Ben Brereton Diaz

[Exiled in Toronto]

I think people are underestimating what it takes for Mowbray to be confident picking someone. Six months after Mowbray landed, Danny Graham himself was sat on the bench as understudy to Nuttall. Brereton has barely been here six weeks.

Why isn’t he as good as Graham? Six months ago Graham wasn’t as good as Graham, nor Evans as good as Evans, Nyambe as good as Nyambe. Mowbray’s regime has got the spine of the team playing the best football of their careers, but it took quite a long time.

Yes, Dack and Reed were able to step right in, but they are seasoned pros in comparison to Brereton.

Too early to call IMO.

[47er]

I agree its too early to call but the signs are not promising. He'll just have to amaze us all.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

5 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

 that thatIt's far too early to dismiss Brereton as an expense flop although I admit, having watched every appearance he has made thus far, it's clear the lad hasn't exactly hit the ground running.  Rather like Kevin Davies, the size of the fee seems to be an albatross around his neck.  He seems totally lacking in confidence and, more worryingly, lacking in basic fitness compared to those around him.  Granted that he has not played much football - either with Forest or ourselves - this season and the physical demands of the way we play seem totally alien to him at the moment.  Clearly he has ability - as his appearances for Forest and England youth would suggest - but the issue seems to be how to apply that ability within the system and style that we use.  At the moment he doesn't seem to have the physical attributes to allow him to play the Graham role nor does he have the pace to play him in the middle chasing long balls over the top - hence he appears in wide positions trying to cut in and support the player in the middle.

Davies eventually proved to be an exceptionally good player - although sadly long after his Ewood exit.  Brereton needs time to develop his own identity at Ewood and it may well be that it will take some time before we see the best of him.  The lad didn't set the fee but, unfortunately, he is having to live with it and is continually in the spotlight.  Perhaps one or two games with the Under-23's might help with confidence in the short term.

 

If you watch that video that was posted on here Parson it consisted mainly of clips of the lad picking the ball up out wide and running in field at people with the ball. Other than that I couldn't see what his real attributes were.  He didn't look to carry much of a goal threat. Worryingly he didn't appear to be particularly strong and seemed to go to ground easily. Another concern was for a tall guy he appeared to have very little heading ability. 

Would I have signed him for £7million on the strength of that video ? No.

Edited October 24, 2018 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[tomphil]

5 minutes ago, Exiled in Toronto said:

I think people are underestimating what it takes for Mowbray to be confident picking someone. Six months after Mowbray landed, Danny Graham himself was sat on the bench as understudy to Nuttall. Brereton has barely been here six weeks.

Why isn’t he as good as Graham? Six months ago Graham wasn’t as good as Graham, nor Evans as good as Evans, Nyambe as good as Nyambe. Mowbray’s regime has got the spine of the team playing the best football of their careers, but it took quite a long time.

Yes, Dack and Reed were able to step right in, but they are seasoned pros in comparison to Brereton.

Too early to call IMO.

He did similar with Dack I seem to recall, it's obviously his method and they are tried and tested but the likes of Dack can operate in several roles but this lad clearly needs to be in a central position so that's where he should be getting his cameo's.

[darrenrover]

8 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

It's far too early to dismiss Brereton as an expense flop although I admit, having watched every appearance he has made thus far, it's clear the lad hasn't exactly hit the ground running.  Rather like Kevin Davies, the size of the fee seems to be an albatross around his neck.  He seems totally lacking in confidence and, more worryingly, lacking in basic fitness compared to those around him.  Granted that he has not played much football - either with Forest or ourselves - this season and the physical demands of the way we play seem totally alien to him at the moment.  Clearly he has ability - as his appearances for Forest and England youth would suggest - but the issue seems to be how to apply that ability within the system and style that we use.  At the moment he doesn't seem to have the physical attributes to allow him to play the Graham role nor does he have the pace to play him in the middle chasing long balls over the top - hence he appears in wide positions trying to cut in and support the player in the middle.

Davies eventually proved to be an exceptionally good player - although sadly long after his Ewood exit.  Brereton needs time to develop his own identity at Ewood and it may well be that it will take some time before we see the best of him.  The lad didn't set the fee but, unfortunately, he is having to live with it and is continually in the spotlight.  Perhaps one or two games with the Under-23's might help with confidence in the short term.

 

I hope Stuart Harvey got this one right Parsonblue!

 

[Tom Stinny]

As a few others have mentioned. The manager hasn't helped him out by playing him as a winger. I don't buy into the putting Dack up front after 60 minutes. Dack plays midfield so should stay there either in his normal position or on the wing himself. 

 

If the guy can't get about after 60 minutes as well which has looked the case a few times this season then Dack himself should be subable as well. That's why there is a squad available. I think is was brentford he wasn't playing and they won so it can be done.

 

The manager is mostly at fault for Breretons slow start but during the Swansea game he seemed to try and take it to them when he came on and genuinely seemed to be up for it so all this sulking/not trying I can't see where it comes from.

[BlackburnEnd75]

10 hours ago, tomphil said:

He did similar with Dack I seem to recall, it's obviously his method and they are tried and tested but the likes of Dack can operate in several roles but this lad clearly needs to be in a central position so that's where he should be getting his cameo's.

Yep, I recall first few times i saw Dack I wasn't particularly impressed. Played him out wide left and he look unfit out of position, tried things that weren't coming off. He was in and out for a few games after he came back from his Hamstring injury at the start of the season.

[Leonard Venkhater]

15 hours ago, Parsonblue said:

It's far too early to dismiss Brereton as an expense flop although I admit, having watched every appearance he has made thus far, it's clear the lad hasn't exactly hit the ground running.  Rather like Kevin Davies, the size of the fee seems to be an albatross around his neck.  He seems totally lacking in confidence and, more worryingly, lacking in basic fitness compared to those around him.  Granted that he has not played much football - either with Forest or ourselves - this season and the physical demands of the way we play seem totally alien to him at the moment.  Clearly he has ability - as his appearances for Forest and England youth would suggest - but the issue seems to be how to apply that ability within the system and style that we use.  At the moment he doesn't seem to have the physical attributes to allow him to play the Graham role nor does he have the pace to play him in the middle chasing long balls over the top - hence he appears in wide positions trying to cut in and support the player in the middle.

Davies eventually proved to be an exceptionally good player - although sadly long after his Ewood exit.  Brereton needs time to develop his own identity at Ewood and it may well be that it will take some time before we see the best of him.  The lad didn't set the fee but, unfortunately, he is having to live with it and is continually in the spotlight.  Perhaps one or two games with the Under-23's might help with confidence in the short term.

 

As a fully paid up member of the John O'Mara Appreciation Society, I think this is a very balanced appraisal.

I am worried by what I have seen and I am also slightly concerned about the possible dangers of the Ewood self fulfilling prophesy.

Both Kevin Davies and Jimmy Quinn drew very negative responses from a crowd that they really needed to be on their side. Both achieved considerable success, once they were away from the frustrated Ewood crowd.

I understand that Davies also had some health issues and that there were issues around the way Hodgson did/did not support him in a difficult dressing room. Thankfully, TM seems to be a much better man manager.

The question for me is why we have invested so much money on one for the future, when the money might have been better spent on the here and now....but, of course, none of that is the fault of a nineteen year old....

[Bigdoggsteel]

3 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

As a fully paid up member of the John O'Mara Appreciation Society, I think this is a very balanced appraisal.

I am worried by what I have seen and I am also slightly concerned about the possible dangers of the Ewood self fulfilling prophesy.

Both Kevin Davies and Jimmy Quinn drew very negative responses from a crowd that they really needed to be on their side. Both achieved considerable success, once they were away from the frustrated Ewood crowd.

I understand that Davies also had some health issues and that there were issues around the way Hodgson did/did not support him in a difficult dressing room. Thankfully, TM seems to be a much better man manager.

The question for me is why we have invested so much money on one for the future, when the money might have been better spent on the here and now....but, of course, none of that is the fault of a nineteen year old....

Self fulfilling prophesy is when someone doubts themselves and then they end up bombing. I take the point that similar could happen though ,as it seems some fans have their minds made up about the guy and unless he scores 20 goals this season they will say he was a failure. Players pick up on that. Especially young players.  

[OJRovers]

25 minutes ago, BlackburnEnd75 said:

Yep, I recall first few times i saw Dack I wasn't particularly impressed. Played him out wide left and he look unfit out of position, tried things that weren't coming off. He was in and out for a few games after he came back from his Hamstring injury at the start of the season.

We pretty much built the current formation to fit Dack in that hole behind the striker.

If we are going to persevere with brereton then Mowbray needs to come up with a formation that works for him, rather than shoehorning him into the current system.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

That's why it's a puzzle that we didn't sign a Danny Graham MK 2 and went for somebody completely different.

[tomphil]

24 minutes ago, Leonard Venkhater said:

As a fully paid up member of the John O'Mara Appreciation Society, I think this is a very balanced appraisal.

I am worried by what I have seen and I am also slightly concerned about the possible dangers of the Ewood self fulfilling prophesy.

Both Kevin Davies and Jimmy Quinn drew very negative responses from a crowd that they really needed to be on their side. Both achieved considerable success, once they were away from the frustrated Ewood crowd.

I understand that Davies also had some health issues and that there were issues around the way Hodgson did/did not support him in a difficult dressing room. Thankfully, TM seems to be a much better man manager.

The question for me is why we have invested so much money on one for the future, when the money might have been better spent on the here and now....but, of course, none of that is the fault of a nineteen year old....

I heard from a few places that Hodgson didn't fancy signing Davies but the club wanted a big signing to replace Shearer and hopefully replicate him in some form and Davies was the man brought in, young, English, quick, strong etc.

It was also an open secret that Woy made him about as welcome as a turd in a swimming pool !

Part of the problem of the Hodgson reign was that he was one of the original 'Head Coach' foreign schooled types that were beginning to become common in England. Places where he'd worked did things differently and the head coaches asked their sporting directors for certain types of players and they went out, sourced them, brought them in then said here you go coach him and fit him into your side.

Roys poor signings fir huge money would largely back this up i'e he hadn't a clue as he was just used to being presented with quality players who could do as he asked. Also probably around that time agents really got a foot hold into Ewood for obvious reasons !

Apart from the fee I don't think this lad can be compared to Davies really it's a different landscape now.......we hope ?

Edited October 25, 2018 by tomphil

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, tomphil said:

I heard from a few places that Hodgson didn't fancy signing Davies but the club wanted a big signing to replace Shearer and hopefully replicate him in some form and Davies was the man brought in, young, English, quick, strong etc.

It was also an open secret that Woy made him about as welcome as a turd in a swimming pool !

Part of the problem of the Hodgson reign was that he was one of the original 'Head Coach' foreign schooled types that were beginning to become common in England. Places were he worked did things differently and the head coaches asked their sporting directors for certain types of players and they went out, sourced them, brought them in then said here you go coach him and fit him into your side.

Roys poor signings fir huge money would largely back this up i'e he hadn't a clue as he was just used to being presented with quality players who could do as he asked. Also probably around that time agents really got a foot hold into Ewood for obvious reasons !

Apart from the fee I don't think this lad can be compared to Davies really it's a different landscape now.......we hope ?

Be great if we had a 28 year old Kevin Davies now. Would fit in with our style of play very well! 

[tomphil]

34 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Be great if we had a 28 year old Kevin Davies now. Would fit in with our style of play very well! 

Certainly would he turned into one of the best battering rams in England once he had a manager who knew how best to use him. Just shows how players can change though as they develop as at first he was more of an Armstrong type albeit larger.

Bet Bolton wish they had a 28 year old Davies to sell around now as well !

[dingles staying down 4ever]

2 hours ago, tomphil said:

I heard from a few places that Hodgson didn't fancy signing Davies but the club wanted a big signing to replace Shearer and hopefully replicate him in some form and Davies was the man brought in, young, English, quick, strong etc.

It was also an open secret that Woy made him about as welcome as a turd in a swimming pool !

Part of the problem of the Hodgson reign was that he was one of the original 'Head Coach' foreign schooled types that were beginning to become common in England. Places where he'd worked did things differently and the head coaches asked their sporting directors for certain types of players and they went out, sourced them, brought them in then said here you go coach him and fit him into your side.

Roys poor signings fir huge money would largely back this up i'e he hadn't a clue as he was just used to being presented with quality players who could do as he asked. Also probably around that time agents really got a foot hold into Ewood for obvious reasons !

Apart from the fee I don't think this lad can be compared to Davies really it's a different landscape now.......we hope ?

I heard that Hodgson wanted Davies as one for the future but was horrified when he found out how much we'd paid. As a result he felt he had to play him regardless of form in a vein hope he'd play himself into form. We all know how successful that was.

Could history now be repeating itself with Brereton and Mowbray playing the parts in the reboot? Maybe Chaddy picking himself upfront would see him as the Nathan Blake replacement?

Edited October 25, 2018 by dingles staying down 4ever

[chaddyrovers]

From Rich Sharpe

Just re-read TM’s comments on Brereton from the day he signed. Almost two months on, think they’re possibly more relevant now. #Rovers https://t.co/Yb5HsKZ0k3

[Bigdoggsteel]

13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

From Rich Sharpe

Just re-read TM’s comments on Brereton from the day he signed. Almost two months on, think they’re possibly more relevant now. #Rovers https://t.co/Yb5HsKZ0k3

For once the LT are upfront about regurgitating content! 

Edited October 25, 2018 by Bigdoggsteel

[47er]

4 minutes ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

I heard that Hodgson wanted Davies as one for the future but was horrified when he found out how much we'd paid. As a result he felt he had to play him regardless of form in a vein hope he'd play himself into form. We all know how successful that was.

 

He should have been more horrified about that donkey of a centre-back he signed for almost as much! Scottish, can't remember his name thank God!

Bloody hell Woy did us some serious damage. A benefactor like that and he relegated us, technically he didn't of course but it was his fault.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

Just now, 47er said:

He should have been more horrified about that donkey of a centre-back he signed for almost as much! Scottish, can't remember his name thank God!

Bloody hell Woy did us some serious damage. A benefactor like that and he relegated us, technically he didn't of course but it was his fault.

That would be Christain Dailly but even he was better than Darren Peacock who'd arrived in the summer.

Actually thinking about Dailly was a converted Scottish midfielder who became a Centre Half. So thats another player cast in the reboot.

Edited October 25, 2018 by dingles staying down 4ever

[Stuart]

52 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

From Rich Sharpe

Just re-read TM’s comments on Brereton from the day he signed. Almost two months on, think they’re possibly more relevant now. #Rovers https://t.co/Yb5HsKZ0k3

“The price for me is really irrelevant. I know it’s not for the bigger picture for the football club but...”

That’s the problem though. £7m IS big money for Rovers, and the rest of us. Unless he finds form soon that’s going to be a bitter pill to swallow. £7m for a prospect is very unwise as a Championship club and it’s looking like it was a huge gamble.

However, the main problem as a fan is that we can see holes on the pitch with square pegs still in round holes. £7m could have gone a long way towards fixing that.

It’s the anti- Jordan Rhodes argument just without the goals.

https://www.football-addict.com/article/blackburn-rovers-fc/tbrfootball/5bd1868ce6094065cc5fcbaf/form-of-blackburn-rovers-man-proving-nottingham-forest-right-to-cash-in

[Bigdoggsteel]

16 minutes ago, Stuart said:

“The price for me is really irrelevant. I know it’s not for the bigger picture for the football club but...”

That’s the problem though. £7m IS big money for Rovers, and the rest of us. Unless he finds form soon that’s going to be a bitter pill to swallow. £7m for a prospect is very unwise as a Championship club and it’s looking like it was a huge gamble.

However, the main problem as a fan is that we can see holes on the pitch with square pegs still in round holes. £7m could have gone a long way towards fixing that.

It’s the anti- Jordan Rhodes argument just without the goals.

https://www.football-addict.com/article/blackburn-rovers-fc/tbrfootball/5bd1868ce6094065cc5fcbaf/form-of-blackburn-rovers-man-proving-nottingham-forest-right-to-cash-in

That link is to 2 sentences. I have seen some garbage posted on here, but that takes the biscuit. Seriously, did you write that or something? Makes Nixon look like Hemingway 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

4 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Be great if we had a 28 year old Kevin Davies now. Would fit in with our style of play very well! 

Exactly.

[Doaksie]

2 hours ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

That would be Christain Dailly but even he was better than Darren Peacock who'd arrived in the summer.

Actually thinking about Dailly was a converted Scottish midfielder who became a Centre Half. So thats another player cast in the reboot.

A move that only happened after we were rebuffed in our attempts to bring in Sol Campbell. 

[Bigdoggsteel]

Just now, Doaksie said:

A move that only happened after we were rebuffed in our attempts to bring in Sol Campbell. 

He would have been alright. Himself, Roy Keane and Zidane would have been a decent spine to the team.  

[JHRover]

Does anyone still believe we've committed to spending £7 million on him? Try half that with the rest performance/appearance related, so if he does flop, which is far too early to tell, then we will save on payments.