Attendances

[only2garners]

29 minutes ago, arbitro said:

My daughter and granddaughter actually went to the Blackburn End having not checked their tickets. They were directed to the Blackburn End side of the JW Upper. They sat amongst parents and kids from her school but they said there were a few other schools there too.

Another thought - it may have been to minimise extra staff. Presumably the JW Upper is fully staffed anyway and putting everyone in the BE Upper might have meant more staff.

[Don Said]

29 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

18-25 attendances are down. Something blueboy has repeatedly raised on here, not sure the club’s response in the minutes are particularly encouraging, just waffle about ‘being competitive’.

I go to away games with a number of 18-25's who go to Ewood once or twice a season. One lad I go with (23) went to every Saturday away game last season, yet he only went to Ewood once on the last day vs Oxford. I think the last game he went to before that was Burnley. Call it fickle but recognise it's reality.

Most people in this age bracket go to games for the overall experience rather than a 90 minute football match.

Aside from the stuff on the pitch, that's our issue - the Ewood match day experience barely exists. If it DID exist we could make a significant addition to the crowd week in week out.

Away from home for most 18-25's it's great. Spend a few hours with your mates beforehand, most having a drink. Have a good sing during the game etc, make some noise and proudly show off how much noise your town can make, often stay in the town/city for a few hours afterwards. It's a good day out and you get a right laugh for your money. It gets rinsed and repeated. Folk spend loads doing it all season because it's worth it.

It doesn't feel like that for home games. The product doesn't equate to the cost due to the overall experience. A load of people realise that, especially after good experiences away from home, and turn a blind eye to going to home games because they can go and do something else more enjoyable, more worth their time and money.

One issue, the toughest to influence - the area. There is not much worthwhile to do around Ewood before and after the game. There are only a few pubs within walking distance so the opportunity to have a good day out both before and after the game barely exists. On top of that the rather uneventful town centre is a distance away from the ground with awful public transport links so that doesn't help. Out of our control but a better train link would help that big time. Always said that going to Ewood would be much improved if the area with an Aldi/Maccies on was redeveloped, similar to a mini version of Middlebrook next to the Reebok. A few shops, restaurants/bars and even something like a cinema would attract more people and would make the day experience better. Go for food/a drink, watch the game, go and do some sort of activity/drink in a nice place and call it a day. But just like transport infrastructure, it's not something we can do a great deal about, unfortunately. (And we all know the inept BwD council don't give a toss, shown by their decades old blantant disregard for parking solutions and numerous other things, but that's a rant for another day).

But there are very realistic things we CAN do something about, away from on the pitch, cost and council addressed areas, that other clubs HAVE done something about. One being the experience directly outside/at the ground... the fanzone is a bit of a gimmick, just a small bar under a tent serving up sunday league entertainment. I went to Bristol City away this season and they had loads of pop up food/drink areas directly outside the ground with decent music and so on. Everything was busy with a real buzz around (they weren't doing that well in the league at the time just to add). I've been to games in Germany where it was similar - grab some decent food and drink, mill about just enjoying the vibe around the place. The fanzone was a step in the right direction but we need to go one step further. These things are easy enough to set up and pay for themselves if done properly.

Perhaps the key thing; the main turn off for most 18-25's is the atmosphere. I think it's been covered to death in this thread so I won't go in to it, but we really need to address it and at the very least designate a signing/atmosphere area. I know people who are embarrassed by how quiet Ewood is these days and won't turn up because of that. They would genuinely go if it was louder, it's that simple. Boro, Derby, Ipswich and many other clubs have CONSISTENTLY boosted their crowds by designating an area. Many clubs boost their crowds this way without serving up Premier League football. You can't just expect/ hope it sorts itself out when the atmosphere has got as bad is it is, you can't just say 'well they could choose to go and sit somewhere and sing' as that isn't realistic. Designating somewhere is cheap to do, just needs a bit of a marketing campaign. Ridiculously easy, baffled we haven't done it.

These are quick wins that have proven to stand the test of time at clubs like us.

The matchday experience for anybody above the age of 12 hasn't been touched.

'Looking at keeping the price of season tickets competitive to retain the support' what a load of non-commitall tosh. Don't act, don't get.

As we've seen so often in recent history, we focus on little things and make a song and a dance about them when in reality we're standing still compared to clubs of a similar and smaller stature to us.

[Mattyblue]

Totally agree with most of that, though compared to most away grounds, I think there are plenty of pubs in walking distance to Ewood. There’s about 6 on Livesey Branch Road alone!

A PROPER singing section has to be looked at. Really promote it, help with banners and flags, make it cheap for that age bracket. I look around Ewood and thankfully I do see healthy numbers of kids, but ‘young adults’ if you want to call them that are noticeable by their absence - yet if a camera ever zooms to the singing section at say Palace or Huddersfield or Bristol City and it is all that demographic.

I hope the club doesn’t expect the answers to come from the Fans Forum, because as committed as they undoubtedly are, issues like the shelves in the Jack Walker stand or the need for a Harry Chapman postcard in the club shop aren’t exactly burning issues for the future of the club.

Edited April 8, 2019 by Mattyblue

[JHRover]

Yeah, if you think the range of pubs within walking distance of Ewood is the problem I'll have to disagree. Off the top of my head we have Golden Cup, Uncle Jacks (closed last time I went past), Fernhurst, Fox & Hounds, Brown Cow, White Bull, Moorgate, Wellington, Lord Raglan, Ivy and Navi all within 15 minutes walk of the turnstiles. Quite a healthy selection of proper pubs. Far better than the out of town retail setups at places like Derby, Bolton and Reading. The town centre is pretty poor but I suspect the vast majority of Rovers fans don't pass through the town centre anyway.

The atmosphere at Ewood is poor though. OK a large part of that comes down to having a half empty stadium and it is probably similar to PNE, Bolton and Wigan in that regard, but the club could certainly do more to deviate from the tried and tested matchday routine.

[Mattyblue]

And Ewood WMC

[JHRover]

Forgot to add the excellent Black Bull which isn't too much of a walk down the hill or a short cab ride.

[blueboy3333]

4 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

8-25 attendances are down. Something blueboy has repeatedly raised on here, not sure the club’s response in the minutes are particularly encouraging, just waffle about ‘being competitive’.

Lets see how 'competitive' translates when the ST details are released later in the month. There's a reason other clubs are making them genuinely 'competitive' for that age group - that's the age people stop going. The research is already out there. Lets see what Waggott does, but if he doesn't make them cheap the trend will just continue. Just doing nothing, which he normally does, will not being people back. 

 

[blueboy3333]

4 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Some interesting things out of the last Fans Forum:

18-25 attendances are down. Something blueboy has repeatedly raised on here, not sure the club’s response in the minutes are particularly encouraging, just waffle about ‘being competitive’.

And hallelujah it looks as if the noon KOs are no more!

https://www.rovers.co.uk/contentassets/d47edf0f19cd47dea3a73e898f8da69c/fans-forum-minutes-18-3-19.pdf

 

Terrible to read reports in there of racist chants by our own fans aimed at Nyambe. Unbelievable. They want shooting.

[tomphil]

I wonder if the closure of the DE had anything to do with a drop off in 18-25s not renewing, i'd wager it did !

O.G !

[Mattyblue]

They didn’t want to be inconveniencing the Darren Enders by constantly moving them for all those 6,000+ away followings...

Edited April 8, 2019 by Mattyblue

[Don Said]

Fair point on the pubs, I’m more nit picking at the lack of variation of places for 18-25’s - nowhere near as big a problem as other things though!

I drive past the Black Bull on my way back from games and have nipped in for one on occasions - deserves every bit of acclaim it’s had, great place.

[Stuart]

5 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Some interesting things out of the last Fans Forum:

18-25 attendances are down. Something blueboy has repeatedly raised on here, not sure the club’s response in the minutes are particularly encouraging, just waffle about ‘being competitive’.

And hallelujah it looks as if the noon KOs are no more!

https://www.rovers.co.uk/contentassets/d47edf0f19cd47dea3a73e898f8da69c/fans-forum-minutes-18-3-19.pdf

Some incredible stuff in there. No shelving, scouts cleaning gravestones, untied emergency cords.

In terms of more trivial matters:

- no scope for a cheap game to end the season because of the super six offer??

- Less than 500 half STs!!

- Northcote no longer want to run our hospitality (issues with Northcote or the club low-balling??). Fully expect a cut price provider being brought in and the price to go up..

- A couple of youngsters were complemented and it was batted away with the need for ‘balance’ - I.e. playing all of the old guard!!

- Banning kids from entering NO1 with incorrect tickets??

What concerned me most though was the blasé way that Waggott dealt with the request for a Harry Chapman postcard. Hopefully this can be raised to a more senior level at the next meeting.

[Mattyblue]

The banality of some of the issues that constantly get raised beggar belief when you think of some of the real structural problems the club has.

I’m sure O2G has said before that 500 is about standard for half season ticket sales.

The daftest thing is because 100 folk bought a Super 6 bundle ticket we can’t discount match tickets in the run in. For the piddling amount that were sold, why even bother with these bundles? Just keep a couple of individual game ticket offers up your sleeve.

 

 

[perthblue02]

24 minutes ago, Stuart said:

No shelving,

And we mocked when Degsy  was running the show, bet that wouldn't have happened during that time.

[Stuart]

12 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

The banality of some of the issues that constantly get raised beggar belief when you think of some of the real structural problems the club has.

I’m sure O2G has said before that 500 is about standard for half season ticket sales.

The daftest thing is because 100 folk bought a Super 6 bundle ticket we can’t discount match tickets in the run in. For the piddling amount that were sold, why even bother with these bundles? Just keep a couple of individual game ticket offers up your sleeve.

Agreed. Disappointing if it’s the case that half season tickets only ever reach 500. We are definitely doing something wrong. People don’t even want them for Christmas!

And you’d think I’d made up the Harry Chapman postcard for a larf - but no, it was a genuine request!

[blueboy3333]

At least the forum confirmed that Mowbray is responsible for all signings. The obvious follow-up was why £7m was spent on a kid who can't get a game.

[CD_93]

8 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Some interesting things out of the last Fans Forum:

18-25 attendances are down. Something blueboy has repeatedly raised on here, not sure the club’s response in the minutes are particularly encouraging, just waffle about ‘being competitive’.

And hallelujah it looks as if the noon KOs are no more!

https://www.rovers.co.uk/contentassets/d47edf0f19cd47dea3a73e898f8da69c/fans-forum-minutes-18-3-19.pdf

 

No vaping. Just ignore the big signs advertising it.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

3 hours ago, Stuart said:

Some incredible stuff in there. No shelving, scouts cleaning gravestones, untied emergency cords.

What concerned me most though was the blasé way that Waggott dealt with the request for a Harry Chapman postcard. Hopefully this can be raised to a more senior level at the next meeting.

Absolutely ferkin unbelievable!

No news about redeveloping the Riverside stand before it floats away in the River Blakewater?

Good news about the Museum though...

Edited April 8, 2019 by SIMON GARNERS 194

[Roving Mick]

It's the River Darwen.  The Blakewater is a long way from Ewood.

Land of Dope and Glory

[only2garners]

I had decided that I wasn't going to comment on the Fans Forum meetings but I think I need to say something re the comments above.

I wasn't at the last meeting (I messed up the dates and was on a plane at the time), so i can't comment on the detailed discussions. But the agenda had a number of items that have been big talking points on this Forum for weeks now including Season Tickets, Attendances and Preston Game Kick-Off Time. In addition there has also been comment on the Northcote contract and on the state of John Lewis' grave. And I hope all fans would want us to raise instances of racist and homophobic behaviour.

I've been on the Forum now for around 10 years and the one item that we have talked about more than any other has been attendances and atmosphere. It's probably one of the most constant threads on brfcs over that time as well.

I know that Steve Waggott has said that he was unable to develop more affordable hospitality options because of the terms of the Northcote contract, so I expect the ending of the contract was mutual. So hopefully next season should see some cheaper options.

There was criticism earlier in the year that the club had not carried out their promise to clean up John Lewis' grave given at the last Supporters' Meeting as it was reported in the LET that a scout group had done the work. In fact it was the Rovers chaplain who arranged that.

I would hope that most fans would see that the emergency cords being tied up in disabled toilets so that anyone in a wheelchair can't reach them is important to get sorted. It might only affect a handful of people but still. Putting up shelving in the JW Upper is of course a minor issue but do you think we should never raise things like this because at every meeting there are always more important issues? It was a simple request and it will be handy for fans, so why shouldn't it be raised?

[JHRover]

Can someone explain to me how the club can 'review' early kick off times and move towards only TV games being moved from 3pm?

The club has said, more than once, and is on record as saying, that they are powerless in these circumstances and they have to do as the police instruct them.

So they can review things all they like. Unless they can persuade the police to change their policy then things will continue as they have been. Unless Rovers lied previously and they do have a say over what time games are?

[Mattyblue]

Think it’s fairly obvious that the 12pm’s were the club’s idea, though the police were happy to oblige. They’ve just been rumbled this season and obviously didn’t like the backlash in the LT and on social media.

O2G - If the folk on the forum think issues like shelves, postcards etc need raising, fine, they are the ones that turn up meeting after meeting.

However, the minutes (to me) never seem to see much of a push on the FF side about potential attendance initiatives. Apologies if you do and the minutes don’t fully reflect the back and forth, they just normally read as flat batted replies from the club and then move on to other business.

I personally think the 18-25 demographic and a PROPER singing section need to get pushed and pushed hard with the club, and if you guys don’t do it, what other avenues are there?

Edited April 9, 2019 by Mattyblue

[blueboy3333]

14 minutes ago, only2garners said:

I had decided that I wasn't going to comment on the Fans Forum meetings but I think I need to say something re the comments above.

I wasn't at the last meeting (I messed up the dates and was on a plane at the time), so i can't comment on the detailed discussions. But the agenda had a number of items that have been big talking points on this Forum for weeks now including Season Tickets, Attendances and Preston Game Kick-Off Time. In addition there has also been comment on the Northcote contract and on the state of John Lewis' grave. And I hope all fans would want us to raise instances of racist and homophobic behaviour.

I've been on the Forum now for around 10 years and the one item that we have talked about more than any other has been attendances and atmosphere. It's probably one of the most constant threads on brfcs over that time as well.

I know that Steve Waggott has said that he was unable to develop more affordable hospitality options because of the terms of the Northcote contract, so I expect the ending of the contract was mutual. So hopefully next season should see some cheaper options.

There was criticism earlier in the year that the club had not carried out their promise to clean up John Lewis' grave given at the last Supporters' Meeting as it was reported in the LET that a scout group had done the work. In fact it was the Rovers chaplain who arranged that.

I would hope that most fans would see that the emergency cords being tied up in disabled toilets so that anyone in a wheelchair can't reach them is important to get sorted. It might only affect a handful of people but still. Putting up shelving in the JW Upper is of course a minor issue but do you think we should never raise things like this because at every meeting there are always more important issues? It was a simple request and it will be handy for fans, so why shouldn't it be raised?

I've got no criticism of anything that's been raised and every single thing on those forum notes is valid. They are all issues that need addressing. My concern is there are obvious follow up questions to the vague answers given. Example - Waggott saying they will 'keep prices competetive' in order to encourage support from the 18-25 age group. They aren't competetive, that's the whole point and is why attendances are declining for that age group. 

[only2garners]

As I said I wasn't at the last meeting so can't comment, but normally the discussion on the major items runs on for some time and the minutes are just a reflection of the major points made by each side. it certainly isn't a matter of we ask a question, the club answers and I write it down - there is more debate than that.

i guess the minutes end up looking like the lesser matters are given the same prominence but most of these are often one sentence question and answer.

[AshleyClifford]

Just had a look into 18-25 year old pricing and the first thing that stands out is the fact we don’t have this we have 18-21 , these are at decent prices both for match day and season tickets. We need to move with the times. The age where you are considered an adult seems to be blurred, different issue entirely but we have 18/19 year olds trying to pass as juniors then trying to by beer on the concourse. No one wants to pay more but you have to make a decision on what is classed as adult. 18/21/25. personally I think 22 is fine, but clearly not the case.