Tony Mowbray Discussion

[arbitro]

41 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

I still think we need a change of direction and voice in the dressing room in spite of any potential success that the manager might have upto January.

On a separate topic, I watched the Brereton Diaz short film about his rise and I have to say it is amazing. There’s also a sense of shame as a Rovers fan as to how he was judged. The booing of him a year or two ago is probably an all time low for us as a fan base.

I hope he’s had a positive enough time with the club to sign an extension and that he continues to develop. The fee we eventually receive from his sale is important to us.

Wow.  Even Bradley Dack criticised his first three years on the video. That isn't words on a message board seen by a few hundred, it's gone out to millions of people. 

I criticised him and feel no shame whatsoever. 

[47er]

44 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

There’s also a sense of shame as a Rovers fan as to how he was judged. The booing of him a year or two ago is probably an all time low for us as a fan base.

Here we go again! What % of your posts criticise Rovers fans?  Quite a high one I'd have thought. 

Brereton has been very well supported by the fans despite flopping for a long period of time.

 

[Blue blood]

Whilst I get our league position is creditable given the squad we have there are a few factors that make me want to get rid of TM. 

Yes, it is a good position for the resources that we have but it's entirely TMs fault we have the resources/team that we do. He's the reason we have a paper thin squad. He's spunked so much on unneeded squad filler and his mates, he's overly relied on loans and he's not renewed contracts. it's beginning to come home to roost but if he has us in a good position with a weak squad remember he gave us the weak squad. 

What makes this even more astounding is he has had 4+ years to make such a weak squad, with no pressure regarding results and very limited forced sales. To be in this position squad wise given that environment is mental. 

Add in some of the worst runs ever that would have got any other manager sacked. Factor in we crumble every time we get near top 6 - a repeated theme. Consider his ludicrous playing players out of position. And there's the comments and slurs to fans. Put that all together and why would you want him anywhere near your club? 

[47er]

25 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

My view is that it simply is indicative of some of our fickle supporters! 

Yeah, it would be.

[Bigdoggsteel]

46 minutes ago, Blue blood said:

Whilst I get our league position is creditable given the squad we have there are a few factors that make me want to get rid of TM. 

Yes, it is a good position for the resources that we have but it's entirely TMs fault we have the resources/team that we do. He's the reason we have a paper thin squad. He's spunked so much on unneeded squad filler and his mates, he's overly relied on loans and he's not renewed contracts. it's beginning to come home to roost but if he has us in a good position with a weak squad remember he gave us the weak squad. 

What makes this even more astounding is he has had 4+ years to make such a weak squad, with no pressure regarding results and very limited forced sales. To be in this position squad wise given that environment is mental. 

Add in some of the worst runs ever that would have got any other manager sacked. Factor in we crumble every time we get near top 6 - a repeated theme. Consider his ludicrous playing players out of position. And there's the comments and slurs to fans. Put that all together and why would you want him anywhere near your club? 

This is really the only issue to me. If he manages to get over that hump this season, a strong argument could certainly be made to offer him a new deal. Personally I still wouldn't though. I don't think it would be a case of building on it next season. He could leave with his stock high and we would be a relatively attractive option for a new manager. Win/Win 

[arbitro]

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

My view is that it simply is indicative of some of our fickle supporters! 

Does that fickleness apply to supporters who are critical of Mowbray and Waggott?

In your quest for the moral high ground you are guilty of double standards.

[tomphil]

Brereton suffered being messed around badly by the manager when he first arrived. He carried a huge price tag which didn't help as it naturally created expectation. Not his fault and certainly not fans fault who after seeing the biggest money splashed since Jordan Rhodes were entitled to expect a little bit of bang for the bucks.

The player himself though wasn't putting enough effort in on the pitch, nothing like he does now. He looked poor and lacking confidence but in the eyes of fans effort can cover over for that.  There wasn't enough and that led to what was nothing more than a few grumbles and moans on matchday. 

Not the first of last player to get that at any club but all this 'booing' accusations is utter nonsense. Please point us to any really loud examples of this at Ewood or away apart from the one game where the patience of a few pissheads snapped ?  That was an abject effort by both player and team at the time and if it actually gave him a kick up the backside then it did more good than harm.

In truth it took a break from Ewood, a new manager putting faith in him and playing in a different approach to really set him alight. 

There is nothing more fickle than people trying to play both sides, people who've moaned themselves at times how poor hes been. If you want an example of real shameful treatment of a player look no further that Villa fans treatment of Gestede.  

The two scenarios don't remotely compare.

Edited November 18, 2021 by tomphil

[Mattyblue]

That’s the thing with TM, remember this is a two way thing.

If he decides to go at the end of the season (as I still think there’s every chance of a new deal offer), as he sees the writing on the wall budget wise, he has without doubt boosted his reputation after his stint here (you may think otherwise, but I certainly get that impression from those within the game) and he will definitely have chances of other decent jobs.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Mattyblue

[Armchair supporter supremo]

2 hours ago, Paul Mani said:

there’s also a sense of shame as a Rovers fan as to how he was judged. The booing of him a year or two ago is probably an all time low for us as a fan base.

 

he spent 3 years earning 10s of thousands a month for contributing very little. Yes that was largely down to the Our clown if a manager Mowbray not having a clur of what to dibwith him and molly codling him for years at the clubs expense, but still footballers rarely get sympathy from me unless its very bad injuries or serious personal issues that are effecting them. 

 

also i don't yhink he's half as good as gis currently being made out, not a fan of "confidence players"  great players are like machines, they just go out and do tge business week after week regardless of how hey feel

[1864roverite]

2 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Bit like those that used to rant about the owners on a daily basis, but now go in to bat for them instead…

And once again MB you are misguided in your attempt at besmirching me! My views on the owners have not changed since day 1 you really should take a hard look at my posts and read them properly😜

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, 47er said:

Yeah, it would be.

Am I not entitled to a view 47 or is that exclusive to your good self?

[Mattyblue]

1 minute ago, 1864roverite said:

And once again MB you are misguided in your attempt at besmirching me! My views on the owners have not changed since day 1 you really should take a hard look at my posts and read them properly😜

So you still want the club sold? 

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

Does that fickleness apply to supporters who are critical of Mowbray and Waggott?

In your quest for the moral high ground you are guilty of double standards.

Absolute bollocks Arbitro my views and opinion remain consistent be it the owners, mowbray and/or waggot.

[1864roverite]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

So you still want the club sold? 

I want what is the best for the club whether its new owners, the current owners or whether it is a fan based ownership. My views are the same as ever since day 1 regarding the owners

[Blue blood]

1 hour ago, Bigdoggsteel said:

This is really the only issue to me. If he manages to get over that hump this season, a strong argument could certainly be made to offer him a new deal. Personally I still wouldn't though. I don't think it would be a case of building on it next season. He could leave with his stock high and we would be a relatively attractive option for a new manager. Win/Win 

Appreciate the thought out response. For me (as my post details) there's a lot of other cautions. Besides even focussing on the one crumbling issue even if he stayed the course to playoffs for the season but didn't go up do you think the evidence is there that he would do it again? I'd say it'd be more against than for based on his history here. 

I think your point on building is spot on though. For all the talk of journeys we very much are a short term operation. We've done two resets in the past two seasons plus have 2 or 3 years before that and seen little building. So would agree he's not a builder either. 

[Mattyblue]

15 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

I want what is the best for the club whether its new owners, the current owners or whether it is a fan based ownership. My views are the same as ever since day 1 regarding the owners

Well they aren’t the same views then, are they?

As you used to post some mega rants on here telling them to sell up ASAP…

fickle fans indeed.

[1864roverite]

22 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Well they aren’t the same views then, are they?

As you used to post some mega rants on here telling them to sell up ASAP…

fickle fans indeed.

And pray tell please highlight were I have changed my views on the ownership of the club?

 

[Mattyblue]

Because now you are not demanding they sell the club ASAP, seems fairly clear cut really, 1864.

Edited November 18, 2021 by Mattyblue

[arbitro]

49 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Absolute bollocks Arbitro my views and opinion remain consistent be it the owners, mowbray and/or waggot.

So anybody who criticises Brereton is fickle but criticising the owners, Mowbray or Waggott is allowed. I took humbrage with your description of fans as fickle for criticising Brereton but you can slate the others with impunity it seems. That in my book is double standards.

[Oldgregg86]

I’ve never seen a player as bad as Ben get so much in ground support in my 25 years of watching rovers. 

Edited November 18, 2021 by Oldgregg86

[47er]

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

Am I not entitled to a view 47 or is that exclusive to your good self?

Of course-- we can both say what we think! 

 

1 hour ago, 1864roverite said:

Absolute bollocks Arbitro

Is Arbitro not entitled to one then!

[rigger]

19 minutes ago, Oldgregg86 said:

I’ve never seen a player as bad as Ben get so much in ground support in my 25 years of watching rovers. 

Beamo !

[1864roverite]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

So anybody who criticises Brereton is fickle but criticising the owners, Mowbray or Waggott is allowed. I took humbrage with your description of fans as fickle for criticising Brereton but you can slate the others with impunity it seems. That in my book is double standards.

Have it your way then at no point have I advocated either of the scenarios you paint I simply said it epitomises SOME of our fans and yes I will stand by my point about them being fickle

[arbitro]

2 minutes ago, 1864roverite said:

Have it your way then at no point have I advocated either of the scenarios you paint I simply said it epitomises SOME of our fans and yes I will stand by my point about them being fickle

What scenarios have I painted? You used the word fickle as you say it epitomises some of our fans who criticised Brereton but your continual criticism of Mowbray and Waggott is not fickle. Can you not see any difference?

My point is anybody can be criticised as they are in the public eye. Providing it doesn't get personal that is.

[1864roverite]

I don't believe that I have ever swayed from my opinion on the owners/TM or SW so no I am not fickle.

In respect of BB, you should go do a little research, I have always said he was a good player, a valuable player when played in the correct position and I can never get my head around why Mowbray played him in the manner in which he has done until this season.

As for being critical, I am in agreement to a large extent, you put yourself out there to be shot at.

By the way, impunity for me being critical? Oh please, I said that some of our supporters are fickle. I stand by it, there are some on here, there are some at the ground and there are others over the world. 

Being fickle about TM/SW? Not me at all, my viewpoint hasnt changed at all.