v Sunderland (h) 18/10/2022

[arbitro]

45 minutes ago, renrag said:

I watched on tv last night, in real time and from the camera angle the non penalty looked a good call. I think Pawson had a similar angle. However, when different angles were shown and slowed down, I became more convinced we got away with one.

As far as the second goal is concerned, I thought it was tight, again the camera angle was slightly behind play but, judging by the grass cutting lines, the defender at the right of the wall and Wharton could well have been level. Only by being in direct line could an accurate decision be made

I really think there was doubt in the officials minds as to whether or not Wharton actually touched the ball. There was an instruction several years ago where they were told to give the benefit of any doubt to the attacking team.

[superniko]

43 minutes ago, Fraserkirky said:

I thought their Clarke lad looked excellent.

£10m I think they've paid (with all add-ons I assume). Decent wedge for a Championship club.

Edit: Low initial fee and high add-ons apparently - probably includes PL promotion etc. which would make it all worthwhile.

Edited October 19, 2022 by superniko

[roversfan99]

Another thing from last night, why again have they started with goal music? Very tacky and counter productive to any atmosphere.

[SAFCfaninpeace]

9 minutes ago, superniko said:

£10m I think they've paid (with all add-ons I assume). Decent wedge for a Championship club.

Edit: Low initial fee and high add-ons apparently - probably includes PL promotion etc. which would make it all worthwhile.

He’s a very decent player but very raw. Needs to learn to go on his left and shoot a lot more. Mind if he was able to get that into his game he would still be at Spurs and not down a league with us. Surprised Spurs didn’t stick a buy back clause into the sale agreement like they have with Cirkin

[RV Blue]

I thought Clarke looked shite (maybe because I had high expectations considering the fee paid), Roberts on the other hand….

[SAFCfaninpeace]

Just now, RV Blue said:

I thought Clarke looked shite (maybe because I had high expectations considering the fee paid), Roberts on the other hand….

He had a bad game by his standards. 4 goals and 4 assists this season. Decent but should have a lot more if he took a few more chances rather than dilly dallying on the ball too long

[Sparks Rover]

1 minute ago, SAFCfaninpeace said:

He had a bad game by his standards. 4 goals and 4 assists this season. Decent but should have a lot more if he took a few more chances rather than dilly dallying on the ball too long

Lad's light years ahead of rest of your team.  Nobody in decent positions to play off so it looked like he was running into dead ends.

If that's his bad game....he was terrorising our right back at times.  Quality player and only young.👍  Mogadon will  have him at right back soon enough 

[RoversTilliDie]

2 hours ago, superniko said:

We had Elliott and the 2nd top scorer in the league (as well as the 2nd top scorer the season after) all in the same team but still failed to make the playoffs! Almost feels more of a missed opportunity than how we threw away last season. We looked unreal at times in the Elliott season but just couldn't defend. If only we had Hyam, Wharton and a fit Ayala!

Tony Mowbray lost the plot the last 3rd of last Season. What a replacement JDT is turning out to be. With the team we've got we should be putting in a serious challenge for a top 6 finish. Dare we dare to dream of automatic after last Season. Hang your heads in shame those who gave JDT some stick first month of the Season.

Edited October 19, 2022 by RoversTilliDie

[magicalmortensleftpeg]

1 hour ago, arbitro said:

I really think there was doubt in the officials minds as to whether or not Wharton actually touched the ball. There was an instruction several years ago where they were told to give the benefit of any doubt to the attacking team.

If he didn’t touch it, he’s clearly close enough to be impacting the play. Think it would have gone in either way but it’s still offside.

Definitely a pen to Sunderland as well. Surprised it wasn’t given in real time and even more so when looking at the replays. Fine margins etc.

[BigBar]

1 hour ago, Fraserkirky said:

I thought their Clarke lad looked excellent.

Looked a quality player

[jim mk2]

Sunderland's next game at home to Burnley. They didn't get the rub of the green against us so let's hope they get some luck in the next one

Black Cats 2  Mongrels 0 

[AllRoverAsia]

1 hour ago, rigger said:

The ref didn't think so.

Full stop.

Theory in football .... good luck comes back to bite you on the arse, all you have to do is wait.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

23 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

Theory in football .... good luck comes back to bite you on the arse, all you have to do is wait.

If it does I won’t being going on our opponents site moaning about it. At this level it’s all part of the game.

[den]

I’ve never liked winning or losing games to penalties or “ref/linesman” decisions.

There was one and a half hours to score goals. We did it twice through good play, Sunderland didn’t manage it at all. 
 

Tough. Maybe Sunderland weren’t good enough last night?

As for Rovers, I thought we were superb. So many young lads - it’s fantastic to see them coming through and doing a great job. Very happy with our display. It gives us hope.

[BigBar]

1 hour ago, RoversTilliDie said:

Tony Mowbray lost the plot the last 3rd of last Season. What a replacement JDT is turning out to be. With the team we've got we should be putting in a serious challenge for a top 6 finish. Dare we dare to dream of automatic after last Season. Hang your heads in shame those who gave JDT some stick first month of the Season.

Jury is still out on JDT. Did you see the games against Cardiff and Wigan this month alone. Boro was nearly another disaster but for a wonder save and last night was touch and go. Let's see where we are come the new year.

[The Mighty Chaffinch]

Winning every time we score first is a nice habit to have however I want to see us react positively to going behind and showing a bit more steel in that department. I still see a fragility that is a clear hangover from last season (specifically the second half of it!!!). We did well not to concede at 2-0 last night and what I saw from Sunderland in that 15 minute spell is the kind of urgency and incision I want to see from us when we fall behind. They didn’t have a goal scorer to capitalise on that intense pressure whereas we do have forwards who can find the net fairly regularly. That was the difference last night. We’ve ended the WLWL hoodoo, now for a rousing comeback after conceding first. My other thought on last night is the continued impression that Hedges is making on me. Putting aside the penalty that should have been, I thought his general contribution to the game was excellent. He seems to find space and has the ability to drive forward with the ball. Add a few more goals to his armoury and we’ve got a cracking player on our hands and one who I hope gets a seat on the plane to Qatar with Wales. Versatility is always welcomed in any squad. Given the performance of Brittain and Hedges I’d be tempted to stick with both of them on Saturday. Hard to predict JDT though, not so much a tombola, more a smorgasbord!  

[bluebruce]

Hmm, just watched the replays of the goals.

The first goal, I find it really hard to tell if it should have been a Sunderland penalty. My instinct at the time was he got the ball, though I was worried the ref would give it. I watched the replay back and said definitely a penalty. I watched it a bit more closely and (from the one angle I have, which is probably the best one they have but could do to be slowed down a bit) I'm finding it almost impossible to tell if we got the ball before, or simultaneously to the Sunderland player, or if his cut back was momentarily before the boot hit him. Whatever the truth, it was really close. The ball moves in a way that logically could have been from contact with either player.

The second goal, Wharton is 100% offside. I would point out that he can actually be seen trying to get back onside, but is pushed back into place by the Sunderland defender. Not sure what the letter of the law says about that, since the push probably wasn't enough to warrant a penalty, but it did impede his getting back onside. I imagine that technically it should have been disallowed.

[AllRoverAsia]

1 hour ago, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

If it does I won’t being going on our opponents site moaning about it. At this level it’s all part of the game.

I am not moaning or on our opponents site, I appreciate that is probably not what you meant.

The bit in bold ... is my belief that it all evens out given time ... and who knows what sort of game lady luck turns in ... and against whom.

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by AllRoverAsia

[CrouchingNunhiddenCucumber]

2 hours ago, RoversTilliDie said:

Tony Mowbray lost the plot the last 3rd of last Season. What a replacement JDT is turning out to be. With the team we've got we should be putting in a serious challenge for a top 6 finish. Dare we dare to dream of automatic after last Season. Hang your heads in shame those who gave JDT some stick first month of the Season.

I don't think its that cut and dry on JDT - as much as I want it to be. We've looked absolutely appalling at times this season and dare I say it generally had luck fall on our side across the season for the first time I can remember.

I think in reality the league is bang average this year and that's what has us in first place above any great tactical nous from JDT - but you know what, if the outcome is the same and we're in the top 6 at the end of the season who gives a flying fuck, could be great banter watching Haaland score 8 against us at the Etihad next year.. 

[AllRoverAsia]

Did anyone in a 'dark' country, meaning a country that did not transmit this game which was chosen for international coverage, manage to watch it on Rovers TV?

I gave up trying to find a match pass and used an alternative.

I did not use safc.com but I know that their in-house tv covered the game for such 'dark' places and that the full match and extended highlights are now on that site and viewable without the need even for registration.

Edited October 19, 2022 by AllRoverAsia

[Aqualung]

15 minutes ago, AllRoverAsia said:

Did anyone in a 'dark' country, meaning a country that did not transmit this game which was chosen for international coverage, manage to watch it on Rovers TV?

I have up trying to find a match pass and used an alternative.

I did not use safc.com but I know that their in-house tv covered the game for such 'dark' places and that the full match and extended highlights are now on that site and viewable without the need even for registration.

When I checked both the rovers tv and Sunderland TV sites there were no match passes available. Due to it being the main match on sky. However,the Sunderland site did offer the advice of using nowtv and the sky go app. 

And what really cheesed me off... The Middlesbrough match pass didn't show up for me until the day after the game!!!! 

Amatuers. 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

1 hour ago, AllRoverAsia said:

I am not moaning or on our opponents site, I appreciate that is probably not what you meant.

The bit in bold ... is my belief that it all evens out given time ... and who knows what sort of game lady luck turns in ... and against whom.

 

I wasn’t referring to you matey, I was referring to the Sunderland fan that came on here earlier.
 

I’m sure it does even out over time although their are occasions when you seem to get a run of one bad decision after another. I’ve long since concluded that off side rule is a shambles now and I just take the rough with the smooth.

Edited October 19, 2022 by Tyrone Shoelaces

[JHRover]

7 hours ago, rigger said:

I realise that the club have to be careful about pricing and not undercutting season ticket holders. But there are a lot of fans from outlying areas, with present situations such as rail strikes, could the club not put on transport to try to get people to go again. Even if it fails, it would be better than doing nothing and would show that at least the club is trying.

Absolutely they could. That is one easy, obvious option to try and boost numbers coming in from areas in the wider region. It isn't rocket science, go to many other Championship grounds and you'll see coach after bus after coach parked up outside the ground waiting to take people back to their towns and villages after the game. 

Waggott is aware of this- I've seen it raised at several fans forum meetings over the years and we get the customary 'will look into it' response yet 5 years into his tenure nothing has happened.

Why? Because it comes back to my original point - he isn't here to grow numbers, that is just a welcome outcome if it happens. He's here to cut costs and increase cash flow, so going to the hassle of arranging additional expense and transport costs to try to encourage more people to come just isn't on the agenda. Never has been, never will be. It would cost money and effort in the short term, wouldn't guarantee a return in the near future and therefore is of no use to him and his spreadsheets.

It's a dangerous game when you look at the demographic and economic changes in a town like Blackburn and consider the vast numbers of support we have in more distant areas - those people need building and growing - but it seems the Club has all but given up on doing that, it seems they are happy for those areas to be surrendered to rival clubs and instead focuses it's efforts to 1 double decker bus to collect children from Blackburn and give them free tickets. Nice idea and gets plenty of positive publicity but unlikely to make any noticeable difference to things. 

[Andy]

VAR gives that penalty decision every time, however I thought the ref got it right in real time.

The dramatic dive to the floor, after the minimal contact, is why it wasn't given - their lad can only blame himself.

And as for Wharton's, the linesman was directly in line with the players and he didn't feel it was offside. I've not seen it from his direct view, but I suspect the 2-man wall was just playing Wharton on.

Who cares, decisions were made and we got the win; onto Saturday we move.

[RoversTilliDie]

6 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

Brilliant to see us at the top of the league at any point, even if it is because we have played more games than most. Was an excellent result from an average performance in which Sunderland dominated big chunks but lacked their injured strikers and we benefitted from massive refereeing mistakes which we will take every day of the week. We made lots of stupid errors on the ball in the first half and struggled to manage the game in the second half but here was lots of determination and guts to get us over the line, aided by the referee and 2 bits of quality.

Kaminski made another great save and the stand out defender again was Hyam, not amazing on the ball and nearly cost us in the first half but reads the game very well and when we struggled to manage the game in the second half, inviting on pressure, he was the main man in the defensive wall stopping them. Wharton has not been at his best this season and made one or two mistakes again but he is a good defender. Carter is an upgrade on Phillips at the moment but not a Championship regular standard, clumsy on the ball and sometimes a little rash.

Brittain is not a left sider and Hedges is not a wing back and they contributed in making us a little disjointed simply by being out of position, as much as both are very competent players at this level. Hedges has loads going for him, superb skill to win the free kick and the ball in was excellent, and his shot at the end was so close to being goal of the season, but he was caught out a few times defensively because he is not a wing back. Brittain is a good player but he kept coming inside, the problem is that we don't have any adequate alternatives to him and Pickering really. Morton again impressed me, Garrett was tenacious and let no one down although wasn't man of the match which was awarded to him IMO because it was his debut rather than being stand out.

Brereton was man of the match, he ran himself into the ground to the point that I was worried about a potential injury, superb goal too. Gallagher was not particularly effective nor were the subs Vale and Dolan, and the fact that we were still solely reliant on Brereton on the counter attack tells you how they did.

The Dack and Szmodics situations naturally overlap because of their position, Szmodics runs round all day and really grafts, once he did really well to force Even if we were a really intense pressing side which we aren't, just running off the ball and trying your best isn't enough to become a good player, Elliott Bennett ran all day but he was shit, on the ball is at least as important (probably moreso) and the jury is still out on Szmodics in that regard. He has had occasional quality in a Rovers shirt (his 2 goals were well taken and his assist v Rotherham was excellent) but often he struggles to get on the ball and when he does, his decisions can be wrong or his technical ability can let him down. Yesterday he once did well to get to the byline in the first half and nearly forced an own goal but he also hit a shot nowhere near the target and chose to wrongly cross to Brereton (who did remarkably well to avoid a goal kick concession) in the second half, improvement is needed there to start every game. So a mixed bag from him.

I stand by the fact that Dack would offer more than any other sub last night, assuming he doesn't start. The social media stuff with his wife is not ideal but it's a woman made "famous" by reality TV and trying to promote a new show getting attention, the people sucking up to/arguing with her on there really do puzzle me, why you would spend your time doing that I have no idea. 

Lots of talk on here and elsewhere about the dislike of Mowbray and the potential booing and negative reaction, as expected it never materialised aside from one or two jovial "Mowbray, whats the score" chants.

They were a decent side Sunderland, like you said some refereeing decisions went our way, its usually the other way round on most occasions. Wouldn't be surprised to see Sunderland in the top 6 at the end of the season. Roberts is some player, hopefully Rovers will be in the top 6 with them.