Is it massively in our favour?If I live in your world maybe yes, where the likes of Ayala and Holtby took massive wage drops with no signing on fees to join us Brereton and Gallagher were 12 alone.Armstrong would have hit a few clauses so we will say conservatively 2 million.Kaminski we paid a fee for ,Pickering,loan fees.Signing on fees for others.Plus as our wages show we are spending a lot more than we are bringing in which the owners are covering. The club must also be psychic that Armstrong was going to be worth that sort of money, he went up a level for 18 months and again through gross mismanagement we ended up getting a poor deal because of the length in his contract, but a good deal in the circumstances

Chaddy did a breakdown not too long ago of the profits they have made from player sales I can't remember the exact figures but they were well in Boro's favour.And yeah it will help signing players from abroad if you can pay what they are paying

My point with Rhodes Is Venkys are not in this to make a few million pound off player sales.There is no evidence to suggest they are. Mate the "frees" you go on about were not free they were expensive deals as you even said yourself last season regarding Ayala.And you know that Holtby ,Rodwell ,Johnson and Downing would have done well When you ain't selling any player then transfer fees of 7 million and 5 Million with our level of income is going beyond what we should be spending.The owners are putting that money in and there is no evidence to suggest that they are in this to make a bit of profit.Even last January we could have sold Armstrong if we wanted to. The stuff about the ground I agree but that isn't the part I'm arguing, I'm arguing the owners spend money on the squad but they appoint the wrong people to spend it. Like IV said I think they have no interest in us but if the manager asks he gets and they don't sell players unless they are practically forced too. I just don't get why they pay Waggott 300 grand a year and he doesn't even have the authority to clear up around the ground.These guys have loads of businesses and they want to be bothered with such trivial matters? If it takes months for a simple thing like that to be sorted out then inside the ground must have no chance of being sorted.

My argument is he wasn't bought purely to make a profit on him.I still think 40% was too much.20% standard, he wanted to leave and Newcastle weren't trying to stop him.A player is worth what someone is willing to pay and although I know Preston were in for him there wasn't that much interest in him at the time.His last loan spell in the championship with Bolton hadn't gone well and he wasn't spectacular for us in league one either

We were so desperate to get a profit out of Armstrong we gave up 40% of the deal to get it done?That doesn't make sense. And Brererton cost 7 million and Gallagher 5 is it beyond the realms of possibility that we have stupidly agreed to such a clause in their contracts aswell?With the best will in the world they would have to have seriously hit the ground running to have made a quick profit on those 2.But I don't think selling players is a bad thing anyway if some of the profit is reinvested. You can argue with me till you are blue in the face but Jordan Rhodes wanted out of here a long time before he agreed to sell him and we had offers of similar to what we eventually got for him.Im not one to make out I'm itk but this is one thing I know to be true and it's from the Rhodes end.They do not sell players easy, but for me that is a black mark because sometimes you just have to see the bigger picture and you have to sell an asset to strengthen other areas.We never sell players and when we do we don't get what we should. He brought 12 players to the club last season ,half of them loans but still add them all together and it will still have cost the club a pretty penny especially when you are committing to a 4 year deal for Ainsley Pears.Dont you find that odd, that everyone else gets a 2+1 year deal but a son of an ex teammate of a manager gets this deal. They have no interest in us but if the manager asks for something he gets it.But after bringing 12 players to the club last season and to have as poor a season as we did then I don't blame them from pulling back a bit.I blame them for not sacking him. I still think they will allow him to bring a striker in permanent

A left back yes but a right back won't be in the manager's thoughts.Rankin Costello will alternate with Nyambe, I wouldn't do that but Mowbray will.And if Carter isn't sent on loan then he will come in if those two ain't available or Costello is moved further up the field

Not absolving the owners of anything. I'm pointing out the fact that they have spent money on the squad in Mowbrays reign,there is no denying or disputing that. Every summer Mowbray has been here he has brought at least 6 players in through a mixture of transfer fees,free transfers and loans. Money brought in Raya, Nuttall and two week ago Armstrong. People can come up with theories if they so wish that the likes of Brererton and Gallagher were signed as a way of making a quick profit.Yet both hardly start a game in their first 2 seasons at the club, no profit forthcoming and the manager is still in situ. The high cost free transfer deals signed off, no profit was ever coming from any of those signings. The extensions to the out of contract and out of favour players after the covid break again signed off no problem.All facts.Not things made up to suit my argument. And yeah I'm sure Suhail gives weekly reports to the owners about the over grown weeds etc outside the ground.

Scott Wharton isnt fit and probably won't be fully match fit till Christmas hence the need for a left footed centre back preferably being able to play left back too

I agree that they hold little interest in us, I have never argued that point.How could I?It's clear for all to see. We were obviously bought to give the Venky name exposure in Europe.And although I do not use it as an excuse for them , initially when they bought the club they were misled in my opinion. All the guff about leasing players and qualifying for Europe with a 5 million budget that seed was obviously planted in their heads by others, Mrs Desai didn't wake up one morning and decide all that. On Brererton and Gallagher being bought for a quick sale and to make profit ,I find that a stretch too.Brererton and Gallagher hardly started a match in their first two years at the club if that was the case then surely Mowbray would be gone by now? And like you said yourself last season regarding Ayala.You critizised the owners and the club for not putting the money up to secure the center half the club was crying out for when it appeared that he was heading to Saudi Arabia. The high cost deals which that were for Downing (first time) Ayala,Johnson, Holtby...those signings weren't made with a profit in mind. My only argument is the line we don't spend money when we clearly do.How that money is spent is another matter. On the state of the ground again I agree an utter disgrace but do the owners actually know about this?Or is it a case of the people on the ground, Waggott and Cheston etc trying to keep the costs down to make it appear that they are doing a better job than they have been doing. Just find it a stretch that the Venkys would agree to all those players to be kept on with extensions last year after the covid break but then won't shell out the few thousand it would take to give the place a general tidy up.

Last season the club brought in 12 players a mixture of permanent,loans and free transfers including Pickering and finished 15th after one of the worst runs in recent history. In all of Mowbrays summers here he has brought in at least 6 in the summer window. We have sold Raya 3 leading to 5,Nuttall 500k and Armstrong for 15 which was only 2 week ago .

And what about the likes of Armstrong, Brererton and Gallagher?The likes of Ayala,Holtby, Downing,Johnson? They were not contracted to bring those players to the club. They spend money just let it be spent stupidly

Yeah because Mowbray decided to spend 7 million on Brererton and 5 Million on Gallagher. He changed his mind and decided to blame our young goalkeeper Raya for our poor defensive record. Add up all the signings Mowbray has made permanent signings,loan signings and free transfers then come back and tell me signings weren't made .

Trybull has had his contract terminated.Hope we stay clear of trying to bring him in

Without Elliots 11 assists and 7 goals we could have been right in the mix to go down.Without Harwood Bellis being brought in our defence would have been even worse than it was. It's not a long term solution granted, but when the club is generating hardly any income and we don't have much room to move in the transfer market what other solution is there. I would argue the majority of the younger loans we have brought in have been a success in the short term.I would also argue the free transfer signings the club have made in Holtby,Johnson,Roswell etc have been far more costly to the club and haven't worked out for the most part. The majority of the experienced loan signings haven't worked out at all.

Sharpe said he doing a story tomorrow about a permanent striker deal. We have this every season.The club say different things to the media but the end result is players are brought in. Also Mowbray was only saying a week ago that no negotians over new deals yet Waggott was in the lounge at the weekend telling people that Lenihen is close to signing and Brererton not far off.So one of them is lieing.

I agree with you.I am not defending the owners I am pointing out to others that the line "they don't spend money" isn't true And I will also say this people on here every summer are demanding that we sign players etc well the money has to come from somewhere?It's not coming from any income the club recieves. Up until 2 weeks ago the club had brought in about 5 million in transfer fees the last 4 years. We spend much more money on transfer fees and wages than the clubs who are generating similar income to ourselves.

I agree with everything you say but they are talking about another defender being signed on loan presumably a left footed for when we do switch to 3 at the back. I think Carter is more than capable I just worry that if he is kept on he won't get enough minutes and will stifle his development. For me he has shown that he is capable but with the manager pressing ahead with bringing in loan defenders then it just doesn't instill me with confidence that Mowbray feels the same

What you or I or Joe or whoever would do is pretty much irrelevant though.Its what Mowbray will do that matters and I'm not sure he would give Carter the minutes he perhaps would deserve at this time. Ayala and Lenihen will 100% be ahead of him, when Wharton comes back then him aswell .Mowbray will probably pick Costello at full back when he is fit.The Brighton lad won't be guaranteed a starting position

Teams ain't spending money at this level on permanent deals so I don't think we would get very much for Nyambe in this current window, we may even get more for him in the long run if it goes to tribunal were it's standard for 20% sell on to be awarded as part of the deal. If we could get upwards of 2 million for Rothwell I would look at it but don't think we would get that much but who knows people might start to panic as we approach deadline

Nothing wrong with it like I said I would keep him but will Mowbray give him the minutes to aid his development that I am unsure about and I think he would be better served playing every week if that is the case. Suppose it could be looked at again in January if he isn't getting enough minutes

Talk of another defender coming in on loan and if like you say that we will be playing 3 at the back at times this season then surely the club will look to bring in a centre half/left back as we don't have a left footed option when we switch to a 3. I would keep Carter, he looks more than capable but don't think it will do anything for his development playing a hand full of minutes

I would keep Carter myself but I can also see the benefits of Carter playing every single week if he was to go on loan. This guy from Brighton will be back up, we won't be guaranteeing him a starting place. Ayala and Lenihen will be Mowbrays preferred 2 and when Wharton Is fit that could put Carter as potentially fourth choice centre back and possibly third choice at right back when Costello Is fit as Tm likes to play him at full back even though I don't agree with that

In hindsight Brewster turned out to be a poor signing but at the time he was signed he was a coveted player and Liverpool insisted a buy back Clause was put into his contract. They made a profit on Ramsdale who was another big buy. Wilders second season in the prem was a disaster but injuries to key players played it's part particularly O'Connell who was probably their most important player with the way they play . Terrible second season but what Wilder did at Sheffield United on the whole was exceptional and that shouldn't be forgotten about, prior to taking the Sheffield United he had done well

We will get money for Nyambe regardless if he runs his deal down as it will go to tribunal. What will we get for Rothwell?I'd say it wouldn't be very much so probably best keeping for the season unless we were to get decent money

I don't think a renaissance but if a Wilder had had the backing Mowbray has had the club wouldn't find itself in the position it is now . The late bowyer era we were heading and headed into a transfer embargo so they couldn't have spent in that time? When they turn off the taps it coincides with the end off the ffp cycle