The Dingles

[chaddyrovers]

2 minutes ago, smiller14 said:

Would you really count Scott Wharton and Szmodics as 'experienced'? Not sure on the age/experience of their team, but Rovers are a very young and inexperienced team. 

Wharton has 200 games and Szmodics has near 250 games. Is that inexperience now? 

Travis has 219 games, Hyam has 255, Brittain has 223, Kaminski has 391, Gallagher has 295, BBD has 205 and Hedges has 237.  

[smiller14]

2 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Wharton has 200 games and Szmodics has near 250 games. Is that inexperience now? 

Travis has 219 games, Hyam has 255, Brittain has 223, Kaminski has 391, Gallagher has 295, BBD has 205 and Hedges has 237.  

Fair enough, didn't realise Wharton had played so many games. Szmodics I did know but generally at a lower level. 

Perhaps I've been too quick to swallow some of the talk about how inexperienced we are - easy mistake to make when our team is so young.

Hopefully our mix of appearances and youthful enthusiasm stands us in good stead. 

[booth]

5 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Wharton has 200 games and Szmodics has near 250 games. Is that inexperience now? 

Travis has 219 games, Hyam has 255, Brittain has 223, Kaminski has 391, Gallagher has 295, BBD has 205 and Hedges has 237.  

Young and inexperienced squad probably best describes it.

Also a lot of those games were played at a lower level for some players.

[Miller11]

When we have played well this season we are certainly as good as Burnley when they play well, maybe better.

When we play badly we are a lot worse than them when they they have an off day.

So it’s simple really, we just need to play well! In all seriousness though, hopefully the non-performances we’ve seen at times so far are hopefully a thing of the past. No reason we can’t get something from this game, but we need to be really at the races.

[chaddyrovers]

55 minutes ago, booth said:

Young and inexperienced squad probably best describes it.

Also a lot of those games were played at a lower level for some players.

does that really matter tho? still professional footballing experience isn't it? 

Here are their Championship appearances 

Scott Wharton - 49

Dominic Hyam - 99

Callum Brittain - 86

Lewis Travis - 149

Sammie Szmodics - 50 

Ben Brereton Diaz - 187

Sam Gallagher - 219

[booth]

Just now, chaddyrovers said:

does that really matter tho? still professional footballing experience isn't it? 

Here are their Championship appearances 

Scott Wharton - 49

Dominic Hyam - 99

Callum Brittain - 86

Lewis Travis - 149

Sammie Szmodics - 50 

Ben Brereton Diaz - 187

Sam Gallagher - 219

There's many variables to consider, but I think it matters. A sunday league squad may have plenty of footballing experience but most likely wouldn't endure a championship season.

Also that's 7 players picked out of the squad. We've plenty of players with a lot less experience. Our two young midfielders have less than 23 championship appearances put together.

Don't get me started on our CF options. We've Gallagher and then the rest have about 15 appearances between them.

[sympatheticclaret]

13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

does that really matter tho? still professional footballing experience isn't it? 

Here are their Championship appearances 

Scott Wharton - 49

Dominic Hyam - 99

Callum Brittain - 86

Lewis Travis - 149

Sammie Szmodics - 50 

Ben Brereton Diaz - 187

Sam Gallagher - 219

 For interest, here's Burnley's starting XI from last night, and their appearances in senior Football ...

Muric     82

Maatson    89

Vitinho    92

Harwood Bellis   94

Bayer   52

Brownhill   353

Cork      556

Gudmundsson    449

Tella     56

Zaroury   86

Rodrigues   493

[roversfan99]

The midfield will be a worry, not much experience against Cullen, Cork and Brownhill.

[chaddyrovers]

5 minutes ago, booth said:

There's many variables to consider, but I think it matters. A sunday league squad may have plenty of footballing experience but most likely wouldn't endure a championship season.

But Sunday league isn't professional football standard where League 1 or 2 level is professional. So my points on experience stance and that all the professional games that players like Szmodics, Hyam and Scott Wharton should count! 

5 minutes ago, booth said:

Also that's 7 players picked out of the squad. We've plenty of players with a lot less experience. Our two young midfielders have less than 23 championship appearances put together.

Morton, Garrett and Adam Wharton despite lack of championship appearances have performed very well so far and I would say their inexperience isn't a problem at all this season. 

5 minutes ago, booth said:

Don't get me started on our CF options. We've Gallagher and then the rest have about 15 appearances between them.

Hirst has over 100 games at Professional level whether its Championship level, level, EFL trophy level or Belgium second division. 

Dolan has 95 professional games including Championship, EFL and FA cups. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

18 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The midfield will be a worry, not much experience against Cullen, Cork and Brownhill.

The Rovers young ones against Burnley’s dads army.

[chaddyrovers]

54 minutes ago, sympatheticclaret said:

 For interest, here's Burnley's starting XI from last night, and their appearances in senior Football ...

Muric     82

Maatson    89

Vitinho    92

Harwood Bellis   94

Bayer   52

Brownhill   353

Cork      556

Gudmundsson    449

Tella     56

Zaroury   86

Rodrigues   493

what their championship experience tho? 

 

52 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The midfield will be a worry, not much experience against Cullen, Cork and Brownhill.

would it be? It hasn't stopped Rovers moving forward this season despite Morton, Garrett and Adam Wharton inexperience and also, they will be going to get experience by playing games! 

Edited October 26, 2022 by chaddyrovers

[BankEnd Rover]

35 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

The midfield will be a worry, not much experience against Cullen, Cork and Brownhill.

I think the difference on the day will be the midfield. If we can compete with them, then i have every confidence in Diaz & Gally executing their chances.

[roversfan99]

13 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

what their championship experience tho? 

 

would it be? It has stop Rovers moving forward this season despite Morton, Garrett and Adam Wharton inexperience and also, they will be going to get experience by playing games! 

Yes, I think it would. 3 canny, seasoned pros who are capable of playing higher, 3 good players at this moment a level above our young lads, who have put in some good performances without dominating a midfield.

[smiller14]

15 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

what their championship experience tho? 

 

would it be? It has stop Rovers moving forward this season despite Morton, Garrett and Adam Wharton inexperience and also, they will be going to get experience by playing games! 

Guessing you mean 'it hasn't stopped' us? He isn't saying that they shouldn't play and I'm sure he knows that experience is gained by playing games, but he's just worried that in a one-off derby game that their experience in midfield may benefit them. On the flipside, our youthful midfield may help us - less shackled down by past disappointments etc. 

[roversfan99]

Just now, BankEnd Rover said:

I think the difference on the day will be the midfield. If we can compete with them, then i have every confidence in Diaz & Gally executing their chances.

I think we will likely be very reliant on especially Brereton on the day, Burnley have Rodriguez who is a very good player but is aging, they do have plenty of options in attacking areas in Tella, Gudmundsson, Benson, Zaoury, Churlinov etc but none provide the goal threat that Brereton does.

[booth]

36 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

But Sunday league isn't professional football standard where League 1 or 2 level is professional. So my points on experience stance and that all the professional games that players like Szmodics, Hyam and Scott Wharton should count!

The point I was making is there is a difference in experience, I was just making an exaggerated example to make it clear.

Keeping it pro then. Is the professional experience of playing in the U23's for Liverpool just the same as playing in the Premier League?

[chaddyrovers]

11 minutes ago, smiller14 said:

Guessing you mean 'it hasn't stopped' us? He isn't saying that they shouldn't play and I'm sure he knows that experience is gained by playing games, but he's just worried that in a one-off derby game that their experience in midfield may benefit them. On the flipside, our youthful midfield may help us - less shackled down by past disappointments etc. 

yes i did. now correct. 

We have plenty of experience in the squad and I think us having a younger midfielder might be a benefit. 

13 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Yes, I think it would. 3 canny, seasoned pros who are capable of playing higher, 3 good players at this moment a level above our young lads, who have put in some good performances without dominating a midfield.

So we didn't midfield in games like Watford at home and Blackpool away as 2 examples. 

I think us having younger less experience players might actually be benefit to us. They can play with freedom and less worry about past Burnley experience.  

11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I think we will likely be very reliant on especially Brereton on the day,

I think If we can be solid defensively and have players like Szmodics, Hedges and Brittain available after injuries plus BBD and Gallagher then we have more than to caused them plenty of problems and alot more than Norwich actually did yesterday. Norwich was very poor attacking 

[chaddyrovers]

1 minute ago, booth said:

The point I was making is there is a difference in experience, I was just making an exaggerated example to make it clear.

Keeping it pro then. Is the professional experience of playing in the U23's for Liverpool just the same as playing in the Premier League?

No unless they played in the EFL trophy which is against some teams at league 1 and 2 level. 

[booth]

45 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

Hirst has over 100 games at Professional level whether its Championship level, level, EFL trophy level or Belgium second division. 

Dolan has 95 professional games including Championship, EFL and FA cups. 

Or to spin it another way, Hirst has 38 appearances in the Championship, 2 in the cup and zero goals. He's currently working on his fitness in the U23's. Not someone I'd want to pin my hopes on.

Dolan isn't a CF.

[Dreams of 1995]

11 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

Yes, I think it would. 3 canny, seasoned pros who are capable of playing higher, 3 good players at this moment a level above our young lads, who have put in some good performances without dominating a midfield.

I have always found it amazing how much weight you have given towards players for Burnley, throughout this and other threads on the board.

Who would have defined Cullen as "canny"? Based on what? The fact he was part of a poor Anderlecht side or based on his single season for Charlton in which they finished 22nd?

Or Josh Brownhill, who has spent his career in the Championship, save for 2 seasons at a dying Burnley squad in which they only just survived and then relegated. Can he play higher? History suggests not very well

The only player better would be Jack Cork, but he's 33 now, and found himself dropped, either through injury or form, in Burnley's last 2 seasons at a higher level.

For all of their canny play they find themselves neck and neck with our young lads.

If appearances are the benchmark for 'better' players then Jason Lowe has over 200 appearances at Championship level - is he canny or would you rather Morton?

I don't think we have to fear this Burnley squad at all. We can beat them.

I also thought Adam Wharton absolutely dominated Blackpool's midfield, whereas Burnley's succumbed to 3 goals conceeded.

Football is a funny old game

 

[roversfan99]

5 minutes ago, Dreams of 1995 said:

I have always found it amazing how much weight you have given towards players for Burnley, throughout this and other threads on the board.

Who would have defined Cullen as "canny"? Based on what? The fact he was part of a poor Anderlecht side or based on his single season for Charlton in which they finished 22nd?

Or Josh Brownhill, who has spent his career in the Championship, save for 2 seasons at a dying Burnley squad in which they only just survived and then relegated. Can he play higher? History suggests not very well

The only player better would be Jack Cork, but he's 33 now, and found himself dropped, either through injury or form, in Burnley's last 2 seasons at a higher level.

For all of their canny play they find themselves neck and neck with our young lads.

If appearances are the benchmark for 'better' players then Jason Lowe has over 200 appearances at Championship level - is he canny or would you rather Morton?

I don't think we have to fear this Burnley squad at all. We can beat them.

I also thought Adam Wharton absolutely dominated Blackpool's midfield, whereas Burnley's succumbed to 3 goals conceeded.

Football is a funny old game

 

I never specifically said that appearances are a benchmark for better players. I have seen Burnley a fair few times this season and Cullen has always stood out, dictating the game from deep. Brownhill is stand out at this level albeit limited (but still capable) at Premier League level and earnt a move previously based on standing out at this level and Cork is a canny operator too. Those 3 have proven themselves over many appearances but are not just good players because theyve played a lot of games. That us Burnley's strong point and they tend to dominate games in midfield but their attacking players hage blown hot and cold.

I do feel though that we lack experience in our midfield ranks and have said so all season, we have undoubted talent there but you look at Wharton, he either cant or Tomasson wont play over an hour or back to back games if we play midweek. The Burnley 3 are used to the grind.

[sympatheticclaret]

I saw an earlier reference to Burnley's " Dad's Army " ....

Cork, Rodrigues and Gudmundsson are 33,33, and 32 respectively .... Josh Brownhill & Josh Cullen are 26, but none of the rest of last night's starters are over 23 .... I'd say it's a Classic blend of " youth & experience " !! 😁

As for the " Derby " on the 13th, I've seen enough winters to know not to make any rash predictions .... 

[J*B]

1 hour ago, roversfan99 said:

The midfield will be a worry, not much experience against Cullen, Cork and Brownhill.

We'll lose the game in midfield. We're better in attack and for me, in defence. But that midfield will have our three running like dogs after a ball.

[booth]

Just now, J*B said:

We'll lose the game in midfield. We're better in attack and for me, in defence. But that midfield will have our three running like dogs after a ball.

That or injuries. I have a terrible feeling we'll be a bit threadbare by the Burnley match.

On his day though Adam Wharton could dominate any midfield. Sadly I can't see him being thrown into the cauldron of hate at his age.

[lraC]

If the players are as up for it, as the fans, we should certainly have a chance. Given the local lads, especially the Wharton brothers, it should make it an even more special occasion.

It already has me feeling the butterflies, just reading the last few posts, so bring it on and let's get the BR EXIT EMENT done.