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3 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Mowbray disappointed with attendances. Not true what he says about grounds like Pride Park being full when we go there - well over 10,000 empty seats at Derby, for example. 

But there is obviously a feeling within the players and staff that they deserve more backing - they do. Though perhaps knock on your Chief Exec’s door to ask why we can’t sell more than 9,600 season tickets...

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/16908899.tony-mowbray-feels-a-warmth-from-fans-to-rovers-players/?ref=mac

I can completely understand why Mowbray says the things he does and have to agree tbh with some of them. Like I said at the Oxford game that majority of the fans who just turn up that day wouldn't be back and had no intentions of doing so. 

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Totally echo others in that Mowbray needs to turn to Waggott as his first man to question, his greed/decision making has ensured that we have failed to boost crowds at a point where we have momentum behind us, both via season ticket increases and also the surcharges on matchday, as well as closing the Darwen End and moving kick offs unnecessarily, the latter 2 are minor in the scheme of things but ae further examples of a lack of consideration towards home support.

the Subcharge on the day sales is there to cover the cost of having staff there on Saturday afternoon instead of people looking to buy days before or before the game. 

closing the Darwen end should have happen ages ago and I never understood why fans wanted to sit there tbh. But everyone is entitled to do what they want. We had this debate before and I don't want it again. 

I always believe that if fans want to be there they will be without any doubt. people always find a way to attend  the games

 

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The surcharge is complete nonsense and not something we ever had before last season.

Again Chaddy, you don’t seem to realise that there are Rovers fanatics like me and you, but there are also those that ‘pick their games’.

So Joe Bloggs make a late decision to come to the Leeds game. Jack Walker stand - the surcharge will make his ticket £32 in the wings or £34 in the centre! In the second division!!!

Red button it is for Joe. Just like it’s Sky for you for the Bolton game.

Edited by Mattyblue
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Spot on about the noon kick offs boys plus all the other factors MC has mentioned especially just deciding to close stands and expecting people to lump it even if it isn't many. I bet we've lost a couple of hundred regulars through doing that, can we afford to do that ???

The Leeds and PNE games should be belters but they've ruined those and reduced them to just run of the mill.

Some fans do need to step up to the plate more often but the club really really needs to look at itself first. Promotion was righting the wrong of relegation but now it's as you were and to kick on needs radical thinking on and off the park.  Signing Dack got people interested and excited, spending 7 mill on a mostly untried 19 yr old from Forest just got the heads scratching again. Spending that on a ready made player or two would certainly have got a few more back in the habit following last season.

They need to consider that as well !

Edited by tomphil
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Just now, chaddyrovers said:

 

the Subcharge on the day sales is there to cover the cost of having staff there on Saturday afternoon instead of people looking to buy days before or before the game. 

closing the Darwen end should have happen ages ago and I never understood why fans wanted to sit there tbh. But everyone is entitled to do what they want. We had this debate before and I don't want it again. 

I always believe that if fans want to be there they will be without any doubt. people always find a way to attend  the games

 

The cost of staff can come out of the ticket price, why does there need to be a surcharge? Do you pay more for merchandise from the shop on matchday because they've more staff behind the counter? Do I expect to pay more for a pint in the pub because its busier and they need extra bar staff on?

Its all just an excuse. They don't want large numbers turning up unexpectedly at the last minute. It's too messy, too much hard work. They want everyone on the database, ticket issued and details registered well in advance. They want to know who is coming, where they are sitting. That's lovely but there are a lot of people who aren't prepared to commit to that days in advance and just want to decide on Saturday morning.

Wigan offer cash turnstiles on 2 stands. Any sensible reason we can't do similar?

The Darwen End was attractive to some people, I think, because it was different to the rest of the ground - it was originally promoted as being significantly different - it was significantly cheaper than other areas, had unreserved seating, standing was permitted and was promoted as a singing/dancing area. Once that shut it wasn't as simple as moving it to another area, as prices would go up in line with that and the people who went in there would have to mix with people who want their own seat and want to sit down. The only way it was going to work properly was if the club cordoned off a block of the BBE and did what Palace do with their Holmesdale End and encourage a block or blocks to stand and sing. That hasn't been done.

You're right that existing fans who are used to going will usually find a way to attend, but it isn't those people we should be looking at. It is the drifters, odd gamers, part timers etc. who we should be trying to get in as easily as possible and once in trying to entice them to come back for more.

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7 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

The surcharge is complete nonsense and not something we ever had before last season.

Again Chaddy, you don’t seem to realise that there are Rovers fanatics like me and you, but there are also those that ‘pick their games’.

So Joe Bloggs make a late decision to come to the Leeds game. Jack Walker stand - the surcharge will make his ticket £32 in the wings or £34 in the centre! In the second division!!!

Red button it is for Joe. Just like it’s Sky for you for the Bolton game.

I think most/some clubs have these Subcharge these days on the day sales. 

what about have special offers for games during a month. so if we had 3 home games in month then you can attend all 3 for a special price of 45 pounds. Or if a adult buy a ticket for one game then a child under 12's goes for 1 pound to game or a season tickets for just weekend home games for people who cant attend midweek games due to work or family commitments. 

what do you think Matty? 

I don't mind early kick offs games cos it allows me and the family to do things after. 

I wanted to the Bolton game with mates but the cost and lack of trains means its a no for me. so it was nice meal and beers at home with missus and mate and his missus

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Exactly, so you’ve been put off going with cost and all round inconvenience. Just like a potential match goer to Ewood often finds.

I’m up for any kind of offer, but they don’t really seem to add much to the crowd - it was tried a few times last season. A better idea would to make a high profile game that your floating fan is interested in, like Leeds, Villa or Preston cheaper. But they won’t.

Edited by Mattyblue
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This smacks of Waggot using TM to take out his frustrations on the fans for his failures.

Why can't we get 27,500 per week?..are these people for real? 

Are they still aware of the depth of feeling towards our owners? are they again aware of the financial demographic of the area? are they aware that ALL local Clubs similar to Rovers are relatively struggling with attendances?

The comments from Mowbray are disappointing and badly informed.

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One suggestion would be that 1875 members get a significant reduction in the price of a ticket. Not just exemption from the surcharge or whatever it is they get.

I'm not sure what benefits there are at present to membership. I am very unhappy that I've effectively been forced into getting membership and paying an extra £10 on top of my season ticket increase just to enable me to be first in the queue for away tickets. My purchasing history should ensure I get priority, not signing up to some daft 'club' which has very few worthwhile benefits.

I'm not interested in going to the training ground or winning a copy of FIFA. Club Cash is no use when stock has run out in the shop by mid-September and tracksuit bottoms are costing £50.

That's another way of getting around the away fan issue - offer high ticket prices but with a significant reduction if an 1875 member. That way we can continue to milk the away followings but also provide a way for home fans to get on for a reasonable price.

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Just now, JHRover said:

One suggestion would be that 1875 members get a significant reduction in the price of a ticket. Not just exemption from the surcharge or whatever it is they get.

I'm not sure what benefits there are at present to membership. I am very unhappy that I've effectively been forced into getting membership and paying an extra £10 on top of my season ticket increase just to enable me to be first in the queue for away tickets. My purchasing history should ensure I get priority, not signing up to some daft 'club' which has very few worthwhile benefits.

I'm not interested in going to the training ground or winning a copy of FIFA. Club Cash is no use when stock has run out in the shop by mid-September and tracksuit bottoms are costing £50.

That's another way of getting around the away fan issue - offer high ticket prices but with a significant reduction if an 1875 member. That way we can continue to milk the away followings but also provide a way for home fans to get on for a reasonable price.

Last season I joined along with the people I go to games with. None of us have joined this season because of the sheer greed of the club looking to make a fiver out of us. It's not the money but the principal. I'd like to see the take up this season compared to last.

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19 minutes ago, JHRover said:

The cost of staff can come out of the ticket price, why does there need to be a surcharge? Do you pay more for merchandise from the shop on matchday because they've more staff behind the counter? Do I expect to pay more for a pint in the pub because its busier and they need extra bar staff on?

Its all just an excuse. They don't want large numbers turning up unexpectedly at the last minute. It's too messy, too much hard work. They want everyone on the database, ticket issued and details registered well in advance. They want to know who is coming, where they are sitting. That's lovely but there are a lot of people who aren't prepared to commit to that days in advance and just want to decide on Saturday morning.

Wigan offer cash turnstiles on 2 stands. Any sensible reason we can't do similar?

The Darwen End was attractive to some people, I think, because it was different to the rest of the ground - it was originally promoted as being significantly different - it was significantly cheaper than other areas, had unreserved seating, standing was permitted and was promoted as a singing/dancing area. Once that shut it wasn't as simple as moving it to another area, as prices would go up in line with that and the people who went in there would have to mix with people who want their own seat and want to sit down. The only way it was going to work properly was if the club cordoned off a block of the BBE and did what Palace do with their Holmesdale End and encourage a block or blocks to stand and sing. That hasn't been done.

You're right that existing fans who are used to going will usually find a way to attend, but it isn't those people we should be looking at. It is the drifters, odd gamers, part timers etc. who we should be trying to get in as easily as possible and once in trying to entice them to come back for more.

extra staff will be on match days who might only work part time or just match days. When I go in on non match days to the club shop its around 3 or 4 staffs tops but match days its about 7 or 8 staff. 

I wonder how many people decide on a match day make a decision to attend the game? 

most of those groups you mention don't want to attend or cant for number of reasons. 

5 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Exactly, so you’ve been put off going with cost and all round inconvenience. Just like a potential match goer to Ewood often finds.

I’m up for any kind of offer, but they don’t really seem to add much to the crowd - it was tried a few times last season. A better idea would to make a high profile game that your floating fan is interested in, like Leeds, Villa or Preston cheaper. But they won’t.

if the game wasn't on Sky Sports then I would either gone to the game with mates or took my missus and step daughter and drive to the game. I thoughtly enjoyed going to Stoke and watching the game and talking to different Rovers fans. great day out

1 minute ago, JHRover said:

One suggestion would be that 1875 members get a significant reduction in the price of a ticket. Not just exemption from the surcharge or whatever it is they get.

I'm not sure what benefits there are at present to membership. I am very unhappy that I've effectively been forced into getting membership and paying an extra £10 on top of my season ticket increase just to enable me to be first in the queue for away tickets. My purchasing history should ensure I get priority, not signing up to some daft 'club' which has very few worthwhile benefits.

I'm not interested in going to the training ground or winning a copy of FIFA. Club Cash is no use when stock has run out in the shop by mid-September and tracksuit bottoms are costing £50.

That's another way of getting around the away fan issue - offer high ticket prices but with a significant reduction if an 1875 member. That way we can continue to milk the away followings but also provide a way for home fans to get on for a reasonable price.

I agree with the 1st paragraph. 

I think its a good idea of the membership and the extra benefits plus the discount on items from the club shop from being a season ticket holder. 

I am interested in going to the training ground and watching 1st team training.

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56 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I can completely understand why Mowbray says the things he does and have to agree tbh with some of them. Like I said at the Oxford game that majority of the fans who just turn up that day wouldn't be back and had no intentions of doing so. 

the Subcharge on the day sales is there to cover the cost of having staff there on Saturday afternoon instead of people looking to buy days before or before the game. 

closing the Darwen end should have happen ages ago and I never understood why fans wanted to sit there tbh. But everyone is entitled to do what they want. We had this debate before and I don't want it again. 

I always believe that if fans want to be there they will be without any doubt. people always find a way to attend  the games

 

Again I apologise to others for being baited into this discussion.

The issue here and reason for you apologising for the club and Waggott again is a total lack of empathy.

Chaddy doesnt want to be in the Darwen End. Why would anyone else want to sit there?

Chaddy prioritises his money to spend on Rovers, why wouldnt anyone else?

Chaddy goes to every home game without fail, surely other people wouldnt be less consistent in their attendance?

I like early kick offs as they suit me and my family so how could they inconvenience anyone else?

The argument that people will find a way regardless is so flawed its untrue. As others have mentioned, the people we are trying to add to the attendances are not the hardcore like us 2, attending regardless. Waggott has done nothing to encourage an increase in sales, ticket surcharges are nonsense as even if your logic is correct that for some reason staff on a matchday are a more valuable resource, more sales would be made if say like at Wigan we had cash turnstiles.

Mowbray is perhaps right to want bigger crowds. He needs to blame Waggott for why that hasnt happened. 

Edited by roversfan99
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Chaddy picks and chooses his away games. He’s chosen not to go to Bolton because of expensive tickets and other inconveniences - he’ll watch on Sky instead.

Some fans pick and choose their home games. Some will choose not to do Leeds because of expensive tickets and other inconveniences - they’ll watch on Sky red button instead.

Chaddy thinks these fans should find a way to go regardless.

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6 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

extra staff will be on match days who might only work part time or just match days. When I go in on non match days to the club shop its around 3 or 4 staffs tops but match days its about 7 or 8 staff. 

I wonder how many people decide on a match day make a decision to attend the game? 

But there would obviously be more staff on a matchday as there’s around 10,000 people around rather than the usual 4-5 at other times and plus the ticket sales are open for other games anyway so that argument is odd 

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6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Again I apologise to others for being baited into this discussion.

The issue here and reason for you apologising for the club and Waggott again is a total lack of empathy.

Chaddy doesnt want to be in the Darwen End. Why would anyone else want to sit there?

Chaddy prioritises his money to spend on Rovers, why wouldnt anyone else?

Chaddy goes to every home game without fail, surely other people wouldnt be less consistent in their attendance?

I like early kick offs as they suit me and my family so how could they inconvenience anyone else?

The argument that people will find a way regardless is so flawed its untrue. As others have mentioned, the people we are trying to add to the attendances are not the hardcore like us 2, attending regardless. Waggott has done nothing to encourage an increase in sales, ticket surcharges are nonsense as even if your logic is correct that for some reason staff on a matchday are a more valuable resource, more sales would be made if say like at Wigan we had cash turnstiles.

Mowbray is perhaps right to want bigger crowds. He needs to blame Waggott for why that hasnt happened. 

Chaddy doesn't priorities his money to spend on Rovers so don't talk shite pal. This month I will be buying Christmas presents for family I haven't bought for yet and Its the Missus on Wednesday so Ive bought her presents. So It will mean I miss out on going West Brom away but that's life. My priorities are family first every time. 

Yes I do go to every home league games and miss one for many many years pal. 

I never understood why people wanted to sit there in Darwen end. I wouldn't be in favour of unreserved seating as I have my seat in Blackburn end for many years and enjoy the people around me and the discussion. Plus the great view I get every single game. 

I am talking about my opinions not others. That's why I posted my opinions not everyone opinions that's why we have messageboards. 

1 minute ago, Mattyblue said:

Chaddy picks and chooses his away games. He’s chosen not to go to Bolton because of expensive tickets and other inconveniences - he’ll watch on Sky instead.

Some fans pick and choose their home games. Some will choose not to do Leeds because of expensive tickets and other inconveniences - they’ll watch on Sky red button instead.

Chaddy thinks these fans should find a way to go regardless.

I do pick and chose my away games as I cannot afford it. I try to do 5 this season. Stoke away, Preston away will be one, hopefully Leeds away but depends on whether I'm working that night or have a new job by then, then 2 more in 2019. 

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I've found myself no longer rushing home to get back for the mid week games. I've watched our mid week home games on Sky despite having a ST and I actually live just off Livesy Branch.

Last season I was leaving work early to ensure I beat any traffic, getting in and changing and going straight out. This season that willpower to drop everything I am doing at work and rush home (I work quite far from Blackburn usually) hasn't been there. I'd often find myself getting to about 5pm and thinking "oh well, I'll get back to mine probably just after kick off, maybe just before" and continuing to finish what I'm doing. What is the point in me increasing my workload the following days when I can still catch the game? It's a predicament I thought I'd never be in when I was younger but responsibilities soon take over - combined with the fact that it's now convenient to catch it on tele!

I could probably still rush down Livesy and catch most of the 1sd half, only missing the first 15/20 some days, but why would I?

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19 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I've found myself no longer rushing home to get back for the mid week games. I've watched our mid week home games on Sky despite having a ST and I actually live just off Livesy Branch.

Last season I was leaving work early to ensure I beat any traffic, getting in and changing and going straight out. This season that willpower to drop everything I am doing at work and rush home (I work quite far from Blackburn usually) hasn't been there. I'd often find myself getting to about 5pm and thinking "oh well, I'll get back to mine probably just after kick off, maybe just before" and continuing to finish what I'm doing. What is the point in me increasing my workload the following days when I can still catch the game? It's a predicament I thought I'd never be in when I was younger but responsibilities soon take over - combined with the fact that it's now convenient to catch it on tele!

I could probably still rush down Livesy and catch most of the 1sd half, only missing the first 15/20 some days, but why would I?

I think that's the tv era right there in a nutshell people will take the easier options if it's constantly plonked in front of them with the blanket coverage these days even if it's not a live game.

SKY etc will thank you for that but clubs won't, the same clubs who take the Media money with open hands and pass it straight into players and agents pockets. Hardcore fans are supposed to turn up to carry the can of keeping the ground running, cheering the team and making it a better spectacle.........for the tv camera's !

An industry of sheer hypocrisy really ?

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23 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Chaddy doesn't priorities his money to spend on Rovers so don't talk shite pal. This month I will be buying Christmas presents for family I haven't bought for yet and Its the Missus on Wednesday so Ive bought her presents. So It will mean I miss out on going West Brom away but that's life. My priorities are family first every time. 

Yes I do go to every home league games and miss one for many many years pal. 

I never understood why people wanted to sit there in Darwen end. I wouldn't be in favour of unreserved seating as I have my seat in Blackburn end for many years and enjoy the people around me and the discussion. Plus the great view I get every single game. 

I am talking about my opinions not others. That's why I posted my opinions not everyone opinions that's why we have messageboards. 

I do pick and chose my away games as I cannot afford it. I try to do 5 this season. Stoke away, Preston away will be one, hopefully Leeds away but depends on whether I'm working that night or have a new job by then, then 2 more in 2019. 

My point is chaddy, while I respect that you have different needs, wants and opinions to me, you have to show that you appreciate that peoples opinions differ to that.

The Darwen End debate is a case in point. I liked that it was unreserved primarily. That said, my reasons for preferring it are irrelevant, just as I respect that not everyone feels the same, you for example prefer the Blackburn End. If you had a valid reason why you think the Darwen End should have closed, fair enough. But saying you dont see why anyone would go there just smacks of ignorance and lacking empathy.

You do see attending home games as a key priority in life otherwise you wouldnt go to every one. Same with me. Doesnt mean I doubt that obviously your family is most important.

I intend on doing more than 5 away games, I did about half last season. If Mowbray said why havent our high away followings continued this season, I wouldnt start telling you or anyone else that you should go to more and "find a way." Youve already said about Bolton that ticket prices are too high, so its hypocritical to not empathise when others are saying the same about prices at Ewood, whether it be season ticket increases, matchday surcharges etc.

And the reason I blame Waggott is, as others have explained with far more clarity. The target audience of people who could increase crowds on last season are by default, not ones who see going to Ewood as their sole priority. You freeze prices and you are more likely to draw people back following a good season. You remove frivolous surcharges and you increase the chance of people waking up on a Saturday, perhaps with nothing else on and thinking, I fancy going Rovers today. And you dont irk the hardcore fans already there by moving them from their favourite areas. 

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2 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Chaddy doesn't priorities his money to spend on Rovers so don't talk shite pal. This month I will be buying Christmas presents for family I haven't bought for yet and Its the Missus on Wednesday so Ive bought her presents. So It will mean I miss out on going West Brom away but that's life. My priorities are family first every time. 

Yes I do go to every home league games and miss one for many many years pal. 

I never understood why people wanted to sit there in Darwen end. I wouldn't be in favour of unreserved seating as I have my seat in Blackburn end for many years and enjoy the people around me and the discussion. Plus the great view I get every single game. 

I am talking about my opinions not others. That's why I posted my opinions not everyone opinions that's why we have messageboards. 

I do pick and chose my away games as I cannot afford it. I try to do 5 this season. Stoke away, Preston away will be one, hopefully Leeds away but depends on whether I'm working that night or have a new job by then, then 2 more in 2019. 

Leeds are charging £40. If you aren't going to Bolton because of the cost surely Leeds will be too much.

In the summer I recall you saying that you would pay a lot more for your season ticket and watching Rovers was more important than your job. I'm sure you wrote that you would pack your job in if you couldn't get time off to watch Rovers play at home.

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1 hour ago, arbitro said:

Leeds are charging £40. If you aren't going to Bolton because of the cost surely Leeds will be too much.

In the summer I recall you saying that you would pay a lot more for your season ticket and watching Rovers was more important than your job. I'm sure you wrote that you would pack your job in if you couldn't get time off to watch Rovers play at home.

You're wasting your time. 

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1 hour ago, arbitro said:

Leeds are charging £40. If you aren't going to Bolton because of the cost surely Leeds will be too much.

In the summer I recall you saying that you would pay a lot more for your season ticket and watching Rovers was more important than your job. I'm sure you wrote that you would pack your job in if you couldn't get time off to watch Rovers play at home.

Will the Leeds game be on TV? we don't know, but it is a Boxing game match and I would like to attend. I would probably go with my missus and not mates so we could do some Boxing Day shopping before. Plus I would drive to Leeds but for Bolton I would go on trains then I could drink. 

I rearranged my shifts around Blackburn Rovers home games yes. I would pack my job in and get another job that would allow me to watch Rovers home games. But at the minute I'm currently do have to worry about it but things could change soon. 

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

My point is chaddy, while I respect that you have different needs, wants and opinions to me, you have to show that you appreciate that peoples opinions differ to that.

The Darwen End debate is a case in point. I liked that it was unreserved primarily. That said, my reasons for preferring it are irrelevant, just as I respect that not everyone feels the same, you for example prefer the Blackburn End. If you had a valid reason why you think the Darwen End should have closed, fair enough. But saying you dont see why anyone would go there just smacks of ignorance and lacking empathy.

You do see attending home games as a key priority in life otherwise you wouldnt go to every one. Same with me. Doesnt mean I doubt that obviously your family is most important.

I intend on doing more than 5 away games, I did about half last season. If Mowbray said why havent our high away followings continued this season, I wouldnt start telling you or anyone else that you should go to more and "find a way." Youve already said about Bolton that ticket prices are too high, so its hypocritical to not empathise when others are saying the same about prices at Ewood, whether it be season ticket increases, matchday surcharges etc.

And the reason I blame Waggott is, as others have explained with far more clarity. The target audience of people who could increase crowds on last season are by default, not ones who see going to Ewood as their sole priority. You freeze prices and you are more likely to draw people back following a good season. You remove frivolous surcharges and you increase the chance of people waking up on a Saturday, perhaps with nothing else on and thinking, I fancy going Rovers today. And you dont irk the hardcore fans already there by moving them from their favourite areas. 

Ive explained my reasons why I not going Bolton away as no trains, game on tv and ticket price. Plus it would allow me to attend another game that isn't on TV. No trains is a huge problem aswell as a group of lads we want to have all day of drinking and not a couple of drive to the game. 

I love attending home games and don't want to miss one at all. 

I do have empathy for the Darwen end closing for home fans but for me its sense to do this. Me and my mates have been saying it for a few years now that should happen. 

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3 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

And that’s fair enough chaddy. Some folk pick and choose home games for the same reason. They can’t just ‘find a way to go’.

maybe have a season ticket where you can attend 10 home games per season for 120 pounds or something like that. would allow flexible and suit someone on shift work patterns

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