The Dingles

[booth]

4 minutes ago, tomphil said:

I doubt they'll be competing with us unless HSH are getting a foot in their door.

Skint or not it's odds on their next appointment will be more ambitious than ours.

Still daft to sack Dyche as they’ve gone from a very good championship manager to the unknown.

Edited May 23, 2022 by booth

[roverandout]

3 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Burnley would be wise to avoid the lazy appointment of Jackson, how many times have we seen a novice take temporary charge, see a slight initial bounce followed by a struggle once permanently appointed. 

They would also be wise to avoid the sentimental appointment of a Barton or Duff, fans often have an obsession with former players but you don't pick managers based on what they do as a player.

The likes of Farke and Carvalhal are sadly going to be attracted much more to a side recently relegated but they would be the sensible type of appointments. They should have kept Dyche.

Hopefully they act irrationally of course because that first season down is crucial and if they mess it up they could become stuck.

 

No no by all means appoint Jackson.  Hes a very good coach who could lead Burnley back first time. *ahem* *bollocks* *bollocks*

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, booth said:

Still daft to sack Dyche as they’ve gone from a very good championship manager to the unknown.

Maybe Dyche being “ a very good championship manager “ wasn’t quite enough for a team in the Premier League.

[Mattyblue]

To give that lot six years in the PL says he certainly was…

[booth]

7 minutes ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Maybe Dyche being “ a very good championship manager “ wasn’t quite enough for a team in the Premier League.

They dropped without him and now they’ll need to bounce back without him. I don’t think they will.

[rigger]

5 minutes ago, booth said:

They dropped without him and now they’ll need to bounce back without him. I don’t think they will.

I hope they don't

[longsiders1882]

12 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

To give that lot six years in the PL says he certainly was…

Exactly this. If you step outside any rivalries etc it is remarkable that a club, from a town with a population of 80,000, with no major backers not only got there with Dyche but stayed there for 6 years, finished top 10 twice as billionaires spent money hand over fist, as much better financially backed clubs, with larger gates and deeper pockets floundered. If it wasn’t us you’d be lauding the club - and if it wasn’t us I would be too. I never expected to see it once in my lifetime so I don’t expect a rerun but boy it’s been some ride.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

2 minutes ago, longsiders1882 said:

Exactly this. If you step outside any rivalries etc it is remarkable that a club, from a town with a population of 80,000, with no major backers not only got there with Dyche but stayed there for 6 years, finished top 10 twice as billionaires spent money hand over fist, as much better financially backed clubs, with larger gates and deeper pockets floundered. If it wasn’t us you’d be lauding the club - and if it wasn’t us I would be too. I never expected to see it once in my lifetime so I don’t expect a rerun but boy it’s been some ride.

What was good enough previously for the Premier League isn’t good enough now. The Prem moved on and Dyche didn’t. That doesn’t make him a bad manager, he’d be welcome at Ewood as far as I’m concerned.

[sympatheticclaret]

1 hour ago, RevidgeBlue said:

Now now Chris, don't get cheeky, and there was me feeling sorry for you (for all of about 2 seconds) last night!

Hopefully from our point of view over the next two or three seasons we'll see the difference between our owners who despite their many and well documented faults appear able to absorb a £200m loss without batting an eyelid and yours who seem intent on fleecing the Club at a fairly exorbitant rate of interest.

Hi Revidge,

I think you may be confusing me ( Sympathetic Claret ) with my fellow supporter ( Longsiders1882 ) ... unless you know both of us and we're both called Chris !! Good to know it's not just me having " senior moments " ... 😁

Keep well, pal !

[longsiders1882]

1 minute ago, sympatheticclaret said:

Hi Revidge,

I think you may be confusing me ( Sympathetic Claret ) with my fellow supporter ( Longsiders1882 ) ... unless you know both of us and we're both called Chris !! Good to know it's not just me having " senior moments " ... 😁

Keep well, pal !

I just let it slide 😂

[longsiders1882]

25 minutes ago, goozburger said:

That's what Mr. Pace said about Burrrrnleeeee =]

Ba dum tish 

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, goozburger said:

I'm not convinced they'd have stayed up with him.

I think his sacking was more than what was happening on the pitch. Pace and his threepenny bit consortium don't strike me as the type willing to chuck millions away on a contract, only to install a caretaker to try to keep them up. Something doesn't smell right. Pace was brown-nosing Dyche as the man for the long term before his four year contract last summer. I did hear something on the grapevine.

 

 

[cesus]

I've just read on twitter that Burnley have borrowed against the 2nd down-payment from Newcastle of £12.5m for Chris Wood, at an eye watering 8-9% interest. It's from Kieran Maguire so I'd defo say it's legit. Pace (the club) has no cash!

[Mattyblue]

Good piece in the Daily Telegraph that outlines the mess (‘best run’, ‘sensibly run club’ labels certainly have parallels to BRFC c2010)…

 

By
Tom Morgan
and 
James Ducker
23 May 2022 • 10:15pm
Burnley will play in the Championship for the first time since 2016 next season

Over the four years since Burnley reached the heights of European qualification, the decline of the Premier League's "best-run club" began gradually and then, in recent months, went into freefall. 

Here Telegraph Sport dissects how the risky and contentious American leveraged buyout of a locally owned club leaves the Clarets facing the most expensive relegation in English football history.

Boardroom inertia immediately before the takeover 
Mike Garlick's ownership of Burnley was hailed as a beacon of footballing overachievement. Analysis by the University of Liverpool's Centre for Sports Business Group concluded in 2019 that Burnley were the "most sensibly run club in the Premier League financially". 

In June 2020, six months prior to the ALK takeover, there was £80million in the bank and minimal long-term debt. However, as he brokered a sale, the club's ability to bounce back from the Championship became a good deal more brittle than it had been after previous Premier League relegations in 2010 and 2015. 

Those close to the club say alarm bells began ringing in the weeks after the club enjoyed one its happiest days – May 5 2018, when the Clarets secured seventh spot and a return to European football for the first time in 51 years. To some disappointment there would be no ambitious signings that summer to build on the record arrival of the previous season, Chris Wood. 

As a result the squad's average age gradually rose and cumulative values fell, with pleas for renewal falling on deaf ears as Garlick put an apparent brake on spending while the prospect of a sale grew and negotiations with potential buyers took place.

The lack of Premier League safeguards 
With a £65million millstone now hanging around the club's neck, Burnley fans can quite rightly claim to have been failed by the system. Telegraph Sport reported a fortnight ago how the Football Association and Premier League are in talks about clamping down on leveraged buyouts as part of a new directors' and owners' test. 

But that will be of no comfort for a club which must now immediately start repaying a relegation clause connected with the takeover. The £170million deal secured by ALK Capital in December 2020 loaded the club with eye-watering levels of debt. Accounts published earlier this month show the fall to the Championship triggers the immediate repayment of “a significant proportion” of a £65million loan from US equity firm MSD Holdings. As a result, the initial parachute payment that gives most recently relegated clubs a head start will be of little help. 

Burnley are due to receive £42million in the first year from the top tier but that appears almost certain to be swallowed up, with Alan Pace’s ALK Capital also borrowing £37million from the club’s own bank to help finance the takeover. For a club now facing life without the Premier League TV money that currently accounts for 90 per cent of revenues, there will also be concern over interest rates for the debt within the club. 

The London Inter-bank offered rate is plus eight per cent and US private equity firms tend to use six or 12-month deals. The six-month rate is currently 1.8 per cent, which would make Burnley’s interest rate 9.8 per cent – around £6.5m a year.

Unanswered questions for ALK Capital 
Pace, a former Wall Street financier who led the US consortium ALK Capital, has described the exact details of the takeover as confidential. The level of debt within the club was only laid bare earlier this month in the annual accounts, which detail how, in the event of relegation, "steps to reduce costs and borrowings to a level which are more sustainable for a Championship club" will be required. 

"In the event of relegation, the directors are satisfied that the group will continue to have the support of its lenders," the accounts add. However, there remains some confusion over how much a club with a proud history of retaining cash reserves has in the bank as it stands. 


Earlier this month, for example, it emerged Burnley had taken out a £12.5million loan from Australian firm Macquarie Bank in order to effectively claim up front the second half of a transfer instalment from Chris Wood's sale to Newcastle. The striker had moved to St James' Park in January after Newcastle activated a £25million release clause, but the second £12.5million instalment is not due until February 2023. 

There was no immediate explanation for why Burnley had taken the money as a loan now, rather than wait 12 months for Newcastle to cough up the rest of the cash. Pace, who is a committed Mormon, has repeatedly declined to go into extensive details about how the private investment firm purchased a controlling 84 per cent stake for about £170million. However, outlining his vision, he said in January 2021: "To be super clear, this is not Moneyball."

‘False economies’ under the new regime 
Pace arrived at the club with a long list of ideas and there has been much activity behind the scenes, which one source describes as: "A lot of fiddling around while Rome is burning." 

ALK, which embraces data and analytics, would help the club win an innovation award for its use of AiScout, an artificial intelligence-based platform for identifying player talent. Modernisation of Turf Moor has included revamped hospitality suites, new LED big screens and a new stand sponsor, Utilita.  

There are also new kit sponsors and a TikTok live stream for women’s team matches. New jobs behind the scenes included the appointment of Russell Ball as head of matchday operations, Harriet Harbridge as fan experience manager, Lola Ogunbote as business lead on the women's team, and Gurpri Bains as equality, diversity and inclusion lead. 

Wout Weghorst, Burnley's big January signing, shows his disappointment following their relegation
Wout Weghorst, Burnley's big January signing, shows his disappointment following their relegation CREDIT: REUTERS
In other areas, however, positions have taken longer to fill. Mike Rigg, the technical director since 2018, left last year. 

The club was for some time without a chief executive, technical director and head of academy. But ultimately it is the lack of player recruitment that has hampered a team which was close to the brink for more than a year.  

In 2021, Burnley had the lowest points-per-game total of all 92 Football League clubs. Pace flew to Croatia to try to tie up a deal for Mislav Orsic from Dinamo Zagreb in January but it fell through, leaving Wout Weghorst, a £12m buy from Wolfsburg signed as Wood's replacement, as the only mid-season arrival.

Owners now need to fill managerial vacuum 
Whether Dyche still had fresh enough ideas to keep Burnley up is debatable. His relationship with Garlick, once rock solid, had become increasingly strained during their final two years together and there was exasperation at the lack of investment in the squad. Tensions remained in the wake of the change of ownership. 

Despite declaring initially that Dyche was central to their plans, ALK gradually seemed to be moving in a different direction to the manager, not least over the age and profile of players they wanted to target, and concern began to grow over results and performances. The four-year contract Dyche signed last September was described as a "marriage of convenience" by one insider. 

Despite his previous success on such a meagre budget, some of the players were also said to be supportive of a refresh when his shock sacking was announced in April. For some of the older players, in particular, there was frustration at Dyche's refusal to modify training schedules to help them cope with the demands of two matches a week. 

However, a month on, Burnley are no closer to finding a long-term replacement. Results initially improved under caretaker Mike Jackson, but the ownership were targeting Vincent Kompany, the current Anderlecht manager and ex-Manchester City captain, for the summer. 

Given the tall order facing Burnley now, there are serious doubts over whether Kompany would still consider the job. Whoever takes over faces a much tougher task building a squad than Dyche did in 2012, insiders point out. 

Player recruitment has become much more sophisticated among rivals over the past 10 years, and, despite a dip post-pandemic, there has also been heavy inflation on player values for youngsters in League One and the Championship.

Enforced player clear-out to come
The biggest worry of all is a potential struggle in the Championship, with the vultures already swooping to snatch Burnley's best talent. Everton and Aston Villa are already doing battle for the signing of defender James Tarkowski, who is out of contract this summer. 

Tarkowski is among nine players at the end of their deals and able to leave, with little incentive to stay given salaries will be automatically reduced. Company accounts all but confirm that a change in personnel is required: "In this scenario [relegation] the group has forecast a significant reduction in wages and salaries which will be largely achieved by contractual means existing in player contracts." 

Nick Pope could be among the players snapped up by Burnley's competitors
Nick Pope could be among the players snapped up by Burnley's competitors CREDIT: AFP
The England goalkeeper Nick Pope, winger Dwight McNeil and the forward Maxwel Cornet, who has a £17.5million release clause, would be high on the list of targets for rival clubs. Weghorst will also attract interest. 

Dr Rob Wilson, head of Sports Business Management at Sheffield Hallam university, has said relegation could be even more costly than it was for Sunderland, given the debt involved.

Telegraph Sport revelations last week that Burnley's academy is set to lose its category-one status add to the sense of despair over the club's future prospects. The Professional Game Board (PGB) is expected to formally ratify a revokement this week, meaning that the club will no longer have the highest ranking for what will be an increasingly crucial talent pipeline. 

Burnley were one of a number of clubs, along with Leeds, Crystal Palace, Nottingham Forest and Birmingham City, who were provisionally afforded category-one status in the summer of 2020 during the Covid pandemic on the understanding that a comprehensive audit would be undertaken once it was safe to do so. But, after failing checks carried out by the Professional Game Academy Audit Company (PGAAC) during a full and thorough review earlier this year, it was recommended that Burnley’s academy is downgraded. There are minimal levels of investment expected in coaches, pitches and facilities to meet Cat 1 status.
 

[lraC]

Putting the rivalry to one side for a second, it is criminal that this should be allowed. Even allowing for the fact that this is our local rivals, it still makes me angry.

We were victims too and are still in a terrible situation, due to the powers that be allowing this sort of thing to happen. 

Football has sold it's soul, as we are sure to see the next club go down the same path in the not too distant future.

We have the likes of Bassini and Ken Anderson taking on clubs, despite their previous issues  that the powers that be are aware of, so this sort of thing, is simply attracting the chancers and hangers on waiting in the wings, ready to pounce. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Just goes to show that even well run teams are only one or two bad decisions away from a disaster. In our case two I suppose. Selling out to the Chicken Chokers and firing Big Sam. In Burnley’s case selling out to the Yanks and maybe firing Dyche in the manner they did. IE with no real replacement. At least their guy did better than Kean.

Putting the rivalry to one side what happened at Burnley is a disgrace from a financial point of view. I know they thought it was hilarious when the Chokers trashed one of the most well run clubs in the Prem. It’s their turn now. Maybe they’ll be more sympathetic in future ? Neither club should have been put in this predicament.

Edited May 24, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Ianrally]

It makes you wonder what the outcome of the sale of Chelsea will pan out. Let’s see if the “Fit and Proper Test” works with that sale. I won’t hold my breath. 

[RevidgeBlue]

Ah, so you're my fellow former inmate at school are you, thought it was Longers.

Apologies to both of you.

You're still screwed though! 

😁

[Admiral Nelsen]

13 hours ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

Just goes to show that even well run teams are only one or two bad decisions away from a disaster. In our case two I suppose. Selling out to the Chicken Chokers and firing Big Sam. In Burnley’s case selling out to the Yanks and maybe firing Dyche in the manner they did. IE with no real replacement. At least their guy did better than Kean.

Putting the rivalry to one side what happened at Burnley is a disgrace from a financial point of view. I know they thought it was hilarious when the Chokers trashed one of the most well run clubs in the Prem. It’s their turn now. Maybe they’ll be more sympathetic in future ? Neither club should have been put in this predicament.

 

Being slightly flippant, even K**n started off with a couple of decent results before it became obvious that he was about 1,000 leagues of his depth. 

 

I won't pretend that there's not a lot of schadenfreude with their current situation, but you're 100% right that it's a scandal. The worst thing about their (relative) success was that you had to grudgingly tip your hat off to how they were going about their business. Massively upsetting the odds, whilst investing in the club's infrastructure and future-proofing their finances for when they would eventually get relegated. That seems to have gone up in a puff of smoke now, and whilst I'm certainly not going to be crying about it, it's so worrying that years of progress can be so precarious. Not that we need telling that, I suppose. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

7 hours ago, Admiral Nelsen said:

 

Being slightly flippant, even K**n started off with a couple of decent results before it became obvious that he was about 1,000 leagues of his depth. 

 

I won't pretend that there's not a lot of schadenfreude with their current situation, but you're 100% right that it's a scandal. The worst thing about their (relative) success was that you had to grudgingly tip your hat off to how they were going about their business. Massively upsetting the odds, whilst investing in the club's infrastructure and future-proofing their finances for when they would eventually get relegated. That seems to have gone up in a puff of smoke now, and whilst I'm certainly not going to be crying about it, it's so worrying that years of progress can be so precarious. Not that we need telling that, I suppose. 

That’s my thoughts also. There seems to be nobody in authority that is bothered in the slightest. Then I just heard on the radio that another Yank has taken over at Chelsea.

Edited May 25, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[Mattyblue]

That Garlick will be counting his silver… but at least he got a good deal unlike those fool Walker kids.

[Exiled_Rover]

On 24/05/2022 at 12:24, lraC said:

Putting the rivalry to one side for a second, it is criminal that this should be allowed. Even allowing for the fact that this is our local rivals, it still makes me angry.

We were victims too and are still in a terrible situation, due to the powers that be allowing this sort of thing to happen. 

Football has sold it's soul, as we are sure to see the next club go down the same path in the not too distant future.

We have the likes of Bassini and Ken Anderson taking on clubs, despite their previous issues  that the powers that be are aware of, so this sort of thing, is simply attracting the chancers and hangers on waiting in the wings, ready to pounce. 

Then they came for me. And there was no one left. To speak out for me.

[JHRover]

Strong rumours and odds suggesting they are appointing Kompany as manager, who is meant to be leaving Anderlecht.

A bit of an unkown appointment if it happens. Of course it will get plenty of publicity due to his playing career, but in his 2 years with Anderlecht he's got a 45% win record and no trophies with the biggest club in Belgium.

To be honest if that happens at least it takes away another rival who could be shopping for decent managers.

[Tricky]

1 hour ago, JHRover said:

Kompany

very risky for both parties, guess they'll get some City youngsters out of it mind

[Admiral Nelsen]

2 minutes ago, goozburger said:

Kompany might be a bit of an unknown quantity as a manager, but I bet it's quite a pull for potential signings. He's a winner, and one of the best defenders the Premier League has seen. Hughes wanted him at some point, didn't he?

 

I believe one of the reasons that he went to City was our inability to push the boat out to get a couple of players. Kompany, Zabaleta & Lassana Diarra all come to mind, but others might know more about that.