JANUARY TRANSFER WINDOW

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

30 minutes ago, philipl said:

My argument is January isn't when you can substantially rebuild a club. Sure there are odd good permanent and some good loan signings to be had.

I would hope we are looking at loan with a view to buy options.

But there is precious little transfer action anywhere so far this month.

It wouldn't be the end of the world if Rovers had no more ins or outs this window. The nightmare would be a £20m offer for Dack coming in on 29 January.

 

 

Given that we are likely safe yet not good enough to get a top 6 spot, blooding the younger lads may be a better option.  Give the likes of Nuttall, Butterworth, Grayson, Wharton etc a couple of first team games to see what they're about.  Sink or swim scenario.  Then spend accordingly  in summer.

[Tom]

No Lyons with the under 23s tonight wonder if his loan move in impending 

[roversfan99]

5 hours ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

Well I can imagine them saying that if he asked for more money for a striker alright. 

At the end of the day, Wigan and Preston games aside, we are very competitive this season and are over achieving. So Mowbray is doing a great job building the squad and working with who is at his disposal. 

I think we have a good squad, so hopefully we can have a good end to the season,. I'm not too bothered about transfers this month to be honest. 

Are we really overachieving? You seem desperate to suggest we are but I think we are about on par in terms of league position compared to where we should be, in terms of wages as much as everything else.

There are teams above us (Bristol City, Hull, QPR and Birmingham) all of whom I would suggest are "overachieving" more than we are. Whereas below us, only Stoke (mismamaged this season and under considerable reconstruction) and Preston (riddled with injuries and have fat less resources) surprise me in terms of being below us.

I also think you are overestimating our competitiveness by mentioning just Preston and Wigan. We have been beaten by more than one goal on quite a few occasions.

Mowbray is doing a good job but his ability to build the squad with new players is questionable and hit and miss and his loyalty to some is also a big concern.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

59 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Are we really overachieving? You seem desperate to suggest we are but I think we are about on par in terms of league position compared to where we should be, in terms of wages as much as everything else.

There are teams above us (Bristol City, Hull, QPR and Birmingham) all of whom I would suggest are "overachieving" more than we are. Whereas below us, only Stoke (mismamaged this season and under considerable reconstruction) and Preston (riddled with injuries and have fat less resources) surprise me in terms of being below us.

I also think you are overestimating our competitiveness by mentioning just Preston and Wigan. We have been beaten by more than one goal on quite a few occasions.

Mowbray is doing a good job but his ability to build the squad with new players is questionable and hit and miss and his loyalty to some is also a big concern.

For me League position wise we are over achieving by a few places. I thought we'd be around 6th from the bottom. Football wise we are about where I thought we'd be at the start of the season. Although we were promoted ok from a football point of view we blew hot and cold somewhat. When we were hot it was enough to get us over the line. With more or less the same team I didn't expect things to be a lot different this season.

Edited January 14, 2019 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[AJW]

IMHO we need a left back and someone to play right hand side of attack (or left hand side and move Armstrong to right) ,that way when can get Harrison Reed into the centre of Midfield  i like the look of Alex Mowatt of  Barnsley 

Edited January 14, 2019 by AJW

[roversfan99]

52 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

For me League position wise we are over achieving by a few places. I thought we'd be around 6th from the bottom. Football wise we are about where I thought we'd be at the start of the season. Although we were promoted ok from a football point of view we blew hot and cold somewhat. When we were hot it was enough to get us over the line. With more or less the same team I didn't expect things to be a lot different this season.

The thing is, there is a key variable within your analysis. You say we have more or less the same team that got promoted. Would you not agree that, considering the money we had in the summer, that is a slight on our summer recruitment?

Which 5 teams do you perceive to be worse than us, and which teams are we above that has surprised you? We have a 10th to 16th level wage budget and had 10m to spend. For all the grandeur about the league, which admittedly is entertaining, it is also littered with crap.

I also think you are underestimating the ease to which we got promoted last season. Both us and Wigan finished on incredibly high points tallies, and for us that factored in a really poor start in which we initially struggled to accumulate the consistency that after a dozen games saw us overcome a 12 point gap with ease. The level of consistency in terms of results always takes precedent over the performances.

This is something to which I feel is commonly underestimated when people use "for a promoted team." We are a Championship side who even in a season of even for Venkys extreme negligence only went down on goal difference. 

[Sparks Rover]

11 hours ago, Don Said said:

Seemed slow and not much of a threat at all on Saturday. Aside from the 2 goals he scored in the FA Cup last week, he's only got 4 goals in over 100 for Millwall with a lot of those games in League One, we could do much much better than him. A poor man's Conway.

So you've seen him once and then gone on Google...he would be cheap and would add good balance and improve the options in my opinion. Good delivery too.

Championship - 20 games 2 goals and 3 assists so far ain't that bad....decent return and an international 

[47er]

6 hours ago, Tom said:

On the official site Mowbray says Nuttall will be competing with Graham for the spot up front which indicates he may not go on loan and that maybe Brereton is won’t be considered centrally.

It makes you wonder if we can bring in a proper winger if it’s worthwhile sending Brereton to league one to get some games 

It makes you wonder what was the point of Brereton at all.

[AAK]

3 hours ago, Tom said:

No Lyons with the under 23s tonight wonder if his loan move in impending 

He's only signed for 18 months, be a bit strange if we loaned him out for 6 months and then he comes back with 12 months left on his contract. He will end up a league two player, let's be honest.

[G Somerset Rover]

3 hours ago, Tom said:

No Lyons with the under 23s tonight wonder if his loan move in impending 

The big news of the window thus far. Says it all. 

[RevidgeBlue]

10 hours ago, Ewood Ace said:

Tony say's “I’ve talked before, I put a lot of stock in loyalty in players who have done well for this team and I want to see how far they can take us." 

I think it's stretching it a bit to say that the players TM is talking about have done particularly well by the Club. In the last 3 seasons in the Champoonship we've finished 15th, relegated, and are currently 14th. And let's be honest, we wouldn't have been anywhere near bouncing straight back were it not for Dack, and without him we'd be in serious trouble this season as well.

Imo there's no way the core of the players TM feels so loyal to are going to deliver anything other than a lower mid table finish at very best. We had this problem when the late Ray Harford took over and he was being too loyal to players who'd won the Premier League. Not ones yo-yoing between Leagues 1 and 2.

[tomphil]

5 hours ago, philipl said:

My argument is January isn't when you can substantially rebuild a club. Sure there are odd good permanent and some good loan signings to be had.

I would hope we are looking at loan with a view to buy options.

But there is precious little transfer action anywhere so far this month.

It wouldn't be the end of the world if Rovers had no more ins or outs this window. The nightmare would be a £20m offer for Dack coming in on 29 January.

 

 

From their point of view that would be the best time for a bid then the brass would disappear and if we survived ok they'd use the excuse we don't need to spend big, really its already been reinvested upfront..

We'd miss him and I don't want him to leave now or in the summer but I do think we'd be ok and it would force Mowbray to use the number of options he's been collecting properly. We did ok when it was altered on Saturday when he went off after all.

[RevidgeBlue]

5 hours ago, philipl said:

My argument is January isn't when you can substantially rebuild a club. Sure there are odd good permanent and some good loan signings to be had.

So that's your own view and it's purely coincidental that it's word for word what Pep Guardiola said on Sky the other day? ?

My view is that if players are available who will improve the team on a permanent basis are you have to sign them whether it's January or July. Otherwise if you just fiddle about with the odd loan you're back to square one in August.

You'd have to go some to unearth a player who'd improve the City team. However I can't believe there aren't any players available in January Europe wide who would improve our first eleven.

Edited January 14, 2019 by RevidgeBlue

[RevidgeBlue]

3 minutes ago, tomphil said:

We'd miss him and I don't want him to leave now or in the summer but I do think we'd be ok and it would force Mowbray to use the number of options he's been collecting properly. We did ok when it was altered on Saturday when he went off after all.

I don't, at least not without very major surgery elsewhere.

It would have echoes of selling Rhodes on the last day of the transfer window. The season after we went down.

[tomphil]

4 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

I don't, at least not without very major surgery elsewhere.

It would have echoes of selling Rhodes on the last day of the transfer window. The season after we went down.

That's what happens when you end up relying so heavily on one player and your whole style revolves around them.  We'd never get another creative/goal poaching type like Dack so I think he'd be forced to get some pace on the wings otherwise we'd need a creative mid and possibly a front 3 of Armstrong/Graham/Brereton which is something I've thought he might be planning should Dack leave.

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

I think it's stretching it a bit to say that the players TM is talking about have done particularly well by the Club. In the last 3 seasons in the Champoonship we've finished 15th, relegated, and are currently 14th. And let's be honest, we wouldn't have been anywhere near bouncing straight back were it not for Dack, and without him we'd be in serious trouble this season as well.

Imo there's no way the core of the players TM feels so loyal to are going to deliver anything other than a lower mid table finish at very best. We had this problem when the late Ray Harford took over and he was being too loyal to players who'd won the Premier League. Not ones yo-yoing between Leagues 1 and 2.

And in the 2 summers prior to this (in the Championship) we were under a transfer embargo ahead of the first (signed Akpan, Guthrie, Delfouenso etc and sold Cairney, Rhodes mid season, Gestede etc) and the following season we sold our remaining stars (Hanley and Duffy) and spent 250k.

Correct on the loyalty issue. Token contracts to Smallwood and Williams are examples of a lack of ruthlessness.

[roversfan99]

57 minutes ago, tomphil said:

From their point of view that would be the best time for a bid then the brass would disappear and if we survived ok they'd use the excuse we don't need to spend big, really its already been reinvested upfront..

We'd miss him and I don't want him to leave now or in the summer but I do think we'd be ok and it would force Mowbray to use the number of options he's been collecting properly. We did ok when it was altered on Saturday when he went off after all.

I fear that like many others you underappreciate how impressive his goal and assist returns are. And how difficult it would be even if we got every penny to reinvest, to replace him.

Look at the other attacking players for various fees that we have on our books that Mowbray has signed. Armstrong, Rothwell, Samuel, Brereton, Gladwin. None have come close to suggest they could make up the surplus of goals needed. And theres over 10m of attackers there.

[JacknOry]

13 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

He's done ok but even at this stage  only has one really good game every four or five. The rest of the time he looks miles off the pace.

Sorry but thats tosh - Our whole system revolves around him. Sure, in terms of getting goals they seem to come in dibs and dabs but that really isnt his main role. The system is designed to get Dack the goals (and the others behind) and he does it fantastically. We are like chalk and cheese when he is on/off the pitch.

[RevidgeBlue]

3 hours ago, JacknOry said:

Sorry but thats tosh - Our whole system revolves around him. Sure, in terms of getting goals they seem to come in dibs and dabs but that really isnt his main role. The system is designed to get Dack the goals (and the others behind) and he does it fantastically. We are like chalk and cheese when he is on/off the pitch.

It doesnt get others goals though.

Seven  (and 2 og's) other than Dack/Mulgrew/Graham.

[JacknOry]

14 minutes ago, RevidgeBlue said:

It doesnt get others goals though.

Seven  (and 2 og's) other than Dack/Mulgrew/Graham.

That is more down to them though really. Arma should have more than he has and the player chosen on the otherside is usually a more defensive minded player like Bennett or Reed.

I would argue it does work considering Dacks return and DG himself can be happy enough with his return also. Only Arma should have more really - he has had plenty of chances. Evans and Smallwood are hardly ever going to be brave enough to go past the halfway line let alone get in the box much. 

[philipl]

8 hours ago, RevidgeBlue said:

So that's your own view and it's purely coincidental that it's word for word what Pep Guardiola said on Sky the other day? ?

My view is that if players are available who will improve the team on a permanent basis are you have to sign them whether it's January or July. Otherwise if you just fiddle about with the odd loan you're back to square one in August.

You'd have to go some to unearth a player who'd improve the City team. However I can't believe there aren't any players available in January Europe wide who would improve our first eleven.

I didn't know Pep had said the same thing.

I am sure he also agrees with me that rain is wet- statements of the bleeding obvious.

What players are currently available for sale or loan?

Remember if they are no better than what we have, there is no point getting them so we are looking for Championship promotion winners. Only 16 other clubs (and one or two Prem clubs) looking for the same rare beasts. 

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, philipl said:

I didn't know Pep had said the same thing.

I am sure he also agrees with me that rain is wet- statements of the bleeding obvious.

What players are currently available for sale or loan?

Remember if they are no better than what we have, there is no point getting them so we are looking for Championship promotion winners. Only 16 other clubs (and one or two Prem clubs) looking for the same rare beasts. 

Spot on. 

People wanting a 'pacey wide man' to come in to the first team, how many of the 92 clubs also will be after the exact same thing? I'd reckon a good 3/4's.

[Guest]

Mowbray on Lewis Travis saving him from spending a million or so on a new CM: 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17357537.lewis-travis-has-saved-rovers-money-says-mowbray/

[gumboots]

1 hour ago, philipl said:

I didn't know Pep had said the same thing.

I am sure he also agrees with me that rain is wet- statements of the bleeding obvious.

What players are currently available for sale or loan?

Remember if they are no better than what we have, there is no point getting them so we are looking for Championship promotion winners. Only 16 other clubs (and one or two Prem clubs) looking for the same rare beasts. 

They're not all looking for the same kind of player in the same position though. Some may already have the perfect guy for them at centre back but may be short of an attacking midfielder. Some may be short of just a final piece in their own jigsaw to fit in with players they already have. There are players out there who are available that are what each team needs. It's a cae of identifying them and then all the other bits falling into place. That's why it can take a while but still work out to everyone's benefit

[47er]

13 minutes ago, Mellor Rover said:

Mowbray on Lewis Travis saving him from spending a million or so on a new CM: 

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rovers/news/17357537.lewis-travis-has-saved-rovers-money-says-mowbray/

Alternative headline---"Mowbray cottons on at last"