Club Revenue Generators

[Ladyboys of Bank Top]

9 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

I would have thought the entry fee for Blues was originally designed to keep demand under control when there were more competing Pubs nearby rather than be a Revenue raiser per se. 

The decision to raise the entry fee to £2.60 seems a bit ridiculous to me, the increase in Revenue is neither her nor there at the end of the day and £3 and getting some shrapnel back in your pocket is vastly different to £1.

On the other hand I can't for the life of me understand why people moan about the 1875 membership. Even at £10 I still think It's exceptional value, you get £5 cash back in the Club shop immediately and £2 or £3 off every time you purchase a match day ticket.

The extra match day charge I have no real view on one way or the other. If you know in advance It's going to be more if you leave it until the last minute I'm not sure how you can complain and if you really want to go but can't commit until the last minute because You're not sure what else you've got on I can't see that paying a bit more would necessarily put you off.

 

It's still a quid to get into Blues. 

[JHRover]

9 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

I would have thought the entry fee for Blues was originally designed to keep demand under control when there were more competing Pubs nearby rather than be a Revenue raiser per se. 

The decision to raise the entry fee to £2.60 seems a bit ridiculous to me, the increase in Revenue is neither her nor there at the end of the day and £3 and getting some shrapnel back in your pocket is vastly different to £1.

On the other hand I can't for the life of me understand why people moan about the 1875 membership. Even at £10 I still think It's exceptional value, you get £5 cash back in the Club shop immediately and £2 or £3 off every time you purchase a match day ticket.

The extra match day charge I have no real view on one way or the other. If you know in advance It's going to be more if you leave it until the last minute I'm not sure how you can complain and if you really want to go but can't commit until the last minute because You're not sure what else you've got on I can't see that paying a bit more would necessarily put you off.

 

What benefits do season ticket holders get? Fair enough for those who buy game by game who dodge the surcharge on tickets and who will get their money back through that over a season, but if you don't buy tickets for home games what is the advantage? Club cash is a joke when it can't be used for anything other than merchandise and kits and training gear are extremely expensive.

The only practical benefit as I see it is that you get priority on away tickets. Not only is that not likely to be relevant this season with demand less and supply of tickets much greater but more importantly I think it is completely wrong that people can effectively buy a place at the front of the queue for tickets whilst years and years of loyalty and ticket purchase history is considered to be less valuable or significant than 10 quid for membership. I always considered a season ticket to be membership and sufficient committment.

[Baz]

Had an interesting conversation with Andy Holt. His opinion is the only way to really noticably increase revenue is to play more games (e.g. cup games), or increase your gates by winning games. Even then a club like Stanley is on a shoestring budget and start the season with a black hole of 300k to 500k to breakeven. Recently they have just down well enough with wins, cup games etc, but it's not a sustainable platform.

One suggestion would to be trying to utilise the preseason more, maybe by re-introduction of the Manx cup, where gates would be higher, a bit more in it for the fans (and less travel costs). What does anyone else think?

 

[Paul]

8 hours ago, Baz said:

Had an interesting conversation with Andy Holt. His opinion is the only way to really noticably increase revenue is to play more games (e.g. cup games), or increase your gates by winning games. Even then a club like Stanley is on a shoestring budget and start the season with a black hole of 300k to 500k to breakeven. Recently they have just down well enough with wins, cup games etc, but it's not a sustainable platform.

One suggestion would to be trying to utilise the preseason more, maybe by re-introduction of the Manx cup, where gates would be higher, a bit more in it for the fans (and less travel costs). What does anyone else think?

 

I can see the argument playing more games is a good, and likely is the best, income generator but it's still not adequate. Much as I'd enjoy going to Manx cup games I doubt they would be financially viable - charge much more than £5 and the same criticisms will be levelled at the club by the same people. As it happens we won't get to any of the pre-season games as we are away most of the time but that's an aside.

Where Holt is correct is gates increase through winning games and is of course why John Williams always focused on investing every penny possible in to the team. Results are all that matters in terms of increasing revenue other than, obviously, promotion to the PL. We can discuss more activity on selling sponsorship, ground advertising, corporate etc. but does it really have an impact? Other than shirt sponsorship I doubt it. Who here can honestly say they've been influenced by ground advertising? I'm aware of some names but haven't rushed of to Forbes for advice on updating my will.

I don't understand the objections on much of this thread, basically the club is adopting what are now long established ideas on income generation. In general, not specifically at Ewood, I don't like these charges but there is little option other than to accept them. Discount for advance ticket purchase, booking fees, parking fees, extra charges for plane seats, priority check in (oh that's a joke) happens everywhere so I can't see the issue with Rovers doing the same.

Entry to Blues has always been £60/season apparently so this is nothihg new. I didn't know that and if folk want to shell out £60 to miss the second half while I don't understand it that's their choice and their money. I do object to paying to go in to a bar but it's far from enough to push me away from Rovers, being called an apologist, Venky lover or whatever the current dig is, by other fans for holding an alternative view is more likely to have that result.

The 1875 club to me is a good deal. We didn't take advantage of club cash but that was largely idleness on my part driven by the fact I know the club merchandise is not what I want so why bother with the trip to Roverstore? The discount on match tickets easily paid for itself and priority for away games meant we could book travel at the best rate safe in the knowledge we could buy match tickets. As priority was given to regular away fans when we had a small allocation this should not be considered an issue.

The club is "going for the money?" Of course it is. It's a commercial world we live in. The real point is far too many people expect something for nothing whether it be going in to a bar, cheap food or receiving decent public services - in reality it all has to be paid for. Those who use a service should be those who fund it.

I rarely go in to Blues. It costs money to run. Can someone justify why I as a season ticket holder should effectively subsidise those who want to drink during the second half? If the facility is offered for free it is taking away from potential investment in other areas of the club which all fans who attend should and do benefit from. Those who want the benefit of Blues should, and apparently have been happy to for years, pay for it. No issue at all and just another example of kicking the club.

Edited July 2, 2018 by Paul

[JHRover]

The majority of other clubs have a loyalty scheme in place where those supporters with most points accumulated through past purchases are able to get priority on buying away tickets. Therefore the club rewards their loyalty. What Rovers are basically saying is that loyalty counts for nothing. More important now is whether you have joined the 1875 club and paid them an extra £10 on top of the £300+ that most will already have shelled out for a season ticket. The result being that someone who has had a season ticket for 30 years without missing and who has bought every away ticket for 10 years but who won't join the 1875 club is behind a person who has never been to an away game and has only just got a season ticket but has paid to join this club.

I don't think that's right. I'm also not aware of any other club that does it.

If they're putting a priority scheme in place it should be season ticket holders with X number of away games bought, or points accumulated through purchases. Not that a priority scheme will even be required this season but it was last year and speaking for myself I like to get tickets bought as soon as they go on sale.

I'd prefer it if they increased my season ticket by £10 than charge me £350 and then try to force me to go out of my way to pay an extra £10 just to ensure I can get away tickets early doors.

[JHRover]

As I mentioned earlier, if the club was so concerned about making more money then they'd have replica kit on sale now in 30 degree sunshine as everyone is getting ready to go away on their summer holidays.

As usual we'll be late bringing it out by which time people and their kids will be back from their summer holidays having spent up and the weather will be poor.

No doubt the excuse will be 'but it's up to the manufacturers as to when we get delivery' in which case I'd suggest we should look elsewhere for a kit manufacturer as we're missing out on a key sales period here. Likewise the delay in obtaining a new shirt sponsor is another thing that could have been boxed off weeks ago.

[Mattyblue]

Would be interested to know the take up on 1875 membership this season. I haven't bothered signing up myself this time, as yet.

Last year was unique in many ways - loads of new grounds, loads of derbies, there was a local away game with a tiny allocation, top of the league, cheap. This season, I can't think of a single game where demand will outstrip supply  - as even the local games provide massive allocations, not new grounds etc etc.

[Paul]

11 minutes ago, JHRover said:

The majority of other clubs have a loyalty scheme in place where those supporters with most points accumulated through past purchases are able to get priority on buying away tickets. Therefore the club rewards their loyalty. What Rovers are basically saying is that loyalty counts for nothing. More important now is whether you have joined the 1875 club and paid them an extra £10 on top of the £300+ that most will already have shelled out for a season ticket. The result being that someone who has had a season ticket for 30 years without missing and who has bought every away ticket for 10 years but who won't join the 1875 club is behind a person who has never been to an away game and has only just got a season ticket but has paid to join this club.

I don't think that's right. I'm also not aware of any other club that does it.

If they're putting a priority scheme in place it should be season ticket holders with X number of away games bought, or points accumulated through purchases. Not that a priority scheme will even be required this season but it was last year and speaking for myself I like to get tickets bought as soon as they go on sale.

I'd prefer it if they increased my season ticket by £10 than charge me £350 and then try to force me to go out of my way to pay an extra £10 just to ensure I can get away tickets early doors.

 

Last season, and all previous seasons I've been a season ticket holder, disprove  this argument. Regular away fans do get priority, it happens for every match where the allocation requires it. If this wasn't true I'd have gone to, or at least had a chance to, go to Fleetwood for example. I didn't qualify for a ticket and I didn't moan that regukar away fans got one ahead of me.

Edited July 2, 2018 by Paul

[JHRover]

15 minutes ago, Paul said:

 

Last season, and all previous seasons I've been a season ticket holder, disprove  this argument. Regular away fans do get priority, it happens for every match where the allocation requires it. If this wasn't true I'd have gone to, or at least had a chance to, go to Fleetwood for example. I didn't qualify for a ticket and I didn't moan that regukar away fans got one ahead of me.

Before last season when away tickets went on sale the usual selling process was for season ticket holders only, and if there was high demand that would be accompanied by an additional requirement of 1,2, or 3 away game purchases. That's fair enough as those first in the queue were those who had been to the most games. Those who hadn't been to any away games or weren't season ticket holders had to wait for a period until they could get what was left.

Last season when the 1875 club was introduced the usual buying process was for those season ticket holders WITH 1875 membership to get priority, meaning in theory you could be a supporter with 20 years of going to every away game and not be guaranteed an away ticket if you didn't sign up for 1875, meanwhile someone who had never been to an away game could get priority ahead of him purely by paying £5 for membership.

Fleetwood was a cock up in itself as I know lots of supporters who had 1875 membership didn't get one because the club immediately put them on sale to more people than they should meaning all the tickets were snapped up within a few hours.

I've got a 100% away ticket purchase history for the last 7-8 years, yet in theory if I don't buy this 1875 membership then I won't be able to get my away tickets as soon as they go on sale, and there is a chance in theory that I won't be guaranteed away tickets and could miss out. Probably won't happen but it is a risk.

What happens if we get to the play-offs and are away at say Leeds? The members will get priority over non-members, limited allocation, and if I understand it correctly there is the possibility that a non-member who has been to every game could be unable to get a ticket whilst a member who has been to a couple of away games would be ahead in the queue.

Clearly the 'simple' way round it is to cough up another £10 for membership to avoid all this which is likely what I will have to do, but I don't think it is right that as a loyal supporter I should have to pay an additional charge to ensure I can get away tickets as soon as they come out when I believe buying history and loyalty should secure that

 

[tomphil]

10 hours ago, Baz said:

Had an interesting conversation with Andy Holt. His opinion is the only way to really noticably increase revenue is to play more games (e.g. cup games), or increase your gates by winning games. Even then a club like Stanley is on a shoestring budget and start the season with a black hole of 300k to 500k to breakeven. Recently they have just down well enough with wins, cup games etc, but it's not a sustainable platform.

One suggestion would to be trying to utilise the preseason more, maybe by re-introduction of the Manx cup, where gates would be higher, a bit more in it for the fans (and less travel costs). What does anyone else think?

 

Seeing as we tangle with Bolton, Preston, Wigan regularly now anyway and we've played that other lot quite regularly i'd prefer a version of the Anglo Scottish seeing as I never got to see that.

But yes some kind of pre season tourno might get some interest and also be decent prep, maybe they should play part of the farcical checktrade pre season.

[Paul]

58 minutes ago, JHRover said:

Before last season when away tickets went on sale the usual selling process was for season ticket holders only, and if there was high demand that would be accompanied by an additional requirement of 1,2, or 3 away game purchases. That's fair enough as those first in the queue were those who had been to the most games. Those who hadn't been to any away games or weren't season ticket holders had to wait for a period until they could get what was left.

Last season when the 1875 club was introduced the usual buying process was for those season ticket holders WITH 1875 membership to get priority, meaning in theory you could be a supporter with 20 years of going to every away game and not be guaranteed an away ticket if you didn't sign up for 1875, meanwhile someone who had never been to an away game could get priority ahead of him purely by paying £5 for membership.

Fleetwood was a cock up in itself as I know lots of supporters who had 1875 membership didn't get one because the club immediately put them on sale to more people than they should meaning all the tickets were snapped up within a few hours.

I've got a 100% away ticket purchase history for the last 7-8 years, yet in theory if I don't buy this 1875 membership then I won't be able to get my away tickets as soon as they go on sale, and there is a chance in theory that I won't be guaranteed away tickets and could miss out. Probably won't happen but it is a risk.

What happens if we get to the play-offs and are away at say Leeds? The members will get priority over non-members, limited allocation, and if I understand it correctly there is the possibility that a non-member who has been to every game could be unable to get a ticket whilst a member who has been to a couple of away games would be ahead in the queue.

Clearly the 'simple' way round it is to cough up another £10 for membership to avoid all this which is likely what I will have to do, but I don't think it is right that as a loyal supporter I should have to pay an additional charge to ensure I can get away tickets as soon as they come out when I believe buying history and loyalty should secure that

 

I wasn't aware of this change but then we don't go away very often. I fully get your point then and sympathise with you. Sadly though this is the way of the world, whether we like it or not

[arbitro]

16 minutes ago, Paul said:

I wasn't aware of this change but then we don't go away very often. I fully get your point then and sympathise with you. Sadly though this is the way of the world, whether we like it or not

I do think though Paul that the club haven't considered all the facts which JHRover has listed. I believe they have hiked up the price based on the success of 1875 last season without factoring in that the majority only joined to ensure tickets for the local and small allocation derbies.

[AshleyClifford]

On 01/07/2018 at 10:28, Stuart said:

Random? That’s the cost per match at £60.

Stuart I do not believe this to be a dig at you. 

More the realisation you can still pay £1 on the door and that to increase the standard entry to 2.60would have been random. 

 

[JHRover]

Just now, meadows said:

Rovers are advertising the 1875 Membership with the phrase “increased club cash” prominent

Has anyone received “increased club cash” at this stage? My cashback on this year’s season tickets  season seems entirely proportionate to last season’s taking into account the increase in season ticket prices

My club cash balance currently reads at £17 or so, which I presume is 5% of my £349 season ticket.

Last season my season ticket was £299 and I received almost £15 in club cash (5%) so in return for my £50 (17% increase) I'm getting about £2.50 more club cash back.

So pay an extra £55 for a season ticket and membership and get an extra £2.50 back for club cash in return.

[RevidgeBlue]

This thread is becoming a bit like a spoof, not only are people apparently whinging about what effectively is after cashback in the shop at most an OPTIONAL  £5 for away ticket priority if You're a season ticket holder and Don't buy any extra tickets for friends and family, now they are trying to see if they can catch the Club out on their advertising blurb by calculating whether the ratio of Club cash to season ticket price is higher or lower than last season! Unreal.

It's pretty simple really. If you Don't think away ticket priority will not be necessary next year then the 1875 scheme is optional not compulsory therefore it doesn't cost anyone a penny. If you think priority might be necessary for two or three games then £5 (if you use the Club Shop) is surely a more than reasonable price to pay.

It's little wonder we might only be signing loans and free transfers this summer if the reaction on here to the modest increase in ST prices and the Monty Pythonesque debate about the 1875 scheme is typical of the fan base as a whole.

Outside of this board I haven't heard any comment about price one way or the other.

 

[Mattyblue]

Really?

Most ST holders I know have mentioned it, hasn’t stopped them renewing, but it’s still a noticeable increase.

[Stuart]

13 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

This thread is becoming a bit like a spoof, not only are people apparently whinging about what effectively is after cashback in the shop at most an OPTIONAL  £5 for away ticket priority if You're a season ticket holder and Don't buy any extra tickets for friends and family, now they are trying to see if they can catch the Club out on their advertising blurb by calculating whether the ratio of Club cash to season ticket price is higher or lower than last season! Unreal.

It's pretty simple really. If you Don't think away ticket priority will not be necessary next year then the 1875 scheme is optional not compulsory therefore it doesn't cost anyone a penny. If you think priority might be necessary for two or three games then £5 (if you use the Club Shop) is surely a more than reasonable price to pay.

It's little wonder we might only be signing loans and free transfers this summer if the reaction on here to the modest increase in ST prices and the Monty Pythonesque debate about the 1875 scheme is typical of the fan base as a whole.

Outside of this board I haven't heard any comment about price one way or the other.

 

Rev, if we are relying only on our fanbase then we are making no signings for the foreseeable future.

[JBiz]

14 hours ago, Stuart said:

Rev, if we are relying only on our fanbase then we are making no signings for the foreseeable future.

What, like Davenport?

[MarkBRFC]

We didn't buy Davenport on the basis of our season ticket sales etc though did we?

That is what Stuart is getting at.

[JBiz]

1 hour ago, MarkBRFC said:

We didn't buy Davenport on the basis of our season ticket sales etc though did we?

That is what Stuart is getting at.

How did we buy him then? What’s the difference between the money we’ve taken through the coffers for ST’s and the money we’ve spent on the signing?

I do apologise if I’m missing something, but I’ve read this whole thread twice and I still can’t get my head around what people are complaining about, other than logical and small increases in cost of certain things. I’d expect many things to cheapen overnight (tickets, travel, club membership etc) if we had a premier league income stream.

There is a stark irony for me, of wanting rid of the owners but lamenting keeping our club solvent! You can’t have both, if you want the owners to invest more money into the club, for signings - you’re effectively saying you want them to stay.

Quicker the club can pay for its expensive facilities and academy itself, whilst still staying competitive.. quicker we can get rid of the Rao’s.

[Bigdoggsteel]

 

On 02/07/2018 at 09:32, JHRover said:

As I mentioned earlier, if the club was so concerned about making more money then they'd have replica kit on sale now in 30 degree sunshine as everyone is getting ready to go away on their summer holidays.

As usual we'll be late bringing it out by which time people and their kids will be back from their summer holidays having spent up and the weather will be poor.

No doubt the excuse will be 'but it's up to the manufacturers as to when we get delivery' in which case I'd suggest we should look elsewhere for a kit manufacturer as we're missing out on a key sales period here. Likewise the delay in obtaining a new shirt sponsor is another thing that could have been boxed off weeks ago.

Ya, I totally agree. The jersey should be out to capatalise on the positivity of last season. If other clubs have theirs out, why can't we? Even a date when it will be out would be a start 

[Stuart]

10 hours ago, Biz said:

What, like Davenport?

Having a slow one today?

Venkys are buying all of our players. Fans are keeping the lights on.

Just about.

[bob fleming]

On 01/07/2018 at 10:27, Stuart said:

 

Shame on those fans who excuse them for doing so.

 

On 01/07/2018 at 11:27, Stuart said:

According to one poster yes, apparently they’ve been ripping people fans in this way for a couple of years now but emboldened by the number of apologists are much happier to shout about it.

Panic over Bob.

#asyouwere

 

12 hours ago, Stuart said:

Having a slow one today?

Venkys are buying all of our players. Fans are keeping the lights on.

Just about.

Ah yes, no doubt aided by “shameful” “apologists”, aka “people fans”.

And they say it’s Venkys who divide the fan base ? 

[tomphil]

They seem to have a new way of doing things now after last summers audit so maybe ST money does go to signings these days on paper at least. Wonder if it might be something to get round FFP because it is the clubs own income so surely it can be spent on buying players, in terms of the figures anyway ?

The parent company continues to under pin everything else by loans/equity from profits elsewhere which seems to suit them and maybe now suits the FUFP that way ?

[Bigdoggsteel]

Is there any way the club could raise revenue from the fan base without there being uproar?