Adarabioyo is very difficult to replace but moreso because of his technical ability, and the priority is conceding less goals, not playing out from the back. He wasnt a bad defender either of course but there is nothing wrong with getting in the type of player in which you turn your nose up to, players whose first priority is to defend. I dont think he is a realistic signing but someone like Ayala would be a better defender than Adarabioyo and help us probably concede less, even though he lacks the footballing ability of Adarabioyo. I dont understand why you seem to think that an extra centre back automatically means a tighter defence, especially when it involved converting full backs to play there. You look at teams who have conceded less, Preston are the obvious one. They lack an Armstrong or a Dack but they are built on solid foundations, getting a normal centre back like Bauer has really improved them, no nonsense to an extent, no transfer fee, one we missed out on. We shouldnt be snobbish towards players like that. Teams like Millwall, Forest, Swansea and Cardiff, they are organised better than us, they put more emphasis into defending properly, even when we brought in a good centre back at last, it was one who stands out for his technical ability. I also dont see us spending 3m.

Definitely. It is also certainly true that we are nowhere near good enough against the bottom teams. I think its 15 points out of a possible 42 against the bottom 7. So there is a credible point. But lets not make out that we are good enough v the top teams either.

I dont think we are anywhere near good enough against the lower teams, the points record shows that, the teams we have lost to shows that, there is a weakness there. Its just that theres a misconception that its our only weakness. But people often peddle this myth, "be typical Rovers to lose v bottom and beat top" and that we are good v the better teams. We need to improve v them too. Surely pre season should have a mix of teams we can try and break down and one or two better teams. We seem to be best against lower mid table also rans.

Its a bit of a myth that we are totally comfortable v the bigger teams in the division. Out of the 20 games we played v teams that finished above us, we collected 20 points. And 29 points from the bottom 10. We need improvement across the board, not just v the smaller teams.

I dont think that was the reason that Irvine or indeed a lot of players wouldnt play. Ultimately these players knew that they were soon to be out of contract and playing and potentially getting injured could jeapordise their chances ahead of their next contract. Lyle Taylor is an obvious example, about to get the last decent contract of his career, so it is totally understandable. Troy Deeney did have doubts similar to what you have mentioned but he played anyway, presumably content that it was safe to go back to playing

Refusing to play post lockdown isnt an indicator of a bad attitude. Its a quite understandable protection of a players career and is very common.

I certainly dont thnk that Nzonzi's performances were a "class above" but the reason that he had his doubters was because of his application, he had a tendency to strop and to down tools. Raya did make plenty of mistakes here to be fair which we shouldnt forget but he obviously was talented. The whole way that it was handled, fee, replacement (both quality and the fact it was a loan) and how the money was spent, the whole package was dismal from Mowbray.

Becsuse it didnt work.

What is Plan A? Clearly didnt work that well.

Brilliant penalty save by Raya.

Lets get plan A sorted before we worry about Plan B. And no false 9, box midfield, wide strikers crap.

Do we disagree on how those behind the striker should play? You never say what your opinion is, just repeatedly state what Mowbray does and doesnt do. Do you agree with wide strikers or do you prefer wingers to play there? You dont need to change a formation to have a "Plan B" but either way, you perfect Plan A first. You can change players. For example, Dack off Armstrong is plan A. Plan B could be to move Armstrong wide and put Gallagher up front. Struggling to break a team down with Travis and Evans in midfield? Put a Downing or Holtby there. Stick to the same formation all the time and it promotes consistency.

Mercer is trying to provoke and antagonise. Either way, "some people" dont expect academy players to all be Phil Jones and David Dunn, one person claims to in an attempt to wind up and cast doom. Tosin as a defender maybe slightly overrated, its his technical ability that makes him stand out. Either way, the main difference is the fact that had we signed Bauer, we could have had a long term partnership at CB. In essence, Adarabioyo just helped us finish mid table. If we had Raya and Bauer now, this very difficult summer would be far less difficult than it is now. Regarding Raya, thats 3 errors, if a goalkeeper makes 3 errors a season, youd take that. Its when it gets above 10 that you have a problem. Selling Raya for peanuts, loaning a crap temporary keeper and signing Gallagher with the Raya money was a dismal three pronged bit of business.

You mean Mercer does, a man who is a parody of himself with his daily administration predictions? Not "some people" Carter was ok v Reading, no more. Wasnt directly responsible for any of the goals but defensively we were poor again. The own goal was poor on his behalf, no escaping that, and one of numerous signs of him struggling. What you cant grasp with Raya is that it is almost as if for you, its mistakes or no mistakes, black or white. He has made far fewer errors which doesnt compute with you. Every goalkeeper makes them, hes made far less this year. Waltons problem is not that he made a mistake or 2, he made over 10. You wont acknowledge that even though hes still certainly not perfect, hes getting better and making fewer mistakes. And again like with Paul Mani you are totally looking short term when judging signings that were short term and helped us finish mid table. Whilst also judging the manager not on who he did sign but who he didnt sign but tried to, even though you dont know who they are! Would you be happier now if we had Bauer and Raya? Of course you would, and we could have had both and not got Gallagher.

@Paul Mani how is Bauer now sub standard? You described him as 7 out of 10, which is far from sub standard. Also claiming that Williams is a 7 out of 10 standard Championship defender which is crazy. How is replacing Raya with Walton "arguable?" Walton is clearly more error prone and again critically, no longer our player. You sign a loan player ideally to push you on that final last step. I suspect that after a mid table season, that it is pretty obvious that if we had Raya and Bauer at this moment in time, we would be in a better place than just having Gallagher. If we signed that level of player this summer youd be over the moon. Now we have a real task on our hand filling those 2 positions.

Either way, your system is to complicated for me, false 9 should be an experiment never to be repeated. A 4-2-3-1 is much simpler. It doesnt have to involve direct play like we played with Graham, but we dont need to come up with complicated formations or copy off other teams.

Is Derrick Williams a middle of the road Championship defender?! I must have been watching a different player in the last 4 years. Is a 7/10 defender who heads away more balls than anyone in the league a pretty desirable thing to have! We would certainly take that now. Instead we downplayed his chance of starting for us (he would walk into our defence) and let him go, in the end getting a temporary CB (who is obviously far better technically but a FAR better cb? Lenihan is a better defender than Adarabioyo I would suggest) which on the back of a mid table finish has left a hole again that could have been permanently fixed. Dodged a bullet? Do me a favour. Mr elite football? Agenda? You've lost me. Clean sheet record? I am not sure from when that record is, but he conceded 63 goals this season, surely that is the most important stat, and it is still bottom half level defending and has cost us. I have seen him play and he definitely has improved, he looks far less eccentric, I am sure coupled with playing for a team that prioritises its defence. He will always make errors, goalkeepers do, its the quantity that is important and it has come right down this season. So has the number of goals that have gone into his net. I will say that he did not fill me with confidence and I will not pretend that I was his biggest fan. It is the low fee, coupled with how we used that and the inferior temporary replacement that came in that rankles. Again, it goes back to forward planning. We could have easily had a permanent, talented goalkeeper and a solid and reliable partner for Lenihan at the moment. Instead, we have a poor striker.

He scored many of the goals from playing central early in 2020. Plus assisted eg v Sheffield Wednesday.

I certainly did not even hint that I expect academy players to be of that standard. For example my analysis of Carter was from a Championship game v Luton in which his game was riddled with errors, not because he didnt play like Phil Jones. I havent written him off, I just dont think he is ready at this time. Surely Bauer should have been prioritised based on the fact that he would have been a longer term solution? From what I have seen, he is a very capable Championship CB, I think he won the most aeriel duels in the League this season, Preston conceded 9 less goals than us this season. To compare him to Williams seems a little strange.

Just a simple 4-2-3-1. Trying to copy other teams or come up with complicated and inconsistent formations does not breed familiarity and consistent results. Nyambe is not good enough in the air to be a centre back, and Dack has played as a false 9 in the past with no success, he isnt suited to being a striker. Expecting Downing to regularly play as a wing back at his age is unrealistic, and Armstrong should play centrally when possible. Rankin Costello is a winger so like Chapman should compete for that position. No more strikers out wide, Armstrong can be effective there should Gallagher hit some form but of course as a central striker. Holtby could potentially play wide right too, Rothwell left, but we need a winger, certainly far more than a central midfielder. Whether Mowbray will I am unsure before people jump up saying he doesnt play wingers, and we were linked with a few in January so maybe there is hope.

People have a natural confirmation bias. There is an element of fairness there based on judging players on their overall performances throughout the season, but of course an unfairness in that it is more difficult to judge players on the individual game that the topic relates to. For example, if Nyambe and Bell both had poor games, the reason that Bell may suffer more criticism is that Bell is poor more often than not, and Nyambe is good more often than not. If Bennett gives a penalty away, he has done so many times before so it will be further proof that he is a liability in that regard. If Nyambe or Travis did, it is more uncommon and not a common theme.

Fair enough. I feel at times that youngsters performance are bigged up or if negative, dismissed purely because they are young. But I cannot argue with your post.

Interesting that pre season is 3 weeks away! Reckon we will have a budget by then?

My point is more that I think some (not aiming this at yourself) seem to see "being patient" as unwilling to accept any doubts, any criticism of individual performances from specific games, even if it is done constructively. Take Carter for example, I thought he looked well off v Luton, was ok v Reading despite the 3 goals, but not just the own goal, his passing, his dealing with the high balls, his positional play with the ball in behind, I thought he was a massive weak link. For me, thats not being impatient to say, it is from my opinion being honest about his individual performance and how I see him currently in terms of if hes able to contribute to a supposed promotion chasing side, or indeed at this level. If I said he will never make it etc, fair play, but I said loan out and see how he does. You then look at Wharton, he broke through mid season, in a worse team, at a really tough time, and for me looked far more at home, but still probably a bit short. Centre back for me is a really difficult area to break through. Throw in 3 loans in League 2 where he will not only have developed physically and toughened up, but seemingly really impressed overall. When he broke through, I suspect although I didn't think he was out of his depth in the same way as Carter looked v Luton, With Rankin Costello, he definitely doesnt look out of place in the same way. Technically he looks fine, clearly not a full back, but he has been competent even if the praise has been at times over the top. I think for what its worth, considering that Dack will be back, that Holtby is more effective (even if he has been at times a drifter) as back up, we have Brereton and Gallagher who could play with Armstrong, I think the time Buckley would get would be minimal, he isnt a wide man either, he would benefit from a season in League 1. I think you have been a little harsh on Evans, not in terms of his overall Rovers career, which has been disappointing and underwhelming in the most part. But statistically him and Travis together is a winning combination and I think he has had a good season when he has played. Downing for me is better central as he doesnt have the pace to play wide anymore, and he does have the technical ability and can play on the half turn. That being said, defensively he is lacking. Can only play with Travis.