Stewarding and the club/fan relationship

[SuperStella]

Basically the rovers dont want to eject any of their own fans as we need as many as we can get. However, the licensing authority regulations set the rules and if it is seen rovers are not following the guidelines then further action will be taken.

[stuwilky]

Basically the rovers dont want to eject any of their own fans as we need as many as we can get. However, the licensing authority regulations set the rules and if it is seen rovers are not following the guidelines then further action will be taken.

SS,

I posted this on the official message board.

Whilst not all relevant some points are....

Standing up is against the rules set by the Football Licensing Authority. We can debate the pros and cons of this until the coews come home, its likely to stay as it is for the foreseeable future.

The difficulty that Blackburn Rovers currently have is in the way Mr Newsham and Mr Caley (amongst others) choose to try and implement the rules. They appear to be under the (misguided) illusion that alienating the fans will staop them standing up.

Last season I would guess that there was less than 50 persistent standers at the back of the Blackburn End, this season there is a hell of a lot more. Why is this?

- Indiscrimate letters to EVERYONE in this area, regardless of whether they sit or stand. The correct way to get up everyone's noses.

- Heavy handed stewarding, the likes of the young lad on the NO1 stairwell are too young, inexperienced, and quite frankly naive to understand what is happening, "harry potter" is doing what he is told to do by his superiors, I suspect the poor lad has had the minimum in terms of training (which is nothing - seriosuly) and has been put in what must be the most difficult area of the ground to steward.

- The trouble with the incident on saturday involving the boro fans was that the club (specifically Stuart Caley) failed to prevent the fans in question gesturing, and instead of solving the problem by removing (or calming them down!) the offending fans. What did they do? Kick out some Rovers season tickets holders?

A bizarre approach some might think. I certainly do!

It is a shame that when Mr Williams and the rest of the board are working relatively hard to stabilise season ticket sales when some jumped up jobsworth is managing to alienate the very fans they should be encouraging.

I have been to many football grounds and have never experienced a situation where the home fans are treated in a worse way than the away fans. FRankly who cares if we upset some scousers..... £28 a year - buig deal!

If we upset our own fans that is a hell of a lot more if (WHEN) the dont come back.

Lee - I hope that the relevant people at the club are directed to this (and other) message boards and that the strength of feeling is taken on board. I have tried emailing Mr Newsham and Mr Caley twice in the last fortnigth and neither has had the courtesy to even acknowledge my email, never mind offer a full reply. Whatever happened to the customer charter?

[Hughesy]

As Superstella mentioned the article is in tonights telegraph.

Page 38 and 39.

It states that no fans on saturday were ejected from the blackburn end for standing

[CAPT KAYOS]

I was at a meeting with John Newsham last night regarding Saturday's events and the problem regarding persistent standing. Whilst I am not prepared to post every point of that meeting on this board, I would like to make fans aware of the following;

1.) Plenty of work is done behind the scenes to stop away fans standing up as well. Posters are put up - welcoming fans to Ewood and asking them politely to remain seated in the interests of safety. This was succesful against West Brom and even their fans thought it was a good idea. Letters are also sent with tickets distributed to away fans warning them they risk being ejected if they stand persistently. Aston Villa received these letters, however, and never included them when distributing tickets to their fans.

2.) Licensing Authority grants safety certificates on the measure that people sit down. Rules stipulate that if the stand is at more than 25% camber/gradient from the back to the front it is deemed dangerous to stay stood up. The camber/gradient in the stands at Ewood is 28% raising to 32%, dipping in the middle. Licensing authority will grant a safety certificate on condition fans do not persistently stand during the match

3.) If the problem persists drastic action will be taken such as problem areas having ticket allocations slashed/reduced. This has already happened at Notts Forest where they have reduced tickets given to away fans from 3,500 to 2,000.

4.) A piece about exactly what happened on Saturday etc will appear in tonight's Telegraph as Rovers have released a statement about it

5.) ) It was pointed out that several premiership clubs e.g. Arsenal, Southampton have stands behind the goal where nodody sits down.  They said that sooner, rather than later, these clubs will have their ticket allocation in these stands reduced. It remains to be seen.

Now that's more like it SS some info at last - how come you got to go to the meeting?

Glenn I think we all appreciate what you can and can't say and I know you do alot to get the feelings of the fans across maybe a watered down version of meetings may be allowed to be 'published' on here?

Coming back to the meeting SS - was the general feeling of its in Black 'n White so that's that or have the club got measures to contest it ( within reason of course) especially on the viewpoint of the detrimental effect this is having on our club as we are not alone in this matter ? Is the club aware of the Standing Up Campaign? As StuWilky has posted he has had no feedback from the club yet has has followed an exceptable procedure (he beat me to it and we have spoken on e-mail).

This is my gripe with football at the moment for all clubs and why I see the 'Standing Up Campaign' as a major medium for these laws to be reviewed.

Personally, if I receive a letter for standing up it will promptly be sent back with an accompanying letter and my Season ticket - hope the club realise this as my feelings are not alone - in fact does any club really understand the general feelings on this matter amongst the fans up and down the country?

Edited October 19, 2004 by CAPT KAYOS

[Hughesy]

Reading the article, i think they are saying they would rather make the minority sit down (Home fans), as the majority who are standing, (the away fans) generate more money.

[trueblue]

Superstella.. can I ask.. In what capacity were you at a meeting with John Newsham ?

[Paul]

Rovers explain stand up row

[Glenn]

Article now online at http://www.thisislancashire.co.uk/lancashi...rt/ROVERS0.html

(warning, link won't work after today).

[den]

A fuller statement on the Official site?

[Ste B]

However I also feel, that whilst some parts of it may not be conducted the way I'd prefer, that on the whole it is a worthwhile exercise for both the fans and the club.

I do wonder why they have avoided rearranging the one from August though.

Last I heard the FF Chairman wasnt getting his calls returned.

[Ossydave]

Seems to me like theres a lot of belly-aching on this thread.

Firstly anyone who lets a few Boro fans get to them that much shouldn't attend football matches. I bet they're still laughing now at how easy it was to wind a few Rovers up. Banter is part of football - deal with it. So what if they were in a hospitality box in the B'burn end? We need every penny we get at the moment. The sad fact that the B'burn public couldn't give a toss about attending and supporting their local team means that unfortunately we are now heavily reliant on away fans to bolster the gates!

Standing up is quite simply not allowed, they're the rules, stick to them. Seems to me that a large proportion of the people persistently standing are teenage lads who think they look hard standing up and love the rebel element of it all, proper mugs the lot of them. I've witnessed the moronic £2 an hour etc chants and to be honest if they didn't support the same team as me I'd be tempted to kick the clowns out myself. So what if the away fans are standing up, does that make it ok? Can I go round murdering Mancs on the basis that Shipman did it? The only way you're gonna stop them is by forcing the referee to stop the game till everyone sits down............. or by amputating their legs on entrance into the stadium.

[Tris]

The statement from Tom Finn in the LET and on the official site is particularly clear in linking the "unpleasant atmosphere" and subsequent arrests in the Blackburn End to the actions of one or more Middlesbrough fans in the executive area.

The unnamed fan goes into more detail of the provocation.

In many cases, people invited to exec boxes are invited via a work contact (supplier, associate, whatever) and so are in effect representing their employer.

I think two things should happen in this case. The owner of the box, therefore the host, should be reminded in no uncertain terms that they are responsible for the actions of their guests, and that in this case one guest (or more) has caused a potentially dangerous situation to occur through provocation of the home fans.

Secondly the host should be encouraged to shop the guilty party to his/her employer, pointing out that whilst representing the company as an invited guest his/her/their actions from behind the glass window led to public order offences out on the terrace.

I have no doubt that if I were to behave like that whilst representing my company, with or without the ensuing chaos, I would face severe disciplinary action, and probably dismissal (especially if the incident could be linked to alcohol).

For me, the bit in the clubs statement re the occupants of the box (saying "from thereon their behaviour was closely monitored and was acceptable") is not enough.

The damage had already been done, and to me it appears that those who were ultimately responsible for the situation degenerating are being allowed to get away with their irresponsible actions.

Edited October 19, 2004 by Tris

[mattyboy6000]

"public order offences"

that means anything, and from this thread alone it seems that this is the tip of the iceberg

[Blueboy Downunder]

firstly, i would like to say that before tuges sending off, neither side was doing much to enlighten what was otherwise a rather dull first half. middlesboro showed just how to play against a team with only 9 outfield players on the pitch, keep the ball moving instead on posession type football. please folks, don't slag off rovers for the way we played after the sending off, cause all credit to boro they exploited us perfectly . after the sending off i don't have a problem at all with the way things turned out. to be perfectly honest even before the sending off i was not that angry cause neither side was doing much to entertain us.

the stewarding at ewood and i have always thought this is nothing short of totally abismal and a ###### disgrace. these people are not into football, don't even like football and probably not rovers fans either. we as fans who pay their @#/? ###### wages, get treated like @#/? and i only wish sometimes that we could play 38 games away from home every season cause we are greated witha smile and a laugh and joke with stewards from most other clubs....spurs away last season, anyone!!!!

i agree with kiwiwannabe...the club needs to get it sorted, and quick style too.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

Everyone standing up chanting for the Rovers, will have a double effect.

A. The team might play better.

B. Fans are standing up for a specific reason, apart from causing civil disobedience.

Couldn't agree more,you know what you have to do at the Liverpool match Rovers fans....over to us.

[cletus]

I`ve seen alot of other clubs fans having various types of protests,

I`ve seen a mass sit down by West Ham Fans at Ewood (during terrace days)

West ham fans (again) have 'bonds' protests,

Fans 'red carding' their chairmen,

fans turning their backs on their teams (en mass)

....Is it time Blackburn Rovers fans started to show their feelings by having an organised protest....to show the club how they feel they are being badly treated & unappreciated??

[Ossydave]

I`ve seen alot of other clubs fans having various types of protests,

I`ve seen a mass sit down by West Ham Fans at Ewood (during terrace days)

West ham fans (again) have 'bonds' protests,

Fans 'red carding' their chairmen,

fans turning their backs on their teams (en mass)

....Is it time Blackburn Rovers fans started to show their feelings by having an organised protest....to show the club how they feel they are being badly treated & unappreciated??

No-ones going to organise it. People would much rather just come on an internet message board and bleat about it.

[mrsjansen]

During the Liverpool game we could all stand for 90 minutes? What will happen them, we all get banned.

Or when we score we could just all sit and clap, although on recent results I can't see that happening.

[Linny8]

Or when we score we could just all sit and clap, although on recent results I can't see that happening.

Welcome to the riverside!

[mattyboy6000]

i suppose that's another reason they're so keen to make people sit down.. so they can't stage a sit-down protest.. (oxford utd wasn't it?)

you could invade the pitch (and get a criminal record)

or stop going..

..whoops.. looks like that protest is in full swing already..

[roversWASmylife]

It doesn't matter whether they tell visiting supporters to sit down with leaflets,signs etc. Normally the majority of away supporters do stand when they visit Ewood Park, on occasions away supporters who visit Ewood do sit.

Against Liverpool, will they take any notice of the signs that they are given ?

The club need to sort it out, either they let both sets of fans stand or they don't.

I'd love to John Newsham and co sort the Darwen End against Liverpool.

[den]

It doesn't matter whether they tell visiting supporters to sit down with leaflets,signs etc. Normally the majority of away supporters do stand when they visit Ewood Park, on occasions away supporters who visit Ewood do sit.

Against Liverpool, will they take any notice of the signs that they are given ?

The club need to sort it out, either they let both sets of fans stand or they don't.

I'd love to John Newsham and co sort the Darwen End against Liverpool.

but the club say they haven't thrown anyone out for standing up.

[roversWASmylife]

It doesn't matter whether they tell visiting supporters to sit down with leaflets,signs etc. Normally the majority of away supporters do stand when they visit Ewood Park, on occasions away supporters who visit Ewood do sit.

Against Liverpool, will they take any notice of the signs that they are given ? 

The club need to sort it out, either they let both sets of fans stand or they don't.

I'd love to John Newsham and co sort the Darwen End against Liverpool.

but the club say they haven't thrown anyone out for standing up.

Yes, I am aware of that.

However, but don't you expect there to be standers from both ends against Liverpool?

We get told to sit down, yet 8,000 Scousers stand up.

My point originally wasn't about the club saying that nobody got chucked out for standing.

Just my general opinion on how Rovers treat the fans is dreadful, they can't keep going the way that they are.

[14/5/95]

<<Fans that Stand... the bane of my elderly mother's life as a BBE season ticket holder. She no longer goes to games because she missed half the game due to being forced to look at someones back end rather than her beloved Rovers. Move to a more sedate area of the ground you say... Why should she?>>

14/5/95 - it wasn't your Mum who used to start the chants on the Blackburn End with 'Give us a B...etc', 'You are my sunshine...' and 'I was born....etc'?

Also, why is sitting in the Blackburn End more important to her than watching her team?

Even in the Blackburn End there are some seats where no one could obscure your view (over the vomitories or even with the percussion section on the front row somewhere). Incidentally, why are they not obliged to remain seated by the stewards?!?

Do all you can to get her back on (she could even act as a spotter for the stewards)!

What with her eyesight? Mind you....

She's much older than the 'give us a B' fan... 'Roll along Blackburn Rovers Roll along' is more up her street.

She was a BBender all her life and, at 74 wouldn't sit in the Nuttall St as 'thats always full of old people, whining'.

[cletus]

LET

The Telegraph`s view.....