[Archived] Nicko's Thread Part 3

[rover6]

Somewhat concerned about the or else. The thing I find befuddling, well at least from the view across the pond here, is that the press don't seem to be taking Hughes as a serious contender. You Nicko are convinced it is between him and big Phil however the media over there seem to be touting anyone but Hughes, at least that is how it seems from the limited news we get on the situation.

Why do you think this is nicko, can they just not get their heads around the fact that lil ol Blackburn have a top notch young manager or what?

The other thing that is concerning me is I have seen nothing out of Ewood on the speculation, from either Sparky or Williams, when the Geordie job was being bandied around there was at least comments coming out of Ewood Park, now there seems to be an eery silence, what is your take on that. or have I just missed any comments

The eerie silence is most probably down to the fact that the season is over. There aren't any scheduled media access moments for the nosy parkers to get asking the big questions (unlike when Hughes was linked to Newcastle). JW and MH don't want to say anything because they've got nothing to say - confirmatory or in denial.

As for the media not taking Hughes seriously - I agree and I can only think that his profile isn't glamorous enough to fill pages with, so they'll avoid it until they have to. Why go on about some geezer who finished mid-table when you can bleat on about BIG Phil.

[nicko]

Somewhat concerned about the or else. The thing I find befuddling, well at least from the view across the pond here, is that the press don't seem to be taking Hughes as a serious contender. You Nicko are convinced it is between him and big Phil however the media over there seem to be touting anyone but Hughes, at least that is how it seems from the limited news we get on the situation.

Why do you think this is nicko, can they just not get their heads around the fact that lil ol Blackburn have a top notch young manager or what?

The other thing that is concerning me is I have seen nothing out of Ewood on the speculation, from either Sparky or Williams, when the Geordie job was being bandied around there was at least comments coming out of Ewood Park, now there seems to be an eery silence, what is your take on that. or have I just missed any comments

You get nothing from Chelsea...so most of the stories for the past week have been from candidates who drop hints to their mates abroad and start a story.

Mancini leaving Inter, so he MUST be in the running. Ancelotti fluffs it in Serie A and could go, so he MUST be interested.

To be fair two Sundays had the story first and led on it. The Telegraph caught up a day later. The Mirror caught up on Tuesday and several others have given it a mention but it has been overtaken in the press by a daily flow of misinformation.

Rovers are right to say nothing. What can they say? 'We're kacking ourselves'...they just have to sit and wait. Like the rest of us.

[nicko]

theno is your source...don't deny it...

I hate being 'outed.'

[Big Archie]

Any truth in the Emre to Fenerbahce talk? The Turks have claimed its a done deal, BBC reporting a fee of 8 million, surely not that much?

[EwoodGlory]

It's done.

[Tom 1]

Incidentally, it is not inconceivable that Gerard might have to move to Villa to join Barry playing CL football seeing as Stevie G is so worried about the two of them not mssing the chance of playing together at that level. Lerner slipping into the Villa CEO slot can only mean one thing- he is very serious about winning and Lerner's free cash is large enough for him to plug all the gaps in MoN's side and a lot more besides. Rafa contacting MoN and offering to buy Barry with used empties probably has added a bit of "personal" to Randy's desire of getting to the CL.

That interview borders on tapping up, am in no doubt it was the spanish waiter who made him say all that. Our fans have been going mad on our boards, telling our director to report Liverpool. Everyone knows his been tapped up and approached over our heads, we're just lucky he has more loyalty than to go behind our backs like many players would. I said it before but when Liverpool want someone they are as bad as Real Madrid, remember Heinze last year!

Our fans were saying put a bid in for Gerrard if his so desperate to play with Barry

[ace]

Our fans were saying put a bid in for Gerrard if his so desperate to play with Barry

..and put in a bid for Torres while you are in the mood!

[Tom 1]

We're obviously not seriously suggesting he'd join....

Torres could fit nicely next to Carew and Gabby

[philipl]

Tom, there is currently a huge mismatch between football power and monetary power.

Liverpool have the football kudos to come kicking sand in Villa's face and have done so with the Barry tap-up.

On the other hand, Villa have the financial muscle. Lerner could probably put cash down for Gerard and Torres in such a way that the Royal Bank of Scotland (who have advanced most of Liverpool's £350m debt) would tell Liverpool FC to reduce their next borrowing roll-over requirement and accept the offer on the table. That borrowing is so big in relation to Liverpool's business that there must be extremely onerous reporting and consultation requirements imposed by the RBoS on LFC.

I'm not saying Lerner would be willing to do that. However, he has enough "down the back of the sofa" money to be ABLE to make a winning offer if he wanted to and Liverpool COULD be manoevred into being forced to sell both Gerard and Torres before the current Hick/Gillett/Parry/Benitez impasse is resolved and the ownership of LFC changes to something that works. Possibly Lerner is holding back because he knows Abramovich would gazump him.

[brian_gallagher85]

For the Rangers element...

The Kenny Miller move is on, price agreed, the 'homecoming' is on for next week.

Let the Holy War begin.

Bah, who needs him when we have Scott Mc Donald?

Derby are screwed though

[thenodrog]

Tom, there is currently a huge mismatch between football power and monetary power.

Liverpool have the football kudos to come kicking sand in Villa's face and have done so with the Barry tap-up.

On the other hand, Villa have the financial muscle. Lerner could probably put cash down for Gerard and Torres in such a way that the Royal Bank of Scotland (who have advanced most of Liverpool's £350m debt) would tell Liverpool FC to reduce their next borrowing roll-over requirement and accept the offer on the table. That borrowing is so big in relation to Liverpool's business that there must be extremely onerous reporting and consultation requirements imposed by the RBoS on LFC.

I'm not saying Lerner would be willing to do that. However, he has enough "down the back of the sofa" money to be ABLE to make a winning offer if he wanted to and Liverpool COULD be manoevred into being forced to sell both Gerard and Torres before the current Hick/Gillett/Parry/Benitez impasse is resolved and the ownership of LFC changes to something that works. Possibly Lerner is holding back because he knows Abramovich would gazump him.

With investment and improvements to Villa and Spurs into their second year and with Everton having a few bob extra I'd not be all that suprised to see Liverpool finish out of the top four next season. And for them that could have very serious consequences. DIC could get em for next to nowt...... if they still want them that is.

[modes98]

That interview borders on tapping up, am in no doubt it was the spanish waiter who made him say all that. Our fans have been going mad on our boards, telling our director to report Liverpool. Everyone knows his been tapped up and approached over our heads, we're just lucky he has more loyalty than to go behind our backs like many players would. I said it before but when Liverpool want someone they are as bad as Real Madrid, remember Heinze last year!

Our fans were saying put a bid in for Gerrard if his so desperate to play with Barry

Most clubs 'tap up targets' fact of life i am afraid. Be it out in public or through private means. The fact that some are less subtle is by the by really, players always know through word of mouth that they are wanted and when to kick up a fuss.

[philipl]

With investment and improvements to Villa and Spurs into their second year and with Everton having a few bob extra I'd not be all that suprised to see Liverpool finish out of the top four next season. And for them that could have very serious consequences. DIC could get em for next to nowt...... if they still want them that is.

I think that is DIC's game now to be honest.

When DIC bought Cunaard, all hell was let loose by American politicians over the "arabs controlling America's ports" and DIC were forced to divest Cunaard's ownership of six east coast port authorities because of the fear they would manipulate the ownership politically somehow.

Wind forward 18 months to the US bank crisis last Fall and many US banks sold three or four percentage of themselves to DIC to re-build the capital in their balance sheets. Then in April, surprise surprise, Tom Hicks cancelled a $500m property investment citing the toughest lending environment in history. Coincidence or could it be DIC turning the tables and in effect saying "you assumed we would be politically motivated when we weren't intending to be so the pay-off is we're squeezing a few Texan testicles when it comes to Tom Hicks standing in our way"?

That might be over-fanciful but I guess Lerner taking the CEO seat at Villa Park was a very clear message to his debt-burdened fellow- American sports owners in Houston and Toronto. One that's not filtered down to Rafa and Gerard which is possibly another indication of how disfunctional everything has become at Anfield.

[Tom 1]

Being genuinly honest, if I were a Villa player I wouldn't join them this season. I'd give it one more year to see if the club continues to progress past 6th place. That's what most of us are asking from him, some more time, I know how long his been here but to stick through the rough and leave in the smooth makes no sense. Our club set up is a lot more favourable than theirs right now...they have the on the pitch players and off the pitch rep and the champions league I admit. It's nothing he can't achieve here with some luck.

It's up to us though, we need to show ambition in the market and he will stay.

[Exiled_Rover]

Being genuinly honest, if I were a Villa player I wouldn't join them this season. I'd give it one more year to see if the club continues to progress past 6th place. That's what most of us are asking from him, some more time, I know how long his been here but to stick through the rough and leave in the smooth makes no sense. Our club set up is a lot more favourable than theirs right now...they have the on the pitch players and off the pitch rep and the champions league I admit. It's nothing he can't achieve here with some luck.

It's up to us though, we need to show ambition in the market and he will stay.

If I were Barry I'm not sure I could pass up the opportunity to play with Torres and Gerrard.

[Tom 1]

Assuming he doesn't turn into a different player, this summer won't be the only chance he'll have to move to a top club. He won't stop performing. He is a class act. I said it for years but it took all this time and a move to a new position for everyone else to agree.

[leftfooter]

I think that is DIC's game now to be honest.

When DIC bought Cunaard, all hell was let loose by American politicians over the "arabs controlling America's ports" and DIC were forced to divest Cunaard's ownership of six east coast port authorities because of the fear they would manipulate the ownership politically somehow.

Wind forward 18 months to the US bank crisis last Fall and many US banks sold three or four percentage of themselves to DIC to re-build the capital in their balance sheets. Then in April, surprise surprise, Tom Hicks cancelled a $500m property investment citing the toughest lending environment in history. Coincidence or could it be DIC turning the tables and in effect saying "you assumed we would be politically motivated when we weren't intending to be so the pay-off is we're squeezing a few Texan testicles when it comes to Tom Hicks standing in our way"?

That might be over-fanciful but I guess Lerner taking the CEO seat at Villa Park was a very clear message to his debt-burdened fellow- American sports owners in Houston and Toronto. One that's not filtered down to Rafa and Gerard which is possibly another indication of how disfunctional everything has become at Anfield.

If Liverpool were to sell out to DIC, that for many with a slightly broader perspective, would be the end of Camelot and the legend of the 'Anfield Boot Room'.

DIC/Dubai is built on the exploitation of cheap Asian labour. Dissent or talk of workers' rights, or any rights whatsoever actually is met with instant expulsion. Justice (ha ha), or what masquerades as such, is dispensed with a medieval brutality.

Property laws are explicitly so racist, (no non-UAE national can own land outside the designated free zones) that if such policies were practiced in a non Arab/sub-Saharan country, such as the U.S.A or Israel for example, there would be mass boycotts and sanctions. Indeed the 'liberal' press is still holding the U.S. to account for the slave trade it (shamefully) practiced over a century ago.

Foreigners may not own land in Dubai and any foreign company wishing to do business there must acquire a Dubai sponsor; 'baksheesh' in other words.

As for democracy, well it is Arabia after all. There isn't any.

I can just imagine an eminent trustee at the BBC discussing the situation of the imminent takeover of a national institution like Liverpool with a Foreign Office official in Whitehall. I imagine the conversation would be played out along the lines of: 'this democracy business is alright for the likes of us, but...it's not suitable for them, what?'

Compare the liberal hand wringing outrage at the acquisition of Madasafish City by Ole Blue Eyes Shinawatra, who despite the allegations of 'human rights' abuses leveled against him, was deposed as an elected leader in a military coup.

One would imagine Liverpool would be in for rough ride therefore from the same sources.

Probably not.; in fact the silence is deafening.

The media is still dazzled by the Liverpool mythmaking factory (ask Boris Johnson who had to go there cap in hand for questioning the hysteria surrounding the death of a contract worker in Iraq, who'd bailed out of his home city decades ago) and the British Establishment has always been in thrall to the Arabs and their oil money.

So when you see the hordes of ersatz Scousers in the Kop, holding their anti-American banners aloft whilst bellowing for 'their club' to become an offshoot of DIC Investment, spare a though for the poor old Bangladeshi construction worker slung out of the 'Mushroom City' on his ear for a perceived indiscretion of Sharia Law or the Filipina domestic servant, arbitrarily jailed, flayed and expelled for the crime of complaining about the rapes she was suffering at the hand of her Arab Master.

In the end, money talks and bullshirt walks, as they say. I've no doubt the deal will go through eventually. With oil approaching $150 a barrel, and the U.S. dollar on the slide, there is enough liquidity for the DIC juggernaut to roll over the Texan Two.

I for one will have little sympathy however, once the first rumblings of complaint creep out of Anfield about the beaviour of the Maktoum dictatorship.

[doctorryan]

I think that is DIC's game now to be honest.

When DIC bought Cunaard, all hell was let loose by American politicians over the "arabs controlling America's ports" and DIC were forced to divest Cunaard's ownership of six east coast port authorities because of the fear they would manipulate the ownership politically somehow.

Wind forward 18 months to the US bank crisis last Fall and many US banks sold three or four percentage of themselves to DIC to re-build the capital in their balance sheets. Then in April, surprise surprise, Tom Hicks cancelled a $500m property investment citing the toughest lending environment in history. Coincidence or could it be DIC turning the tables and in effect saying "you assumed we would be politically motivated when we weren't intending to be so the pay-off is we're squeezing a few Texan testicles when it comes to Tom Hicks standing in our way"?

That might be over-fanciful but I guess Lerner taking the CEO seat at Villa Park was a very clear message to his debt-burdened fellow- American sports owners in Houston and Toronto. One that's not filtered down to Rafa and Gerard which is possibly another indication of how disfunctional everything has become at Anfield.

Houston and Montreal, but, whatever. By the way Phil, I find most of what you write interesting, informative and entertaining (which is the point of all this in the first place). Where I think you draw heat on yourself from some here (especially Rock of the Bluegrass (shillito15), who seems to have some issues) is when you start with the conjecturing. I'm not saying that any of the above is wrong, but you do admit that what you suggest could just as easily be the beginnings of a great geo-political-financial-athletics Hollywood movie script. Hey, you might have something there!

[ftry]

The shortlist gets shorter.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/t...sea/7429419.stm

"AC Milan have rejected an approach from Chelsea for permission to talk to coach Carlo Ancelotti about the vacant manager's position at Stamford Bridge."

[RibbleValleyRover]

Great...

[brfcshabba]

"He and another Italian coach were at the top of Chelsea's list."

Interesting - I didn't know Hughes was Italian

[modes98]

The shortlist gets shorter.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/t...sea/7429419.stm

"AC Milan have rejected an approach from Chelsea for permission to talk to coach Carlo Ancelotti about the vacant manager's position at Stamford Bridge."

Isn't that irrelevant? Chelsea can just pay to buy out his contract/he quits.

Still confident on your list nicko? or do you think this approach was made before roman had his shortlist?

[nicko]

The Galliani quotes I saw said 'there were no offers.' I think that is correct.

[ffan]

David Beckham captaining England

[philipl]

I suddenly feel a bit better about a possible early resolution that doesn't involve Rovers losing Sparky.... just a bit.

There were no denials that Abramovich asked Ancelotti's advice about a week ago and its not that long (about two weeks ago) that Ancelotti was more likely than Mancini to get the chop.

As for Galliani quotes, believe anything he says at your peril. Talk about an operator!

I've seen it suggested that Ancelotti's star would be very much in the ascendant if he were able to bring Kaka with him- hence perhaps this line: "Ancelotti is very happy at Milan. Milan don't sell their players, let alone the coach," Galliani told Italian newspaper Corriere dello Sport.

You could intepret that as "we were going to sack Ancelotti but unlike that dumbut Moratti, we are going to bull up the ante on our boss and take Abramovich's compensation but all bets are off if he thinks Kaka is part of the deal."

PS Of course Milan have sold their players.

PPS Thanks American- and yes I add a bit of local colour for the fun of it just to see who bites on what. Hopefully I do signal where I go into conjecture clearly enough (and thanks for the Montreal correction).

PPPS Cannot reach my pal who is close to Milan football scene whilst the Juve boys are just laughing and telling me to get the Euros on their Scudetto and a CL semi-final next season.