Summer Transfer Window

[simongarnerisgod]

Just now, Paul Mani said:

Oh no. Bauer is BANG average and I’d have taken Tosin all day over.

There is no difference between a fully fit Derek Williams and Patrick Bauer. They’re both middle of the road Championship defenders.

As for stats, well our outgoing keeper just had the joint best ever record for clean sheets and is seemingly one of the worst keepers to grace Ewood park. ?

All about opinions of course but I watched  Bauer at the end of his time with Charlton and probably 5 or 6 times at PNE and he’s basically a 7/10 run of the mill cb. Anyone who says anything different (Including mr elite football lol) Is just trying to further their own agenda.

We dodged a bullet last season and got a FAR better cb. Get Del fully fit and a good lb in and we’re in no worse situation than had Bauer signed. 

got to disagree about williams,he`s a weak and unreliable centre back who is bullied by anyone with muscle(stockley for pne completely owned him) and as a left back is an accident waiting to happen,one of the players we need to get shut of if we are ever going to mount a play off challenge,bauer might not be anything  special but he`s far superior to williams

[Admiral Nelsen]

Just now, Paul Mani said:

The only money we’re getting from Raya is if they go up. Have you actually watched him play this season? Same shit...sublime to the ridiculous.

Will prob get him a lovely raise though. Beautifully timed with his award too ?

Brentford seem to be on Sky quite a bit, so I've noticed a couple. There was one at Hull which was an incredible error, worse than Walton ever conjured up (although appropriately I think he produced a worldie in the same game if I remember rightly, sublime to ridiculous indeed!)

I still think three million was a bit too cheap given that he's young for that position and there is still time for him to progress into being a very good keeper. But that's obviously not guaranteed by any stretch, so if they go up and we get an extra couple of million we might yet have got the better end of that detail, jury is still out. 

[tomphil]

10 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Oh no. Bauer is BANG average and I’d have taken Tosin all day over.

There is no difference between a fully fit Derek Williams and Patrick Bauer. They’re both middle of the road Championship defenders.

As for stats, well our outgoing keeper just had the joint best ever record for clean sheets and is seemingly one of the worst keepers to grace Ewood park. ?

All about opinions of course but I watched  Bauer at the end of his time with Charlton and probably 5 or 6 times at PNE and he’s basically a 7/10 run of the mill cb. Anyone who says anything different (Including mr elite football lol) Is just trying to further their own agenda.

We dodged a bullet last season and got a FAR better cb. Get Del fully fit and a good lb in and we’re in no worse situation than had Bauer signed. 

Lazy comparison ? for a start one is a left back recently converted to CH and has not much more than a handful of games in that position last season.

Plus you've actually answered the point most are trying to make in saying Bauer is a steady 7/10 Championship defender. JHC man isn't that exactly what we need to pair up the our other one ??????

Tosin and his like are simply expensive luxuries that only pay of if you get yourself into contention for promotion. Otherwise pointless really COMPARED to building your own defense to serve you season in season out and provide a proper steady if not spectacular platform to build a team on.

The only one pushing an agenda as usual is you with your painful i know everything attitude.

Edited July 26, 2020 by tomphil

[roversfan99]

Just now, Paul Mani said:

Oh no. Bauer is BANG average and I’d have taken Tosin all day over.

There is no difference between a fully fit Derek Williams and Patrick Bauer. They’re both middle of the road Championship defenders.

As for stats, well our outgoing keeper just had the joint best ever record for clean sheets and is seemingly one of the worst keepers to grace Ewood park. ?

All about opinions of course but I watched  Bauer at the end of his time with Charlton and probably 5 or 6 times at PNE and he’s basically a 7/10 run of the mill cb. Anyone who says anything different (Including mr elite football lol) Is just trying to further their own agenda.

We dodged a bullet last season and got a FAR better cb. Get Del fully fit and a good lb in and we’re in no worse situation than had Bauer signed. 

Is Derrick Williams a middle of the road Championship defender?! I must have been watching a different player in the last 4 years.

Is a 7/10 defender who heads away more balls than anyone in the league a pretty desirable thing to have! We would certainly take that now. Instead we downplayed his chance of starting for us (he would walk into our defence) and let him go, in the end getting a temporary CB (who is obviously far better technically but a FAR better cb? Lenihan is a better defender than Adarabioyo I would suggest) which on the back of a mid table finish has left a hole again that could have been permanently fixed. Dodged a bullet? Do me a favour.

Mr elite football? Agenda? You've lost me.

Clean sheet record? I am not sure from when that record is, but he conceded 63 goals this season, surely that is the most important stat, and it is still bottom half level defending and has cost us.

Just now, Paul Mani said:

The only money we’re getting from Raya is if they go up. Have you actually watched him play this season? Same shit...sublime to the ridiculous.

Will prob get him a lovely raise though. Beautifully timed with his award too ?

I have seen him play and he definitely has improved, he looks far less eccentric, I am sure coupled with playing for a team that prioritises its defence. He will always make errors, goalkeepers do, its the quantity that is important and it has come right down this season. So has the number of goals that have gone into his net.

I will say that he did not fill me with confidence and I will not pretend that I was his biggest fan. It is the low fee, coupled with how we used that and the inferior temporary replacement that came in that rankles.

Again, it goes back to forward planning. We could have easily had a permanent, talented goalkeeper and a solid and reliable partner for Lenihan at the moment. Instead, we have a poor striker. 

 

[bigbrandjohn]

12 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

The only money we’re getting from Raya is if they go up. Have you actually watched him play this season? Same shit...sublime to the ridiculous.

Will prob get him a lovely raise though. Beautifully timed with his award too ?

Golden gloves suggests better quality Shyte?

[Stuart]

21 minutes ago, JHRover said:

So we are by some accounts absolutely skint, to the point we are sending Tosin back early to avoid paying him and, again according to some also have to make cutbacks for FFP compliance which may result in us having to sell at least one of our prized assets, possibly putting us in serious relegation danger next year, yet we can find the money to make expensive gestures such as these in the hope we manage to get a reputation as a nice club that will 'look after' players.

Madness.

Hope that reputation helps when we are fighting relegation and attendances have continued to plummet after refusing to refund fans out of pocket.

Hart, Smallwood, are these not the very definition of non contributing players having barely appeared for the last 12 months and have been very well paid in the meantime?

Didn’t say I agreed with it. I was suggesting why Mowbray did it - and trying to find a positive.

No way would I have given out month long extensions in our apparently precarious financial state (at a day-to-day level) but the mistake was giving these players new deals in the first place rather than just this last month.

[Paul Mani]

Just now, tomphil said:

Lazy comparison for a start one is a left back recently converted to CH and has not much more than a handful of games in that position last season.

Plus you've actually answered the point most are trying to make in saying Bauer is a steady 7/10 Championship defender. JHC man isn't that exactly what we need to pair up the our other one ??????

Tosin and his like are simply expensive luxuries that only pay of if you get yourself into contention for promotion. Otherwise pointless really COMPARED to building your own defense to serve you season in season out and provide a proper steady if not spectacular platform to build a team on.

The only one pushing an agenda as usual is you with your painful i know everything attitude.

Williams is actually a CB who was converted to a LB but let’s leave it there..

When fit and playing alongside Lenihan he was pretty much a 7/10 guy. Yeah he’s going to struggle against big guys like Stockley but no more so than Bauer does against pace. By definition as 7/10 guys they’re going to have obvious failings.

I still don’t understand this “building our own defence” rhetoric...are you saying you’d rather have an inferior player on a two year contract than a better player on loan for a season? If so I’m completely blown away.

I just want us to have the best players possible and Tosin is considerably better than Bauer.

Replacing the inconsistent Raya with The equally inconsistent Walton was arguable. Signing Tosin over Bauer was a bloody master stroke. The end.

[USABlue]

20 hours ago, Mercer said:

IMO, looking at cheaper replacements for players to be sold!

Think there's a good chance Travis is off if we are looking at Whiteman - would net Rovers a couple of £million or so.

What makes you think that Merc?  Would bother me he is probably my favourite player.at.the moment.

[tomphil]

10 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Williams is actually a CB who was converted to a LB but let’s leave it there..

When fit and playing alongside Lenihan he was pretty much a 7/10 guy. Yeah he’s going to struggle against big guys like Stockley but no more so than Bauer does against pace. By definition as 7/10 guys they’re going to have obvious failings.

I still don’t understand this “building our own defence” rhetoric...are you saying you’d rather have an inferior player on a two year contract than a better player on loan for a season? If so I’m completely blown away.

I just want us to have the best players possible and Tosin is considerably better than Bauer.

Replacing the inconsistent Raya with The equally inconsistent Walton was arguable. Signing Tosin over Bauer was a bloody master stroke. The end.

You don't understand building our own defense ?  I'd despair but i'm not really surprised.

Tosin over Bauer and an alleged million quid cost attached to it leaving us well out of the play offs, behind the other guy in the table and now back to square one with poss no money is a masterstroke ?  Turned out a decent signing in the end but that counts for zero now absolutely nothing unless you're the player himself of his parent club.

Just how in the grand scheme of things is it we could easily be sitting here saying Bauer done ok he didn't cost anything and we are looking at a decent partnership next season.  That might been seen as a masterstroke getting a guy in for nothing and it working out.

You dig yourself into some holes on here at times ?

As for Williams he was signed here as a left back, has played most of his time here at left back then at his own request wanted to only be considered as a center half after a few games there. That's all that matters, the End.

Edited July 26, 2020 by tomphil

[tugayislegend]

Bournemouth going down means king is off = 20% sell on clause

[Paul Mani]

9 minutes ago, bigbrandjohn said:

Golden gloves suggests better quality Shyte?

Walton has had more clean sheets than he had at Rovers. Does that mean he’s better? Of course not. You can read stats anyway you like.

Im pretty sure Raya’s agent has released the story about Arsenal and City on the same day he receives the award to get him a new contract. I don’t see Raya being nearly good enough to get in either of those teams. Just my opinion.

[dingles staying down 4ever]

1 hour ago, Angry_Pirate said:

Here's a thought Tony... let's not sell off our "star" younger players for peanuts again this summer, instead let's not keep giving long term contracts and extentions to L1 and past it players. 

Smallwood, Hart, Leutwiler and Samuel combined probably cost £1-1.5m in wages this past season... basically half of what we sold Raya for went to pay them 4 last year. Let that sink in.

Mulgrew and his £20k a week will cost that much next season on his own, Evans, Johnson, Bennett and Downing* will cost around £3-4m next year in wages.

But instead, lets sell Nyambe or Travis to cover those 5 players wages for a year. 

So who is likely to be wanted Mulgrew on 20k a week or Travis. Easy to say get shut of Mulgrew and the like and keep Travis.

If the instruction from the money men is we need cash and quick then it is the saleable assets that have to go not Deadwood, unless you pay them up.

[Wing Wizard Windy Miller]

14 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Williams is actually a CB who was converted to a LB but let’s leave it there..

When fit and playing alongside Lenihan he was pretty much a 7/10 guy. Yeah he’s going to struggle against big guys like Stockley but no more so than Bauer does against pace. By definition as 7/10 guys they’re going to have obvious failings.

I still don’t understand this “building our own defence” rhetoric...are you saying you’d rather have an inferior player on a two year contract than a better player on loan for a season? If so I’m completely blown away.

I just want us to have the best players possible and Tosin is considerably better than Bauer.

Replacing the inconsistent Raya with The equally inconsistent Walton was arguable. Signing Tosin over Bauer was a bloody master stroke. The end.

Expensive loan signings like Tosin over a permanent signing like Bauer are only a master stroke if that bit of extra class gets you promoted.

Now we're stuck trying to play this passing game that Tony rambles on about - which he based on Tosin playing out through the press. Now we are without the only player who could make it work and no CB.

Not such a master stroke.

[Exiled_Rover]

7 minutes ago, dingles staying down 4ever said:

So who is likely to be wanted Mulgrew on 20k a week or Travis. Easy to say get shut of Mulgrew and the like and keep Travis.

If the instruction from the money men is we need cash and quick then it is the saleable assets that have to go not Deadwood, unless you pay them up.

I'd pay half of Mulgrew's wages for a year if it got him off the books. You'd still be saving £500k a year. 

[Exiled_Rover]

2 minutes ago, Wing Wizard Windy Miller said:

Expensive loan signings like Tosin over a permanent signing like Bauer are only a master stroke if that bit of extra class gets you promoted.

Now we're stuck trying to play this passing game that Tony rambles on about - which he based on Tosin playing out through the press. Now we are without the only player who could make it work and no CB.

Not such a master stroke.

I mean it works if you have a CM who can pass too - which we don't currently have. 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

So was paying 1 million for 1 season for a CB a gamble worth paying? Id say for a limited budget Championship side that failed to get anywhere near the promotion race then no.

[chaddyrovers]

53 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I certainly did not even hint that I expect academy players to be of that standard. For example my analysis of Carter was from a Championship game v Luton in which his game was riddled with errors, not because he didnt play like Phil Jones. I havent written him off, I just dont think he is ready at this time.

Surely Bauer should have been prioritised based on the fact that he would have been a longer term solution?

From what I have seen, he is a very capable Championship CB, I think he won the most aeriel duels in the League this season, Preston conceded 9 less goals than us this season. To compare him to Williams seems a little strange.

I wasn't saying you want them to be Phil Jones standard but some people do. Why haven't mention Carter's performance vs Reading was he was very good. Yes he made mistakes but if we had a better number 1 behind him and left back, he wouldn't have made as many. The own goal he scored wouldn't have happened if we had Brad Friedel in goal. Walton's communication is woeful. We need experience keeper who can command the area and good communication skills aswell Shot stopper skills. 

On Bauer, he is mid table Championship centre defender. I would say Tosin is better all round game than Bauer who is old fashioned style defender

52 minutes ago, neophox said:

Will Derrick and Charlie still be here in september?

 

I really hope we give Scott Wharton a run out in pre season. Promoted with northampton and probably their best player. Thats good experience for a young lad coming in to a rovers team.

Hope Both are gone. 

I would like Wharton to be given his chance here. Judging by his comments online in the Lancashire Telegraph he wants to break into the first team here, 

16 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

 

I have seen him play and he definitely has improved, he looks far less eccentric, I am sure coupled with playing for a team that prioritises its defence. He will always make errors, goalkeepers do, its the quantity that is important and it has come right down this season. So has the number of goals that have gone into his net.

I will say that he did not fill me with confidence and I will not pretend that I was his biggest fan. It is the low fee, coupled with how we used that and the inferior temporary replacement that came in that rankles.

Again, it goes back to forward planning. We could have easily had a permanent, talented goalkeeper and a solid and reliable partner for Lenihan at the moment. Instead, we have a poor striker. 

 

Raya still made the same mistakes he had done during his time here. I think @Sparks Rover's comments on Raya all round game today is spot on. 

WE have been over and over the situation is that we have 2 keepers lined up and both fell through at the last hurdle sadly. I don't have names. We tried for Darlow last summer but his wages were outside our budget and couldn't afford him. We got a solid and reliable partner in Adarabioyo next to Lenihan. 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

Just now, Exiled_Rover said:

I'd pay half of Mulgrew's wages for a year if it got him off the books. You'd still be saving £500k a year. 

Only an option if he agrees to it. If you pay that then maybe Rovers may stump up the other half.

[Paul Mani]

1 minute ago, Wing Wizard Windy Miller said:

Expensive loan signings like Tosin over a permanent signing like Bauer are only a master stroke if that bit of extra class gets you promoted.

Now we're stuck trying to play this passing game that Tony rambles on about - which he based on Tosin playing out through the press. Now we are without the only player who could make it work and no CB.

Not such a master stroke.

We don’t know how expensive Tosin was for us.

Totally agree that they have to find a another very good cb and if they can’t then it will lead to criticism. But I still can’t fathom the rationale that we would even dream of wanting someone like Bauer for 2/3 years. Is literally the epitome of decent....average.

[roversfan99]

@Paul Mani how is Bauer now sub standard? You described him as 7 out of 10, which is far from sub standard. Also claiming that Williams is a 7 out of 10 standard Championship defender which is crazy.

How is replacing Raya with Walton "arguable?" Walton is clearly more error prone and again critically, no longer our player.

You sign a loan player ideally to push you on that final last step. I suspect that after a mid table season, that it is pretty obvious that if we had Raya and Bauer at this moment in time, we would be in a better place than just having Gallagher. If we signed that level of player this summer youd be over the moon. Now we have a real task on our hand filling those 2 positions.

[Exiled_Rover]

Just now, dingles staying down 4ever said:

Only an option if he agrees to it. If you pay that then maybe Rovers may stump up the other half.

If we paid £10k a week and his new club paid £10k a week, what's there to agree to? He's not going to sign a new contract at the same rate with anyone - and he's certainly not going to be playing for us.

I guess it depends on whether he wants to sit on his arse for a year.

 

[LDRover]

9 minutes ago, Paul Mani said:

Omg. You genuinely do wish we’d signed a sub standard defender just so we could call him our own! ?

Argh, embarrassing ??

I'm really struggling with the point you are trying to make here.

Sign Bauer cheaply, stay up, spend time in the play offs, borrow Tosin, spend roughly the same, stay up, briefly threaten the play offs but stay up regardless.

Only with the former we'd have an asset, possibly a profitable one and there'd be less of a panic to plug a glaring hole.

And that's before your subjective view that he's a better defender. Tosin is definitely a better 'footballer', not sure he's a better 'defender'.

[Paul Mani]

Just now, roversfan99 said:

@Paul Mani how is Bauer now sub standard? You described him as 7 out of 10, which is far from sub standard. Also claiming that Williams is a 7 out of 10 standard Championship defender which is crazy.

How is replacing Raya with Walton "arguable?" Walton is clearly more error prone and again critically, no longer our player.

You sign a loan player ideally to push you on that final last step. I suspect that after a mid table season, that it is pretty obvious that if we had Raya and Bauer at this moment in time, we would be in a better place than just having Gallagher. If we signed that level of player this summer youd be over the moon. Now we have a real task on our hand filling those 2 positions.

Sub standard to Tosin!? Absolutely. 

[dingles staying down 4ever]

1 minute ago, Exiled_Rover said:

If we paid £10k a week and his new club paid £10k a week, what's there to agree to? He's not going to sign a new contract at the same rate with anyone - and he's certainly not going to be playing for us.

I guess it depends on whether he wants to sit on his arse for a year.

 

so which half are you paying?

I agree that no one is going to pay him what he is on here but I cant see many going to pay half in the present climate. Heard on Talksport the other week of a young premiership squad player being shocked that he was only being offered wages of around £700/week to join a Championship club. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by dingles staying down 4ever

[davulsukur]

Tosin won't be getting in the city squad, will he? 

Chances of another loan late in the window. All parties might be up for that, as he got game time here.

Of course, we can't leave it late in the window to bring a CB in (which might not happen anyway) but it would be good if we could get him back.