Scotty, of course it is not a good position to be in and I am sure deep down the Rovers hierarchy are livid that this has happened when they should be using the window for securing targets and off loading players they adjudge as dispensable. By strong, I am saying the club's negotiating position against Rangers and Viola is strong just as Gordon Taylor pointed out very publicly this morning. Time is on the Rovers' side and they are using that and their public statements to perfection. City have stonewalled Newcastle into offering £7m for Distan this evening. A very ordinary player. Rangers have already benefitted to the tune of £8m from Souness splashing Fat Freddie's dosh. Is Ferguson as good as Boumsong, better, 75% as good or only half as good? To all intents and purposes, 3.5 years left on a contract are as good as 2.5 years for all Murray's pseudo bullshit seven days ago. Here's another one for you, which of Boumsong or Ferguson would sell more shirts in the Ibrox shop? The club owns the shirt. Rangers cannot pretend they are not receiving an unplanned £8m from Boumsong. So fair dos, they should hand it over if they want Ferguson.

Come on Izzitnot, allow us the moment of excitement at signing a new player. Do you know whether Savage can play on April 30 or not? There seem to be so many different stories going about. How roused are the Birmingham rabble that Sullivan is rabble rousing?

A slightly more robust version of what John Williams has said already. Head in the sand time BP- you can see that clubs are paying big money to get target players who are on contracts of over two years' duration. You ducked the straight question that if Rangers and Birmingham got huge fees for Boumsong and Savage (and it looks like City will get a ridiculous amount for Distan) why on earth shouldn't Rovers also get a huge fee for Ferguson? The Walker Trustees own the club and John Williams would not have said what he did about the Board being sacked if they take a £3.5m loss on Ferguson without a nod from Jersey. The Trustees is where the ultimate decision will be taken, certainly not by bitter fans, not by Barry Ferguson, not John Viola and David Murray's only role is to sign a very substantial cheque, or not as the case may be. If Ferguson stays, it is up to him to win the fans back onto his side. You can boo him, the majority will not if the PR is handled OK. The fans can't even get Matteo dropped so they are hardly going to force Ferguson out of the club now are they? Mark Hughes is making it very clear he wants Ferguson to stay and no doubt he will tell the fans that again in his usual clear style if Ferguson stays. Are you going to boo Sparky for that? So, taking your premises, firstly if Rangers don't want him badly enough, he's not going back. Secondly, the fans can be won round. (Go back through this thread, what %age are from Rovers fans implacably opposed to Ferguson even now?) The Rovers are in a strong position. In the last 24 hours or so, Rangers, Viola and Ferguson have done nothing in the face of Williams' obvious delaying tactics. The Rovers' position has strengthened with the effluxion of time as of today (of course it could change tomorrow and we don't know what is going on behind the scenes). Next week is the last week of the window by which time Murray has publicly said if Ferguson has not got himself out of Ewood Park, he will be looking elsewhere for a midfielder. At the moment, everything is being handled in a respectful gentlemanly manner at Ewood and no bridges are being burnt unlike the shrill screaming which is still going on down at St Andrew's so I believe it is perfectly possible for Ferguson to come back into the fold. My gut feel is that Rangers are too far down the road on this one and that Ferguson will go to them on a transfer formula which allows Rovers to recoup ALL the transfer fees paid AND give us opportunity for upside. It may take another Premiership club to come in or an intemperate outburst by Viola "speaking for Barry" to push it along but that is my 50% outcome with the player staying at Ewood or going to another Premiership club both of which I would put at 25% likelihood. If there are no public developments by Monday morning and we are still waiting for Rovers' response to the transfer request, it will have shifted to 50% on Ferguson staying.

Rovers winning a riproaring local derby on Monday night and a satisfactory resolution of the Ferguson saga (be it a chastened BF declaring undying loyalty to Ewood Park or a very substantial transfer fee) would help as well.

The Brummies are laughing about that interview. Apparently when Savage starts making exaggerated movements not to look at the camera, he is not to bew trusted.

Welcome back. Thank God you are OK. Have you seen the pictures on the thread about it on the official site?

is that the A330-200 or -300 series? The technical answers are here. (I was a little bit out by the way). The perjorative answer is a hell of a lot further than Barry Ferguson.

Gives a huge incentive to beat Colchester first time! Otherwise we are looking at playing the top 6 in the Prem in 6 consequetive games with presumably the rescheduling of the Liverpool game (for the League Cup Final) taking precedence over Norwich given Norwich are also out of the FA Cup and Liverpool have European Cup commitments.

Some transposed posts? Everyone's favourite trade unionist spells it out. Savage's long contract enabled Brum to extract a big price. Ditto Rovers and Ferguson. Hughes has just echoed what John Williams has said in his statement. The BBC coverage is much fuller than the selected Sky reporting which has been edited to give a slant towards Rangers. Williams has indicated that it will be Friday at best and Monday probably before he has canvassed the views of the Board on Ferguson's transfer request- bang on, time being used to our advantage. Big developments on Tyneside- Butt has broken down again with the hamstring problem. With Souness continuing to be at loggerheads with Kieron Dyer and the Geordie fans openly speculating about a Souness bid for Ferguson.....

Thank you 1864, if Rovers are handling the situation better than Brum and Rangers did Savage and Boumsong, then they are better positioned to get an over-valued price for Ferguson than those two did successfully for Savage and Boumsong. The reality is fans' anxiety, players' true value etc. go through the window in these situations. Recent history teaches us that players in these circumstances ONLY get their move when the selling club gets something CLOSE to its own over-valuation of the player. Rangers have already signalled where they could be going to when they tried to suggest Rovers had valued Ferguson at £5m. They know they have to go to that price with their next bid to have any chance of getting him and frankly, its beginning to look like they've choked. Rovers hold Ferguson's registration so have every right to drop him AND to fine or not to pay him if he is not abiding by the letter of his contract. If Rangers stick at £3m, Rovers can run the odds which probably work out that they are better off running the risk of putting Ferguson on cold turkey. He has not been a big positive influence on the dressing room when he was happy so why should he be a big negative influence when he is not happy? Ginger has a good point about making up the difference from Ferguson's own pocket. Rovers would stand to loose around £5m in wages and transfer value if this deal goes ahead as Rangers currently want it. I would think that Viola and Ferguson would be at risk of legal injunctions and damages actions if Rovers are forced to swallow that. No doubt Viola's UEFA Agent's License would be at risk. In answer to your questions, there are over 50 moons in the Solar System and more are being discovered as telescopy improves. The A330 can do around 11,000km without a fuel stop- if you are asking about the A340-500, I think that can do 19,000km. Tony Blair- I don't know but he shouldn't be and the answer to the last question is a lemon.

From reading the Rangers news, I would say to all in the "Ferguson has to go" camp: - there is a story questioning whether Rangers have the cash to go above a £3m offer. (Remember JW has made a statement which makes it impossible for Rovers to now accept only £3m for Ferguson). Rangers are having to sell to buy- Arvedladze is going. - McLeish has gone on Rangers World saying Rangers have a number of targets (including Nonda from Monaco) and that supporters have to be prepared to accept they will fail on some of them. This is probably an invitation for Barry to start to throw his toys out of the Rovers' pram. Lets see if he has it in him. It is also a signal that Rangers are willing to abandon him and his scheming agent.

To 1864, Scotty, Duff's Minder, Blue Phil et al: Is Boumsong worth £8m? Is £3m a fair price for Savage? Are Rovers handling the Ferguson saga better or worse than Birmingham handled Savage or Rangers handled Boumsong? PS Cn and Tris-

Once again, brilliantly played by JW. This guy is world class! By making this statement yesterday and allowing a leak suggesting Ferguson's request will be refused he really puts the onus on the Rangers side to put in a new realistic bid now. Relating it to a loan deal clearly tells Ibrox what realistic means which is you've got to offer all our money back to make us even think about it. Anything less will not be "challenging" , great use of language. If Rangers don't bid again at around the £6.5m level, JW will be strengthened in his argument that Rovers want Ferguson more than Rangers do when the Rovers' formal response to the Ferguson request is issued. Two elements are worth highlighting - the statement that Barry does not want to go to any other English club is both a hands off and a declaration of intent to keep the player and a clear warning to any EPL club coming in that they have to bid high to avoid a summary rebuff from the player and Rovers. - the comment that the shareholders would demand the resignation of the board is a master stroke. It hits directly at Murray who is the 92% shareholder and is as fronting the negotiations for Rangers- he is totally exposed and has nowhere to hide. By contrast Rovers are multi-layered- Williams is negotiating who needs to have the support of the Board who in turn need the sanction of the Walker Trustees. Rovers can obfiscate, delay, refer to their heart's content totally legitimately whereas Murray/Rangers are reduced to a one-man band, Williams can go back three times asking for more on each occasion on behalf of each level in the Rovers' hierarchy. No doubt the Jersey-based trustee is on a well-deserved holiday on a remote Pacific Island with no telecommunications. This means the Rovers now command the most powerful element in this negotiation which is time. There were 20 days to the end of the window when JW held the meeting he had initiated with Viola and Ferguson (again, JW taking that initiative in the first place buys him more ability to delay later) and today there are 11 days left. All that has happened in the intervening period is that Ferguson has made himself financially more disadvantaged viz a viz the Rovers by asking formally for a transfer request- as JW acknowledges in his comments that was what in effect happened a week last Tuesday. If the Rovers want to retain Barry, they are playing a blinder. If Rovers are to get the last Scottish bank note on the deal, everyone has to be convinced not only Rovers want to keep Ferguson but that they stand a decent chance of doing so. The suggestion dropped on Rovers World that Ferguson's injury would not be recovered in time for Monday was another smart move and could quite possibly be true- groins can take three to four weeks. Murray is backed into a corner and Viola has probably over-played his hand. Everybody knows that Ferguson is nowhere near as strong a character as Savage. Ferguson has often said all he wants to do is play football- I should imagine the just the hint of what happened to Savage might be repeated would weaken Ferguson's resolve.

Now confused about whether Savage can be picked for the Brum game or not. Sullivan has stupidly placed an article in the Mirror talking about the hatred for Savage and saying he will need a massive police presence for the Rovers' visit to St Andrew's on 30 April. The idiocy of the man. If he had kept his trap shut, the situation could have been diffused to an extent. Now the Brum yobs are given a license to have a go at Savage and all things Blackburn. No doubt, an innocent and unfortunate Rovers supporter will be in the wrong place at the wrong time and will pay for this stupid irresponsible outburst.

Good points SG. Worth mentioning we will be "head-to-head" with the dingles on attendances so to speak with both clubs hosting third division opposition. Will be deeply embarassing if more turn out at Turf Moor than at Ewood. The dingles will be playing a club fighting for their lives- the most bitter criticism of Benitez' decision to play the reserves (close to the bottom of the Northern Premiership Reserve League by the way) has come from Dean Court where the Cherries could well go into administration later this season. They won the jackpot in terms of an away draw at Anfield then had the £500,000 payday snatched away by the dingles' victory. Their best hope of surviving now is to get through against the dingles and hope for a money spinner in the fifth round.

Absolutely brilliant stuff Scotty- every one of Souness' remarks a gem. To Notlob and (thankfully) feeling a lot less confident after last night. Hopefully the computerised video analysis thing will be working over time on the Cardiff game and Hughes will have a deep think about why and how the defensive unit which had become so strong and adaptible was reduced to jelly last night. Also suspect the Cardiff tactics were a good foretaste of Bolton's approach at Ewood. I'm not offering any selection or tactical suggestions (apart from stick to 4-4-2), just a 2-1 win prediction for the Rovers.

How Euro 2004 are passing on the benefits of their experience Very interesting article highlighting: The biggest security risk comes from VIPs, sponsors and players' wives, Hooligans are secondary now they are effectively banned from travelling The argument over segregation and how the Portuguese overcame UEFA demands for cages The most damage done to stadiums is by TV crews The need for a non-computerised "third" back-up plan.

No Jansen on the bench

Matteo in at left back for Nissa and Neill predictably in at right back. Matteo is a big risk given he did so badly at Cardiff. Gally and Dickov start up front.

Brum have become a laughing stock over this! Talk about taking a massive PR defeat out of the jaws of national sympathy! The issue of Savage jumping out of a 4 year contract is now almost forgotten.

Good things come to those who wait (except Glasgow Rangers!). Given the aqmount of vitriol there has been, I fully expect Brum to play a dirty to delay Savage's registration until it is too late for him to play against Notlob. Still no doubt JW is enjoying the masterclass ready to try a few tricks on Murray and Viola.

Nearly Chris. Reject the transfer politely with good grace and good reasoning. Reiterate what JW has said publicly in the Glasgow press (nothing like getting the Gers to get on the back of their own people)- We want Barry more than Rangers do. So far as Blackburn Rovers are concerned, Barry is not for sale. Shut up Wait Wait IF Rangers want Barry they will have to break cover with a significantly improved bid. Still inadequate? "Barry is not for sale" Getting warm? THEN slap on the valuation of £8.5m. I would imagine Savage has an absolute horror story of what the last two weeks have been like at the hands of Brum City. I don't believe for a moment that Ferguson has the balls to go through half of that. As for him rotting in the Reserves, I am sure he will come to heel when he realises that he could throw away another half season (after losing half a season last year) particularly if there is a stick called "we won't pay your wages" and a carrot called "you play your best for us then we will probably grant your request in the summer if you still feel that way".

Lua Lua facing additional charges from the Rovers' game.

Nothing is indicating that Rangers have shifted from offering £440,000 now and cancelling the £2.56m which they were claiming is due this week and Rovers have stated is payable at the end of August this year- that makes sense as it would be the second anniversary of the transfer. Murray has come out with some untruths already- Ferguson being on a Bosman next year and the timing of the final stage payment. Obviously he is playing dirty. Rejecting the transfer request is the obvious and sensible move for Rovers. Now the ball is in the Ferguson (or should I say Viola) court. Does Barry cut up rough? A bit tricky with a groin injury- perhaps Rovers should dispatch him for a hernia operation now. If he does, he is rather too close to the end of the transfer deadline to risk Rovers pulling a Brum-style stunt and stop paying his wages as a suspension punishment for non-cooperation whilst still retaining his registration. Are Rangers willing to up their transfer offer? JW made it very clear that the Rovers DO NOT consider the unpaid balance an element in the negotiations. Whatever happens, the other sides have got to make one if not two moves before Rovers will even name a price for Ferguson. We have only seen two rounds of what is likely to be six rounds at least needed before Ferguson leaves Blackburn. Rangers also have a problem having whipped the Gers fans into a frenzy of anticipation. Rovers can and will play this with steely resolve. All those members of the MB who do not like uncertainty are going to have to sit back and watch a pair of professionals play poker for very high stakes very slowly. Quite possibly through to July 2005 unless Murray cracks and makes a bid of £5m+ now; and even then the Rovers will play cold and hard. We don't need to grab anybody's hands off, we control the asset.

Lennie Lawrence very upbeat about Cardiff's chances tonight. Presumably as this is the FA Cup, the official site will be running free commentary again?