[Archived] Killing Us!

[cletus]

It is a mixture of a lot of things that`s killing the game as we know it, different things for different people.

Personally, i used to love standing on the Blackburn End with my mates, having a bounce around, being a bit daft at times & having the banter. It was all great fun & only cost a few quid (no great hole in the pocket)

Nowadays, i find the price is way too high (this is my personal view)

We are forced to sit in sterile stadiums with 'pumped in' atnosphere.

The music can be so loud that banter between the two sets of fans is quite rare.

Friends/mates are often sat far apart.

What do i want?

I`d love a return to a terraced area (even a small one), where i can stand with my mates,have a bounce, have a laugh, have some banter & make it a more affordable price (iro £20)

I know this aint going to happen, & every time it`s suggested, it gets shouted down from most people on here. So what am i going to do? Put-up & shut -up? or vote with my feet & my hard earned cash?

[CAPT KAYOS]

A point that we agree on Paul ..... and the inescapable nub of the situation.

Not wanting to bang a drum or anything but yet again its old ground thats been gone over previously and comes back to what I kepp saying about the UNIQUEITY of Rovers and how it will affect us more than most teams -but other teams will start to experience the same problems if not on the same scale at the moment

Things like this have been discussed time and time again with same replies

Maybe ROVERS need to be the club that makes the changes - and as mentioned maybe the Rovers stayaways are doing good for the game- Who knows??

CAPT KAYOS Posted on: Aug 6 2006, 17:56

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however I just shake my head at people who are laying the blame at the Blackburn Public. Its not that they don't want a Premiership team ... its because they can't bloody afford it and there are other contributary factors.. ie not the most affluent area, 'BIG Clubs' competing for support , the cutural element , Non city, media negative, replacement support to name a few. They might not be the most passionate as a collection numerically .. but for those that go they certainly are.

Going back a couple of years ago we had a lenghthy thread on here about the way the game was going and alot of people raised there concerns, alot of which are now being proved correct. Now something I raised was the 'uniqueity' of Rovers and how we are different to probably most clubs (some you can't compare as they have never been in a similar position and probably never will be but I suspect would have the same problem) - this is something I have mentioned whenever this sort of topic raise its head - which it appears to do or has done over the last couple of seasons.

I am not a follower of the 'we have been punching above our weight' comment as I feel we deserve to be where we are but I feel the club over the years have lost track of the type type of person Rovers Fans are who we are as a club - difficult for me to explain but I think most will know what I am going on about (hopefully) - and I think this has been the downfall.

Paul has IMO been one of the best posters with the insight to explain the situation including as many have said our love/hate feeling now of the game in general, and on many a time he always explains in great detail. There have been warning signs about what how pricing was going to go - and like it or not - the dead horse (Lancashire Utd) that DROG has tried to flog to everybody on here is probably the most sensible idea going forward - now most people, me included may not like this idea and it probably won't happen in our lifetime but the way things are going this is how it will more than likely end up - unless something is done about it now drastically.

People can blame -clubs, players , fans etc but there is alot of issues the higher echelons of the game need to answer for and need to sort out now before its too late ..if it isn't already

[mickygray316]

I think the club should take note of all these suggestions on the boards. At some point something has to give £36 for a game of football in the north of england is stupid, i dont care if the worlds best are playing its still too much

[roversWASmylife]

Too expensive, end of.

I haven't got a season ticket this season, not because of the cost but because I won't be able to go many games this season, anyway I decided to go to the Everton game. £36 it cost me for where I used to sit in the Blackburn End.

I know I could have sat in the Outer bit of the Riverside but that's not the point. I wanted to sit where I my mate was and where I know plenty of people I can have a chat to and what have you. I admit, when I was in Ewood Arms before the game it did cross my mind, "I've just bought a ticket for £36 and it's on here for free"

I didn't bother with the Chelsea game, I couldn't afford another game at that price and it was on telvision. Man City could be the next game that I might go to, £32 in BBE or £24 in the outer block of the Riverside. I'm not too sure yet, if it's on foreign tele I might go for that.

Over the last season I've become dis-illusioned with football, rip off prices, games at 12pm, 2pm, 3pm, 4pm, 5pm what next?

When it's on foreign tv for free, have a few pints watching it and it doesn't cost you much, it's no wonder people are going for that. As much as Rovers have given good prices for season tickets, very good value IMO, a season ticket is 19 game commitment. If people can't make more than just a few it's not worth it, like myself this season and then when a ticket is in the region of £30 on average, you do feel ripped off.

[Athlete]

Basiclly its the rip off prices the clubs ( not just Rovers ) are charging .

What the clubs have too realise that the entrance fee alone is a large chunk out of the normal working persons weekly wage- say for instance if your take home pay is £250-£300 per week your mortgage , car , etc - kids too bring feed -DO THE MATHS £36 for a match live on Sky or foreign TV it doesnt add up ! - thats why more and more are watchin the game in the pub .

I admit I watched the Portsmouth game in the boozer thus saving myself a nice wedge and putting to better use IE : Salzburg . So the mrs can't complain too much .

[blue phil]

Watching the game on TV used to be a poor second to watching it live because the best thing about going to Ewood was the atmosphere. Lots of singing, funny chants being slung towards the opposition end and being able to walk around.

These days with the drummers and many half empty and soulless stadiums going to the football just isn't the same for many.

Which puts The Drog's argument that it is preferable for the club to charge higher prices in order to maximise revenue to bed . It'll surely get to the point that people stop going not just because of the price but because of the lack of atmosphere from the sub 10,000 crowd - however much they're paying . A self perpetuating cycle that'll kill the club ....

I'll agree with Gordon on one point . Simple demographics will kill this club as surely as apples are apples . Ewood Park is as likely to be a mosque in 50 years time than to be a football ground . In the meantime we can fight against the decline only by charging admission fees within the affordibility range of our own supporters .

I'm not saying my solution of free tickets for kids is going to solve all our problems ....but it's preferable to the slow death of attempting to compete with stupid prices against the Chelsea's and Mancs of this world .

The bottom line is that we have to make our economies ELSEWHERE than overcharging our fans . That way is only hastening the decline .

[thenodrog]

The bottom line is that we have to make our economies ELSEWHERE than overcharging our fans . That way is only hastening the decline .

Very revealing Phil. I'd have used the word 'income' there instead of economies. 'Glasses half empty rather than half full' springs to mind.

[Fife Rover]

One great example of the experience is happening now. Around 500 fans are making plans for the trip to Salzburg. Their expectations of the whole experience are very high, they've been excited since the draw was made. Yes they are shopping around for cheap flights but ultimately the cost is irrelevant because the feel good factor is there. These fans are going to spend £4-500 just to watch a a game of footie.

Makes the point for me. Right product, high expectation, cost is last on the list.

Well Bully for you and them too. How many of those making the trip to Salzburg have family comittments? My bet is that the vast majority (if not all) are single and in well paid employment or else are already wealthy. As for the rest of us; don't you think that we would just love to be there too? Just ask yourself why we are not!

[Paul]

Well Bully for you and them too. How many of those making the trip to Salzburg have family comittments? My bet is that the vast majority (if not all) are single and in well paid employment or else are already wealthy. As for the rest of us; don't you think that we would just love to be there too? Just ask yourself why we are not!

I think you've misunderstood me. First I'm not going, I can't afford it. My only chance of going to an away European tie would be Scotland. You may be right about people's personal circumstances, I won't comment because I only know a few who are going.

The point I was trying to make is this trip is a highlight for many. While they will look to travel as cheaply as possible it still involves £000s. Obviously the money is important but the travelling fans put the enjoyment and experience ahead of the cost. This is what we need to achieve at Ewood; a matchday at Ewood needs to be really good entertainment (as the whole event not just the match) so that fans look at the enjoyment first and the money second. At the moment everyone looks at the price and simply says £36 is too much for a game of footie. The club need to make it more than "just a game of footie"

[Fife Rover]

I think you've misunderstood me. First I'm not going, I can't afford it. My only chance of going to an away European tie would be Scotland. You may be right about people's personal circumstances, I won't comment because I only know a few who are going.

The point I was trying to make is this trip is a highlight for many. While they will look to travel as cheaply as possible it still involves £000s. Obviously the money is important but the travelling fans put the enjoyment and experience ahead of the cost. This is what we need to achieve at Ewood; a matchday at Ewood needs to be really good entertainment (as the whole event not just the match) so that fans look at the enjoyment first and the money second. At the moment everyone looks at the price and simply says £36 is too much for a game of footie. The club need to make it more than "just a game of footie"

Sorry for the mis-understanding about you going to Salzburg Paul. However as for the rest, I do understand what you are saying, but I still disagree.

It is not a matter of making the package more enjoyable, and for me and probably 1000's more like me, it IS purely and simply a matter of affordability. I can only explain things in terms of my own situation, but I would imagine that apart from the fine details my situation is the same as the others I am referring to.

I have as you all know been a Rovers Fan since season 1946 - '47, and have seen the good and the bad times and never, ever, lost my intense love of the Rovers. I have stood on the old, roofless BBE for several hours in rain and even snow to watch Rovers (because of crowd size and need to get there early) That is what it was like years ago, but I and many 1000's more never gave it a thought; it was Saturday afternoon and the Rovers are on. Nothing else mattered, we cant wait to get there.

Now ask yourself why? That was obviously by todays standards in comparitive comfort (of a seat with a view, roof over your head, warm concourse with bars, indoor toilets, Tv screens etc etc) a very "poor buy". So why did we bother? Simple! Because the price was right and more than that; Because we loved the Rovers so much that the thought of missing it was completely untenable. I personally know people who have upped and left wedding receptions in full flow to get to Ewood for the kick-off. And I made sure myself that my wedding day did not clash with any Rovers matches.

I could go on at length but do not want to bore you. Just wanted to make the point that the package does not come into the equation at all for the true "dyed in the wool" Rovers fan, and the only reason why such a person does not go to every match is the cost, pure and simple.

As I have said before on another thread, I try to get to as many matches per season as I can afford which last year was 4; this year will be less than that because of rising costs and fixed income. I have a premium of over £100 attached to each match I attend, plus the match ticket and no beer at all on the ground (far too dear).

Hope that makes it clearer for you. It is NOT the "package"; it IS the price! :ph34r:

[thenodrog]

I have stood on the old, roofless BBE for several hours in rain and even snow to watch Rovers (because of crowd size and need to get there early) That is what it was like years ago, but I and many 1000's more never gave it a thought; it was Saturday afternoon and the Rovers are on. Nothing else mattered, we cant wait to get there.

Now ask yourself why? That was obviously by todays standards in comparitive comfort (of a seat with a view, roof over your head, warm concourse with bars, indoor toilets, Tv screens etc etc) a very "poor buy". So why did we bother? Simple! Because the price was right and more than that; Because we loved the Rovers so much that the thought of missing it was completely untenable.

there's more to it than that Fife...

1. No tele

2. No Car (linked to 3 below)

3. No giant retail parks.

4. Terraced houses ... no garden to look after.

5. No play stations.

6. People working in large groups (t'mills) with BRFC as the main daily topic of conversation.

In short nowt else to look forward to to alleviate the daily grind. btw I'm sure I read somewhere that the 50's was when the population had the best 'feel good' factor. God only knows how they measured it though.

[Billinge End Blue]

<As for watching BRFC in the conference...... sorry, but even if they gave me a fiver to go my life is just too short.>

Sorry to rake over old coals, Theno, but the above statement is feeble in extremis.... you've been advised above to go to Old Trafford but surely you could get attain your LUFC dream now at Elland Road (county pride etc).

<I have stood on the old, roofless BBE for several hours in rain and even snow to watch Rovers (because of crowd size and need to get there early) That is what it was like years ago, but I and many 1000's more never gave it a thought; it was Saturday afternoon and the Rovers are on. Nothing else mattered, we cant wait to get there.

Now ask yourself why? That was obviously by todays standards in comparitive comfort (of a seat with a view, roof over your head, warm concourse with bars, indoor toilets, Tv screens etc etc) a very "poor buy">

Fife Rover - would your shared experiences of supporting BRFC from the middle of the last century onwards have been bettered if they had been in the current Ewood Park from the outset? My loyalty to Rovers was forged not only under the luxury of the cantilevered Blackburn End but under the stars and drizzle of away terraces at Oldham, Barnsley, Huddersfield, Newcastle etc. Today's marketed and sold football 'product' diminishes the game and what it means for supporters in the context of what it was once for those of your generation. That's the fundamental reason why whatever business logic Thenodrog attempts to justify his way forward for BRFC, it will always founder (although 'dunno' replies to Scotty's points raised don't really convince either )

There are three home stands at Ewood Park (5 distinct supporting areas with tiers taken in to account) - why are tickets being sold offering generally the same experience wherever you are in the ground? Top teams' football stadia have followed the same business plan as many pubs over a similar time-frame - standardise the product, follow themes, spoil heritage and break with tradition (ban idiosyncracies and no more tap room, lounge, public bar, games room, dining room etc - open plan room, food and one-size-fits-all ). I know we're concerned with Rovers fans deserting Ewood for the pub but landlords are equally concerned with drinkers deserting pubs for supping at home. With these parallels, the irony is screening live football is seen as the last hope for many pubs these days!

TV screening, cost and matchday experience are three inextricably linked factors as far as the current decline in attendance at Ewood Park goes. The fact that many of us are willing to spend more than a fair amount to follow BRFC to Austria in a fortnight just shows how significant the latter factor can be (although it might not be on telly too ).

[Jim J]

Anyone know if any of the pubs have the Premiere Sport Portal channel?

According to satfootball, its showing our game on thursday.

[thenodrog]

Whingers and moaners please dont read any further cos this is will be too difficult for you to comprehend.

But...

I had an interesting conversation that I had with a long time Terriers fan this morning. He's stopped going just recently on the basis that they charged a Category A price of £19.00 for the home match with Doncaster Rovers! (His normal ticket price being £17).

Parrallel Lines eh? But it kinda puts my ticket cost for every Prem game of £21 into stunning perspective doesn't it?

More putting into perspective needed here...........When I mentioned the cost of £21 per match he told me that he would willingly pay that (and even more) to watch Huddersfield in the prem.

Sometimes some of our less committed, couch potato, beer swilling supporters do not realise how bloody lucky they really are do they?

[Hughesy]

Live on Eurosport

Eurosport saves the day

[CAPT KAYOS]

Whingers and moaners please dont read any further cos this is will be too difficult for you to comprehend.

But...

I had an interesting conversation that I had with a long time Terriers fan this morning. He's stopped going just recently on the basis that they charged a Category A price of £19.00 for the home match with Doncaster Rovers! (His normal ticket price being £17).

Parrallel Lines eh? But it kinda puts my ticket cost for every Prem game of £21 into stunning perspective doesn't it?

More putting into perspective needed here...........When I mentioned the cost of £21 per match he told me that he would willingly pay that (and even more) to watch Huddersfield in the prem.

Sometimes some of our less committed, couch potato, beer swilling supporters do not realise how bloody lucky they really are do they?

Not quite TND - From what you have said you have based your comparison price on our Season Ticket prices against a walk on price so I take it he is just a walk on fan but committed none the less. However as you mentioned he has stopped going - he is used to paying the level of prices they set but then they raised the bar and he stopped - akin to what has happened at Rovers.

- so did you not mention the £36 for the Category A game against Everton and then get a response? Would be interesting to see how long he would go on for that price level.

Don't think many people are disputing the value of our S/T , just the price 'in general' as such for watching football and even the Rovers S/T ticket is alot for people to lay out regardless.

[Fife Rover]

Not quite TND - From what you have said you have based your comparison price on our Season Ticket prices against a walk on price so I take it he is just a walk on fan but committed none the less. However as you mentioned he has stopped going - he is used to paying the level of prices they set but then they raised the bar and he stopped - akin to what has happened at Rovers.

- so did you not mention the £36 for the Category A game against Everton and then get a response? Would be interesting to see how long he would go on for that price level.

Don't think many people are disputing the value of our S/T , just the price 'in general' as such for watching football and even the Rovers S/T ticket is alot for people to lay out regardless.

See also the Ashley Cole thread and seei fyou can spot the common cause!

Edited September 12, 2006 by Fife Rover

[CAPT KAYOS]

See also the Ashley Cole thread and seei fyou can spot the common cause!

Spot on FR

[thenodrog]

and even the Rovers S/T ticket is alot for people to lay out regardless.

We'll just have to widen our supporter base then until we can trawl enough people willing to pay for their tickets.

Anybody any workable ideas in this direction?

[Fife Rover]

We'll just have to widen our supporter base then until we can trawl enough people willing to pay for their tickets.

Anybody any workable ideas in this direction?

Yeah simple! Just get Rovers back to the top two and winning a few things and suddenly there will be another 15k or so S/T applicants Most of them living in or around London or Essex, and about half a dozen or so living in Blackburn. :ph34r:

[CAPT KAYOS]

We'll just have to widen our supporter base then until we can trawl enough people willing to pay for their tickets.

Anybody any workable ideas in this direction?

Yep but it doesn't just relate to Rovers.

As I have mentioned previously, something has to be done amongst the higher echelons of the game and the clubs need to be in agreement.

Wages/Salaries/Bonus etc have spiralled out of control which is impacting increasively upon the paying spectator and cannot carry on. Understandably players have a right to get as much as they can - but if its not there / or there are levels set it can't be paid - simple as, and the players would not be able to hold the clubs to ransom.

There is alot of greed in the game and money is being taken out to its detriment with the costs being piled onto the fans with more being asked for. I'm not naive in the sense to believe this is the only factor, but I would say it is a large contributory factor.

.

[Fife Rover]

Yep but it doesn't just relate to Rovers.

As I have mentioned previously, something has to be done amongst the higher echelons of the game and the clubs need to be in agreement.

Wages/Salaries/Bonus etc have spiralled out of control which is impacting increasively upon the paying spectator and cannot carry on. Understandably players have a right to get as much as they can - but if its not there / or there are levels set it can't be paid - simple as, and the players would not be able to hold the clubs to ransom.

There is alot of greed in the game and money is being taken out to its detriment with the costs being piled onto the fans with more being asked for. I'm not naive in the sense to believe this is the only factor, but I would say it is a large contributory factor.

.

A VERY large contributory factor!

[Paul]

Don't think many people are disputing the value of our S/T , just the price 'in general' as such for watching football and even the Rovers S/T ticket is alot for people to lay out regardless.

I don't hear anyone ranting over the price of an ST at Ewood but I would flatly refuse to pay £36 to watch, week after week. Very occassionally I might be persuaded to pay that but not on a regular basis. The clubs, the FA and the PL have killed the golden goose, the crowds will not return and we (Blackburn Rovers in particular and the PL in general) are at the beginning of a downward attendance spiral. This may be masked this year by increased capacity at Arsenal and Old Trafford, but it will only be a mask. It's very unlikely we will go away this season, we usually only go once or twice but to be honest I can't be bothered. If an important, exciting, local game comes up in the cup we'd probably go but the PL? I can't see any reason to bother.

Worth reading and note the publication date

It's all be done to death; KO times, Sky, uncompetitive leagues, prices, player's wages and attitudes. I don't think the clubs realise just how bored and disillusioned fans have become. The PL must be the classic example of how not to run professional sport. It simply isn't the great league the PL would have us believe.

[den]

Talking to an avid City fan last night. He tells me City have lost 5000 fans off the gates, over the past two seasons.

[thenodrog]

Talking to an avid City fan last night. He tells me City have lost 5000 fans off the gates, over the past two seasons.

Maybe it's since they extended old Trafford.