Football Terminology

[JBiz]

5 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Totally agree, and that’s where Joe differed,  as he believes now calling it a ‘low block’ was a sign of ‘intelligence’ and ‘progressiveness’.

Individual nuances or phrases for this only ever get repeated if they’ve been successful. Where does low block come from?

The way it’s described here reminds me of watching football Italia in the 90s, when they’d call it a Catenacio

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

Well he didn’t mean that actually, as he dismissed those that discussed ‘football intelligence’.  He said it’s actually a sign of ‘intelligence’ if players, parrot like, regurgitated jargon.

That isn’t what makes an intelligent player, just like it doesn’t make for an ‘intelligent worker’ like that individual that constantly talks in jargon and acronyms in the wider world of work.

Yes, of course, there’s a place for data, for better tactical knowledge, indeed a vital place - but Joe often seems to forget about the human, the emotional, the nous element of playing and coaching.

I never said that talking jargon makes a player intelligent. I said that players understanding and putting this “jargon” into place is making them more intelligent. I also said there’s a huge difference between football intelligence and actual intelligence. A footballer with both is a gold mine.

[Mattyblue]

Surely it’s about the instructions themselves, explained to the player in a clear and concise way that shows good leadership and coaching, not a load of ‘progressive’ jargon?

Edited December 16, 2021 by Mattyblue

[Guest]

The suggestion by those on here who dismiss these new terms is that they’re only used to make the person using them sound clever - that’s been debunked. 

Unless there’s a further issue now of fear to change, as I suspect, I don’t understand how this is still a debate.

These terms are used within the game, it’s not self-righteous to say that, it’s just true. Sky pose an issue in their attempts to mainstream some of the technical jargon unnecessarily, but I don’t think these words are causing a major issue.

As JBiz has already said above, words wouldn’t stick around if they weren’t being used in the industry, so there’s obviously value in them. 

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Surely it’s about the instructions themselves, explained to the player in a clear and concise way that shows good leadership and coaching, not a load of ‘progressive’ jargon?

Yes… these terms DO explain instructions and tactical ideas to players in clear and concise ways. Players understand them and put them into practise from a very young age.

[Mattyblue]

Those in the game can use any term they want, a manager any method they want, who cares, it’s about results and what works.

It just amused me that you think it shows you are ‘intelligent’ and ‘progressive’ if you do. They’re just words and doesn’t imply anything of the sort. It’s the tactics themselves that show such qualities.

But as always Joe you have such a thin skin, everything is a personal affront.

Edited December 16, 2021 by Mattyblue

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

Those in the game can use any term they want, a manager any method they want, who cares, it’s about results and what works.

It just amused me that you think it shows you are ‘intelligent’ and ‘progressive’ if you do. They’re just words and doesn’t imply anything of the sort. It’s the tactics themselves that show such quantities.

But as always Joe you have such a thin skin, everything is a personal affront.

This makes such little sense I’m struggling to formulate a response to it.

[Mattyblue]

Well it does, but 👌

Edited December 16, 2021 by Mattyblue

[Ulrich]

3 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

Those in the game can use any term they want, a manager any method they want, who cares, it’s about results and what works.

It just amused me that you think it shows you are ‘intelligent’ and ‘progressive’ if you do. They’re just words and doesn’t imply anything of the sort. It’s the tactics themselves that show such quantities.

But as always Joe you have such a thin skin, everything is a personal affront.

An intelligent and articulate speaker alters their language in accordance with their audience. The whole point of speaking is to allow others to understand your thinking and if you choose words they do not comprehend, then the message or point you are trying to express is lost and your words are pointless.

[Mike E]

13 hours ago, JBiz said:

I think he was referring to players being more aware and understanding of the individual expectations of their role.

Not simply getting top grades in their GCSE’s

For instance, when I played football - my role was the person who keeps the ball out of the net and boots it to the strikers head from the ground or out my hands.

If id played for the same u10-u16 team now, (over in ossy, great to see them still going, and I know the manager / coach, they even have a GK coach in once a month now) I would’ve been taught slow and quick transition, organising defences on corners and free kicks, playing out from the back and positions out the box.

In 1996, If the same manager had seen me stood ten yards outside my box like Tommy K - would’ve been hammered from the touch line 😂 

The game has changed.

Like my coach when I was a defender:

'You head the ball and you kick the ball. When you have time with the ball, give to someone who can play.'

[Mike E]

7 hours ago, Ulrich said:

An intelligent and articulate speaker alters their language in accordance with their audience. The whole point of speaking is to allow others to understand your thinking and if you choose words they do not comprehend, then the message or point you are trying to express is lost and your words are pointless.

Exactly the point that both sides of this debate are making.

[DeeCee]

21 hours ago, Mike E said:

Like my coach when I was a defender:

'You head the ball and you kick the ball. When you have time with the ball, give to someone who can play.'

Brian Clough famously said similar 👍

[Mike E]

1 minute ago, DeeCee said:

Brian Clough famously said similar 👍

I think that's who he nicked it off. Similarly had a mantra of keeping it simple.

I subscribe.

[Ianrally]

“Football is a simple game based on the giving and taking of passes, of controlling the ball and making yourself available to receive a pass. It’s a terribly simple game”

”A football team is like a piano. You need eight men to carry it and three who can play the damn thing” 

William Shankly OBE

Please can someone translate these quotes into modern football jargon so that the intelligent among us can understand what is being said. 

[JohnD]

I was always told .....

The ball can go past you, a player can go past you, but never both at the same time

[roversfan99]

Apparently Scott Wharton is a "ball-progressor" known for his "vertical" passing.

[Mattyblue]

Plenty of ‘vertical passes’ from Darragh went straight to their centre halves last night…

[Guest]

25 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Apparently Scott Wharton is a "ball-progressor" known for his "vertical" passing.

He's not wrong. Both of his statements I'd agree with.

[Guest]

Just now, Mattyblue said:

Plenty of ‘vertical passes’ from Darragh went straight to their centre halves last night…

Yes they did, one great ball to Khadra early doors, but then struggled.

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, JoeH said:

He's not wrong. Both of his statements I'd agree with.

He may well not be, but especially with the word "vertical" it is just an attempt to seem more clued in. Just say forward.

[Mattyblue]

About 6 goals a game on average, some manager that Pep…

Edited January 22, 2022 by Mattyblue

[Upside Down]

On 21/01/2022 at 04:53, roversfan99 said:

Apparently Scott Wharton is a "ball-progressor" known for his "vertical" passing.

What the fuck is a vertical pass? Does that mean he boots it to the moon? What a load of bollocks.

[Guest]

On 22/01/2022 at 10:32, Mattyblue said:

About 6 goals a game on average, some manager that Pep…

Odd. I don't think is a football terminology thing, more so a misprint/error thing surely?

[Atko's Engine]

15 hours ago, Upside Down said:

What the fuck is a vertical pass? Does that mean he boots it to the moon? What a load of bollocks.

I'm guessing that, in the context of a low block meaning defending deep, then a vertical pass is a forwards one into midfield or the forwards, with progressor meaning carrying the ball forwards.

Maybe.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Atko's Engine

[Guest]

Yeah a 'strong progressor' refers to someone who gets the ball upfield and out of the defensive third, with runs, passes or both runs & passes. It just describes both abilities within one phrase.