v Wigan Athletic (h) - 6/2/23

[Exiled_Rover]

1 hour ago, rigger said:

I doubt that.

You doubt it, but you can't be sure - which is the point. 😉

[SIMON GARNERS 194]

A shit 1-1 on the cards.

13,100

[roverandout]

3 hours ago, JoeH said:

I find it funny that the suggestion is JDT see's Jack Vale as shit but plays him anyway. Obviously he see's something in him.

Vale's role in the team isn't really something we're privy to. If the manager keeps playing him, he's definitely happy with what he's doing. Within the system, as far as we know, he could be operating in the exact way the manager is asking him to. In fact, you'd have to bet 2p that he IS doing that, otherwise he'd be dropped. As for Dack, he gets chances from his late arrival into the box, but my view is that Vale's movement creates the space for those opportunities. I think the subtly of his game is perhaps being lost on certain viewers.

I accept people wanting more goals from Vale, but maybe let's see what he can do when he's actually given the right type of opportunities in front of goal. It's true that you create your own chances, but in this system I don't think the 9 has much of a place to. If he drops in too deep to pick up the ball people slag him off anyway! He's a clinical finisher and if you want goals out of him, get the ball into him in the box. The ball gravitates to Dack because everyone gets their head up and tries to find him, he's the experienced man who the other players trust. 

Drop Vale, that's fine, play Sam Gallagher. I don't think he's any better. I've never once seen someone argue that Vale is the second coming of Jesus Christ, I think some people just recognise that he is the best we have. He links play better than Sam Gallagher and I truly believe he is a better finisher. Regardless of who starts, I think we can do better. But that's something I'm confident they'll address next window.

Fucking hell. He plays him because we have no other options!!

[JPTSwindon]

Re: Vale. During the Brum replay Elliott Bennett was the co-commentator. He was very positive about Jack, scores loads in training etc. Maybe there is something that will click?

Wigan are pants but we always lose to them and any struggling club. 1-2.

[roversfan99]

He isnt going to say how shit he is though so id take it with a pinch of salt.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

I don't see why the theory has to be that Vale is doing things that us mere plebs cannot fathom or understand.

 

I didn't mean it like that at all. Someone asked the question as to what professionals in the game might be seeing that the average fan (who shouldn't be expected to go into major tactical detail about football) might not be looking for.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Sparks Rover said:

I agree, all those peasants don't understand do they Joe? 🤷‍♂️

It wasn't meant like that at all, and of course the first opportunity you get to attack my character rather than my argument, in you come. You can't stand my profession... and I don't know why. I wasn't in any way trying to say it was something only I could understand. It was in response to people asking about what professionals are seeing that the average fan isn't.

Edited February 5, 2023 by JoeH

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Inferi said:

Maybe JDT picks Vale sometimes because he tries to increase his value. 

Whilst I am happy to go into this line of thought, my base response to this is a manager would simply never make that decision - not with their own career on the line.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, roverandout said:

Fucking hell. He plays him because we have no other options!!

Calm down, this debate began with you saying "end of discussion" before the discussion had even begun and it's ending with unnecessary language. I'm as emotional about Rovers as the next person but it's just a healthy debate.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

As far as I can see every time he plays his value goes down not up.

[Guest]

Just now, Tyrone Shoelaces said:

As far as I can see every time he plays his value goes down not up.

Could be true. Rovers turned down a 7-figure offer for Vale just under two years ago from a Premier League club. Perhaps in hindsight we'd have been wise to take the cash. 

[AllRoverAsia]

We have, allegedly, for several seasons been looking to sign new strikers.

That is for a reason.

The ones we have are not considered, by our recruitment team, DoF and manager, good enough for the Championship, at least currently.

Until we learn how to press "send" on a laptop we will have to play the cards we have, even if they are all Jokers.

[joey_big_nose]

38 minutes ago, JoeH said:

Could be true. Rovers turned down a 7-figure offer for Vale just under two years ago from a Premier League club. Perhaps in hindsight we'd have been wise to take the cash. 

Wow - really? Who was that from? 

I guess with Vale the issue is he hasn't even taken any decent shots, let alone scored goals. He's played a good amount of minutes. If he was at least getting the chances there would be some hope, but it isn't happening. He goes through games and barely threatens the goal.

We were also actively trying to sign an established striker in Undav and Kone so it's seems to me the manager doesn't fancy Vale or Gallagher either (which based on the evidence seems entirely reasonable!) at least for now. So now we find ourselves in the position where we have three options really

1 - Vale up front

2 - Gallagher up front

3 - Go back to false 9 with Dack or Dolan in there

For me all of them are really really unsatisfactory. It's such a shame as if we had a really decent central striker I could see the team push on. Would create opportunities for all the other players if the opposition worried about who we had through the middle.

[roversfan99]

We could go with Brereton up top, an actual goal threat who can run in behind and hold the ball up.

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, roversfan99 said:

We could go with Brereton up top, an actual goal threat who can run in behind and hold the ball up.

Worth trying for sure

[Exiled_Rover]

2 hours ago, JoeH said:

Whilst I am happy to go into this line of thought, my base response to this is a manager would simply never make that decision - not with their own career on the line.

Just out of interest (I've picked a random answer of yours to quote): how much better do you think Vale is than Leonard? Both now and potentially. 

He seems to be the next cab off the rank, so I'm curious if we simply have no strikers in the Academy or not. 

[speeeeeeedie]

Thanks to ESPN I'll be watching tomorrow. Rovers haven't had much luck against Wigan over the years. I've seen some abject performances going back to Ince's demise. 

I have no idea what Rovers team will turn up, hopefully the good one.

To add to the striker debate; Gallagher's goal scoring average for Rovers is 1 goal every 5 games. That's not good enough for a forward player. His size makes him out to be a target man, but he is rarely played there. He works extremely hard, but is missing something. 

I've not seen much of Vale, but from what I've seen so far he has a long way to go. 

[Mattyblue]

The Academy seems to struggle to get any striker cabs moving off said rank….

[ben_the_beast]

Feel like this is a huge game for us with the mess of a transfer window and the bad taste it's left. We need a win desperately. A bad run of form could see a real negativity Sweep through the club. That's never good regardless of its justification. 

The squad needed strengthening, it feels unlikely that it's capable of the playoffs, but we're still in a strong league position. To quote Souness, you can only wee with the willy you're given, so hopefully we can get a win and a bit of momentum. 

[roverandout]

11 hours ago, JoeH said:

Calm down, this debate began with you saying "end of discussion" before the discussion had even begun and it's ending with unnecessary language. I'm as emotional about Rovers as the next person but it's just a healthy debate.

Maybe I was too overheated 

[goozburger]

10 hours ago, roversfan99 said:

We could go with Brereton up top, an actual goal threat who can run in behind and hold the ball up.

It's worth a punt because Brereton Diaz is a proven goalscorer. Yet, neither Rovers nor Chile have played him in that position on a regular basis, and I can't see that changing anytime soon despite our limited options up front.

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

5 minutes ago, goozburger said:

It's worth a punt because Brereton Diaz is a proven goalscorer. Yet, neither Rovers nor Chile have played him in that position on a regular basis, and I can't see that changing anytime soon despite our limited options up front.

It doesn’t really suit his skill set and previously we would have lost his input running from deep with the ball. Having said that now we have Thomas to do that maybe it’s time to try him there given our lack of other options.

[AllRoverAsia]

Thomas crosses low and fast. Get Dack up the field and into the box every time Thomas makes a run. Same applies on freekicks. At least Dack has natural instinct to read play and get on the end of such a cross.

[arbitro]

As of this morning Wigan have sold around 2,500 tickets.

[Mattyblue]

New manager pique of excitement, imagine it would’ve been c1k with Toure.

Edited February 6, 2023 by Mattyblue