I think there's a dividing line between being"hard" which to me means uncomplaining, giving it out sure, but within the rules of the game. But not complaining about taking it either. ... and being a thug
For me, Kevin Moran was as tough as they come, and a fantastic presence at the back. I'd rather have him than todd, certainly. You couldn't make Kevin back down. If he's not hard enough for people then really I'm at a bit of a loss.