[Archived] Verdict On Souness

[laughatthedingles]

I said this at the end of last season, he has lost it, and by saying "we have the best squad since I have been here" and yet we have no idea where anyone played and have at least two people out of position all game proves my point, he should go a.s.a.p.

[Rover_Shaun]

He's not going to go.....not this side of next June anyway......so bleating about it is just wasting time and energy

[blue phil]

There's hardly been any mention of Tugay not starting the game , but I'm willing to bet that when Megson saw the line up he was delighted that Rovers were being so stupidly unambitious and negative - all the more chance that his bunch of mediocrities could steal something from the game . And that's how it worked out .

What the hell is Souness doing sending out a team without our most creative and enthusiastic player and instead fielding the woeful Emerton and the unfit De Pedro ? I'm beginning to think that our manager really does believe that we are at the level of the West Broms of this world and that survival itself is all that we're capable of .

Personally I'm convinced that we can quite comfortably finish mid table at least , so how the man who created the team can act so negatively is bewildering . It seems no strategic lessons have been learnt in the summer . Hopefully Souey will take a crash course before next Saturday !

[ABBEY]

1 point more than man u we have...ok we didnt win and the 1st half was poor...FACT.WE SHOULD HAVE 2 DEFO PENS AND WHO KNOWS ?....maybe we would have won.

but christ almighty whats the point in sacking a manager after 1 game?????

JAN WHO WOULD YOU HAVE HAS MANAGER?your poor hubby must be one hen pecked S>O>B> because you never seem to let things rest.Bet he never has a stoppy back without asking permission.

I know where man blue is coming from no matter what we do soeyouts are like vampires hoping we fail ,,,just to say as a 3 year old would told you neeeee neeeeeeee ne ne.

[Eddie]

We weren't able to cope with West Brom? The extended highlights I saw were obviously biased, as I came out of it thinking we were the better team, not particularly creative, but still the dominant force. Is anyone realising that we DREW???? Alright we didn't win, but come on, how do you ladies survive in the world of football supporters?

[krislu]

We weren't able to cope with West Brom? The extended highlights I saw were obviously biased, as I came out of it thinking we were the better team, not particularly creative, but still the dominant force. Is anyone realising that we DREW???? Alright we didn't win, but come on, how do you ladies survive in the world of football supporters?

The highlights I saw on rovers world showed that WBA had one great chance at the end and should really have scored. I did not see any great chances like that for us except the goal, closest was Tugays shot which went about 5m wide of the post...

Surely they would have shown more of our "big" chances if we had any...

One more thing, we dominated possision in alot of games last season as well, without really having any clear cut chances...

[Hullrover]

Last season we beat Wolves 5-1. West Brom are better. In fact we only beat Wolves 5-1. Take the positives. As many have said, we would have lost this game last year; Dickov is better than Cole on Saturdays evidence; Yorke is better than Yorke; We were exciting to watch for a while in the second half; There are not really many teams who seem much better on the evidence of one game; We are in the top half; Again, West Brom are going to be much better than last time; We will win at Saints as they will be poor; Souness is as good as all bar half a dozen prem managers.

Why are so many of you whingers?

[92er]

I don't know if there is a correlation between whinging and attending matches. I'm not happy because there were only 2 positives I took from the match-Short and Yorke.Souness does not seem to have learned from last season. The match was not one that could enthuse supporters to go and tell their friends about and tell them to come to the next one.

It's also created quite a lot of negative reports nationally and locally-it's not just contributors to here that whinge.

[Kiwiwannabe]

Yes he did put out the wrong squad in the first half - and it wasn't because he was smart enough to change it as it was glaringly obvious what needed doing.

If you had been there you would understand the angst at which myself and others are showing with this regard - but it wasn't the first time was it - how long do we let this continue and just accept it.

Fair enough if it had been the first time - but it wasn't and its no wonder the players look 'clueless' as to where/ what they should be doing.

We can all accept mistakes - what we can't accept is the same mistakes time and time again and no improvement as to what is happening.

How many more excuses do we want to hear - dodgy wall (Man city last year anybody), lady luck and her sister (pick any game last year)/referees (pick any game last year) injuries (no other team has them don't you know)

And as for the changes - no it didn't work - we should have won the game -all he did was stop the debacle of the first half which was his own doing. If it hadn't been for the determination of Short and the nous of Stead to get the ball in the box we would have been on the end of a defeat - as up to that point we did not look like we where going to score.

I'll leave it on this point -Souness in his own words has said (again) survival is priority - well to me looking at Saturday if we don't start to win our home games , especially against the teams that we will more than likely fighting it out with - it won't be a priority as we will be relegated before we know what has happened.

Excellent post Capt Kayos.

Sadly though, I think Blue and White Army is right. Even if we have a season as bad as last season I cannot see Souness being shown the door, not until the summer anyway. The board seem quite happy to accept his excuses and public fall-outs, even when it is damaging the club. And it is the finacial damage that is the most worrying. However, I guess sacking the manager mid-contract could equally lose us as much money.

I dont think Rovers' fans are unrealistic. Most now can accept that we are not going to challenge for the title every season, but equally we shouldn't* accept a season of poor home performances then all the ref/luck/injuries excuses.

*EDIT: oops, should have been an 'n't' at the end of that should!

Edited August 17, 2004 by Kiwiwannabe

[Philly Rover ®]

...Dickov is better than Cole on Saturdays evidence...

Whilst not an active member of the Souness out brigade, I have to vehemently disagree with this statement. I'll now shamelessly quote myself (from the "Paul Dickov signs" thread):

If Dickov is being brought in as a replacement for Cole, then yes, a mistake is being made.  If, as it seems, Dickov is being brought in to take Yorke's place, then it is an excellent move.  End of story.

I'll stick by that now. Dickov is a wonderful striker to have--he's the type of player that you love if he's at your club and hate if he's anywhere else. His non-stop pursuit and balls-out approach to the game would be an asset to any squad. But that being said, he's not the quality striker that this team is crying out for right now.

It's been said time and time again... Stead needs a creative and productive veteran striker paired with him in order to take some of the onus and pressure off his (still very young and slender) shoulders. Clubs will not worry about Dickov more than Souness... and Yorke, for as well as he played on Saturday, sounds like he's only truly effective when dropping behind the front two, and not as an out and out striker.

As such, letting go of Cole was a mistake. Yes he was a bit past it, and yes he was gobbling up huge wages, but he provided that extra bit of creativity up front, and his previous goalscoring exploits carried enough weight that the opposition was forced to mark him tightly (or at least more tightly than they would mark Yorke, Dickov, Gally or Jansen). IMO Stead cannot prosper as of yet if he's the number one threat for the club, the man that opposition defenses mark most tightly... he's just not ready to carry that burden at this point in his career. He needs a Cole or Phillips or Fowler or even a Sheringham to feed off of--a recognizable first choice striker who opposing defenses must respect enough to mark ahead of what they could very well see as a lucky young kid.

Which brings me to my final point, one which no one seemed to have thought of yet. If, by all accounts, Kanu was the man of the match on Saturday, and Rovers knew they lacked a cutting edge up front when they let go of Cole... THEN WHY THE HELL WEREN'T ROVERS IN FOR KANU WHEN HE WAS AVAILABLE ON A FREE THREE WEEKS AGO?

[Yorkshire Blue]

Having watched the game on Saturday, I would say that Kanu only looked really effective when he dropped back a bit (c.f. Yorke in the second half). He showed some fancy skills, but he certainly didn't lead the line.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Yes he did put out the wrong squad in the first half - and it wasn't because he was smart enough to change it as it was glaringly obvious what needed doing.

If you had been there you would understand the angst at which myself and others are showing with this regard - but it wasn't the first time was it - how long do we let this continue and just accept it.

Fair enough if it had been the first time - but it wasn't and its no wonder the players look 'clueless' as to where/ what they should be doing.

We can all accept mistakes - what we can't accept is the same mistakes time and time again and no improvement as to what is happening.

How many more excuses do we want to hear - dodgy wall (Man city last year anybody), lady luck and her sister (pick any game last year)/referees (pick any game last year) injuries (no other team has them don't you know)

And as for the changes - no it didn't work - we should have won the game -all he did was stop the debacle of the first half which was his own doing. If it hadn't been for the determination of Short and the nous of Stead to get the ball in the box we would have been on the end of a defeat - as up to that point we did not look like we where going to score.

I'll leave it on this point -Souness in his own words has said (again) survival is priority - well to me looking at Saturday if we don't start to win our home games , especially against the teams that we will more than likely fighting it out with - it won't be a priority as we will be relegated before we know what has happened.

Excellent post Capt Kayos.

Sadly though, I think Blue and White Army is right. Even if we have a season as bad as last season I cannot see Souness being shown the door, not until the summer anyway. The board seem quite happy to accept his excuses and public fall-outs, even when it is damaging the club. And it is the finacial damage that is the most worrying. However, I guess sacking the manager mid-contract could equally lose us as much money.

I dont think Rovers' fans are unrealistic. Most now can accept that we are not going to challenge for the title every season, but equally we should accept a season of poor home performances then all the ref/luck/injuries excuses.

Thanks Kiwiwannabe but I don't feel good at having to do the post, what I can't believe though is that people are accepting it.

Yes it might only be the first game, but it was the same old scenario - I'm not saying I want them to sack Souness although I feel he is now hanging on a thin line and the next run of games is not exactly going to be easy. Where does he get these stupid ideas and formations from?

We all want to feel confident and hope Saturday was just a blot - but I couldn't see anything different to last season which after what we witnessed last season does not bode well for this.

I honestly believe we have the players to be challenging in the top 10 and the manager, but if we don't play them in their correct positions and get some form of continuity in the line ups and form a backbone to side then we are going to be in for another rough season.

Souness needs to learn from his mistakes and the number of chances he had last season before the aboration on Saturday, to me he has had enough time to do this and now needs to start showing this to the fans.

[SuperStella]

I would rather Souness rant at his players and fall out with a few of them... the ones he has fallen out with are a.) Yorke - who the rovers fans loved to hate last season. Souenss obviously saw the same lazy, bone idol performances we did and did something about it. It wasnt pleasant at the time but throughout pre-season and against WBA he ran his socks off. So it has done something to him? b.) Todd - refused to sit on the bench v Leeds and stormed off home. If your boss asked you to do something at work and you refused, got in your car and went home, like Todd did would you still have a job ?

Souness came out at the start of last season and said the aim is to survive, he was right. He has said the same this season. Apart from the big 5 in the premiership the rest of the teams are equal. So Souness is plainly stating that we are never gonna win the league so our aim is to get 40 points as soon as possible. Depending on how many games are left we can then look to improving on that and push up the table.

Yeah, ok we had a poor season last year.. but 2 of our key players were out - Thompson and Ferguson. That was out of Souness' control. Im sure we would never have gone in for Baggio if we had cold hard cash to spend.

[Ricky]

Souness is spot on to say that the target is survival. Steve Bruce and Kevin Keegan have both come out and said the same thing this season.

[SuperStella]

Course he is... we are relegation contenders judging last years performances, especially at home.

[92er]

2 pieces of skill from Kanu when he was up front-"did" Emerton and set up one of his forwards and in the 2nd half got past matteo who seemed reasonably lucky not to be sent off.

[RevidgeBlue]

Souness got the tactics badly wrong first half on Saturday IMO but it goes without saying it's far too early to be jumping up and down after one game. I would have sacked him last season but as the decision was taken that he 's still the manager he has to start the season with a clean slate.

If we don't get a result on Saturday then it's not impossible we will be propping the table up on September 11th with one point from five games. I shan't be too worried if this happens PROVIDED the performances are good.

There then follows two respite games v Portsmouth and Charlton before four potentially tough looking games in October v Villa, Boro, Chelsea and Liverpool.

So again there is the possibility that by October the 30th our League position still won't be the best.

November sees four easier looking games against Norwich, City Brum and Fulham. In the event we do struggle at the start then fail to improve over this period, I will be worried.

It will also be 15 games in which I think will give enough time to give a reasonable assessment of our chances.

[BuckyRover]

Souness got the tactics badly wrong first half on Saturday IMO but it goes without saying it's far too early to be jumping up and down after one game. I would have sacked him last season but as the decision was taken that he 's still the manager he has to start the season with a clean slate.

If we don't get a result on Saturday then it's not impossible we will be propping the table up on September 11th with one point from five games. I shan't be too worried if this happens PROVIDED the performances are good.

There then follows two respite games v Portsmouth and Charlton before four potentially tough looking games in October v Villa, Boro, Chelsea and Liverpool.

So again there is the possibility that by October the 30th our League position still won't be the best.

November sees four easier looking games against Norwich, City Brum and Fulham. In the event we do struggle at the start then fail to improve over this period, I will be worried.

It will also be 15 games in which I think will give enough time to give a reasonable assessment of our chances.

Whats this??

Somebody talking sense in a calm and rational manner?

And you are a Blackburn fan?

You have made my day

Edited August 17, 2004 by BuckyRover

[Jan]

While I applaud Revidge, I do just remind you all that the team who are bottom at Christmas have NEVER survived.

I think that we'll need to take a good, hard look at league position after Charlton and Portsmouth. Waiting till the end of November would be a disaster if the scenario pans out without us winning against Soton, Portsmouth and Charlton- or getting freak points elsewhere.

[Yorkshire Blue]

I do just remind you all that the team who are bottom at Christmas have NEVER survived.

I'll start worrying about that when it looks like we might be bottom at Christmas. Not a situation I envisage.

[CAPT KAYOS]

Souness got the tactics badly wrong first half on Saturday IMO but it goes without saying it's far too early to be jumping up and down after one game. I would have sacked him last season but as the decision was taken that he 's still the manager he has to start the season with a clean slate.

If we don't get a result on Saturday then it's not impossible we will be propping the table up on September 11th with one point from five games. I shan't be too worried if this happens PROVIDED the performances are good.

There then follows two respite games v Portsmouth and Charlton before four potentially tough looking games in October v Villa, Boro, Chelsea and Liverpool.

So again there is the possibility that by October the 30th our League position still won't be the best.

November sees four easier looking games against Norwich, City Brum and Fulham. In the event we do struggle at the start then fail to improve over this period, I will be worried.

It will also be 15 games in which I think will give enough time to give a reasonable assessment of our chances.

Not just in your opinion RB - tell us something that most of the world dosen't already know except Souness (first half anyway)

Do I sense a little let up in your stances with Souness - have you found your ladders and climbed back on the fence?

Just going with what you have said re the games coming up based on last Season and the theory of the results against the respective teams:-

WBA -(h) draw

Southampton - (a) lost

Arsenal-(a) lost

MU -(h) won

Newcastle- (a) won

P'Mouth -(h) lost

Charlton -(a) lost

A Villa (h) lost

Mboro (h) - draw

Chelsea (a)- draw

L'pool - (h) - lost

Norwich - (a) -N/a

Citeh (a) - draw

B'ham (h) - draw

Fulham (a) - won

Total 14 pts (h7) 6 (a8) 8

So hypothetically speaking as I know (hope) it won't be like last season - barring the Norwich game on a pro rata basis we could be heading for around the 42-45 pts marker

Doesn't look good does it.

I don't take stock of those who said we would have lost this game last season as we didn't - same sort of scenario and we hammered Wolves yet still struggled.

Possibly over critical and its only the first game - but maybe people can understand where I am coming from now. Improve on our home games and we could easily be in for a better season.

[Manchester Blue]

Souness got the tactics badly wrong first half on Saturday IMO but it goes without saying it's far too early to be jumping up and down after one game. I would have sacked him last season but as the decision was taken that he 's still the manager he has to start the season with a clean slate.

If we don't get a result on Saturday then it's not impossible we will be propping the table up on September 11th with one point from five games. I shan't be too worried if this happens PROVIDED the performances are good.

There then follows two respite games v Portsmouth and Charlton before four potentially tough looking games in October v Villa, Boro, Chelsea and Liverpool.

So again there is the possibility that by October the 30th our League position still won't be the best.

November sees four easier looking games against Norwich, City Brum and Fulham. In the event we do struggle at the start then fail to improve over this period, I will be worried.

It will also be 15 games in which I think will give enough time to give a reasonable assessment of our chances.

I don't often get to say it but I agree almost entirely with your post Rev. I know I give you enough stick so it's only fair to give credit where it's due. It's almost a positive post from you but i'd prefer to say realistic.

[tonygreenbank]

But come 3pm on Saturday we could be TOP of the League if we beat saints! If people are going to suggest that we will be bottom then I can say that we`ll be TOP. Only one game in and so much negativity.

[Brownie]

I reckon I've worked out Souness' tactics and plans for this season, at least for the short term.

He wants to play 4-3-1-2 for the 1st half, with the flexibility to cange to 3-4-1-2 should we need to.

He will start saturday with the following team ;

Friedel

Emerton/Neill Short Amoruso Gray

Tugay Ferguson Matteo

Yorke/DePedro

Yorke/Dickov Stead.

Should we need to change things he can remove drop Matteo into the back 3 and push the full backs up as wingers.

With this formation he has DePedro,Thompson and Yorke who can all play behind the front two and is possibly why he was so adamant that he wasn't interested in selling Yorke.

This formation obviously relies a lot on the 'man in the hole' having a good game which was obviously it's downfall on saturday.

I don't actually think it's that bad a formation and is one that can adapt to any situation.

[G Somerset Rover]

Also very baffled by Soueys formation and line-up. He had all summer to form his plans for the start of the season, plus we only had Neil, Reid and Thomspon out, yet we play a stupid formation and play people out of position. Yes they are all right sided players, but surely Douglas or somebody could have played slightly out of postition on the right, like Dunn used to on the right hand side for Rovers when in need. I'll reserve total judgement for a few more games yet, however Souey should just stick with a 4-4-2 and play people in their correct positions starting with the Saints on Sat.