JANUARY TRANSFER WINDOW

[blondie]

Has he improved his timekeeping?

[JeffRover]

Unfortunately it’s looking like another dud deadline day on the horizon ?

[roversfan99]

3 minutes ago, S8 & Blue said:

Even if you’ve written him off already - how does the Brereton signing negate the fact that we’ve made some cracking signings that many teams would be jealous of?

It doesnt, that wasnt the point I was debating. Chaddy implied that we was 8th in spite of spending little money on our front 4; that is a bit of a deceiving fact when you consider one of our subs cost so much. I don't think its painting a true and fair view of our achievement if you only consider the cost of our players who have been successful signings up to now.

I have never doubted that we have made some cracking signings that other teams would be jealous of. I dont think anyone has suggested that. Dack is obviously the jewel in the crown, Armstrong has been poor in the main for most of the season but has in the last month showed form that he has enough to prove a very shrewd signing in time for 2m. Reed has also been a very good loan deal, and Graham was a very good signing from Coyle.

That being said, I do worry that our transfer targets seem to be from a limited pool, and believe you are wrong to shoot down Mercer for suggesting that we need to look abroad aswell as in the UK.

[G Somerset Rover]

Not a chance TM would bring Joao back. 

[Stuart]

6 minutes ago, alderson777 said:

Brentford want 14 Million for him and already rejected 12. We would have no chance

Football is absolutely bonkers at the moment.

Over £12m for “Brentford’s best player” - a side that haven’t got close to the top flight since WW2!

Another couple of million for a 26yo who has never kicked a ball in the PL!

North of £15 for Dack, who has played a couple of dozen games in the Championship and half a career in league one!

£7m for a fourth/fifth choice striker!

[perthblue02]

49 minutes ago, Paul Mellelieu said:

miserables

Who does he play for ? can we afford half of his 5 / 50 / 500 K p/w wage?

Edited January 30, 2019 by perthblue02

[chaddyrovers]

13 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Armstrong has been poor in the main for most of the season but has in the last month showed form that he has enough to prove a very shrewd signing in time for 2m. Reed has also been a very good loan deal, and Graham was a very good signing from Coyle.

That being said, I do worry that our transfer targets seem to be from a limited pool, and believe you are wrong to shoot down Mercer for suggesting that we need to look abroad aswell as in the UK.

Some signings take time to settle in for various reasons. 

Mowbray has set up a scouting network now overseas but this can take time to get up to speed and find the right players. 

I also think we shouldnt be signing loads of foriegn players. Nothing wrong with players all being from the UK and Ireland. 

Edited January 30, 2019 by chaddyrovers

[blueboy3333]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Nothing wrong with having a British based squad. 

I'd say it's essential. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

Some signings take time to settle in for various reasons. 

Mowbray has set up a scouting network now overseas but this can take time to get up to speed and find the right players. 

I also think we shouldnt be signing loads of foriegn players. Nothing wrong with having a British based squad. 

I prefer a squad with the best possible players in it, whether they are from England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Spain or Timbuktu.

We will see if this supposed scouting upgrade sees us signing good players from abroad as well as England. That is all me, Mercer and others who have suggested it want.

 

[chaddyrovers]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

I prefer a squad with the best possible players in it, whether they are from England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Spain or Timbuktu.

We will see if this supposed scouting upgrade sees us signing good players from abroad as well as England. That is all me, Mercer and others who have suggested it want.

 

Yet again it takes time and patience but you wont do that. We signed a couple of foriegn young players over the last 6 months

[SBlue]

12 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

It doesnt, that wasnt the point I was debating. Chaddy implied that we was 8th in spite of spending little money on our front 4; that is a bit of a deceiving fact when you consider one of our subs cost so much. I don't think its painting a true and fair view of our achievement if you only consider the cost of our players who have been successful signings up to now.

I have never doubted that we have made some cracking signings that other teams would be jealous of. I dont think anyone has suggested that. Dack is obviously the jewel in the crown, Armstrong has been poor in the main for most of the season but has in the last month showed form that he has enough to prove a very shrewd signing in time for 2m. Reed has also been a very good loan deal, and Graham was a very good signing from Coyle.

That being said, I do worry that our transfer targets seem to be from a limited pool, and believe you are wrong to shoot down Mercer for suggesting that we need to look abroad aswell as in the UK.

Ah, understand apologies.

However I do feel compelled to weigh in when people put it like -

“Why aren’t we signing players like Maupay and Pukki from abroad like everyone else!? We are missing out! Recruitment department needs sacking!”

Its ridiculous and completely dismisses the fact that every team in the league and half of the one above must be sick that they never signed Dack for peanuts from league one, and many will see that Arma is as effective and shrewd a signing you can hope for. 

Pointing at other’s successes and at our failures is so ridiculously myopic and illogical that I often wonder whether the argument is being made in good faith.

 

[SBlue]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I prefer a squad with the best possible players in it, whether they are from England, Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Spain or Timbuktu.

We will see if this supposed scouting upgrade sees us signing good players from abroad as well as England. That is all me, Mercer and others who have suggested it want.

 

Eh? You just said you don’t care where they come from! ?

There is an argument for a core of common language, culture etc. too.

Edited January 30, 2019 by S8 & Blue

[jim mk2]

20 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Nothing wrong with players all being from the UK and Ireland. 

Except they are very expensive. 

[47er]

56 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

what the rush? 

Mowbray has picked the team on form and playing well and are 8th after being promoted last season.

Mowbray has said what his plan was with Brereton from moment 1. But fans like you ignore what Mowbray has said cos you think you know better for some reason. Mowbray's words were time and patience 

Football clubs like us don't spend £7M on any player unless he is ready to walk into the team. Please don't pretend all is going to plan with Brereton!. Its a disaster.

If he comes good in a two or three years (and its a big "if") it still wouldn't justify it. 

Spent wisely that sort of money could have taken us into the top 6. We still might get there but Brereton won't be part of it.

[roversfan99]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

Ah, understand apologies.

However I do feel compelled to weigh in when people put it like -

“Why aren’t we signing players like Maupay and Pukki from abroad like everyone else!? We are missing out! Recruitment department needs sacking!”

Its ridiculous and completely dismisses the fact that every team in the league and half of the one above must be sick that they never signed Dack for peanuts from league one, and many will see that Arma is as effective and shrewd a signing you can hope for. 

Pointing at other’s successes and at our failures is so ridiculously myopic and illogical that I often wonder whether the argument is being made in good faith.

 

But that implies that if we started looking at players from abroad, that we would totally neglect the English market! The key is to find the best players possible wherever they are, but having a bigger pool to pick from is only going to be an advantage. 

I suspected that Mowbray was restricted in terms of perhaps a limited scouting network but recent quotes suggest he is uneasy with the idea of bringing in players from abroad.

Look at Norwich, they have signed Pukki, Leitner and Onel Hernandez but also the likes of Rhodes and Hanley, and Brentford signed Maupay and partnered him with Watkins from Exeter, its getting a nice mix.

You look at the Brereton deal, I refuse to accept that across Europe we couldnt find an alternative for that amount of money who would offered so much more so far. And going for the likes of Chapman and seemingly Gallagher again seems incredibly restricted and unimaginative.

[Tom]

1 hour ago, Mike E said:

*ahem*

WE HAVEN’T PAID £7M FOR BRERETON.

*ahem*

We have as much as any player goes for x amount, pretty much all deals now are ‘rising to’ so it seems a silly defence of the Big Ben fee.

I imagine any striker we sign would be a fee in instalments when targets are reached even the Jones to United sale  structured that way 

[47er]

We are committed to spending around £7M, its £7M that won't be available for anything or anyone else and that's the point.

[TruRover]

Let’s not have a BB debate. Does anyone know about our plan of action for tomorrow?

[47er]

we've already got one?

[SBlue]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

But that implies that if we started looking at players from abroad, that we would totally neglect the English market! The key is to find the best players possible wherever they are, but having a bigger pool to pick from is only going to be an advantage. 

I suspected that Mowbray was restricted in terms of perhaps a limited scouting network but recent quotes suggest he is uneasy with the idea of bringing in players from abroad.

Look at Norwich, they have signed Pukki, Leitner and Onel Hernandez but also the likes of Rhodes and Hanley, and Brentford signed Maupay and partnered him with Watkins from Exeter, its getting a nice mix.

You look at the Brereton deal, I refuse to accept that across Europe we couldnt find an alternative for that amount of money who would offered so much more so far. And going for the likes of Chapman and seemingly Gallagher again seems incredibly restricted and unimaginative.

Again you are only looking enviously at others successful signings!

I maintain we have done good business overall, business that MANY teams will envy, and as you say - it doesn’t matter where they come from!

[roversfan99]

Just now, S8 & Blue said:

Again you are only looking enviously at others successful signings!

I maintain we have done good business overall, business that MANY teams will envy, and as you say - it doesn’t matter where they come from!

I am not saying that signing players from abroad is a risk free strategy, there will be duds everywhere.

My point is the more players we are considering, and the bigger pool we are picking from, the more beneficial it will be for us.

A player with equal "potential" as Brereton signed from overseas would almost certainly cost a much more reasonable fee.

It also worries me that our primary targets seem to be former players, despite their obvious flaws/limitations (Chapmans injuries for example) which for me highlights a lack of variation and imagination.

I never expect that we will have a perfect record in the transfer market either, obviously I am going to show examples of successful transfers from abroad to back up my point, but that point is that picking players from a bigger pool is better than being limited to where we buy from, not that signing from abroad is guaranteed to be more successful.

I have never doubted that some of the business we have done is good.

[SBlue]

4 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I am not saying that signing players from abroad is a risk free strategy, there will be duds everywhere.

My point is the more players we are considering, and the bigger pool we are picking from, the more beneficial it will be for us.

A player with equal "potential" as Brereton signed from overseas would almost certainly cost a much more reasonable fee.

It also worries me that our primary targets seem to be former players, despite their obvious flaws/limitations (Chapmans injuries for example) which for me highlights a lack of variation and imagination.

I never expect that we will have a perfect record in the transfer market either, obviously I am going to show examples of successful transfers from abroad to back up my point, but that point is that picking players from a bigger pool is better than being limited to where we buy from, not that signing from abroad is guaranteed to be more successful.

I have never doubted that some of the business we have done is good.

Fair comments, and I understand your point of view, much of what you would like sounds great of course.

But for me I do have to boil it down to the fact that our current methods have led to better results than most other clubs get, and they have us progressing solidly as a team.

Edited January 30, 2019 by S8 & Blue

[bluebruce]

1 hour ago, chaddyrovers said:

Its the way it is. Put me on ignore if you don't like it.

Or how about you just show your fellow posters a bit more respect and a lot less passive aggression? What kind of reply is that? 'Its the way it is'. So you're just accepting you're being rude and don't care? No wonder a lot of people haven't exactly missed you with that shitty attitude.

[only2garners]

1 hour ago, Paul Mellelieu said:

miserables

Ah, Victor Hugo. An excellent craftsman but getting on a bit.

[JHRover]

I don't think signing players from abroad like Brentford, Norwich and Leeds have done is necessarily as simple as it sounds. I don't think it is as simple as setting up some sort of network, waiting for that to bear fruit and a year or two down the line we are unearthing gems from all over. 

Anyone who takes some time to look at the behind the scenes structures in place at Leeds, Norwich, Brentford would soon realise that those clubs operate on completely different terms to us. They employ various highly qualified directors, technical staff, sporting directors etc. Who are very well paid and specifically tasked with using their expertise and contacts abroad to better their clubs. Norwich with Webber and Farke, Leeds with Orta and the other bloke whose name I forget, Brentford's owner also owns a Danish club and they have a unique way of working that has been very successful.

I'm afraid we are miles away from that and will be until the owners decide that is a route they want to go down. That would include reducing the managers power and responsibility for recruitment and delegating to other suitable experienced staff, who we don't currently have. 

Like it or not the club has set itself up to be provincial in its approach. Recruitment, target audience, promotions, staffing, all diluted and downscaled over the years due to lack of a long term plan from above and cutbacks to non essential staff. 

I suspect anyway that Mowbray is a manager who will always look close to home when possible for his players, which is his way and that's fine, but if you want to properly tap into the European market these days in a highly competitive market you have to invest in a suitable structure to identify these players and get them in, there's no real evidence that the owners or manager have any burning desire to see that happen. It doesn't have to either. Many clubs have gone up with mainly British squads. But it does annoy me when we moan about the price and restricted options in available players without ever signing from overseas where they are generally cheaper.