The announcement was purely confirming that his initial loan has ended. Local media in Norwich suggests that they are strongly considering an extended stay. Latter 2 certainly not good enough.

No, made the big error v QPR, was generally terrible coming for crosses, and as @Oldgregg86 said, was really slow to get down, as shown for Norwich's first goal and also McBurnies header. The problem with bringing in "an experienced Championship keeper in to put pressure on" Raya suggests that the new keeper will not be first choice and thus isnt as good as Raya. Whats the point bringing in a player who isnt an improvement?

Leutweiler adds nothing to that scenario. Hes a goalkeeper who almost certainly wont feature, even being in the 18 will be be rare, and crucially he has already proved that if he was needed, he isnt up to it.

To suggest that hes handicapped by a poor defence in front of him is misleading, he is much as fault as anyone back there. Many of his errors are due to poor decision making coming for crosses etc, thats his main flaw, and it wont just go away by signing a defender or two. The poor kicking that you touch on is quite a small part of whats wrong in his game, its the constant errors leading to goals that is causing the problem. You mention the Brentford game, but the times hes won points have been very infrequent compared to his costly mistakes. If you had said you can see him becoming a good keeper, maybe even a Premier League one, fair enough. But youve suggested that he may not only be capped for Spain, which I would suggest itself is incredibly unlikely, but to become number one. Even if we are saying that there will be a window for him to do so post David De Gea (5 years senior), that would imply that a goalkeeper whose place at a mid table Championship side has become under massive scrutiny due to consistent errors, and one who is being linked with other mid table Championship sides, that his progression will accelerate at a rate that will see him push ahead of a goalkeeper only one year difference in age, who is a 70m signing and regular for Chelsea, and who barring his antics in the Cup Final, has put in regular, consistent performances for a team who finished 3rd in the Premier League and are in the Europa League final, and got to the League Cup final. Not to mention La Liga goalkeepers that Raya will also have to get ahead of.

I'd rather have Raya!

Do you genuinely believe he will become Spains number 1 one day? A goalkeeper as far as im aware never played for the Spanish youth teams, who is struggling at the moment to convince he is a competent Championship goalkeeper, whilst in terms of competition, he is up against Kepa, a 70m keeper playing regularly for Chelsea who is one year older, and even De Gea (admittedly after a bad season himself) who is only 28.

Its not that he makes mistakes, it is the regularity of them.

I think our main difference of opinion is how highly we rate Raya, he certainly isnt one of the best goalkeepers in the League at this moment in time and we definitely need an upgrade rather than "experienced back-up to push him" as he is not at this moment in time capable of playing a starring role in a side with the ambitions that Mowbray claims we have. You mention the defence and undoubtedly that is a handicap but with his regular errors and inability to command the defence, he is as big a part of that as anyone. Over the course of a season, not just a couple of months, he made error after error, yes he is capable of some superb saves but all goalkeepers are. I would disagree with the notion that he won us more points than he lost. I would agree that in an ideal world, we could have Raya competing with a good quality experienced keeper, but being a little more pragmatic and realistic, with our idiotic and eccentric owners, as well as the threat of FFP and 7m already pissed up the wall on Brereton, the resources available to Mowbray will be finite and if sacrificing Raya is required to get us a number 1 good enough to push for the top 6 (the likes of Frank Fielding need not apply) then it would be something worth seriously considering, academy graduate or otherwise in my opinion.

Don't think the Cairney comparison is accurate at all. He was sold for cheap primarily as we was going into a transfer embargo, that was the summer that a few went and the likes of Guthrie, Akpan, Koita and Delfouenso all came in. As far as we know, at the moment we are not under such restrictions. Also, Cairney had won player of the season here, he was undoubtedly at that time a strong aspect of our side, with potential, rather than a weakness with potential. Rocky patch in my opinion doesn't accurately summarise his performances over the entire season either for me. I also never have felt he is unbeatable. He definitely has a quality reflex save in him (which keeper doesnt) but his overall game is very questionable, and crucially for a goalkeeper, he makes far, far too many mistakes to be relied upon. Of course he may improve, and ideally we could have him and a quality experienced keeper at the same time, but I wouldnt be gutted to see him leave I dont think.

You are reading far too much into it I suspect. The lack of importance/effort placed by Mowbray on a potential League 1 title, I share your frustration in. But playing Reed wide was something he did because as he said, Evans and Smallwood "played the position better." Something I disagreed with at the time, but I put it down to over-cautiousness and over-loyalty to those 2 in question rather than trying to lower expectations, that seems incredibly far-fetched. The shackles did come off once relegation was mathematically impossible, notably the defensive winger nonsense was knocked on the head, why would Mowbray even give the supporters a glimpse of a potentially both more exciting and more effective side when nothings to play for, only furthering the evidence of those who felt that he had made incorrect decisions earlier in the season, if he was primarily managing expectations? By doing that at the end of the season, hes left himself wide open to judgement. If at the start of next season he returns back to old ways, defensive wingers, Smallwood and Evans etc, then we really can worry.

All 5 players have been released for financial reasons, with Swansea having spent all of their time since relegation trying to cut the wage bill down wherever possible. Nothing laughable about it. Archer has been mentioned more than once and I find it very strange, a goalkeeper released by Millwall. All the talk about Rayas age is very well but for me hes made far too many mistakes this season. There has been a lot of talk about Raya going into next season as number 1 but with a more "experienced" keeper pushing him. You'd presume someone like Fielding would fit the bill for that role but for me it would be a complete hash of our goalkeeping situation to go in with 3 keepers, none of whom are particularly good (in Raya's case, potentially for now, we dont know) and in essence, would be a case of quantity over quality, you dont need 3 senior goalkeepers. If sacrificing Raya enabled us to get a better upgrade then I wouldnt be against the idea. The Leutweiler deal however will never make sense.

Wayne Routledge is 34 and has lost much of the pace he had earlier in his career. Olsson has been injured for a while with an achilles injury.

The player we should be looking at here is Aribo.

They shouldnt have been offered new deals was my point. Its not conjecture, hes been offered a new deal. Im not even considering rumours about his personality, pissed up rants etc. Hes not started a league game in 2 years of paid employment, when he did play in the cups his attitude was terrible, so ultimately we owe him nothing. But as a decent club, by all means let him use our facilities to get back to fitness. A paid contract out of pity makes a mockery out of our constant and understandable desire to bring costs down and work to a budget. Downing, like Leutweiler, Gladwin and Conway is not good enough, the reason people havent criticised the decision to not offer him a new deal is because he shouldnt be offered one either.

Technicalities, Gladwin and Conway have been offered new deals then which they shouldnt. When Gladwin did play he didnt look like he could be arsed. Allowing him to use the facilities to recuperate is a kind gesture, paying him to do so is absurd and a waste of money. Samuel it was a response to a quoted paragraph, I wasnt inferring that we should or can release him. The best season hes had is the last one in terms of reputation. Hes not good enough and should be offered around for free if anyone wants him. If the reasoning behind Luetweiler (a player not good enough) is in case during the whole summer we cant sign a keeper then its absurd. It also highlights the flaw of discovering a budget only after the retained list needs submitting.

The key issue is that Mowbray and Waggott have both discussed many times about not having unlimited fund and having to cut our cloth accordingly and look for value, that every penny counts. I cant believe that people are defending the Gladwin deal. This is a player who has been drawing a wage for 2 years in which time hes never started a League game. He has been paid for the last 18 months in which hes been injured. It would be a noble and understandable gesture to allow him to use the facilities The goalkeeper weve retained is blatantly not up to standard though. Mowbray said the other week hes bringing one in so your hypothesis that essentially we are sticking with the 2 we have is either wrong or something has changed since he said it. If he is still bringing one in then theres absolutely no need for a senior third choice keeper. Again, money down the drain. You say Samuel could add something, he was sub standard in League 1 (not scoring post November) and again has since had a major injury. We are supposedly after a new striker (again Mowbray has said as such) and thats on top of our player of the season and a striker he blew 7m on, and another who sees himself as a striker who cost 2m himself. How many strikers do we need? Hes also given Conway a new deal, does he fit into this new style (high energy, technical, full of young players) Mowbray seems eager to move towards? No. Its clear that we need a few players coming in to boost the starting 11. Who is going out to make way on the wage budget?

The retained list of a manager who has predictably failed on his promise to be ruthless to allow us to push forwards already. A manager who was talking about having to find value in the market last week, yet is throwing money down the drain with many of these extensions, when we need both the room in the squad and room to manoeuvre on the wage budget. Firstly, agree with the Downing decision. We need better. Leutweiler is never, ever good enough. If hes one of our main 2 keepers, we have major problems. If he isnt, why on earth do we need a third choice senior goalkeeper who will seldom even make the bench? One who isnt good enough to deputise should we get 2 injuries anyway. Gladwin is an absolute joke, the absolute opposite of ruthlessness. This is a player who was out of his depth in League 1, prior to a series of serious injuries, in which time he has been paid by the club. To let him use the facilities would be a noble, human decision. To give him a wage is absolutely ridiculous. Conway is someone who was out of his depth at this level 2 or 3 years ago. Not good enough anymore, nor does he fit into this apparent new system Mowbray seems to want to move toward, high energy, progressive football. Rodwell I am the least annoyed about, but still I am unconvinced that he should have been given a new deal. Has quality as a midfielder, but Mowbray will see him as an option at centre back.

I would suggest that Graham is better technically than Brereton. Ultimately, it came down to the players behind him and of course the manager as to why we chose to predominantly hoof the ball up to him. Graham played an important role in the Derby, Forest and QPR wins.

Ive not doubted that, nor have I suggested that we right him off. But ultimately, the primary objective is to get results and as it stands, Danny Graham up front is more likely to achieve that. Not having him as first choice striker does not mean writing him off.

What can you possibly have seen in Brereton to be willing to go into a new season without any new strikers, and also with him above our player of the season in the pecking order?

No chance. Was not good enough at League 1 level, before a serious injury.

Why is that the benchmark?

Whilst I dont think that Mikel is realistic, it seems totally unfair to generalise that he wouldnt give a shit, presumably based on the likes of Murphy and Etuhu. Mikel impressed at Boro, including at Ewood where he was as good as any midfielder I've seen all season, and if he wanted do very little to earn a good wage then surely hed have stayed in China; the wage youve suggested is surely a guess. Hes younger than our player of the season last season.

It would decrease the quality of the football massively if the likes of Liverpool, Spurs, Real Madrid, Atletico Madrid etc were replaced by champions from more obscure leagues,

The thing is, with Mulgrew and Conway, you have 2 senior players, one of whom whose contract was going to expire this summer and one whose still does, both of whom are clearly well past their best, and both of whom are prime candidates to jettison if the manager has developed the ruthless streak that we have all speculated about in the past following comments he made about giving players we had in League 1 a chance. Its easy to say "they can come on for 10 minutes here and there" but ultimately they will be evidence that the strong, aggressive push towards a top 6 place is perhaps not as likely to materialise as we hope.