[Archived] Verdict On Souness

[RoverDrake]

I'm just still peeved we never got Van Buyten and got that chump Matteo.

[tcj_jones]

But why? What has Matteo done for you to think hes so pants? I was very pleased when I heard we had signed him. Whats even better is that we didn't pay a thimgs for him! As captain of a team with players like Smith, Viduka, Robinson etc and with the decent run of performances he gave last season, why do you value him so little???

[Exiled in Toronto]

The only real mystery is who came up with the status-saving tactics unveiled at Fulham.

That's the kind of rollocks often spouted by the so called souness-out brigade which stops me from giving them credence. Only Rover6 actually comes up with any tactical nous, the rest just winge and gripe and basically display no knowledege at all.

I was upset with the tactics in the 1st half but happy in the 2nd. I don't simply accuse the manager of being f***wit and then getting lucky because I know better. Sadly some of our wannabe Champ Manger fans on here seem to only want to see the bad in our manager whic is why I have little time for them.

Not sure if it's been mentioned but did anyone see the formation for Chelsea today. 4-4-2 with 4 tackling midfielders and the fullbacks to give the width. For what it's worth I thought they lacked width and struggled but it's interesting to see someone else play this formation. Fair enough though i'd understand against Manure but maybe not the tactical f***wit some of our more awesome tactical genuises on here would have us believe.

So you think a formation which totally confuses our own players, leads us to being 1-0 down against a weaker team, and that gets totally revamped at half time is good do you? Well, you seem to be a self-appointed tactical expert, so I'd better bow to your superior knowledge.

I don't claim to know more about tactics that Souness, my granny or you; just that the number of times he has to totally revamp mid-match is ridiculous; and hardly a sign of being on top of his job.

Most other managers play the same formation week in week out, and bring on substitutions to remove non-performing players within the same formation. When we won the league, we played the same formation, regardless of who was fit, every single game. The average thicko player needs that kind of repetition drummed into them.

I'm sure Souness in his pomp could have easily coped with the kind of tactical changes he rings; but the evidence of last season, now initially continued into this, is that most average players can't.

[Exiled in Toronto]

He had already spent the money on Grabbi, Yorke and Cole. The board had to take the money for Duffer to balance the books after the crap deals Souness took us into.

The board then unfortuntely gave him more money to squander in the transfer market, Stead the exception.

To be fair, I wouldn't pick on Souness for his transfer record. Most clubs have a Grabbi-like horror story to tell (Rebrov? Veron? Heskey? etc.) But not every club can match the Tugay, Freidal, Berg, Stead bargain basement list.

Plenty of other issues, but I think his transfer legacy isn't one of them.

[Philly Rover ®]

Emerton is no way a right wing back

Really?

[Jimbo]

Nice to see so many destructive posts from people who weren't even at the game - You are all correct Souness got it wrong in the first half - I'm sure even he will put his hands up to that - but once he could make changes, he did so & we dominated the second half with West brom left only with scraps. But even saying that he got it wrong in the first half betrays the fact that none of the players had a particularly poor game and the way I saw it his only real mistake was playing Brad, where a fully fit Enkleman would have probably stopped Clements deflected free kick

[Manchester Blue]

So you think a formation which totally confuses our own players, leads us to being 1-0 down against a weaker team, and that gets totally revamped at half time is good do you? Well, you seem to be a self-appointed tactical expert, so I'd better bow to your superior knowledge.

I don't claim to know more about tactics that Souness, my granny or you; just that the number of times he has to totally revamp mid-match is ridiculous; and hardly a sign of being on top of his job.

Most other managers play the same formation week in week out, and bring on substitutions to remove non-performing players within the same formation. When we won the league, we played the same formation, regardless of who was fit, every single game. The average thicko player needs that kind of repetition drummed into them.

I'm sure Souness in his pomp could have easily coped with the kind of tactical changes he rings; but the evidence of last season, now initially continued into this, is that most average players can't.

I've already stated that I felt the formation or more importantly the players used were wrong on Saturday. Souness shouldn't be immune to criticism but it should also be possible to praise him. Something certain posters seem incapable of which to me detracts from their points.

I don't agree that other managers stick to a formation throughout a game. Just watch Chelsea v Man U yesterday. As the game progressed United chased the game putting on more attackers and Chelsea put on more defenders. Arsenal are another team that change formation dependant on the score.

As for the confusion of the players on Saturday, if Souness turned up at 2pm and said right lads we're trying something new today then fair enough. However if, as certain stories have indicated, they have worked on it for a few weeks then is it the manager's fault that the players are confused.

[stegraham]

I couldn't make the game on Saturday, but a friend said that if we had played to our strengths we could have won the game. This is not a negitive post, and it may be a bit naive, but I'm just interested to hear what other people on the board think are the current teams strengths?

[LDRover]

I'm not so sure that we should be praising Souness for his half time tactical genius when it's plain to see it was borne out of sheer desperation. To me it was more of a s**t or bust scenario as opposed to a tactical masterplan.

And if we were so good in the second half how is it that I can't remember Hoult having to make a save apart from the goal? Compare that to Brad who still had to make a couple of interventions and the defence who had to make at least one last ditch block to prevent a certain winner.

Granted , it is only the first game of the season but I'm sure posters on here would be a lot more tolerant if this performance was a one off. As it is, it's like we never had a summer break and we're picking up where we left off last season.

As far as I'm concerned, we have every right to be worried.

[Scotty]

I'm not so sure that we should be praising Souness for his half time tactical genius when it's plain to see it was borne out of sheer desperation. To me it was more of a s**t or bust scenario as opposed to a tactical masterplan.

And if we were so good in the second half how is it that I can't remember Hoult having to make a save apart from the goal? Compare that to Brad who still had to make a couple of interventions and the defence who had to make at least one last ditch block to prevent a certain winner.

Granted , it is only the first game of the season but I'm sure posters on here would be a lot more tolerant if this performance was a one off. As it is, it's like we never had a summer break and we're picking up where we left off last season.

As far as I'm concerned, we have every right to be worried.

Spot on. People seem to equate having lots of possession as playing well. To me, playing well is determined by how many chances we create and, ultimately, how many of them we take. Possession's nice but it doesn't win you games - goals do.

On Saturday we didn't create a single chance in the first half and only created two or three in the second. It was exactly the same as most of our homes games last season - lots of huff and puff but no end product. The fact that some people seem to be happy with that just amazes me.

[bob]

With all of our players healthy, we would have seen a different starting lineup and formation to begin the game - with any one of Neill, Thompson, or Reid healthy we would have been able to put forward a right back and a right midfielder. Unfortunately, we could only manage one right-sided player, Emerton, who took on the right back role.

Reid!!!! Will people stop thinking he is the answer to all our problems he is a nightmare.

[ptholt]

Whilst i am slightly concerned about GS i would be even more worried about who he gets replaced with, the managers in between GS and KD whilst the media loved them, the players loved them they were far worse than anything GS has done, need we be reminded of ashley ward, nathan blake, kevin davies etc....

One thing that I do like about GS is that he's a fighter, and although he has tactical defencies and has had the odd mare in the transfer market just who would we replace him with?

It needs to be someone who cam get the best out of our current crop of players as we have no cash, to my mind that means either martin o neil or alan curbishley, neither of which are going to happen! Charlton are doing considerably better than us and currently have more money to spend, and celtic, well lets not even go there. If o'neil isnt going to leave them for liverpool he would never come to rovers.

The sad reality is that our target is and will be for the considerable future as said by the manager and the board is anything fourth from bottom up, pure survival. So that means with little cash we must do a bolton and sign journeymen players in between the fergusons/emertons to try and keep us in the league.

As for GS at liverpool if you read the books or you know anyone associated with the club (my cousin was yts there same time as fowler was) GS arrived and within 5 minutes had to say goodbye to 4-5 first teamers who all wanted to leave and he had no cash to replace them due to ground changes, so he was reliant upon the kids he had and raiding old clubs for loyal players (mark walters etc), liverpool's demise was well before GS arrived.

[vinny]

Alot of people seem to be getting on G.S back over his signings and tactics. Other's are actually saying they think he should get the sack. I think this is completely unfair. He is doing the best he can with what he has. The club haven't much money to be splashing around and he is trying to use what he has sensibly. I cant see any manager coming in and doing any better.

Who do you think could do a better job ?????

[Jan]

If you mean the ones we might get -Nigel Worthington, Ian Dowie, Mike Newell, Gary Megson WOULD do a better job and the vast majority of lower league managers MIGHT.

If you mean the ones we couldn't get, well everyone in the Premiership bar Kevin Keegan would do a better job.

Edited August 16, 2004 by Jan

[chris]

Alot of people seem to be getting on G.S back over his signings and tactics. Other's are actually saying they think he should get the sack. I think this is completely unfair. He is doing the best he can with what he has. The club haven't much money to be splashing around and he is trying to use what he has sensibly. I cant see any manager coming in and doing any better.

Who do you think could do a better job ?????

would be a bit late now to select managers because the summer has past and we have only played 1 game anyway

[Drakefyre]

With all of our players healthy, we would have seen a different starting lineup and formation to begin the game - with any one of Neill, Thompson, or Reid healthy we would have been able to put forward a right back and a right midfielder. Unfortunately, we could only manage one right-sided player, Emerton, who took on the right back role.

Reid!!!! Will people stop thinking he is the answer to all our problems he is a nightmare.

... because my post really implies that.

I'm saying that with a second right-sided player, the squad would not have its off-kilter and unbalanced look that it had on Saturday.

[RoyRover]

I was disappointed with the lack of good players being brought in during the summer and was baffled by the formation on Saturday, but I still think Souness is the man for the job, and I'll be happy if he can bring in the Nigerian player Odemwingie, who is very good.

[dave birch]

"verdict", that tends to say that his term is up. You can only give a "verdict" when all the evidence is in. The Souness era is not yet finished.

I would agree that he is going (or has been) through a difficult period, but to give a verdict on his occupancy at the Rovers is a little premature.

I reiterate, would the whingers tell me who they would replace him with, and, to state their preferences qualifications for the job.

I was the one that posted a thread about stating yourslag off of the season. We're one game in, and the usual suspects are at it again.

Effing amazing

Edited August 16, 2004 by dave birch

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Two excellent posts LD and Scotty,absolutely spot on.Souness says he's happy with a point at home against newly promoted(tipped for relegation) West brom.

I cant find anything positive to say about that way of thinking.

JHC.

Edited August 16, 2004 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[dave birch]

un-bloody-believable-post

[vindaloobob]

He had already spent the money on Grabbi, Yorke and Cole. The board had to take the money for Duffer to balance the books after the crap deals Souness took us into.

The board then unfortuntely gave him more money to squander in the transfer market, Stead the exception.

it's my understanding that duff had a clause in his contract that meant that he was free to talk to anyone who bid over a certain amount, chelsea bid that amount, it was duff's choice to stay or go.

one game in is a bit early to have your knives sharpened yet. the result was a little dissapointing, but that's the way it goes. teams like west brom are going to be like so many of the teams we played in div1 - they are going to come to us and play 10 men behind the ball. and at times in div1 we had a lot of problems unlocking teams like that.

it's a shame that we have a fairly tough run of fixtures now, i hope we can get a result agains southampton because with arsenal and man u after that it could be a while before we get a win, and that could put another huge dent in the team's confidence.

[vindaloobob]

Souness says he's happy with a point at home against newly promoted(tipped for relegation) West brom.

did he actually say that or are you just taking a small part of a bigger quote out of context?

[dave birch]

vindaloo, if that happens, what's it going to be like on this board?

By rights, there should be mass suicide!

[broadsword]

I think the problem is not Souness so much as a lack of money.

He's only spent 150K so far, is that all he's been given? I wonder whether he started noises about Finnan signing for 2 mill with agents just to get back at the board, otherwise, where has the story come from? Also we've bid well under the 500K required to prise El Hamsandwich away, whereas 2 years ago we bout Grabbi for 7 million. This is frugality of the highest order, is it because the board no longer trust Souness, or is it a genuine attempt to get value-for-money? If it's the latter then it's a dodgy game to play as everyone has now been alerted to our interest in him, and can now move in for a slightly higher bid.

The only real cock-up Souness has made is Grabbi. Every time you go into the market you take a chance, so it's understandable.

However, the new cold wind of financial reality seems to be blowing ultra-strong around Ewood, no doubt linked to poor season-ticket sales. We seem to be sailing very close to the wind though. Attack - lot resting on Stead's shoulders, with some support from Dickov and Yorke. Midfield - jury's out on the captain at the minute, uncertain who should partner him; on teh flanks we have someone apparently terminally short of confidence and in the other side one of teh telly-tubbies, hopefully in a month or two thsi will improve with Thommo back on de Pedalo off the pies. Defence - hmm, Gray is the pick, but the switch to 3 at the back shows a lack of faith from the manager. GK - carrying an injury.

Personally, I don't think the squad is strong enough. If we start picking up injuries we will be in serious bother, but at least we ain't Everton!

[stegraham]

It would have been interesting to see if Souness had been replaced over the summer, if his sucessor had been given more money to spend in the transfer market.