[Archived] Nicko's Thread

[Mozzer]

i suppose we do need squad men..

and if we can get them for cheap then i suppose thats good..they only seem youngish so that will be good..

are we still interested in huddlestone by your thinking or has the interest died down???

[RevidgeBlue]

Has it gone anywhere?

All this talk of disappearing money is amusing. The Trust have given us millions since 2001, the transfer window is still slammed shut, we have improved the contracts of some high performing players, no doubt costing millions in increased salaries, we have bought Santa Cruz at a cost of £3.5m (give or take the lose change!)

Remember that the club has been posting losses over the last 3 years (picked for no other reason that I can remember the figure) running to almost £20m, even after the £3m donation from our owners.

Changed your tune stu, I remember you saying pre the summer window that if the summer spending was 10-15m, in the light of the new income, no- one needed to defend that against charges of being over excessive.

You have to bear in mind the fee for RSC is not all payable up front, most likely in installments over the life of his contract.

The new TV money puts an annual 10m p.a. in the coffers. We gave about 1m back in the form of reduced ticket prices (an excellent initiative)

Wage increases notwithstanding, there should be a bit of leeway to manoevure within all of that, I think the Trustees are being less than generous with Hughes to say the least. We only need one window when we get lumbered with another couple of Bruno Berners rather than unearthing a couple of Chris Sambas and we'll be struggling.

I can't think Jack Walker would have wanted to see his manager starved of funding to quite this extent. Particularly not the best one we've had since Dalglish.

[LeftWinger]

Particularly not the best one we've had since Dalglish.

...if not better than Dalglish in fairness.

[Boz]

Some might think twice and very carefully about what they wish for. Unless there is a philanthropist out there who loves the Rovers it is hard to see where we might be in a better financial position than we currently are, given the demographics of East Lancashire. Beware of short term gains that may place at jeopardy the long term security.

[USRoverME]

But that's the thing, the current system isn't long term security in my eyes, and apparently in many others views as well. As the financial landscape in the prem changes, the current setup at Rovers can't and won't be able to compete. The post eariler about finding "a couple Berners when you needed a couple Sambas" is my viewpoint entirely.

Hughes is a great manager and talent finder, but everyone makes mistakes, if we make mistakes, we are out of the top half, and we lose the moeny associated with the igher placement, something like 500K per spot. With the other clubs in the prem, and others in the CCC getting cash boosts, Rovers trying to chug along with a bargain budget will just not keep us in the prem for an extended period of time (say more than 3 years) without a boost, unless we are perfect on transfers, which just can't and won't happen.

It really comes down to what you want for Rovers. Do you want the Trust to stay in charge and enjoy a stable CCC football side, with the occasional chance to promote with shrewd moves (a team without Hughes of course), or do you want to give up a bit of the "homegrown" legacy for a chance to continue to compete with the big boys. I understand both views, but to think that you can have your cake and eat it too in this market.... I just don't see it.

I think Eddie's post was a bit off the mark, but the idea was right... we've probably got 1-2 years at most witht eh current setup, trust, board and hughes. If we don't get more money, Hughes will be off to a club with more ambition and means of achieving it. To get more money, the Trust needs to sell. One way or the other, one of those two entities will be gone sooner rather than later.

[stuwilky]

But that's the thing, the current system isn;t long term security in my eyes, and in many others. As teh financial landscape in the prem changes, the current setup at Rovers can't and won't be able to compete. The post eariler about finding "a couple Berners when you needed a couple Sambas" is my viewpoint entirely.

So, define what you think long term security is? We have received one way or another at least £30m from the trust since Jack died.

[Mozzer]

http://www.sportingo.com/football/arsenal_...attle/1001,6082

not the best site, but it says spurs are interested in david bentley,

[USABlue]

but when everything is said and done we end up simply being a mid-table side.

As opposed to being a championship side, which is clearly without a shadow of a doubt where we would be without him.

[deryck guyler's spoon]

http://www.sportingo.com/football/arsenal_...attle/1001,6082

not the best site, but it says spurs are interested in david bentley,

"Bentley wants a move to a bigger club"

Rules out Spuds then.

[Boz]

I am fully aware that under the current set up someone such as Mark Hughes has ambitions which we might not be able to meet. And if indeed he does move onto bigger or better things I wouldn’t blame him and would thank him for his honest endeavours. However I would be very reluctant to place in jeopardy BRFC by selling off the family silver to some Johnny come lately for a quick shot at a Champions League spot. This would be very short sighted and thankfully not something our first class Chairman/MD, or the trustees for that matter are likely to do also.

As to where all the mystical millions have gone, I suggest you concentrate on where they most definitely have not; trustees, Walker family, Board. This leaves players, management, agents and all the others on the football gravy train. These too will soak up any more monies heading the way of the PL, but if you wish to add to this a new owner who doesn’t actually make an annual inflow of cash but draws a dividend or is looking for a quick sell on, in exchange for a £25 million transfer kitty, then so be it. No doubt all us supporters will still be there and on here, but as it currently stands fighting for a UEFA cup spot and domestic cup success is as good as it’s likely to be. Sorry if this shatters any dreams, but in reality for clubs such as The Rovers they only come along once in a lifetime. Anfield May 1995.

[USRoverME]

So, define what you think long term security is? We have received one way or another at least £30m from the trust since Jack died.

I am defining long term security as in a level of funding that keeps Rovers in the prem. 3-5m a year, will not cut it, in my view.

However, as I tried to say in my post.... some would define long term security as the trust, with the small nest egg keeping the Rovers int he CCC with an occasional shout at promtion, and although I'd personally rather see us in the prem, I understand the allure of the "local club" aspect of the current setup.

But do people really think, looking 5 years into the future, that the current situaiton of the club will sustain our existence in the prem? financially I jsut can't see us being able to do it.

[USRoverME]

Changing topics.... going back to the Anelka talk, and I just had a random thought... no idea if it would work, but here goes.

imho, it would almost be a mistake to keep Benni, RSC and Anelka, if we got him, becuase there's not way to keep all three happy, and 2 of those are quick to sulk from past reports... and we mostly agree on needing an attacking midfielder..... so here goes the insane suggestion....

Could Benni be the attacking midfielder? Recently he's been frustrating me by playing too deep off RSC, but he's been quite prolific with his little touches to create a small bit of space for himself in the attacking areas. What if you played Benni as an attacking midfielder behind RSC and Anelka (again if we get him/afford him without selling Benni). Surprising its not an unheard of move for a striker like Benni to drift backt he frmation as they get older... After all, Dwight Yorke took T&T to the world cup in that attacking midfield/free role. There they drew sweeden, played England very tough for 80 mins, and gave Paraguay a run as well before tiring out.

Certinaly this would give him a bit more room to control the ball and any small move he makes could let him run into shooting positions. However, he'd ahve to up his workrate a bit in the midfield, and we'd need a savage type behind him to mop up the defensive duties more often, but could that work?

[LeChuck]

...if not better than Dalglish in fairness.

Nonsense!

There seems to be a slight myth developing around Hughes' ability. For me, he's shown massive potential as a manager, but has delivered nothing to be compared to Dalglish yet.

So far under Hughes, we've finished sixth (same as Souness), made a few semi-final appearances (bettered by Souness), finished tenth last year and shown no signs of improving on that this time round. He has brought in some fantastic players in relation to what they cost, but that is a bit meaningless unless it translates into success on the pitch.

I suppose it does go without saying that he's operating on a much lower budget than the majority of our competitors though, a quick look at the table suggests we're the highest place team working on a tight budget, 9 points ahead of Reading in 12th place. Having said that, we did finish behind Reading and Bolton last season, who are no better off financially than ourselves, so it's not uncommon for teams with lower budgets to get into the higher places in the league.

[stuwilky]

But do people really think, looking 5 years into the future, that the current situaiton of the club will sustain our existence in the prem? financially I jsut can't see us being able to do it.

I remember the exact same conversations in 2001/2002....

Look where we are now.

The reality is that no one knows what is going to happen in football over the next few years.

[Mozzer]

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_2960915,00.html

we should put a bid in for him..

can play either wing and has pace-what we need if you ask me...

[Eddie]

As opposed to being a championship side, which is clearly without a shadow of a doubt where we would be without him.

What do you base that on?

[blue phil]

I remember the exact same conversations in 2001/2002....

Look where we are now.

The reality is that no one knows what is going to happen in football over the next few years.

That's true . The reality of the situation for a small town club like Rovers is that the choice of manager (when Hughes goes) is more vital than at bigger clubs . One balls up and even the trust fund millions won't help us at prem level .

But anyone who believes that someone's going to come along and provide more funding than the trust fund is presently donating is living in cloud cuckoo land . I'll believe in Father Christmas before I believe in Dan Williams .....

[John]

Nicko, have you heard anything on this:

Blackburn are weighing up a move for Sporting Lisbon midfielder Pontus Farnerud who would cost around £800,000

[joey_big_nose]

There have been plenty looking to buy - but nobody who has done the business.

The figures mentioned above are pretty accurate in terms of the level of debt, the amount of trust funding and the running costs of a club.

The bottom line is that the club has to run a tight ship because of its size - which is inescapable - and buy sensibly.

Even if there was a takeover I don't think it would mean masses of cash coming in.

So any time you want to buy big, you probably have to let one leave.

The idea that there is a magic pot of gold out there - either from TV money of trustess - is just wrong.

The TV cash gets swallowed up with increased wages and the trustee input seems steady and helpful, but not evenough to buy superstars.

If I was buying the club - I wish - the best plan would be to start 'growing your own' again and bring better players through the ranks. Remember the the Damien Duff sale probably paid for a lot of incomings since.

If you look at the team and the cost of them it's a miracle you are in the top half. The trouble is you have to keep performing them.

I cant buy that. we have spent very little the past two seasons, much less than other similar sized clubs who lack big investors (Wigan, Fulham ( I don't think Fayed has put much money in), Reading, Middlesborough). There absolutely must be at least 4m kicking around from the TV money, I would anticipate more. Hughes is out in the press saying we won't be buying in order to secure a good bargaining position. Nothing more nothing less. What is the benefit in him saying he will buy players? Only two I can think of- a) give underperformers a kick up the backside appease the supporters. WHat are the negatives? a) unsettle the squad push up the price of targets c) inflate the hopes of the fans d) draw media attention to the club.

Hughes is a pretty logical guy and I am sure he will have few problems 'spinning' things to get results in the transfer market. Im not saying we have tons of money but there must, absolutely must, be some there for spending.

[ABBEY]

DEAR FATHER CRIMBO ...TAKE ME IN TIME TO THE EIGHTIES AND LET ME INVENT THIS MESSAGE BOARD AS I WOULD LOVE TO READ WHAT PEOPLE WOULD OF WRITTEN WHEN BILL FOX WAS SQUEEZING THE SAME TEABAG OUT AND WHAT THREADS THERE WOULD BE FOR 5 THOUSAND GATES AND WHAT PEOPLE WOULD WRITE IN THE predict the next 25 years thread.

[nicko]

Nicko, have you heard anything on this:

Blackburn are weighing up a move for Sporting Lisbon midfielder Pontus Farnerud who would cost around £800,000

I've been checking on that all day and getting a lot of blank looks...he has only played nine games in one and a half years in Portugal. Sounds odd. Who was the last good Swede to come to the Premier?

Anyway...watching the Claret and Blue Brazilians tonight, so best sign off.

[ABBEY]

id have said f off

[b12_simon]

What do you base that on?

Oh come on! Are you seriously suggesting we'd be lording it over PNE and the Dingles like we are without Jack?

Your appetite for contradicting everything and making a complete tit of yourself is truly amazing!

[broadsword]

great improvement, but when everything is said and done we end up simply being a mid-table side.

How we can great improvement and you're not happy?

Dontmakanosensa

[ABBEY]

Oh come on! Are you seriously suggesting we'd be lording it over PNE and the Dingles like we are without Jack?

Your appetite for contradicting everything and making a complete tit of yourself is truly amazing!

exactly..see my earlier post,we would have been bust if it wernt for unkle jack...as for winning the league ..well