Ben Brereton Diaz

[Exiled_Rover]

7 hours ago, AllRoverAsia said:

My opinion of Szmodics has completely changed over the course of the season.

He's one of the very few of the current Rovers squad I'd want in the trenches with me.

JRC is one for me there - always thought he was a talented player (albeit limited athletically), but he doesn't take shit from anyone. His attitude is bang on. 

[AllRoverAsia]

1 minute ago, Exiled_Rover said:

JRC is one for me there - always thought he was a talented player (albeit limited athletically), but he doesn't take shit from anyone. His attitude is bang on. 

Totally agree, he'd be in the trench too.

I was just thinking if we had a team of A. Keeper, Adam plus the rest a  mix of JRCs and SSs it would be a hell of an outfit.

[riverholmes]

37 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

Totally agree, he'd be in the trench too.

I was just thinking if we had a team of A. Keeper, Adam plus the rest a  mix of JRCs and SSs it would be a hell of an outfit.

Talk of Szmodics and JRC as stalwarts is somewhat ironic considering their injury records. I’m not sure either can be relied on for a full season but I hope I’m wrong. Rankin-Costello seems to have kept healthy for an unprecedented spell, so hoping he’s turned a corner.

We have had success with former England youth forwards in Armstrong and Brereton-Diaz, so wonder if keeping an eye there might be worthwhile and their showings for their clubs, of course. Though, we’ve had misses here too.
 

I still have hopes for Markanday but we’ll see. Not looking promising at the moment.

Edited May 9, 2023 by riverholmes

[pick32]

Cheers for a good last game but been dog for months and we were a lot better when he was injured 

[lraC]

I honestly don’t wish it upon him, but I see him being a flop at Villarreal. Spanish football won’t suit him and it’s a big step up is La Liga from the championship.

His first 5 games will be crucial. Score a couple and who knows. A fast start may prove to make or break him, but I see a return to the championship in pretty rapid time. 

[alex l]

9 hours ago, Andy said:

 

Heard a whisper the other week that we did a deal with Villarreal in Dec/Jan whereby they were able to secure his signature and we locked in a sell-on fee. No idea if it's true, but could be an unexpected bonus if we did (and he does well out there).

This would make no sense given from Jan they could sign a pre contract agreement with no clause due to us. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

7 hours ago, lraC said:

I honestly don’t wish it upon him, but I see him being a flop at Villarreal. Spanish football won’t suit him and it’s a big step up is La Liga from the championship.

His first 5 games will be crucial. Score a couple and who knows. A fast start may prove to make or break him, but I see a return to the championship in pretty rapid time. 

Just my view - he’s more likely to be a flop in Spain than a success. You need better close control over there.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

10 hours ago, AllRoverAsia said:

Totally agree, he'd be in the trench too.

I was just thinking if we had a team of A. Keeper, Adam plus the rest a  mix of JRCs and SSs it would be a hell of an outfit.

That’s all you need to get out of this division. Look at Luton etc.

[Norbert Rassragr]

Nice that he turned up for the last game.

[booth]

2 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

That’s all you need to get out of this division. Look at Luton etc.

Two excellent centre forwards have massively helped. Would love either of them here.

[bluebruce]

Now that we know he's leaving for free, I think it's an interesting question, maybe worth a poll: with hindsight, did signing Ben Brereton prove to be a waste of money?

6-7 million on his fee. Unknown amount for signing on fee, unknown amount of wages but reputed to be low (I once read on here it was believed to be about 8k p/w I think it was). Some slight debate over exact numbers, but the below shouldn't be questionable...

First two seasons a complete bust, waste of a shirt. One goal each season.

Third season contributed effectively, 7 goals from out wide, played nearly every game.

Fourth season phenomenal..up to January, then essentially vanished as a force (partly circumstances beyond his control like injuries, Chile callups etc a big factor, but ultimately we're talking about what we got out of him).

Fifth season very good until January, again. Then a bit of a liability most of the rest of the season until the last day send-off.

The club achieved zero playoff placements and zero financial return on investment. We were never in relegation fights during his effective years, so I think it's hard to argue he saved us from relegation either (guess you never know where we'd have been without his goals, but I don't see it).

So, that's what we got out of him and during his time here - was it worth it?

Personally, I'm going with no. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't judge the worthiness of most transfers by whether we reached the playoffs, or we'd say every transfer we didn't make a profit on was a waste. But this was a very, very substantial outlay for a club of our financial strength, and none of the money came back to us. I don't think his wage particularly comes into the equation as we'd still have had to pay someone else a similar wage to be a solid contributor, and let's say 1 or 2 million of that fee too. I'm not talking about someone as good as Ben was at his best, just that we'd have bought someone else for the role who for the sake of argument let's say was an average contributor.

I know someone is going to say it, and yes the club is to blame for not managing his contract and sale better, but that's not the question I'm asking here. No coulda woulda shouldas, just, in the end, did this transfer work out to be a good one for the club, worth what we spent?

[chaddyrovers]

 

 

[roversfan99]

15 minutes ago, bluebruce said:

Now that we know he's leaving for free, I think it's an interesting question, maybe worth a poll: with hindsight, did signing Ben Brereton prove to be a waste of money?

6-7 million on his fee. Unknown amount for signing on fee, unknown amount of wages but reputed to be low (I once read on here it was believed to be about 8k p/w I think it was). Some slight debate over exact numbers, but the below shouldn't be questionable...

First two seasons a complete bust, waste of a shirt. One goal each season.

Third season contributed effectively, 7 goals from out wide, played nearly every game.

Fourth season phenomenal..up to January, then essentially vanished as a force (partly circumstances beyond his control like injuries, Chile callups etc a big factor, but ultimately we're talking about what we got out of him).

Fifth season very good until January, again. Then a bit of a liability most of the rest of the season until the last day send-off.

The club achieved zero playoff placements and zero financial return on investment. We were never in relegation fights during his effective years, so I think it's hard to argue he saved us from relegation either (guess you never know where we'd have been without his goals, but I don't see it).

So, that's what we got out of him and during his time here - was it worth it?

Personally, I'm going with no. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't judge the worthiness of most transfers by whether we reached the playoffs, or we'd say every transfer we didn't make a profit on was a waste. But this was a very, very substantial outlay for a club of our financial strength, and none of the money came back to us. I don't think his wage particularly comes into the equation as we'd still have had to pay someone else a similar wage to be a solid contributor, and let's say 1 or 2 million of that fee too. I'm not talking about someone as good as Ben was at his best, just that we'd have bought someone else for the role who for the sake of argument let's say was an average contributor.

I know someone is going to say it, and yes the club is to blame for not managing his contract and sale better, but that's not the question I'm asking here. No coulda woulda shouldas, just, in the end, did this transfer work out to be a good one for the club, worth what we spent?

Would have to be no. Had we sold him as we should have last summer, even for a profit of £1.5m ish, then yes, but our owners are to blame for that not happening.

[riverholmes]

1 hour ago, bluebruce said:

Now that we know he's leaving for free, I think it's an interesting question, maybe worth a poll: with hindsight, did signing Ben Brereton prove to be a waste of money?

6-7 million on his fee. Unknown amount for signing on fee, unknown amount of wages but reputed to be low (I once read on here it was believed to be about 8k p/w I think it was). Some slight debate over exact numbers, but the below shouldn't be questionable...

First two seasons a complete bust, waste of a shirt. One goal each season.

Third season contributed effectively, 7 goals from out wide, played nearly every game.

Fourth season phenomenal..up to January, then essentially vanished as a force (partly circumstances beyond his control like injuries, Chile callups etc a big factor, but ultimately we're talking about what we got out of him).

Fifth season very good until January, again. Then a bit of a liability most of the rest of the season until the last day send-off.

The club achieved zero playoff placements and zero financial return on investment. We were never in relegation fights during his effective years, so I think it's hard to argue he saved us from relegation either (guess you never know where we'd have been without his goals, but I don't see it).

So, that's what we got out of him and during his time here - was it worth it?

Personally, I'm going with no. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't judge the worthiness of most transfers by whether we reached the playoffs, or we'd say every transfer we didn't make a profit on was a waste. But this was a very, very substantial outlay for a club of our financial strength, and none of the money came back to us. I don't think his wage particularly comes into the equation as we'd still have had to pay someone else a similar wage to be a solid contributor, and let's say 1 or 2 million of that fee too. I'm not talking about someone as good as Ben was at his best, just that we'd have bought someone else for the role who for the sake of argument let's say was an average contributor.

I know someone is going to say it, and yes the club is to blame for not managing his contract and sale better, but that's not the question I'm asking here. No coulda woulda shouldas, just, in the end, did this transfer work out to be a good one for the club, worth what we spent?

Was it a major net loss? Yes, just as pretty much every single signing we have made in this league, from Lewis Holtby to Joe Rothwell, whether we paid a fee or not and includes loanees.

In the credit column, arguably, are intangibles of providing entertainment and satisfaction to fans, as well as raising the profile of the club. There's no doubt Brereton-Diaz did both at times.

However, it is true that throwing huge sums at individual players and neglecting the rest and to consistently let star players leave for free is not sustainable and asking for financial calamity.

Here's something to ponder. Tony Mowbray had Brereton-Diaz, Adam Armstrong, Harvey Elliot and Joe Rothwell in his squad and we didn't make it to the play offs. You might add Harwood-Bellis and Lenihan who are regulars in defence at the top of this league.

Sure, not all were as experienced and mature as they are now but that must go down as a failure.

 

Edited May 10, 2023 by riverholmes

[Andy]

It's a good point - and you can add similar sentiment to the squad that Bowyer had at his disposal.

This is why having a proper manager in place matters more than just the right squad.

This season we've had the opposite - good manager and very limited squad, yet still almost made the play offs.

If Venky's were ever going to throw caution to the wind(!) and buy their way out of the division, now would be the time to do it. Sheff United managed it this season, not even bothering to actually pay for their best player all season and, now, they're up, they face no sanctions or consequences.

It's not fair, but our owners have deep enough pockets to do it, if they wanted to...

[Upside Down]

I am disappointed that he went missing for the last few months.

If he'd have busted a gut and got us up he'd be leaving a club hero. Instead he'll be forgotten within half a season.

 

[rog of the rovers]

Ben Brereton Diaz's redemptive story arc and the Chile callup is what he'll be mostly remembered for in years to come.

As a footballer, he's a top 10 Championship striker at this moment in his career, can he step up to the La Liga/Europa League level next season? I suppose only time will tell.

As a storyline, he's a top 5 Rovers player in my time as a supporter (last 30 years)

As a footballer and 'striker' he's probably not in the top 20.

Edited May 11, 2023 by rog of the rovers

[bobbybrfc]

11 minutes ago, rog of the rovers said:

Ben Brereton Diaz's redemptive story arc and the Chile callup is what he'll be mostly remembered for in years to come.

As a footballer, he's a top 10 Championship striker at this moment in his career, can he step up to the La Liga/Europa League level next season? I suppose only time will tell.

As a storyline, he's a top 5 Rovers player in my time as a supporter (last 30 years)

As a footballer and 'striker' he's probably not in the top 20.

Certainly no Javier de Pedro 🇪🇸

[booth]

47 minutes ago, rog of the rovers said:

Ben Brereton Diaz's redemptive story arc and the Chile callup is what he'll be mostly remembered for in years to come.

As a footballer, he's a top 10 Championship striker at this moment in his career, can he step up to the La Liga/Europa League level next season? I suppose only time will tell.

As a storyline, he's a top 5 Rovers player in my time as a supporter (last 30 years)

As a footballer and 'striker' he's probably not in the top 20.

Deepest sympathies to you that you missed the glory years.

[Upside Down]

2 minutes ago, booth said:

Deepest sympathies to you that you missed the glory years.

Shearer, Sutton, Newell, Gallagher 

That was just one season as well.

[booth]

1 minute ago, Upside Down said:

Shearer, Sutton, Newell, Gallagher 

That was just one season as well.

And the rest who would come well before Brereton in a top 5 players. There's a lot of them, even before promotion in the early 90's.

[rog of the rovers]

1 hour ago, booth said:

Deepest sympathies to you that you missed the glory years.

I think you misinterpreted my point.

As a redemption story, from where he was to where he is now I'd say the 'feel good factor' is a top 5 story. 

As a footballer and striker I'd rank him below: (in chronological order)

Shearer, Newell, Sutton, Gallacher, Jansen, Cole, Bellamy, Dickov, McCarthy, Santa Cruz, Roberts, Yakubu, Rhodes, Gestede, Graham, Armstrong.

Edited May 11, 2023 by rog of the rovers

[booth]

13 minutes ago, rog of the rovers said:

I think you misinterpreted my point.

As a redemption story, from where he was to where he is now I'd say the 'feel good factor' is a top 5 story. 

As a footballer and striker I'd rank him below: (in chronological order)

Shearer, Newell, Sutton, Gallacher, Jansen, Cole, Bellamy, Dickov, McCarthy, Santa Cruz, Roberts, Yakubu, Rhodes, Gestede, Graham, Armstrong.

Soz, I took it that you'd just missed out on the early 90s.

[rog of the rovers]

2 minutes ago, booth said:

Soz, I took it that you'd just missed out on the early 90s.

I’m one of the lucky ones who was there! 😂

[booth]

7 minutes ago, rog of the rovers said:

I’m one of the lucky ones who was there! 😂

I know at least one member of the backroom staff on here that wasn't.

I always find it sad when I meet fellow Rovers that did as it really was like a dream. Difficult to explain in words.