[Archived] Nicko's Thread

[American]

I can't see how someone taking over Rovers can help us more than it helps them, unless they are swimming in cash and are dioing it for PR, or they just love the club and are willing to make a loss on it.

Anyone else will treat it as an investment, and will want to get their moiney back plus more. Which means we will be worse off than bnefore they came along.

Or is there a hole in my logic?

The only hole I would see is that the club will be worse less if we aren't in the Premiership. I wouldn't think we have enough assets to strip and make it worth the purchase price.

[blue phil]

- find someone with a need for personal safety. They seem to be the most successful in footballing terms as well. If the Pakistani consortium does exist, they are probably our best hope as they are most likely to be in this category and stuff the dumbnuts who wrote emotional twaddle about Pakistanis buying Rovers.

I wonder why you assume that the Pakistani consortium would "most likely to be in this category" ......

That could be construed as a racist comment .

It would be enlightening to hear from such a learned person as yourself as to just how a Pakistani consortium would be our best hope when a massive percentage of the supporters would refuse to attend the matches .

Try and be objective and serious in your analysis , Philip .

[Wiggy]

The only hole I would see is that the club will be worse less if we aren't in the Premiership. I wouldn't think we have enough assets to strip and make it worth the purchase price.

Really. If the purchase price is £ 45 million, of course there is commitment to wages, but IMO the first team squad are worth at least that at today's values. That leaves TV payments of approx £50 million in season 1 then parachute payments in seasons 2 and 3. If planning permission was gained on Brockhall, how much would that be worth? ( that might seem difficult to get, but money talks and HMG are relaxing planning laws.)

[thenodrog]

Did you see Lampard yesterday theno? That was the performance of a world class midfielder.

World class!?! Rubbish. Lampard put a decent shift in. From the bit I saw on MoTD it was a good performance against poor (and vastly over rated imo) opposition that was lit up by one superb pass that led directly to Didier Drogba's goal.

[Eddie]

He played several great balls, was good on the ball throughout the game, covered good ground and was unlucky not to score. What more do you want exactly?

[philipl]

I wonder why you assume that the Pakistani consortium would "most likely to be in this category" ......

That could be construed as a racist comment .

It would be enlightening to hear from such a learned person as yourself as to just how a Pakistani consortium would be our best hope when a massive percentage of the supporters would refuse to attend the matches .

Try and be objective and serious in your analysis , Philip .

The Russians at Chelsea and Pompey and the Thai at Man City don't exactly come into the nice and cuddly category. They do come into the having rather a lot of money gathered by possibly questionable means category as well as the there are people out there who seriously don't like them so getting close to the Brits by owning one of their football teams is a rather good wheeze category.

I am suggesting the consortium from Pakistan probably ticks all the same boxes.

You failed to read what was written without seeing your own reflected preconceptions.

[thenodrog]

The Russians at Chelsea and Pompey and the Thai at Man City don't exactly come into the nice and cuddly category. They do come into the having rather a lot of money gathered by possibly questionable means category as well as the there are people out there who seriously don't like them so getting close to the Brits by owning one of their football teams is a rather good wheeze category.

Have you forgotten 'Alf' at Fulham............ the original role model for the rest. This lot make old Blaster Bates look like a saint.

[RevidgeBlue]

I'm quite sure they'd love to sell Rovers for £45 million and buy 10 new jets for Flybe (if they haven't already sold that in order to grow cash somewhere else).

But it seems they can't. Thank Jack for that.

Of course they can Tris. It's just that no-one has actually come up with any, or enough, money as yet!.

Once we get to that stage I guess we'll see how stringent any supposed criteria are. That's if they exist at all beyond having to sell to a "fit and proper" person which personally I doubt.

[philipl]

If you were correct RB, we would already be three months into ownership by American hedge Funds masquerading as Dan Williams.

I think his highest offer involved £65m if I remember Nicko's posts correctly- £45m going to the Walker Trust and £20m into a transfer kitty.

[BrianPotter]

Fully agree there Phil.

We will never know what the constraints on the sale of the club are, but we do know that they exist as John Williams has indicated on more than one occasion.

As has been said before the Walker Trust would consider the sale of the club if the new owner would put the club in a better position than it is currently and offer a safe platform for the future.

If the Walkers desperately wanted out (which I personally don't beleive they do), and there were no constraints in the deeds of the trust then Rovers would have been sold by now.

We should feel grateful to Jack, not just for what he's done in the past but what he has done to help safeguard the club for the future. I have no doubt that at some point the club (or part of it) will be sold. Until then the Trust are doing a fantastic job: Look how much we've developed over the past 3 years, we currently have some of the lowest ticket prices in the Prem, yet we are competing at the top end of the table - there is only one place the extra finance to enable us to do that has come from and this can be seen in the accounts.

Anyone who can put the club in a better position than it is currently would be welcomed as a new owner. But lets be realistic, its going to have to be somebody pretty special who can meet that simple statement based on the clubs current positiion in terms of football and finance.

[thenodrog]

We will never know what the constraints on the sale of the club are, but we do know that they exist as John Williams has indicated on more than one occasion.

If you want to find out then why not put a bid in?

Just musing but if Jack were still here and a young man I'd wager that he couldn't resist selling to somebody like the Williams consortium whilst we are at the very top of our value ..... in order to buy it all back for a song when the whole job goes titsup. I'm sure that we'd have gone for the 67m if Williams hadn't done a u-turn and moved his bid down.

I wonder.... nah bolllox I'm sure that thats already occurred to Fred! He may be reported as not liking football but I'm damned sure that he likes making a business killing.

[philipl]

You are imagining odd scenarios across time zones. The risk and pain of Rovers going "tits up" and ever being capable of righting again at whatever cost it might take is totally at odds with Jack's passion for the Rovers.

Whether DW bid £45m, £65m or 2p, I suspect he did not meet the basic criteria stipulated by Jack's legacy.

[modes98]

Nicko, reports coming from the coventry media are a £30m deal is close for investment? You heard anything about this or is administration still looming?

[nicko]

Nicko, reports coming from the coventry media are a £30m deal is close for investment? You heard anything about this or is administration still looming?

I think it would take a lot more than £30 million to get them out of the mess they are in. For their sake I hope it's right. But I have my doubts as it has been available for so long. The debts are so huge that it is a virtually impossible situation.

[den]

I think it would take a lot more than £30 million to get them out of the mess they are in. For their sake I hope it's right. But I have my doubts as it has been available for so long. The debts are so huge that it is a virtually impossible situation.

What exactly is the financial situation at Coventry, Nicko?

[Hughesy]

If ever there is a time to get the relevant investment at Rovers then surely this is it!! 5th in the league, 3rd if we win our game in hand, Roschilds or whatever they are called should have a queue of potential buyers! What is going on! 3rd if we win our game in hand, done all by hard work and graft and by a little bit of cash! If we could get an extra £25 million to spend in January then that could be us fighting for top 4 for the next few years and maybe bringing the champions league back live to Ewood.

No news Nicko?

[RevidgeBlue]

If you were correct RB, we would already be three months into ownership by American hedge Funds masquerading as Dan Williams.

I think his highest offer involved £65m if I remember Nicko's posts correctly- £45m going to the Walker Trust and £20m into a transfer kitty.

I suppose it depends on whether or not the Dan Williams group ever came up with an acceptable offer. As I recalll nicko's version, he said that the asking price was established, then DW allegedly thought he was paying too much and wanted to pay a lesser amount, and latterly DW appeared to be struggling to get the support of his backers at all.

[philipl]

Quoting Brian Potter:

"Anyone who can put the club in a better position than it is currently would be welcomed as a new owner."

I guess DW fell at the first hurdle so the sale price numbers Nicko referred to were at best hypothetical. The Trust could not legally dispose of the club- as previously explained, my calculated guess is that any new owner has got to be capable of an irrevocable commitment to put £100m+ into the club (most of it long term money) before the putting the club in a better position hurdle is jumped.

The price for the transfer of shares becomes a chat bewteen friends after that is verified by Rothschilds.

[ABBEY]

message board gold awaits 236 pages of gossip..hahahaah must on course for a world record

[nicko]

I suppose it depends on whether or not the Dan Williams group ever came up with an acceptable offer. As I recalll nicko's version, he said that the asking price was established, then DW allegedly thought he was paying too much and wanted to pay a lesser amount, and latterly DW appeared to be struggling to get the support of his backers at all.

Just to go back to where this all started...and maybe put straight some things about the club's attitude - and probably that of the trustees - about a sale.

I only got wind of the story because senior officials thought they had a sale following what turned out to be around three months of talks with Dan Williams and his team.

So the price they thought they were getting - and the money he had behind him - were ok at that time. That is not my view, it was theirs. You will recall that after I broke the story Rovers were happy to confirm it at the figures mentioned to other newspapers.

Make no mistake, the club would like to sell. The trustees would like to do a deal.

Since then Williams has shied away and tried to get the share price down and, as far as I can gather, the rest of his consortium do not share his enthusiasm for the whole project.

The other group - the agent and his Pakistani allies - are out there but I have no further info on them than that. I was hoping I might get lucky and be contacted by someone close to them or with more knowledge, as yet that is not the case.

All this talk about £100 million kitties being needed is tosh. Williams and his various backers never had that. Rovers and Rothschilds knew that.

The realistic prices at the time were £45 million or so for shares and guaranteed spends of around £25 million.

In my opinion the Williams team have probably blown it because last summer was the time to buy and invest. Their ideas - football-wise - were good. I don't think they were asset strippers, but you would need to check that before you did any deal.

As time goes by I think they have missed the boat.

But the point remains that Williams as an individual has probably got more money to put in than anyone else around. I can't think of any other Rovers fans - since Jack Walker - who have even shown a remote interest in putting money in.

That's the reality for now - and the immediate future.

[Fife Rover]

Just to go back to where this all started...and maybe put straight some things about the club's attitude - and probably that of the trustees - about a sale.

I only got wind of the story because senior officials thought they had a sale following what turned out to be around three months of talks with Dan Williams and his team.

So the price they thought they were getting - and the money he had behind him - were ok at that time. That is not my view, it was theirs. You will recall that after I broke the story Rovers were happy to confirm it at the figures mentioned to other newspapers.

Make no mistake, the club would like to sell. The trustees would like to do a deal.

Since then Williams has shied away and tried to get the share price down and, as far as I can gather, the rest of his consortium do not share his enthusiasm for the whole project.

The other group - the agent and his Pakistani allies - are out there but I have no further info on them than that. I was hoping I might get lucky and be contacted by someone close to them or with more knowledge, as yet that is not the case.

All this talk about £100 million kitties being needed is tosh. Williams and his various backers never had that. Rovers and Rothschilds knew that.

The realistic prices at the time were £45 million or so for shares and guaranteed spends of around £25 million.

In my opinion the Williams team have probably blown it because last summer was the time to buy and invest. Their ideas - football-wise - were good. I don't think they were asset strippers, but you would need to check that before you did any deal.

As time goes by I think they have missed the boat.

But the point remains that Williams as an individual has probably got more money to put in than anyone else around. I can't think of any other Rovers fans - since Jack Walker - who have even shown a remote interest in putting money in.

That's the reality for now - and the immediate future.

GOOD!!! Rovers is a Football CLUB; not a stock exchange plaything or a rich man's toy.

[modes98]

I think it would take a lot more than £30 million to get them out of the mess they are in. For their sake I hope it's right. But I have my doubts as it has been available for so long. The debts are so huge that it is a virtually impossible situation.

It would certainly take more than £30m cash, but the deal that they are interested in includes then purchasing the stadium from it's owners. This would give them the ability to loan money against it.

I hope they don't escape the 10points deduction or my bet looks way off.

[Ricky]

Is it 10 or 15 point deduction for administration???

[stuwilky]

Is it 10 or 15 point deduction for administration???

10

[nicko]

Just read the Coventry article. It says there was a meeting on Friday and they would speak again on Tuesday [tomorrow].

Intriguingly it also said that they could have gone into administration today [Monday] before these mystery bidders came in. That was what I had heard last week.

Sounds bleak to me. If the bid isn't right then they are in real trouble.