Championship 2018-19

[CP Company Lad]

Some serious disorder after the Boro/Leeds game on Saturday. Police totally lost control on Albert Road. Proper 80s/early 90s set toos all over the place. No police escort for 1000s of Leeds heading to the station and needing no excuse to break off the main convoy into the back streets behind the shops/bars to front the locals off Albert Road. One set too under the bridge was a good 5 minutes long with no police anywhere. Bodies all over the place. 

Give Leeds 4,500 at Boro and make it an early ko (1pm) but the police got it very very wrong.

[DE.]

7 hours ago, Norbert Rassragr said:

Lambert is a complete quitter, a fake. He couldn't be bothered to go for the long term here, and used our mental owners as an excuse, couldn't get a reasonable Stoke squad to achieve anything and is now getting worse results than the previous manager. If or when he quits Ipswich, he can only hope for some job in the Chinese 3rd division or as a pundit on a foreign satellite channel.

In fairness, the owners (or their adviser(s)) did appear to lie to Lambert about the kind of funds he'd have available. Whether that makes him leaving right or wrong is open to debate, but if you don't trust your bosses and they've massively lied to you within months or taking the job (and you put a get out clause in your contract assumedly because you weren't 100% sure if they could be trusted) then it's hard to be too critical on him for walking away. Stoke's squad was really poor and I think their performance this season in the Championship shows a lot of those players were never very good to begin with. Rowett and now Jones haven't been able to halt their slide either. He was very lucky to get that job but they needed a proper firefighter like Allardyce to have any hope of staying in the PL. 

If he quits Ipswich then yes, I'd think he's done for a while at any decent level. He has improved their general play (they actually played quite well against Norwich in spells) but he hasn't been able to cut out their defensive mistakes and his short term signings all look well short of the standard needed to get Ipswich the points they need, which begs the question of why they were signed in the first place. Judge is decent but being played on the wing. Quaner and Keane no better than what Ipswich already had. Same for the likes of Bree. Just desperation signings with no real purpose. At least we got a couple of decent players in Graham and Bennett. Ipswich might as well have signed nobody at all. 

[roversfan99]

3 minutes ago, DE. said:

In fairness, the owners (or their adviser(s)) did appear to lie to Lambert about the kind of funds he'd have available. Whether that makes him leaving right or wrong is open to debate, but if you don't trust your bosses and they've massively lied to you within months or taking the job (and you put a get out clause in your contract assumedly because you weren't 100% sure if they could be trusted) then it's hard to be too critical on him for walking away. Stoke's squad was really poor and I think their performance this season in the Championship shows a lot of those players were never very good to begin with. Rowett and now Jones haven't been able to halt their slide either. He was very lucky to get that job but they needed a proper firefighter like Allardyce to have any hope of staying in the PL. 

If he quits Ipswich then yes, I'd think he's done for a while at any decent level. He has improved their general play (they actually played quite well against Norwich in spells) but he hasn't been able to cut out their defensive mistakes and his short term signings all look well short of the standard needed to get Ipswich the points they need, which begs the question of why they were signed in the first place. Judge is decent but being played on the wing. Quaner and Keane no better than what Ipswich already had. Same for the likes of Bree. Just desperation signings with no real purpose. At least we got a couple of decent players in Graham and Bennett. Ipswich might as well have signed nobody at all. 

Hes obviously not inherited good situations in particular in his last 2 jobs, my point is based around how he has not caused even a minor improvement at either club, in fact he has overseen a very slight reduction in points per game.

Last season at Stoke, Mark Hughes was understandably sacked after a shocking run of 20 points from 22 games, 0.91 points per game. With such a low benchmark, even with not the best squad in the world, you'd expect a new manager to oversee even a slight improvement, fresh ideas, new manager bounce etc. Following a game with Lambert in the stands and a caretaker on the touchline, Lambert oversaw 13 points from 15 games (3 of which came in a dead rubber on the last day) accumulating 0.87 points per game.

Same at Ipswich. Hurst undoubtedly did a woeful job, picking up 9 points from 15 games, 0.6 points per game. Lambert has picked up the same squad, added to it, and picked up 9 points from 16 games, 0.56 points per game. Piss poor.

[DE.]

8 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Hes obviously not inherited good situations in particular in his last 2 jobs, my point is based around how he has not caused even a minor improvement at either club, in fact he has overseen a very slight reduction in points per game.

Last season at Stoke, Mark Hughes was understandably sacked after a shocking run of 20 points from 22 games, 0.91 points per game. With such a low benchmark, even with not the best squad in the world, you'd expect a new manager to oversee even a slight improvement, fresh ideas, new manager bounce etc. Following a game with Lambert in the stands and a caretaker on the touchline, Lambert oversaw 13 points from 15 games (3 of which came in a dead rubber on the last day) accumulating 0.87 points per game.

Same at Ipswich. Hurst undoubtedly did a woeful job, picking up 9 points from 15 games, 0.6 points per game. Lambert has picked up the same squad, added to it, and picked up 9 points from 16 games, 0.56 points per game. Piss poor.

No argument from me. My main concern as an Ipswich fan right now would be the new signings, which seem absolutely pointless. Their squad when Lambert arrived was nowhere near the required standard, and multiple signings later it's still nowhere near. If you're going to buy Alan Judge at least play him in his correct position, otherwise why not buy a wide midfielder or a winger? Some strange decisions going on there. Will Keane is like a shit version of Andy Carroll, ponytail and all. 

[SBlue]

Makes me think that we could have picked up under Bowyer anyway and didn’t need PL... something that nagged me at the time because by Jesus was PL’s team dull and we hardly cantered to safety.

[RevidgeBlue]

35 minutes ago, DE. said:

In fairness, the owners (or their adviser(s)) did appear to lie to Lambert about the kind of funds he'd have available. Whether that makes him leaving right or wrong is open to debate, but if you don't trust your bosses and they've massively lied to you within months or taking the job (and you put a get out clause in your contract assumedly because you weren't 100% sure if they could be trusted) then it's hard to be too critical on him for walking away. Stoke's squad was really poor and I think their performance this season in the Championship shows a lot of those players were never very good to begin with. Rowett and now Jones haven't been able to halt their slide either. He was very lucky to get that job but they needed a proper firefighter like Allardyce to have any hope of staying in the PL. 

If he quits Ipswich then yes, I'd think he's done for a while at any decent level. He has improved their general play (they actually played quite well against Norwich in spells) but he hasn't been able to cut out their defensive mistakes and his short term signings all look well short of the standard needed to get Ipswich the points they need, which begs the question of why they were signed in the first place. Judge is decent but being played on the wing. Quaner and Keane no better than what Ipswich already had. Same for the likes of Bree. Just desperation signings with no real purpose. At least we got a couple of decent players in Graham and Bennett. Ipswich might as well have signed nobody at all. 

There's no evidence whatsoever anyone lied to anyone else about the funding that might or might not have been available when Lambert was here is there?

That was an assumption people seemed to make when he walked out. After he triggered his get out clause, (which we previously knew nothing about) he had nothing but good things to say about everyone at the Club.

[LDRover]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

who proven in league 1? 1 season of doing well isn't proven IMO. 

 

That's generally because they 'prove' themselves by getting promoted out of that league...or would you say you have to play at that level for 3 or more seasons to be proven? 

And I'm sure I'm not the only one to find your antogonistic tone annoying when 'debating'. You're certainly nowhere near bright enough to be as patronising as you try to be.

[SBlue]

He just used us, he didn’t really care.

 

Normally I wouldn’t mind but the sex was shit too.

[J*B]

56 minutes ago, CP Company Lad said:

Some serious disorder after the Boro/Leeds game on Saturday. Police totally lost control on Albert Road. Proper 80s/early 90s set toos all over the place. No police escort for 1000s of Leeds heading to the station and needing no excuse to break off the main convoy into the back streets behind the shops/bars to front the locals off Albert Road. One set too under the bridge was a good 5 minutes long with no police anywhere. Bodies all over the place. 

Give Leeds 4,500 at Boro and make it an early ko (1pm) but the police got it very very wrong.

Nobody cares mate - stop posting your green street tales.

[CP Company Lad]

Just now, J*B said:

Nobody cares mate - stop posting your green street tales.

Green St tales ? Hardly it was 3 days ago. I am 50 years old and not seen such stuff for a while. Just a heads up for Boro away. Take it as you will though few will get 4,500 tickets.

[SBlue]

Just now, CP Company Lad said:

Green St tales ? Hardly it was 3 days ago. I am 50 years old and not seen such stuff for a while. Just a heads up for Boro away. Take it as you will though few will get 4,500 tickets.

We’ve already been mate, fortunately we didn’t need to reassert or flex our fragile masculinity for internet hardman points.

We drew 1-1 too.

[Silas]

Are we supposed to be impressed by the 4.5k.

Just you've mentioned it twice now, with no real relevance to any of the other words on this page. 

[DE.]

12 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

There's no evidence whatsoever anyone lied to anyone else about the funding that might or might not have been available when Lambert was here is there?

That was an assumption people seemed to make when he walked out. After he triggered his get out clause, (which we previously knew nothing about) he had nothing but good things to say about everyone at the Club.

It's clear from his quotes about being frustrated about the summer budget when he left that he was expecting more assurances than he ended up getting. I think he outright said that, and it seemed tied into selling Rhodes as that was done with great urgency in January when previous managers had failed to do so. As with everything Venky's related it's all smoke-and-mirrors and it'll probably be years before we know the real truth behind the Bowyer sacking, Lambert appointment/resignation, Coyle arrival era of 2015-2016. Some strange stuff going on there regardless. 

[CP Company Lad]

1 minute ago, Silas said:

Are we supposed to be impressed by the 4.5k.

Just you've mentioned it twice now, with no real relevance to any of the other words on this page. 

We asked for 6k as it went. Maybe not a good idea.

[RevidgeBlue]

9 minutes ago, DE. said:

It's clear from his quotes about being frustrated about the summer budget when he left that he was expecting more assurances than he ended up getting. I think he outright said that, and it seemed tied into selling Rhodes as that was done with great urgency in January when previous managers had failed to do so. As with everything Venky's related it's all smoke-and-mirrors and it'll probably be years before we know the real truth behind the Bowyer sacking, Lambert appointment/resignation, Coyle arrival era of 2015-2016. Some strange stuff going on there regardless. 

I can't recall PL specifically saying he was disappointed with the summer budget but if you can find a link to the contrary fair enough. In fact I've got it in the back of my head that PL said somewhere that when he met with Pasha they never even got as far as discussing budgets etc.

Edit: Also it appears PL was no fan of Rhodes at all and the money was made available for Coyle to make Graham permanent so there's nothing there to suggest he should walk out on our account.

Edited February 11, 2019 by RevidgeBlue

[Silas]

Just now, CP Company Lad said:

We asked for 6k as it went. Maybe not a good idea.

Well that certainly clears that up. 

[SBlue]

1 minute ago, CP Company Lad said:

We asked for 6k as it went. Maybe not a good idea.

NAWTY GEEZAHS

[CP Company Lad]

Just now, Silas said:

Well that certainly clears that up. 

Yeah we wanted 6,000 at Boro. 10k would of been better but we can't be greedy.

[CP Company Lad]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

NAWTY GEEZAHS

Occasionally. 

At Ewood.

 

 

[SBlue]

Just now, CP Company Lad said:

Occasionally. 

At Ewood.

 

 

I’m sure you’ll be glad to know I just soiled my pants.

[CP Company Lad]

2 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

I’m sure you’ll be glad to know I just soiled my pants.

Why ? No problem with us at Ewood.

[chaddyrovers]

54 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I hate to speak like Rafa Benitez but I am dealing with facts here.

Hurst got sacked after 9 points from 15 points, an embarrassingly low number of points, and was deservedly sacked.

Lambert has since taken the same squad that Hurst had, presumably expecting at least some sort of improvement on Hursts sorry points total. He has since gone on and accumulated 9 points from 16 games. Why does he deserve any longer in the job?

On top of the squad that Hurst had, which he has got even less from than Hurst got, he has been able to bring in 7 players (two thirds of a team essentially) on short term deals. Losses in their last 4 games suggests that his work in the transfer market has not improved them at all.

Further to this, the work he is doing is very short term. Judge seemed a good signing before he stuck him out wide every week. Will Keane is dog shit, Callum Elder is dog shit, Dawkins is dog shit, and any minutes they play are done neither to the benefit of the short term or the long term, which they wont be around for, Neither will Collins, Quaner or Bree next season.

I have no care for Ipswich fans opinions, their opinions have proved to be meaningless with how they see McCarthy. I only care about results. Lambert might talk a good game, he did here, banging on about what hes learnt in Germany etc, slagging off the job that previous managers or owners have done to curry favour, paying for coach travel as a gimmick to take the spotlight slightly away from the fact that his team is losing every week by showing what a lovely man he is.

I am giving you why I think Paul Lambert is very lucky to still be in a job, in cold, hard, black and white facts. Talking to biased supporters would not make a difference to my opinion. My opinion is solely based on point accumulation, and it is pretty water tight based on what I have said above.

The fact of the matter is, you are refusing to acknowledge that Lamberts record with the same players Hurst add with some of his own players on top is even worse than his predecessor. For me, if Hursts record warranted dismissal, and it did, so equally does Lamberts. End of.

Ipswich squad isn't good enough and that started poor summer recruitment and Hurst wasted 5 millions on league 1/2 players. 

He can only sign players he can due to budget and players wanting to come. Maybe they could have got better players but overpaid wages and transfer fees wise but I guess they didn't want to.

You don't care for Ipswich fans opinions because you cant stand them cos they back Lambert. 

Move on from the Mick McCarthy love in. you are obsess with him. 

Lambert needs to build his own squad and you will see next season. I think Ipswich going down might be a good thing and they can clear the deadwood and start again with a new improving younger team. similar to us. 

Hurst's dismissal was down to more than results. But things going on at training ground, behind the scenes. @DE. has posted these at the time. 

14 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Hes obviously not inherited good situations in particular in his last 2 jobs, my point is based around how he has not caused even a minor improvement at either club, in fact he has overseen a very slight reduction in points per game.

Last season at Stoke, Mark Hughes was understandably sacked after a shocking run of 20 points from 22 games, 0.91 points per game. With such a low benchmark, even with not the best squad in the world, you'd expect a new manager to oversee even a slight improvement, fresh ideas, new manager bounce etc. Following a game with Lambert in the stands and a caretaker on the touchline, Lambert oversaw 13 points from 15 games (3 of which came in a dead rubber on the last day) accumulating 0.87 points per game.

Same at Ipswich. Hurst undoubtedly did a woeful job, picking up 9 points from 15 games, 0.6 points per game. Lambert has picked up the same squad, added to it, and picked up 9 points from 16 games, 0.56 points per game. Piss poor.

No-one has improved Stoke and now onto their 3rd manager in 12 months since sacking Hughes and gone. Yes they 3rd manager. Stoke players weren't good enough and still aren't. 

He had the same point per game over the same games period. But their squad isn't good enough and this started in the summer under Hurst. 

Just now, DE. said:

No argument from me. My main concern as an Ipswich fan right now would be the new signings, which seem absolutely pointless. Their squad when Lambert arrived was nowhere near the required standard, and multiple signings later it's still nowhere near. If you're going to buy Alan Judge at least play him in his correct position, otherwise why not buy a wide midfielder or a winger? Some strange decisions going on there. Will Keane is like a shit version of Andy Carroll, ponytail and all. 

Lambert changed formation on Sunday and played Judge in the 10 role. 

I guess Lambert was restricted by the signings he could make in January due to league position

33 minutes ago, DE. said:

 

If he quits Ipswich then yes, I'd think he's done for a while at any decent level. He has improved their general play (they actually played quite well against Norwich in spells) but he hasn't been able to cut out their defensive mistakes and his short term signings all look well short of the standard needed to get Ipswich the points they need, which begs the question of why they were signed in the first place. Judge is decent but being played on the wing. Quaner and Keane no better than what Ipswich already had. Same for the likes of Bree. Just desperation signings with no real purpose. At least we got a couple of decent players in Graham and Bennett. Ipswich might as well have signed nobody at all. 

Their general play is better than before, but defensive mistakes keep happening even from their most experience players. 

Judge played the 10 role on Sunday. I would say that Jackson and Harrison aren't Championship standard and I don't see Lambert wanting to keep them next season. Quaner is a target man and Lambert like to play with that type of player. 

Ipswich don't appear to have a natural right back at the club so I can understand the Bree signing

[JHRover]

I think some people want to re-write history with Lambert or pin all the blame for what happened on his shoulders rather than the owners. The very same owners who responded to his departure by bringing in Coyle. If ever you needed evidence that the people running this club weren't fit for purpose that was it.

Let's blame it all on Lambert. Nothing at all to do with the owners who sold all our decent players and put us into the 3rd division through a lack of investment, neglect and appalling decisions. 

Quite clear he was brought in on the basis of doing a certain job and at some stage or other the goalposts moved. Is Lambert a saint? No, he's an odd bloke whose career is in danger of falling by the wayside after taking poor jobs and not sticking around, but Venkys take the blame in my book. They appointed him, God knows what they promised him, or what they expected of him, but quite clear that the budget wasn't and still isn't good enough to demand promotion and yet they appear to still seek it or claim to do. Lambert didn't spend anything on players and only brought in frees and loans.

We are back at square one though - supposedly the owners are ambitious and want promotion, supposedly they have made a good budget available for players to achieve that, yet lo and behold money doesn't actually get spent. Where have we heard that one before?

Edited February 11, 2019 by JHRover

[roversfan99]

30 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Ipswich squad isn't good enough and that started poor summer recruitment and Hurst wasted 5 millions on league 1/2 players. 

He can only sign players he can due to budget and players wanting to come. Maybe they could have got better players but overpaid wages and transfer fees wise but I guess they didn't want to.

You don't care for Ipswich fans opinions because you cant stand them cos they back Lambert. 

Move on from the Mick McCarthy love in. you are obsess with him. 

Lambert needs to build his own squad and you will see next season. I think Ipswich going down might be a good thing and they can clear the deadwood and start again with a new improving younger team. similar to us. 

Hurst's dismissal was down to more than results. But things going on at training ground, behind the scenes. @DE. has posted these at the time. 

No-one has improved Stoke and now onto their 3rd manager in 12 months since sacking Hughes and gone. Yes they 3rd manager. Stoke players weren't good enough and still aren't. 

He had the same point per game over the same games period. But their squad isn't good enough and this started in the summer under Hurst. 

Lambert changed formation on Sunday and played Judge in the 10 role. 

I guess Lambert was restricted by the signings he could make in January due to league position

Their general play is better than before, but defensive mistakes keep happening even from their most experience players. 

Judge played the 10 role on Sunday. I would say that Jackson and Harrison aren't Championship standard and I don't see Lambert wanting to keep them next season. Quaner is a target man and Lambert like to play with that type of player. 

Ipswich don't appear to have a natural right back at the club so I can understand the Bree signing

I dont know if you are being purposely obtuse or just ignorant. I know Ipswichs squad isnt very good, but Lambert has done even worse than Hurst with it, just as he did worse thn Hughes at Stoke. The "general play" is objectively not better because its churning out slightly worse results. The fact that rumours of squad morale issues and player-manager fall outs or whatever under Hurst only add additional context to how bad Lambert is doing, you would think a fresh face with no bad blood with his players would lead to better results, not worse!

If Ipswich fans are happy with him, fooled by his gimmicks, his interviews, his personality or whatever, then good for them, but im just glad that he is not our manager anymore because he isnt a very good one. 

The difference is, my argument is based on results and facts, yours is based on personal bias, supporter opinion, baseless predictions, and a total ignorance of results.

[roversfan99]

2 minutes ago, JHRover said:

I think some people want to re-write history with Lambert or pin all the blame for what happened on his shoulders rather than the owners. The very same owners who responded to his departure by bringing in Coyle. If ever you needed evidence that the people running this club weren't fit for purpose that was it.

Let's blame it all on Lambert. Nothing at all to do with the owners who sold all our decent players and put us into the 3rd division through a lack of investment, neglect and appalling decisions. 

Quite clear he was brought in on the basis of doing a certain job and at some stage or other the goalposts moved. Is Lambert a saint? No, he's an odd bloke whose career is in danger of falling by the wayside after taking poor jobs and not sticking around, but Venkys take the blame in my book. They appointed him, God knows what they promised him, or what they expected of him, but quite clear that the budget wasn't and still isn't good enough to demand promotion and yet they appear to still seek it or claim to do. Lambert didn't spend anything on players and only brought in frees and loans.

We are back at square one though - supposedly the owners are ambitious and want promotion, supposedly they have made a good budget available for players to achieve that, yet lo and behold money doesn't actually get spent. Where have we heard that one before?

Ive not seen one person suggest that Venkys were anything other than villains.

Lambert may have been promised finances the owners didnt keep, thats one thing we will never know. His actual spell here was the definition of underwhelming, bringing in plenty of loans, the football was pretty dull, and his results were average, which is admittedly far better than horrendous which his record has been in his last 2 jobs.

His cleverest move was his timing of departure and the way he went about it; Venkys were undoubtedly the primary villains and activating a very curiously placed release clause in his contract when the club was lingering in the bottom half and perhaps justifiably criticising the owners in the media was a PR masterstroke, with fans chanting his name not because he was Paul Lambert, or a competent manager, but because he went publically against the villains of the piece, Venkys.

The way he left aside, his brief spell here was neither successful or a failure, it was instantly forgettable. 

The job he has done in his last 2 roles is subject to most debate. To be unable to coax any improvement at all from managers who had either started to go stale and stagnate (Hughes at Stoke) or managers who were out of their depth from the start and rumoured to have fallen out with key players already (Hurst at Ipswich) is really poor. Look at Mowbray, he took over a limited squad running at a rate of less than a point per game following a woeful manager. With the same squad he caused a considerable improvement.