens - glass half full or half empty??

Crowd not as low as some feared and reasonable noise from the true fans.

A sunny Lancashire day playing in one of the best leagues in the world representing a small Lancashire town.......only spoiled by the ever growing band of spoiled brats here...

HA!! love you all really......NOT!

WE ARE PREMIER LEAGUE, SAY WE ARE PREMIER LEAGUE.....

life is too short....enjoy it while you can....ride the blue 'n' white rover-coaster....

[Nate]

Dickov - Did what we bought him for, got in there and made a nuisence of himself. Not keen on his blatent dives in the area.

Well we have to get one of those this season...... what are they called again? Ummmmm penalty, thats it

[Morph]

I don't see why some people have singled out Emerton for criticism (well I do, but that's for later). Yes, on occasions his crossing was poor and he was sometimes but reluctant to take on his man, however...did Michael Gray do any of that? Did he take on his man down the outside? Did he whip in dangerous crosses every time?...

...On the subject of being poor, how many fouls did Matteo commit today? As for that pass he attempted before their goal...someone should pin a note on his locker: "We don't play in red at home".

I think part of people's frustration with Emerton is that he clearly has the ability to take opposition defenders on, get the ball to the byline and whip a cross in etc, but for whatever reason he just...doesn't. Ever. To continue your comparison Le Chuck, whenever Gray doesn't cross the ball he tends to do at least something constructive with it, be it a decent pass, a crack at goal or a surging run into the box.

Today Brett looked in two minds whenever he was in possession, his train of thought being roughly "Strewth, some drongo has passed the ball to me again! Right, should I zig-zag back and forth for a couple of seconds until this fella tackles me or should I just hoof it into the stands now? Oh, he's gone and tackled me anyway. No worries." Whether this is down to a lack of confidence on his part (and come on, how much self confidence do you really need to run past someone whilst dribbling a small spherical object?) or whether it's down to the instructions he is receiving from the dugout, it needs sorting. Emerton could be one of the best midfielders in the Prem if he lived up to his potential, but from today's showing he has simply picked up from where he left off last year.

Agree 100% as regards Matteo conceding far too many needless freekicks though.

[roversmum]

I believe the crowd was around 24,500 which I thought wasn't bad.

Very disappointed with Matteo. Not impressed with all the free kicks he gave away - including the one leading to the goal, and the pulling of Kanu's shirt getting him a yellow card. Not necessary, Matteo, thank you.

The referee was a disgrace. One or two of WBA's players - that Haas for example, got away with virtually murder. A foot here, an elbow there, at one point holding a player back by the neck, a numer of fouls by them actually won them free kicks. What was that all about referee? Still it did the trick for them and they were well pleased with a point.

After reflection and seeing highlights on Sky I feel we have the makings of a good team. Ferguson, Yorke, Gray, Short and the wonderful Tugay - well done guys. I also feel the absence of Flitty was a bonus and am convinced that if he had been playing we would have lost the game.

I'm not happy about players going off for internationals mid-week, we still have another three games in a fortnight and could do without that.

Looking at the other games on Sky, other teams' defences generally look fairly poor so we should be able to score, but we do need some crossing practice and please leave out the long balls.

[RevidgeBlue]

Let's not beat around the bush, Souness cost us the win today by playing a ridiculous formation first half. You can't afford to be that negative at home, let alone against a team like West Brom. The second half with a reasonable formation was quite good.

Individually

Friedel - not much to do (as with West Brom keeper)

Gray - extremely solid display as always since he joined

Short - a rock as always - still our best defender

Matteo - poor display- hopefully capable of better

Amoruso - unconvincing- couple of really serious errors

Emerton - very poor display

Ferguson - excellent performance - man of the match IMO

Gresko - never a central midfielder

De Pedro - come back at christmas when you're fit

Stead - poor by his standards

Yorke - Excellent in the second half when he dropped off the front two and played deeper but never going to provide much of a direct goal threat.

Subs

Tugay - should have started with Ferguson, made a big difference

Dickov - runs about a lot, but will have few opposition defenders or goalkeepers worried. Not Premiership quality.

Gallagher - not enough time to make an impact but surely either he or Douglas a better option until the Spaniard is fit.

Overall, assuming we start with a sensible formation (not 6 defenders) you would have to be encouraged by the much greater amount of control and possession we have in midfield with Ferguson as opposed to Flitcroft but be worried by the lack of punch up front.

[pg]

Perhaps after playing for so long with no natural left-footers, Souness decided to flaunt his embarrasment of left-sided riches to taunt opposing managers?!?

Seriously though, for a while I've thought that 3-5-2 is a better formation for the Rovers with the current squad, as :

1) We have no 'real' wingers

2) Tugay in his old age can't function in the middle of a 'conventional' 4-4-2 with wingers.

Emerton is better as a wing-back... as far as I know that is where he played for Feyenoord most of the time.

It will be interesting to see if Souness continues with a 3-5-2/3-4-3 option.

Personally, the less said about that first-half line-up the better

[bob fleming]

After my previous post, which I regret, I'd just like to address the balance and point out that at this moment in time we're sixth!. Back in Europe!

It's early doors but you never know!

[Paul]

Just been away for three weeks and feel I've picked up another perspective in the last 48 hours - at least one you can't experience living in Blackburn or if you have web access. Despite visiting the local paper shop every day to scan the sports pages I picked up no Rovers news in three weeks.

On Friday got the official text saying Yorke would lead the line - depressing news. Hit Liverpool airport at 1.43pm yesterday and got a text to say Neil was out and a weird looking team had been announced. Into Blackburn straight from the airport for 2.55pm and the first headline I see is "Souness - Survival is the Key." As we approached the ground I saw FIVE shirts walking AWAY from Ewood. In the ground by 3.03pm to see three left footers, a midfield full of defenders, Emerton at right back and Dwight Yorke on the pitch. Just where was the creativity going to come from?

I’m making these points as for the last three weeks I have almost been a “floating “ fan. Cut off from my usual sources the only info I had was the above. So I ask the question if a casual fan had arrived home from holiday to this scenario would he clean the beach out the car or nip down to Ewood?

Without wishing to be one of tashor’s “spoiled brats” I was disappointed yesterday. Survival is NOT the key. On the team, well it’s what we can afford but the KO selection was daft. I’m left with more questions than answers and the manager has still to address these.

How much longer do we have to tolerate this “Survival is the Key” rubbish

Why is Dwight Yorke at the club and Andy Cole at Fulham – plain bloody daft in my opinion

Three left footers in midfield – Soumess is having a laugh? WBA fans “Premier League? - you’re having a laugh”

What is Emerton doing on the pitch (first game and I’ve broken my promise not criticize him)

Why are we wearing blue shorts?

Souness saw the error of his selection after 30 minutes ( a big plus there) as Toogs warmed up. The changes at half time made the team LOOK better but I’m struggling to recall ANY chance we created other than the goal. Hoult didn’t have a save to make. Tugay, Yorke, Short, Gray, Fergusson played well. The defence and Friedel at fault for the goal. Emerton, out of position, but pushed up second half, fluffed a great chance and still cannot attack the full back or cross. Matteo committed a worrying number of clumsy fouls. De Pedro – don’t know. Dickov – any player who runs around a lot will look good. Stead was below par.

Yesterday we couldn’t beat a first division team with the all the attacking ambitions of a giant sloth. Hopefully Souness will learn from this and put out the following next time:

Friedel

Neil

Short

Amoruso

Gresko

Gray

Fergusson

Tugay

Yorke

Gallagher

Stead