Lewis Travis

[tomphil]

37 minutes ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

I think the breakdown of how many FORWARD passes Smallwood and Evans attempt/complete compared to Travis would be interesting. 

You'd have to calculate those per season because per game would be pointless as often there aren't any.

[Bigdoggsteel]

Evans is the worst. Reminds me of Zoolander not being able to turn left. His body position more often than not seems fixed in position for sideways or backwards passes only. 

[roversfan99]

2 hours ago, FGS5635 said:

75.1 when most of them are 10 yard passes backwards or sideways to the full backs ?

Travis was pushing forward, taking risks and trying to make something happen and still managed 82.3. Lets be honest also, WBA have arguably the best collection of central midfielders in the division and he was the best one on the pitch.

I agree with you on your analysis on Travis v Smallwood, but West Brom's midfield isnt the best in the league, Barry and Morrison are both well, well past their best and lacking in mobility and Phillips is a winger shoehorned in there to give them mobility.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

12 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I agree with you on your analysis on Travis v Smallwood, but West Brom's midfield isnt the best in the league, Barry and Morrison are both well, well past their best and lacking in mobility and Phillips is a winger shoehorned in there to give them mobility.

See your point but Travis played well against Sheff Utd as well. He can only play against who he is pitted against.

The analysis though does not include energy, drive and pace which Travis brought to the game. How many times have we seen Smallwood struggle to keep up with a runner from midfield or after 70 mins have him sit in front of the back 4 inviting pressure because he is knackered? On Tuesday the midfield played further up the park, even when the game entered it's later stages, which was a refreshing change. 

[roversfan99]

3 hours ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

See your point but Travis played well against Sheff Utd as well. He can only play against who he is pitted against.

The analysis though does not include energy, drive and pace which Travis brought to the game. How many times have we seen Smallwood struggle to keep up with a runner from midfield or after 70 mins have him sit in front of the back 4 inviting pressure because he is knackered? On Tuesday the midfield played further up the park, even when the game entered it's later stages, which was a refreshing change. 

Absolutely, he has looked a class above Smallwood who has been evidently lacking in quality for much of the season.

The composure and energy of Travis and also the intelligence really stood out.

Was just a point about West Broms midfield.

[47er]

The problem is TM is still considering loaning Travis out. Cannot fathom that one at all.

[joey_big_nose]

If there's one player Mowbray is loyal to it's Smallwood. Probably Bennett the other one. He does not like dropping players he sees as "core players" like those two.  It's due to their mentality and leadership I think.

I bet even if Travis has a good run Smallwood will still find his way back into the team when he is available again. Probably Mowbray will drop Evans and play Travis and Smallwood, rather than leave Smallwood out entirely.

[Don Said]

16 minutes ago, 47er said:

The problem is TM is still considering loaning Travis out. Cannot fathom that one at all.

Likewise. We wouldn't dream of loaning Evans or Smallwood out so doing so with Travis based on recent form and recent line ups would be insane.

[JHRover]

More likely is he'll find somewhere else in the team for Travis, especially if he goes on to become a fans favourite. RB or RM are potential destinations for him. He won't want to drop Evans or Smallwood, especially after handing new contracts out to them both since the summer.

[Stuart]

22 hours ago, JHRover said:

More likely is he'll find somewhere else in the team for Travis, especially if he goes on to become a fans favourite. RB or RM are potential destinations for him. He won't want to drop Evans or Smallwood, especially after handing new contracts out to them both since the summer.

Probably do what he has done with every other player who has starred in CM and move them out wide so he can play Evans and Smallwood.  

[Stuart]

22 hours ago, OnePhilT said:

It sounds like Travis is going to get the next two matches to show that he should keep his place in the starting lineup for the remainder of the season. Two good games doesn't mean that he'll be at that level consistently, but Smallwood and Evans don't regularly pull up any tress, either.

I think Mowbray is pushing Travis to jump through fire hoops to get the best out of him. He seems to like giving the younger players a high bar to push themselves to in order to get into the team. I don't have a problem with that, as long as Travis gets his just rewards.

Fully agree with the last bit. However, history shows that Mowbray doesn’t reward the youth, despite not being good at recruiting from outside.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

12 minutes ago, Stuart said:

Probably do what he has done with every other player who has starred in CM and move them out wide so he can play Evans and Smallwood.  

So long as it is instead of Armstrong and meaning us not losing Read then I can see logic in it. Would prefer to lose Smallwood with Travis central but I think Travis is capable of doing a job out wide as he was initially a fullback. His energy anywhere along the midfield is a bonus.

Edited January 5, 2019 by dingles staying down 4ever

[Tom Stinny]

22 hours ago, OnePhilT said:

It sounds like Travis is going to get the next two matches to show that he should keep his place in the starting lineup for the remainder of the season. Two good games doesn't mean that he'll be at that level consistently, but Smallwood and Evans don't regularly pull up any tress, either.

I think Mowbray is pushing Travis to jump through fire hoops to get the best out of him. He seems to like giving the younger players a high bar to push themselves to in order to get into the team. I don't have a problem with that, as long as Travis gets his just rewards.

I wouldn't mind that if the experienced players were also being held to that standard. I can guarantee now that after the next few games, Smallwood will be starting again.

 

Travis did a rash challenge last year and wasn't seen again. It shouldn't be one rule for one and another for the other. I'd expect more from the experienced than the youth.

 

If your performing better and trying harder, you play. Simple as.

[Stuart]

1 hour ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

So long as it is instead of Armstrong and meaning us not losing Read then I can see logic in it. Would prefer to lose Smallwood with Travis central but I think Travis is capable of doing a job out wide as he was initially a fullback. His energy anywhere along the midfield is a bonus.

Armstrong is very underrated on here but he can get a ball into the box and has a wicked shot on him. Hasn’t really taken off for him yet.

[Mattyblue]

He’s been getting a hell of a lot of shots blocked this season, perhaps he let’s fly a split second too late, giving Championship defenders their chance.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Armstrong is very underrated on here but he can get a ball into the box and has a wicked shot on him. Hasn’t really taken off for him yet.

Disagree I'm afraid. I've not seen much of him getting the ball into the box. At times he beats his full back and cuts inside but when he is shown outside struggles to make the correct decision. This maybe because he has spent most of his footballing life down the middle. Granted he is tooo god for league one but the evidence of his time in the championship suggests that the step up is too much.

He never really does the defending part of the job which is why the idea of Travis playing out wide appeals.

[Stuart]

12 minutes ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

Disagree I'm afraid. I've not seen much of him getting the ball into the box. At times he beats his full back and cuts inside but when he is shown outside struggles to make the correct decision. This maybe because he has spent most of his footballing life down the middle. Granted he is tooo god for league one but the evidence of his time in the championship suggests that the step up is too much.

He never really does the defending part of the job which is why the idea of Travis playing out wide appeals.

Not to me. We very much lack any driving force (going forward) in the middle. Reed has it, Rothwell has it, Travis has it. Rovers are at their best when they have that in them and at our worst when we play two defensive players. This is where Mowbray lets us down in my view and invites teams to take over the middle of the park. That wouldn’t be so bad but we don’t even play with natural width.

Who's the best winger out of Armstrong and Travis? Neither!

[blueboy3333]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Armstrong is very underrated on here but he can get a ball into the box and has a wicked shot on him. Hasn’t really taken off for him yet.

No doubting his pace and finishing ability but we are defo not getting the best out of him. He is not a creative player but is being asked to play a creative role. 

Edited January 5, 2019 by blueboy3333

[blueboy3333]

49 minutes ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

which is why the idea of Travis playing out wide appeals.

Travis is not a wide-player/winger by any stretch of the imagination. He might be ok at RB but there was a game last season when he came on as sub there in a game we were struggling in and looked fairly bad. He was then moved into central midfield and won us the game, basically because he got us on the front foot and passed forwards. 

[blueboy3333]

26 minutes ago, Stuart said:

Reed has it, Rothwell has it, Travis has it.

Agree with your post but don't think a comparison can be made with these three. Travis showed against WBA he rarely loses the ball and can be trusted not to get too far ahead of play and leave massive gaps behind. Rothwell IMO would be a liability in the middle of the park for those very reasons.  Reed is a lot more responsible than Rothwell but I think he needs a bit more of a free role. Tucking in at RM (like Bennett does) seems ideal for him. 

 

31 minutes ago, Stuart said:

This is where Mowbray lets us down in my view and invites teams to take over the middle of the park. That wouldn’t be so bad but we don’t even play with natural width.

I think that's the problem. Two sitting MF's is fine if you've got players further forward who can create. We only have Dack. I think this season might have been a bit different if we'd signed Freeman. He appears to have the quality we lack on the left. 

On the CM pairing in general we are in danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. One thing that appears fairly obvious is that we concede a lot of goals late on when the Evans/Smallwood shield for the back 4 has blown itself out. It was noticeable that with Travis on the field (with his better energy levels) that the Alamo against WBA didn't really materialise. Sure they had chances but it was no more than you'd expect from a top team in our division going for an equaliser. We don't really control possession as a team so Evans and Smallwood are there to stop our back four being put under pressure. When they stop doing that our back 4 tends to crack. 

Whether the lack of control is because of the coaching/team instruction or because of the players is another matter. Mowbray tried to convince the world last season we were a 'front-foot' team. He gave up the charade after the Wigan game at home and finally admitted we were a 'transition' team (i.e. counter-attacking). We still are that team. We ar certainly more Mourinho in style than Pep/Klopp. Whether that changes as we bring better players in (as Mowbray has said it will) remains to be seen. 

 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

3 hours ago, Stuart said:

Not to me. We very much lack any driving force (going forward) in the middle. Reed has it, Rothwell has it, Travis has it. Rovers are at their best when they have that in them and at our worst when we play two defensive players. This is where Mowbray lets us down in my view and invites teams to take over the middle of the park. That wouldn’t be so bad but we don’t even play with natural width.

Who's the best winger out of Armstrong and Travis? Neither!

Would not disagree about Reed and Travis in the middle but not about Rothwell. Rothwell runs up too many blind alleys to play in the Smallwood or Evans role. Remember in this formation the forward drive from midfield is Dack and the wide players. The two central midfielders are there to secure the central pitch if the move breaks down. If  another midfielder can get forward then thats the bonus and yes Reed or Travis with Evans could make a good pairing.

I see Rothwell fitting in as Dack's understudy. 

Personally I can only see us playing to Armstrong's strengths if we were to return to playing 4-4-2 and Armstrong playing off Graham. To me playing Armstrong, Bereton, Antonsson and Samuel out wide always offers the opposition an easy outlet for the midfield to play the ball out wide as none offer defence work. This allows them to push forward easily and offers overload on our fullbacks which in turn makes them look poor in defence. Reed and Bennett do the back tracking required and offer protection. Travis can offer this as well but I would prefer him in the middle as you say. I was only saying that I can logic playing him wide to help defensively.  Ideally we need two experienced wide men who can do both the attacking and defensive side of the work required for wide men and then we would not need two defensive midfielders to sit but Mowbray does not like tradittional wide men.

[davulsukur]

Had a good game today.

Absolutely cannot be loaned out now. Should be starting.

[Stuart]

Travis is exactly what our CM has been missing. You just know that when he gets the ball he is looking to get it forward as quickly as possible. Moving him out wide to accommodate Smallwood is not the answer, neither is loaning him out. I fear though that Mowbray will see it as a way to avoid the debate and keep Travis playing.

Please, please stay positive Tony. You’ve picked him in the middle and it has been one of your best decisions. Stick with it!

[Swanson]

1 hour ago, Stuart said:

Travis is exactly what our CM has been missing. You just know that when he gets the ball he is looking to get it forward as quickly as possible. Moving him out wide to accommodate Smallwood is not the answer, neither is loaning him out. I fear though that Mowbray will see it as a way to avoid the debate and keep Travis playing.

Please, please stay positive Tony. You’ve picked him in the middle and it has been one of your best decisions. Stick with it!

I fear this as well. Hopefully not the case.

[joey_big_nose]

Emergence of Travis does raise the question of what our best side is now with everyone fit. IMO... 

------------------------Raya

Nyambe---Lenihan---Mulgrew----Bell?

----------------Travis-------Reed

---Bennett?--------Dack-----Armstrong?

---------------------Graham

? = I'm not convinced

Subs : Leut, Williams, Smallwood or Evans, Conway, Rothwell, Palmer, Brereton 

We do seem to be getting ever more narrow. We have only one wide player so we shoo horn central players like Rothwell, Armstrong, Bennett and Palmer in there...

Also central midfield is mad. We have nine decent players I think now who can play there.  But only one decent striker (Graham) and one decent winger (Conway) - and both of them at the end of their careers. Left back is also weak.

All in all good squad though. I would argue the "spine" of central positions GK to CF is promotion quality.