Future Plans/Strategies

[Leonard Venkhater]

4 minutes ago, Kie_BRFC said:

So basically we should accept being a midtable team, cut all expenses back in order to aim for a midtable  finish?  Might as well pack it in a supporter now if that's what we should aim for.

Aiming for Premier League football isn't just about earning a huge pay cheque (which we do need), but it's about playing against the best week in week out. Whether we get there or not is up for debate, but the thought of watching us deliberately try and finish midtable in this division is nauseating 

10 years and...counting

[Hoochie Bloochie Mama]

28 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Who would you like to see? I don’t disagree with this. I think it’s a strong majority of it for sure.

No idea Joe, but managers like McCarthy and Warnock have been in the game a long time for a reason. But if those Nixon reports are true and we're looking at a foreign coach then you'd hope Venkys employ the same advisers as Barnsley. 

[Herbie6590]

41 minutes ago, JoeH said:

I just think you can maturely debate something without resorting to stuff like that. No need.

I submitted a considered reply to your article on Rovers Chat BTW in the interests of mature debate....but it hasn’t been published 🤨

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, Herbie6590 said:

I submitted a considered reply to your article on Rovers Chat BTW in the interests of mature debate....but it hasn’t been published 🤨

I’m sorry to hear that. I don’t really have anything to do with it, was just a guest write. Post it here mate I’d love to look at it

[TheRovers1994]

The academy is key to our future, sell arma and nyambe if he won't sign a new deal, we have costello as a right back and pike who is the brightest talent I've seen in a long time who will be better than nyambe, woukd rather buy cheap and sell big than spent millions on players, the academy is our future thats why maintaining its status is key to this clubs success, Southampton rebuilt on their academy and cayse of that they have been in the 9remier league for nearly a decade now with a cup final and European campaign to boot. 

We rely too much on Armstrong and its clear his ego has gotten too big for him now not really much of a team player hence why we've played well in tbe 2 games hes been out and dack has scored twice when you could see his frustrations with arma before. 

We have more exciting talent in our youth ranks than ever before, I've taken great interest in our 23s/21s and 18s for a while I've watched a lot of 23s this season thanks to live streams by other clubs and thankfully rovers have started streaming now cause of fans wishes and this is by far the most exciting the youth ranks have ever been, normally I could pick out a fair few who I think won't make it and don't but this season I think every player who's played for the 23s this season has a chance aslong as they stay grounded and continue in doing what they are doing, pike, burns, eastham, brennan,fresh out the 18s have been superb and impressed me every time, then you have the others like saddi, Whitehall, durrant who have come through with them along with older more established like Barnes, Thompson, ainnesley, then another recruit Nolan a boyhood rovers fan from Pne who had been superb since he arrived.

You don't need to spend millions to compete you just need a policy and structure and plan that everybody believes in, we have the luxury of a top class academy to help us, for me mowbray needs to go and let a new man come in with ideas to take us to the next level but I can't see it happening till summer 2022 when mowbrays deal is us so he will be allowed one last throw of the dice, but they way he's been talking about the future and taking about a new manager and he hopes they don't undo the foundations he's set he's only aiming to leave us in a strong position and his job his done like a Middlesbrough and take a break from the game, he's gone from talking promotion and us being a premier league club to talking it down and talking about another manager so clearly he knows his job now and waggot won't be around much longer to back him up as there are rumours of his retirement 

[Dreams of 1995]

If any manager came to this club and was asked to put the idea of Premier League in a box, then took the job, I would not want that manager in charge.

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

What are the future plans and strategies of our great owners...is there anybody there?

Hello! HELLO!! HELLO!!!

[MarkBRFC]

1 hour ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

If any manager came to this club and was asked to put the idea of Premier League in a box, then took the job, I would not want that manager in charge.

Mowbray then basically, I'm guessing this would suit him very much despite what nonsense he comes out with.

[Guest]

The thing is, I think we can all recognise that it shouldn't come to theorising online about what a better plan is in the first place. There's no debating whether the system we're currently using has worked, it simply hasn't. Whether thats the manager, recruitment, youth development or whatever, it isn't working.

Besides, "new manager" I don't really anyone suggesting an alternative. Whilst I think most of the disagreement to these ideas is probably justified, and I don't discourage anyone from disagreeing with it, I also think its important that other suggestions are put forward too.

Should the owners go all for it and spent tens of millions to try and assemble a squad. They'd have two season max to go up before FFP struck, but maybe thats the solution? For me, we're stuck in this nether space where were spending money here and there that's nowhere near enough to make us Premier League quality, but also so much that continues to drive our debt into the sky. For me you either have to cut costs and reduce debt, or actually give it a go. Doing neither is leaving us stagnated, and in a very vulnerable position.

Edited March 11, 2021 by JoeH

[LDRover]

4 hours ago, JoeH said:

Do you think the best of championship managers could see us promoted without Armstrong and Elliott?

Or another take on it, could Mowbray get Cardiff or Barnsley into the positions they currently are in the league?

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, LDRover said:

Or another take on it, could Mowbray get Cardiff or Barnsley into the positions they currently are in the league?

Considering the signings and money he's spent here, just to have us bang middle of the road i suspect he'd be taking clubs like that the other way.

Maybe at Barnsley with a small squad he'd have to keep the same team so that might help keep them midtable.

At Cardiff he'd have far more to rotate the arse off and mess around with every game. So i'd wager they'd be very similar to what we are now under him.

[Oldgregg86]

7 hours ago, JoeH said:

Welcome the debate 100% from those willing to talk about it maturely!

I'd love to hear the alternatives. I think personally that a budget of £5m for the summer gets us absolutely nowhere but even further into debt. To make this side promotion worthy, not just scraping 6th worthy, but promotion worthy, it would take a hell of a lot more than that £5m budget once the likes of Elliott and others are gone.

This summer we'll spend roughly that figure, build a squad that we'll be told is promotion candidate worthy, fall short and recycle the exact same strategy again next season. I think it's failing us and making us less and less and less a sustainable club with a long term future. Every single year we attempt this and fail we just head further and further down the same rabbit hole.

I've presented an alternative. Lord knows Brentford operate this way and have managed to grow slowly, yet sustainably over the last five years. They've developed and developed their youth system (albeit slightly different to ours in their B team structure), sold their valuable assets and reinvested. I think it's plausible to operate at least some of what has been suggested in the article to try and make the club less of a debt creating mess year on year.

I think we can all acknowledge that what we're trying right now isn't working. The question is what is the alternative. I've attempted to put one idea forward, maybe you disagree with it, but what's your alternative?

I agree it isn’t working now and in theory your idea would be the next best solution. However from the venkys down to the goalkeeping coach I don’t believe we could ever be anything like Brentford . You need the right people working together with the clubs best interests . We neither have the talent or the people with the clubs interest to attempt your suggestion, sadly

[roversfan99]

@JoeH

1. "15th can be achieved with a small budget." How have you managed to conclude that using a system where we sell all of our best players, dont spend hardly any of that money, dont have any wages of over 10k and throw any ambition to one side, that are league position would remain largely unchanged! Makes absolutely no sense.

2. With such a set up, how do you expect us to churn out 22m worth of player sales each year if we arent investing in players to begin with?

3. With such a reliance on the academy, what happens when we go through inevitable dry spells in regards to prospects breaking through? It is not a reasonable expectation to churn out a number of new graduates into the first team every single year.

4. "Forget the Premier League." What is the point if you have absolutely no ambition? Why does it have to be either wreckless spending (as if we do that!) or total cutbacks. 

5. Ayala, Dack and Gallagher will all be on more than 10k and have at least 2 years left. Do we have to wait to start this plan?

6. Why is the default argument to avoid becoming Bolton or Bury? They are totally different situations, and how can you be content with the club merely surviving as if thats a badge of honour?

7. "Lord knows Brentford operate this way and have managed to grow slowly." No they dont. Toney cost 10m, they certainly do not work on a 500k transfer fee cap. They do not heavily rely on their youth set up. They are very much in the hunt for promotion, they dont pretend the Premier League doesnt exist. They place plenty of importance in their manager and scouting network, things you havent touched on. They dont play pragmatic football.

Breaking even at Championship level is incredibly difficult, and can not be done by totally abandoning any notion of ambition. Selling players for a profit and then via an impressive scouting system and adept management and coaching, signing and improving replacements, maybe. What you suggest? No chance, we would go down within a couple of years.

Our current method isnt working, but that is because recruitment is massively flawed and the manager isnt up to the job, nor have we had a manager good enough to really compete since these clowns took over.

[SuperBrfc]

It's the "forget the Premier League" line that doesn't sit well with me. It might have been said hypothetically by the author, but that is exactly what a lot of the fan base has been conditioned into thinking. Not just that, it plays right into Mowbray and Waggott's hands.

Mowbray's talking down of the club, Waggott making out we are lucky to have Mowbray, the L1 promotion being milked for all it can. All of that creates a false notion that mid table Championship is ok and the best we can hope for. Do the pair of them want promotion? I seriously don't think they do. The proposal to sell off and downgrade our Premier League standard training facilities for no real reason says it all for me.

Unfortunately a number of fans seem to be content with mid table Championship these days. Waggott comes across as a 'normal' CEO, he isn't Shebby, Mowbray isn't Kean/Coyle and the club isn't Bolton or Wigan. All negative, miserable viewpoints, imo, that make mid table mediocrity seem appealing and weirdly comforting to some.

Joe obviously means well, I respect that he has put some time into coming up with a solution, so this isn't a slight on him. I just feel that Mowbray and Waggott would be smiling from ear to ear if they were to read that article. "Forget the Premier League" is music to their ears, though they will never admit it.

The plan suggested would, imo, result in us giving up hope and end any ambition to get back to where we used to be and also allow 'easy street' to continue unchallenged.

The only solution for me is for the owners to get a decent manager in and back a proper promotion push. After all, Mowbray told us the owners were excited after our L1 promotion and wanted to fund an immediate push for the Premier League but he had to "calm them down". It shows it is possible but only if the owners bite the bullet and make a bold decision.

[roversfan99]

10 hours ago, JoeH said:

Do you think? Fair enough. It’s probably the most common response but I just don’t know if the squad without Elliott, Nyambe, Armstrong etc... is promotion worthy with a £5m budget, no matter who the manager is

Do you mean with a 5m budget on top of the fees for Armstrong and Nyambe? If the answer is yes, then we wont spend that much. If no, then we will make a healthy profit this window without the need to aggressively lose any ambition.