The Dingles

[simongarnerisgod]

4 minutes ago, J*B said:

I admire your optimism but I fear those dingles and their dirty parachute payments are about to sign the best young players in the country on loan and be carried by them

more than burnley on the parachute payments and a host of other big clubs in the promotion hunt,if i was a player being loaned out,id`e much rather head to west brom,middlesborough,watford,stoke,,norwich etc

[longsiders1882]

1 minute ago, simongarnerisgod said:

more than burnley on the parachute payments and a host of other big clubs in the promotion hunt,if i was a player being loaned out,id`e much rather head to west brom,middlesborough,watford,stoke,,norwich etc

Of course you would, you hate Burnley. For others there maybe things more attractive about Burnley, such as Kompany, recent premier league experience etc. Also the parent club has the biggest say and I’m sure Kompany still has many ins at City - and in Europe.

[Mattyblue]

Why would a young player who’s spent his career cocooned in an academy like City’s have an opinion either way on the merits of Burnley v Watford v Norwich?

They’ll go where they are told and City will be pushing on an open door with these lads anyway with Kompany there.

Edited June 18, 2022 by Mattyblue

[J*B]

10 minutes ago, simongarnerisgod said:

more than burnley on the parachute payments and a host of other big clubs in the promotion hunt,if i was a player being loaned out,id`e much rather head to west brom,middlesborough,watford,stoke,,norwich etc

If you’re a 19 year old that’s used to being told they’re incredible every day, you’ll do what City say. 

[simongarnerisgod]

5 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

Why would a young player who’s spent his career cocooned in an academy like City’s have an opinion either way on the merits of Burnley v Watford v Norwich?

They’ll go where they are told and they will be pushing on an open door with them anyway with Kompany there.

no doubt kompany will have contacts,but is it wise to have 3 or 4 fragile academy players in the attritional championship,it`s one of my major criticisms of the academy system,it does`nt prepare a young player for first team football like the old central league did,then you had pro`s trying to get back in the first team and young lads trying to make the breakthrough,it was very competetive and gave a young player a real taste of what first team football  was really like,some of the u23`s games are a like a kickabout and are of no use in development imo

[Mattyblue]

No, it’s not wise, but that’s a different issue.

More fool VK if he tries to integrate too many academy loanees. It’s a league that takes no prisoners and some of these lads will be found wanting on the physical side, there ain’t many Harvey Elliotts at 17/18.

Edited June 18, 2022 by Mattyblue

[rigger]

8 minutes ago, simongarnerisgod said:

no doubt kompany will have contacts,but is it wise to have 3 or 4 fragile academy players in the attritional championship,it`s one of my major criticisms of the academy system,it does`nt prepare a young player for first team football like the old central league did,then you had pro`s trying to get back in the first team and young lads trying to make the breakthrough,it was very competetive and gave a young player a real taste of what first team football  was really like,some of the u23`s games are a like a kickabout and are of no use in development imo

It makes a diference the fact that in the days of the central league, there where only two players on the first team bench. Now there are half a dozen.

[booth]

1 hour ago, J*B said:

I admire your optimism but I fear those dingles and their dirty parachute payments are about to sign the best young players in the country on loan and be carried by them

The one thing to counter this is that Pace and co are clearly a pack of dicks. Burnley fans can put their rose tinted specs on all they like, but that's a fact. They are getting by on other peoples money.

They may do great next season but it'll catch up if Pace carries on the way he's started.

[roversfan99]

1 hour ago, longsiders1882 said:

I said ‘as it stands today’. 

As above, I said as it stands today. On the repayment, like I say, this big chunk has been renegotiated. They have been restructuring and cutting staff for over 18 months, nothing to do with relegation.

Of course they will, but they’ll need more than 10/20 million to get him.

Those players may well want out - but someone has to come in with serious offers. I would be surprised if Pope, McNeill, Cornet, Brownhill and Taylor weren’t bought. The real jewel in the crown is Collins, he’s different level altogether. IF people come in for them that’s a big job to do rebuilding - but also a big bank balance, in the region of 140 a 160 million to buy all them.

Im not worried about the back room stuff, it will all be in hand but it’s not headline making.

Roll on the new season.

Would you say that any of those assets aside from Cornet, Pope and Weghorst (who hasn't done too well anyway) will likely leave out of interest?

I think a lot of those others fall into a category of being potentially excellent Championship players that I am not sure would attract the required interest to make a move back to the Premier League. McNeill and Collins are talented and young but both would require high fees and the former had a poor season whilst the latter impressed when he did play but at times struggled to get past Tarkowski and Mee when they were fit. I think the likes of Taylor, Brownhill and Roberts are all top Championship players but I don't see any of them being picked up by Premier League teams.

Burnley unfortunately also seem to have a backbone of Championship experience in Hennessey, Lowton, Rodriguez, Vydra, Barnes and Westwood when fit as well as the others I mentioned so any kids that come in may freshen it up rather than add to an inexperienced team.

1 hour ago, simongarnerisgod said:

no doubt kompany will have contacts,but is it wise to have 3 or 4 fragile academy players in the attritional championship,it`s one of my major criticisms of the academy system,it does`nt prepare a young player for first team football like the old central league did,then you had pro`s trying to get back in the first team and young lads trying to make the breakthrough,it was very competetive and gave a young player a real taste of what first team football  was really like,some of the u23`s games are a like a kickabout and are of no use in development imo

I am not sure it is always a terrible idea simply looking at historical examples, look at Forest who got promoted with players like Djed Spence and James Garner on loan who were aged 20 at the start of the season as well as Keinan Davis and Max Lowe who are slightly older but the former in particular had not played many senior minutes. Or take the Swansea side with Wilmot, Guehi, Gallagher, Brewster etc from 3 seasons ago that made the play offs. Loans are never ideal and it is difficult to get the better ones with not much to go off when deciding who to target but teams seem to more and more often be able to succeed in spite of having a clutch of kids on loan.

I do agree that under 23 football is not very useful and is a terrible barometer for preparing for senior football in general hence why I always think that performing well at that level is far from a guarantee that any player in question can cope at senior level. But senior football has also changed and the standard of the Championship is pretty poor so there are plenty of examples (including at Rovers) of loanees with minimal prior experience standing out at this level. Teams in general seem to have lower average ages and more experienced players who love a tackle seem to be coming rarer and rarer.

Burnley as I mentioned above also have quite a few players with serious experience at Championship players so any loanees may be coming into a very good structure.

[DeeCee]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

No, it’s not wise, but that’s a different issue.

More fool VK if he tries to integrate too many academy loanees. It’s a league that takes no prisoners and some of these lads will be found wanting on the physical side, there ain’t many Harvey Elliotts at 17/18.

I think Citeh and probly VK may have considered this?

[Mattyblue]

You’d think so, it’s a relentlessly professional set up at Citeh.

[chaddyrovers]

3 hours ago, longsiders1882 said:

Those players may well want out - but someone has to come in with serious offers. I would be surprised if Pope, McNeill, Cornet, Brownhill and Taylor weren’t bought. The real jewel in the crown is Collins, he’s different level altogether. IF people come in for them that’s a big job to do rebuilding - but also a big bank balance, in the region of 140 a 160 million to buy all them.

Im not worried about the back room stuff, it will all be in hand but it’s not headline making.

I think Kompany has a quite big rebuilding job there where I think he might have his work cut out there. I do wonder what staff he will have around him and what the club structure is around him. 

I'm still surprised you haven't announce his staff yet? 

Has Mike Jackson gone back to previous role now? 

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

Burnley unfortunately also seem to have a backbone of Championship experience in Hennessey, Lowton, Rodriguez, Vydra, Barnes and Westwood when fit as well as the others I mentioned so any kids that come in may freshen it up rather than add to an inexperienced team.

they might have plenty of experience but most of them you named there are around 32/33 age bracket. Surely you don't want 2 32 years old strikers up front if Kompany plays 2 up front?

In Vydra's case he is injured and no new contract agreed there yet between them

[roversfan99]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

I think Kompany has a quite big rebuilding job there where I think he might have his work cut out there. I do wonder what staff he will have around him and what the club structure is around him. 

I'm still surprised you haven't announce his staff yet? 

Has Mike Jackson gone back to previous role now? 

they might have plenty of experience but most of them you named there are around 32/33 age bracket. Surely you don't want 2 32 years old strikers up front if Kompany plays 2 up front?

In Vydra's case he is injured and no new contract agreed there yet between them

Obviously not but they have a transfer window to add to what they have. I wouldnt want Rankin Costello or Brown at right back here but again im sure that we will sign a new right back. My point was that even if Pope and Cornet are sold that there is plenty of quality at this level there unfortunately.

[chaddyrovers]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Obviously not but they have a transfer window to add to what they have. I wouldnt want Rankin Costello or Brown at right back here but again im sure that we will sign a new right back. My point was that even if Pope and Cornet are sold that there is plenty of quality at this level there unfortunately.

Yes they might have a transfer window but do Burnley have the right personal in place to support Kompany? 

Pope and Cornet will go for sure but then what their budget going to be for signings and how much time has Kompany be focusing on recruitment. 

 

Edited June 18, 2022 by chaddyrovers

[roversfan99]

7 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Yes they might have a transfer window but do Burnley have the right personal in place to support Kompany? 

Pope and Cornet will go for sure but then what their budget going to be for signings and how much time has Kompany be focusing on recruitment. 

 

Plenty of questions that could be asked both at Burnley, here at Rovers and at numerous clubs that have decided to change manager and/or personnel behind the scenes. None of which is relevant to my point about their current squad.

[DeeCee]

24 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

I think Kompany has a quite big rebuilding job there where I think he might have his work cut out there. I do wonder what staff he will have around him and what the club structure is around him. 

I'm still surprised you haven't announce his staff yet? 

Has Mike Jackson gone back to previous role now? 

they might have plenty of experience but most of them you named there are around 32/33 age bracket. Surely you don't want 2 32 years old strikers up front if Kompany plays 2 up front?

In Vydra's case he is injured and no new contract agreed there yet between them

Chaddy doesn't know when he's taking the piss 🏆

[chaddyrovers]

44 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Plenty of questions that could be asked both at Burnley, here at Rovers and at numerous clubs that have decided to change manager and/or personnel behind the scenes. None of which is relevant to my point about their current squad.

Rovers have got 2 very key appointments right IMO and I think JDT bringing in Ben Rosen as performance director is an excellent move given his background and experience in fitness and conditioning 

I agree that they have a few quality players in the season(Collins, Roberts, Taylor, Brownhill and Barnes) and I assume Cornet, McNeil, Pope will leave, but as I have discuss with longsiders1882 they need around 10 signings to be challenging for promotion. My point on staff around Kompany and what kind of control does he have there signing wise is a very valid point and is relate to you point around their squad

Edited June 18, 2022 by chaddyrovers

[Norbert Rassragr]

As the squad stands now, I'd expect them to be around the play offs, maybe better. However, they may lose some key players, and need the money to keep things stable off the pitch. If they don't get promoted this season, the next will be really hard. And a failure after that would mean disaster.

[Tricky]

44 minutes ago, Norbert Rassragr said:

As the squad stands now, I'd expect them to be around the play offs, maybe better. However, they may lose some key players, and need the money to keep things stable off the pitch. If they don't get promoted this season, the next will be really hard. And a failure after that would mean disaster.

bit like us then 😄

[longsiders1882]

1 hour ago, Tricky said:

bit like us then 😄

I don’t know about that. I get the sense most people on here expect us to be relegated or at least in the lower reaches of the league and for you guys to do us over easily. You may well be right but personally I honestly don’t know until we begin firstly to see how the squad shapes up; who goes and comes etc. and then whether Kompany can get a tune out of them. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if we won the league or finished rock bottom. Ask me again at the end of July when (hopefully) we at least have some idea who is playing for us. 
 

Roll on the new season eh 🤷‍♂️

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Of course it’s too early to say who’s going to do well or otherwise. We’ll know more after half a dozen games.

[Exiled_Rover]

3 hours ago, Norbert Rassragr said:

As the squad stands now, I'd expect them to be around the play offs, maybe better. However, they may lose some key players, and need the money to keep things stable off the pitch. If they don't get promoted this season, the next will be really hard. And a failure after that would mean disaster.

We'll see.

It's an old squad that's another year older. I'm not sure they're up to the grind of a Championship season anymore.

[chaddyrovers]

4 hours ago, Norbert Rassragr said:

As the squad stands now, I'd expect them to be around the play offs, maybe better. However, they may lose some key players, and need the money to keep things stable off the pitch. If they don't get promoted this season, the next will be really hard. And a failure after that would mean disaster.

Looks like Collins is off to Wolves by some media reports today. 

I think they will struggle in the coming season under Kompany. 

[longsiders1882]

5 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Looks like Collins is off to Wolves by some media reports today. 

I think they will struggle in the coming season under Kompany. 

If Collins goes that’s another 40 million in the bank - though not sure what sell on Stoke have. I will say this now, based admittedly on a small number of games, that lad will go to the very very top. He’s got all that is needed, I just wish he was English.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

4 minutes ago, longsiders1882 said:

If Collins goes that’s another 40 million in the bank - though not sure what sell on Stoke have. I will say this now, based admittedly on a small number of games, that lad will go to the very very top. He’s got all that is needed, I just wish he was English.

Just make sure it goes in the right bank account matey.