Jon Dahl Tomasson - Officially No Longer Our Head Coach

[chaddyrovers]

2 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Incredible naivety.

No surprised by such a response and you always looking for problems within the club and its management structure that just aren't there

[roversfan99]

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/23034033.blackburn-rovers-boss-not-looking-table-just-yet/

Tomasson isn't looking at the league table, similar to the performance over league table claptrap that Mowbray came out with a couple of years ago. Performance first, results will follow, I have no idea where we are in the league etc...

Proof not that Tomasson warrants similar fury that Mowbray got when he said it, but that all managers trot out the same cliches and it is probably best not to micro analyse them!

[Miller11]

On 08/10/2022 at 12:44, SuperBrfc said:

I suspect we will be hearing "look at Farke's first season at Norwich" a lot on here this season in order to excuse poor results or to defend the manager. It's something (i.e Farke being given time) that the DoF himself has referred to in interviews done prior to joining Rovers. He talked about Norwich sticking with the plan and not rushing to move away from it even when Farke struggled in his first season.

It's highly likely that the Farke angle has been put to the owners along with the need for time. This is why I believe JDT won't be going anywhere no matter how bad it gets. Let's hope things work out, as I don't want another Mowbray situation, where he has to go but the owners do nothing about it.

It’s a really difficult case to make when you look at the managers who have got promoted out of the Championship in recent years. The majority have done it in their first season.

Very few have taken more than 2 full seasons in charge and those that are the exception tend to have yo-yo’d, or in the case of Wilder, brought the team up from league one.

”Patience” and “slow build” might sound nice and rational, but there’s very little evidence to suggest that it leads to promotion. Mowbray is a prime example - he was never going to take us up. 

[lraC]

30 minutes ago, Miller11 said:

It’s a really difficult case to make when you look at the managers who have got promoted out of the Championship in recent years. The majority have done it in their first season.

Very few have taken more than 2 full seasons in charge and those that are the exception tend to have yo-yo’d, or in the case of Wilder, brought the team up from league one.

”Patience” and “slow build” might sound nice and rational, but there’s very little evidence to suggest that it leads to promotion. Mowbray is a prime example - he was never going to take us up. 

In most cases, I would argue it is a self - preservation exercise, as in it buys me more time that I otherwise might have.

I wonder how many managers, would state that they need X number of seasons to achieve the goals that the interviewer asks them what they can achieve and what they have to offer?

[Admiral Nelsen]

13 minutes ago, Miller11 said:

It’s a really difficult case to make when you look at the managers who have got promoted out of the Championship in recent years. The majority have done it in their first season.

Very few have taken more than 2 full seasons in charge and those that are the exception tend to have yo-yo’d, or in the case of Wilder, brought the team up from league one.

”Patience” and “slow build” might sound nice and rational, but there’s very little evidence to suggest that it leads to promotion. Mowbray is a prime example - he was never going to take us up. 

 

Bit of a mixed picture on that score. There really aren't that many managers that have come into a club in the summer like JDT has and then gone on to take a club up first season. Those that do tend to have the advantage of parachute payments too. 

 

Of the last 21 clubs that have been promoted since 2016:

• 7 were clubs bouncing straight back from relegation
• 7 had managers that were in at least their second full season at that level
• 1 was a manager that took charge part way through a previous campaign
• and the last 6 were managers which went up straight after joining in the summer BUT they also included Villa, WBA and Bournemouth who still had parachute payments coming in. 

 

For clubs in our position, it looks like there's a good case for being patient in year one provided that we can see some improvement and the potential to kick on. 

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

15-16:

B*rnley relegated prem

Boro - Second full season

Hull - relegated prem

 

16-17:

Newcastle - relegated prem

Brighton - Second full season

Huddersfield - First season

 

17-18:

Wolves - First Season

Cardiff - First full season

Fulham - Second Full Season

 

18-19:

Norwich - Second season

Sheffield United - Second season

Villa - First season

 

19-20

Leeds - Second season

West Brom - First season

Fulham - relegated prem club

 

20-21

Norwich - Relegated prem club

Watford - Relegated prem club

Brentford - second full season

 

21-22

Fulham - Relegated prem club

Bournemouth - First season

Forest - First season

[chaddyrovers]

4 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/sport/23034033.blackburn-rovers-boss-not-looking-table-just-yet/

Tomasson isn't looking at the league table, similar to the performance over league table claptrap that Mowbray came out with a couple of years ago. Performance first, results will follow, I have no idea where we are in the league etc...

Proof not that Tomasson warrants similar fury that Mowbray got when he said it, but that all managers trot out the same cliches and it is probably best not to micro analyse them!

He will know where we are in league, but I think the point is he knows that performances haven't been good enough in certain games and he knows that we can perform better and more consistence. Its work in progress and that 5 weeks period is crucial for JDT where he can get them on training pitch for 4 weeks of it and even a training camp in Spain including a couple of friendlies there 

[roversfan99]

10 minutes ago, chaddyrovers said:

He will know where we are in league, but I think the point is he knows that performances haven't been good enough in certain games and he knows that we can perform better and more consistence. Its work in progress and that 5 weeks period is crucial for JDT where he can get them on training pitch for 4 weeks of it and even a training camp in Spain including a couple of friendlies there 

I think a more obvious conclusion is that managers all tend to come out with the same cliches and soundbites in press conferences and maybe we shouldn't take them so seriously.

[chaddyrovers]

2 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

I think a more obvious conclusion is that managers all tend to come out with the same cliches and soundbites in press conferences and maybe we shouldn't take them so seriously.

all depends on your perspective and what that person has said in previous comments which JDT has been very consistence with his comments 

[Blue blood]

20 hours ago, chaddyrovers said:

Who is MB? 

Why is all BS Jim? cos Rovers have proper plan in place and they have appointed proper people to their roles with the Football management structure? 

All have backed every manager/head coach and cover the losses every season and continue to support the club. 

the owners have backed JDT and GB with funds just like they did with Mowbray and other previous managers at the club. For me, they have learnt from their mistakes in their early years and now have employed some good people in key roles with the Football management structure. 

Maybe it's me but I'd say a sign they learned from their mistakes is potting a manager who repeatedly takes you on months -long relegation form. Or don't let your best assets leave for nothing. Or getting rid of Waggot. 

I think the evidence points to them not having learned whatsoever. (Which in fairness to the managers has benefited and hindered them.)

[chaddyrovers]

8 hours ago, Blue blood said:

Maybe it's me but I'd say a sign they learned from their mistakes is potting a manager who repeatedly takes you on months -long relegation form. Or don't let your best assets leave for nothing. Or getting rid of Waggot. 

I think the evidence points to them not having learned whatsoever. (Which in fairness to the managers has benefited and hindered them.)

They didn't give Mowbray last January when I think he thought he deserved one after getting into top 2 but has we know he couldn't sustain it. 

Lenihan, Nyambe and Rothwell yes all left on free after 18 months contract talks. They wouldn't sell Rothwell to direct rival for promotion whilst Mowbray didn't use all of his budget in January like he should have. They kept BBD this season and won't accept cheap offers for him  

They gave backed JDT and GB with a good transfer budget this summer. 

[BRFC4EVA]

Needs to sort himself out. I'm livid after tonight. Wrong players, wrong tactics. Hirst is shite. Why isn't dack playing? Where is Markandy? Why are shoeing Hedges into rwb when you have just bought one in the summer for a million quid??

Alot of questions to be answered. Utterly pathetic again. 

STOP THE TIPPY TAPPY SHITE AROUND OUR OWN BOX!!!

[G Somerset Rover]

His inability to have us resembling anything close to a football club away from home is really starting to grate. Zero shots on target, another game plan (ha) that was evident from the first minute that it wouldn’t work, and again, as has been the case since we returned to the Championship, still zero idea on how we get back into matches when falling behind.

It ain’t good enough and a cheesy grin won’t stop fans from being pissed off.

Edited October 11, 2022 by Gavlar Somerset Rover!

[Nuttall is lost]

Getting worried now I must say.  Another poor display and zero threat.  No bodies in the box any time we are attacking.  Just dull boring modern football overly concerned with possession.  Give me a bit more rough and tumble exciting football with some shots on target.  

James McClean was like a 90s throwback for Wigan.  Like Jason Wilcox going past his man and whipping balls in over and over.  Its not the modern way but at least it gives you some hope.  We never had the ball in the box all night.

[matt83]

This man is out of his depth. He’ll no doubt get a very fair crack of the whip, particularly compared to most other professional clubs. Let’s hope another 5 years isn’t wasted on him 

[Upside Down]

You know it will be.

What is it with these managers? When the thing you tried clearly isn't working, try something different!

Not playing Dack, by far the best player we have. Getting bummed by teams like Wigan and Reading. Not fucking good enough. 

My patience is wearing thin.

[Blue blood]

On 11/10/2022 at 00:45, chaddyrovers said:

They didn't give Mowbray last January when I think he thought he deserved one after getting into top 2 but has we know he couldn't sustain it. 

Lenihan, Nyambe and Rothwell yes all left on free after 18 months contract talks. They wouldn't sell Rothwell to direct rival for promotion whilst Mowbray didn't use all of his budget in January like he should have. They kept BBD this season and won't accept cheap offers for him  

They gave backed JDT and GB with a good transfer budget this summer. 

Not sure any of that endorses them Chaddy! 

At 18 months negotiate, 12 months get rid and recoup some money. Or even better yet start negotiations a darn sight earlier - that would stop them playing contract chicken with us (or at least leave us better served when they do ) the more I think on it 18 months is cutting it fine. 

As for the cheap offers for Bereton, assuming that Venkys weren't going to trouser it (admittedly a possibility in which you keep the player) then a cheap offer would have still enabled us to rebuild the team. £10 million wasn't it? That's 2 or 3 new additions to a thin squad. Players who the manager chose. Goodness even if we couldn't have found a striker in budget for a permanent, getting a good PL loan and strengthening a couple of other positions would have still seen us in a better position next summer to be finding a permanent replacement for Bereton. As it is there's been no money to strengthen and we are looking to replace him with zero incoming funds. 

So whilst they've given JDT a bit of money this year, the underlying decision making and business planning is still woeful. 

[islander200]

1 hour ago, Blue blood said:

Not sure any of that endorses them Chaddy! 

At 18 months negotiate, 12 months get rid and recoup some money. Or even better yet start negotiations a darn sight earlier - that would stop them playing contract chicken with us (or at least leave us better served when they do ) the more I think on it 18 months is cutting it fine. 

As for the cheap offers for Bereton, assuming that Venkys weren't going to trouser it (admittedly a possibility in which you keep the player) then a cheap offer would have still enabled us to rebuild the team. £10 million wasn't it? That's 2 or 3 new additions to a thin squad. Players who the manager chose. Goodness even if we couldn't have found a striker in budget for a permanent, getting a good PL loan and strengthening a couple of other positions would have still seen us in a better position next summer to be finding a permanent replacement for Bereton. As it is there's been no money to strengthen and we are looking to replace him with zero incoming funds. 

So whilst they've given JDT a bit of money this year, the underlying decision making and business planning is still woeful. 

It was only 6 million up front for Brererton the rest was add ons.

He is our only regular goalscorer and the offers came to late in the day

If he is scoring regularly and our season Is going nowhere we can always sell him in January.Some prem teams will be desperate and willing to pay for him if he is having a decent season 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

43 minutes ago, islander200 said:

It was only 6 million up front for Brererton the rest was add ons.

He is our only regular goalscorer and the offers came to late in the day

If he is scoring regularly and our season Is going nowhere we can always sell him in January.Some prem teams will be desperate and willing to pay for him if he is having a decent season 

I used to go to games with a mate of mine who was a City scout years ago. He made a point of watching strikers in away games. “ That tells you what they are made of “ he used to say. I can’t see anybody chucking big money at Brererton going off his away performances.

[JacknOry]

Whatever they are doing is just not working is it? People can point to the wins we have, but even in those, I cannot think of many games where we played them off the park. After our three wins in a row that put us top, we had the lowest xG in the league. That suggests we were clinical/lucky (few quality goals from Travis, BB etc) as we were not creating many chances even then. 

The performances have just not been up to standard - we can't create. Feck me, we usually create more chances per game for the opposition than ourselves thanks to this stupid playing it across the back all game. Like last night, we had actually finally come into the game and boom - "here, go score a goal".  

 

[JacknOry]

They need to have a major rethink else its going to go south very quickly. 

[roversfan99]

5 hours ago, Blue blood said:

Not sure any of that endorses them Chaddy! 

At 18 months negotiate, 12 months get rid and recoup some money. Or even better yet start negotiations a darn sight earlier - that would stop them playing contract chicken with us (or at least leave us better served when they do ) the more I think on it 18 months is cutting it fine. 

As for the cheap offers for Bereton, assuming that Venkys weren't going to trouser it (admittedly a possibility in which you keep the player) then a cheap offer would have still enabled us to rebuild the team. £10 million wasn't it? That's 2 or 3 new additions to a thin squad. Players who the manager chose. Goodness even if we couldn't have found a striker in budget for a permanent, getting a good PL loan and strengthening a couple of other positions would have still seen us in a better position next summer to be finding a permanent replacement for Bereton. As it is there's been no money to strengthen and we are looking to replace him with zero incoming funds. 

So whilst they've given JDT a bit of money this year, the underlying decision making and business planning is still woeful. 

Cutting off our nose to spite our face by rejecting it. As you said, no business planning. 

£10m is a massive amount of money, especially considering the FFP excuse people love to mention, it gives us much more scope within that and in itself it is a lot of money, a profit on the purchase and it is over double what we spent in the summer which was described as a "healthy" budget.

[Armchair supporter supremo]

Just a thought... 

If JDTs roller coaster of WLWL... results continues it would have us lose to mowbrays Sunderland, Beat West ham then lose to Burnley 😣

 

So We need to break that cycle fast. 

🎢🎢🎢

[Mattyblue]

Nah, cup ties are exempt. So 3-0 win over there it is.

[tomphil]

On 12/10/2022 at 05:51, Upside Down said:

You know it will be.

What is it with these managers? When the thing you tried clearly isn't working, try something different!

Not playing Dack, by far the best player we have. Getting bummed by teams like Wigan and Reading. Not fucking good enough. 

My patience is wearing thin.

We are always a project to managers because we are a project of some sort to the owners, a money losing accounting/advertising project.

They are employing people and telling the their 'vision' for the club which is all based on a jam tomorrow scenario. If they employed someone with the remit of top 6/promotion as soon as possible and backed them accordingly we might actually see someone put the foot on the gas.

There's a reason Mowbray got away with spinning his yarns for years unchallenged and it's the same now it all starts from the top.

[Giant]

Read Trav’s piece in today’s Telegraph in which he blames the players for their away day blues, not the manager.