Blackburn End: Waggott Out

[Mattyblue]

On strikers his record’s been poor, no question about that.

That aside his signings and contract renewals have been anything but bullshit from where I’m looking.

Edited December 6, 2023 by Mattyblue

[islander200]

54 minutes ago, Mattyblue said:

On strikers his record’s been poor, no question about that.

That aside his signings and contract renewals have been anything but bullshit from where I’m looking.

And even with the striker situation hard to find a decent one with the crumbs he has for a budget.

 

[roverblue]

Thanks Glen for putting the notes out from the meeting, it's a depressing read.

It's a pity that it doesnt get more widely reported on by the LET as there is some real eye openers in there for us fans.

I feel taken advantage of as a season ticket holder after reading the responses. If the club has zero ambition why should I be forking out £400 to basically watch the u21s develop for the next few seasons.

It is obvious with the Venkys financial issues there is no plan and we are on the road to nowhere despite being a few players short of maybe getting into the playoffs.

[SuperBrfc]

2 hours ago, Mattyblue said:

On strikers his record’s been poor, no question about that.

That aside his signings and contract renewals have been anything but bullshit from where I’m looking.

Something that hasn't been picked up on, from what I can see, is point 9 made by Glen in his update:

It was noted that Hyam, Smodzics etc were scouted prior to the new Management set up and have been a success in terms of purchase price, but also the previous recruitment team.

Unless I've got it wrong, the credit for signings of Hyam, Brittain and Szmodics can't exactly be put at GB's door. This is the work of the previous recruitment team, that he has seemingly made use of.

Broughton, imo, is in above his head, and the signings of Mola, Hirst, Telalovic and Ennis are more reflective of his 'talent' spotting ability.

[Mattyblue]

I’d take that with a pinch of salt. Seems a fair bit of politics go on between Swag and GB… and considering his track record of BS; the bus and the lies about bulldozing Brockhall are two that immediately spring to mind, make it two pinches.

Edited December 6, 2023 by Mattyblue

[wilsdenrover]

1 hour ago, Mattyblue said:

I’d take that with a pinch of salt. Seems a fair bit of politics go on between Swag and GB… and considering his track record of BS; the bus and the lies about bulldozing Brockhall are two that immediately spring to mind, make it two pinches.

[simongarnerisgod]

1 hour ago, SuperBrfc said:

Broughton, imo, is in above his head, and the signings of Mola, Hirst, Telalovic and Ennis are more reflective of his 'talent' spotting ability.

the signing of telalovic was desperate indeed,blindingly obvious that our recruitement team were on the phone to every agent in europe in a blind panic,not the lads fault but you can`t expect someone from the german regional leagues to make an impact in the second tier of english football,in a league known for it`s intensity,it`s clear that jdt won`t pick him because he`s not ready,at 23 you should be playing 1st team football,he`s not because he`s not up this level

[glen9mullan]

1 hour ago, SuperBrfc said:

Something that hasn't been picked up on, from what I can see, is point 9 made by Glen in his update:

It was noted that Hyam, Smodzics etc were scouted prior to the new Management set up and have been a success in terms of purchase price, but also the previous recruitment team.

Unless I've got it wrong, the credit for signings of Hyam, Brittain and Szmodics can't exactly be put at GB's door. This is the work of the previous recruitment team, that he has seemingly made use of.

Broughton, imo, is in above his head, and the signings of Mola, Hirst, Telalovic and Ennis are more reflective of his 'talent' spotting ability.

I wil add, that GB took some convincing that Smodzics would be a decent capture and was very much against the idea. However given the leg work which had gone in, and the lack of a real target list (hadn't been here long enough to impact one) it was decided Hyam , Britain and Smodzics would be signed.

January's window was a shambles for different reasons,

Whilst this summers window was handicapped by the Venkys,

So it's very difficult to judge a proper window for Broughton , as for one  reason or another it has handicapped the outcome 

Edited December 6, 2023 by glen9mullan

[tomphil]

1 hour ago, SuperBrfc said:

Something that hasn't been picked up on, from what I can see, is point 9 made by Glen in his update:

It was noted that Hyam, Smodzics etc were scouted prior to the new Management set up and have been a success in terms of purchase price, but also the previous recruitment team.

Unless I've got it wrong, the credit for signings of Hyam, Brittain and Szmodics can't exactly be put at GB's door. This is the work of the previous recruitment team, that he has seemingly made use of.

Broughton, imo, is in above his head, and the signings of Mola, Hirst, Telalovic and Ennis are more reflective of his 'talent' spotting ability.

I may be wrong but i'm sure i read a while ago that Brittain was on the previous lots radar as well.

Although as with the Hyam and Szmods signings it's GB who has got the deals done surely ?

Edited December 6, 2023 by tomphil

[SuperBrfc]

14 minutes ago, simongarnerisgod said:

the signing of telalovic was desperate indeed,blindingly obvious that our recruitement team were on the phone to every agent in europe in a blind panic,not the lads fault but you can`t expect someone from the german regional leagues to make an impact in the second tier of english football,in a league known for it`s intensity,it`s clear that jdt won`t pick him because he`s not ready,at 23 you should be playing 1st team football,he`s not because he`s not up this level

Telalovic and Ennis are both desperate signings. Neither are of the standard required for this club.

I've seen a few say, Chaddy being one, that a lot of scouting and effort has gone into signing Telalovic. I'm not of that opinion.

Telalovic is represented by the same agency as Kaminiski, Wahlstedt and JDT himself. Yet JDT doesn't seem to rate him? Smacks of a last minute panic signing to me. Not one to try and big up Broughton or the recruitment team for looking far and wide.

[tomphil]

It smacks of relying on agents again to conjure something up because the scouting has failed.

 

Edited December 6, 2023 by tomphil

[simongarnerisgod]

2 minutes ago, SuperBrfc said:

elalovic and Ennis are both desperate signings. Neither are of the standard required for this club.

i think ennis is pretty good when he`s not injured,unfortunately he`s injured permanently,which renders it a poor signing,**** all research went into that one,well done greg and his merry team

[islander200]

4 minutes ago, SuperBrfc said:

Telalovic and Ennis are both desperate signings. Neither are of the standard required for this club.

I've seen a few say, Chaddy being one, that a lot of scouting and effort has gone into signing Telalovic. I'm not of that opinion.

Telalovic is represented by the same agency as Kaminiski, Wahlstedt and JDT himself. Yet JDT doesn't seem to rate him? Smacks of a last minute panic signing to me. Not one to try and big up Broughton or the recruitment team for looking far and wide.

Look at the budget he had?

Where are these director of football that get the majority of their signings right with the budget we have?

Ennis was on the back of a very good season and at the time he was signed our budget hadn't been cut.

Telalovic was quite clearly a development signing , if he had the money to bring in proven quality then that's what they would have gone for.And maybe with some time he will come good, Tronsted was being used as a stick to beat Broughton with earlier in the season and over the last couple of month he has probably been one of our most important players.

Hill and Moran so far have looked excellent loan signings.

Wahlstedt has looked iffy for me but at the same time we weren't the only club interested and he made his international debut the previous January so he must have been showing something.

Our business under him hasn't been perfect but I find it incredibly harsh to read he is out of his depth being said with such certainty with the circumstances and budget he works under. 

Also if it was him who identified and chose JDT then he deserves big credit for that , he has also got nearly every member of the first team squad signed onto longer deals.

 

[glen9mullan]

17 minutes ago, islander200 said:

Look at the budget he had?

Where are these director of football that get the majority of their signings right with the budget we have?

Ennis was on the back of a very good season and at the time he was signed our budget hadn't been cut.

Telalovic was quite clearly a development signing , if he had the money to bring in proven quality then that's what they would have gone for.And maybe with some time he will come good, Tronsted was being used as a stick to beat Broughton with earlier in the season and over the last couple of month he has probably been one of our most important players.

Hill and Moran so far have looked excellent loan signings.

Wahlstedt has looked iffy for me but at the same time we weren't the only club interested and he made his international debut the previous January so he must have been showing something.

Our business under him hasn't been perfect but I find it incredibly harsh to read he is out of his depth being said with such certainty with the circumstances and budget he works under. 

Also if it was him who identified and chose JDT then he deserves big credit for that , he has also got nearly every member of the first team squad signed onto longer deals.

 

JDT was identified prior to GB, though he was involved interview process.

It would of been impossible to have his own target list that first window, I don't think anyone could. He relied on 12 months of scouting previously which had included January enquiries prior to his arrival on Hyam and Brittain.

Smodzics again was a long time in the working by the previous recruitment team.

January,  he simply got it wrong.

This summer his list had to be ripped up at the 11th hour.

Hill , Tronstad and Moran have been decent additions. 

The others very suspect, but have cost buttons.

Our plight sits with loons in Pune.

This quantity over quality is a direct result of being potless. I'm sure GB be as cheesed as us tbh

Edited December 6, 2023 by glen9mullan

[DE.]

Not sure you can really describe a lad who turns 24 this month as a development signing tbh. 

[TugaysMarlboro]

I don't get this dislike for Broughton amongst quarters.

 

If memory serves, it wasn't even Waggott who hired him, it was an agency. So I'm sure there's sour grapes on that front with him not being a 'mate'.

 

We also have Broughton to thank for JDT, we were nowhere near a managerial appointment before his arrival.

 

 

With the limited time he had and a partial recruitment team already in place, if certain targets met what the new management team were looking for - prior to their arrival, then why not sign them? The 3 examples above haven't harmed.

Tronstad is starting to look like a good foil in midfield, I'll concede that Sigurdsson needs to show more as does Ennis if he's ever fit and Telalovic is a stab in the dark. All the while working with one arm behind his back this summer seemingly and his second arm being prepared for this winter.

He does have a red spot for me on the O'Brien front.

He does however seem ambitious, just like our manager.

 

Waggott on the other hand is seemingly happy to plod on and toe the Venky line. Does he have or show much passion for the club? Does working for Venkys inspire him? The answer to both is likely no, yet he's happy to pick up the wage.

I get plenty of marketing emails telling me about half season tickets (although not the Watford game for some bizzare reason) but nothing that comes out of his mouth makes me think we'll ever find ourselves in the Premier League again, so as someone else above has alluded to, why part with my cash?

 

The biggest problems, lie above both Broughton and Waggott. Sadly it seems like they've no intention of selling us or giving a fuck.

Edited December 6, 2023 by TugaysMarlboro

[SuperBrfc]

1 hour ago, glen9mullan said:

I wil add, that GB took some convincing that Smodzics would be a decent capture and was very much against the idea. However given the leg work which had gone in, and the lack of a real target list (hadn't been here long enough to impact one) it was decided Hyam , Britain and Smodzics would be signed.

Thanks for the added info, Glen. My post was in response to those three being used as examples of his signings coming good. The scouting legwork had been done previously, before he arrived.

True, he concluded the deals, but I don't think it's right to credit him for those signings. Hill looks a very good signing, as does Moran, so fair play there. But it's truly desperate stuff upfront, imo.

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

I may be wrong but i'm sure i read a while ago that Brittain was on the previous lots radar as well.

Although as with the Hyam and Szmods signings it's GB who has got the deals done surely ?

Yeah, that's what I read too regarding Brittain.

1 hour ago, tomphil said:

It smacks of relying on agents again to conjure something up because the scouting has failed.

 

Exactly. The dominant theme of the last 13 years.

[SuperBrfc]

1 hour ago, islander200 said:

Look at the budget he had?

Where are these director of football that get the majority of their signings right with the budget we have?

Ennis was on the back of a very good season and at the time he was signed our budget hadn't been cut.

Telalovic was quite clearly a development signing , if he had the money to bring in proven quality then that's what they would have gone for.And maybe with some time he will come good, Tronsted was being used as a stick to beat Broughton with earlier in the season and over the last couple of month he has probably been one of our most important players.

Hill and Moran so far have looked excellent loan signings.

But that's just it, islander. He isn't a Director of Football. He never has been previously. Yet has been put in that role here. A role that is above him, imo.

An actual Director of Football comes up with better than Hirst, Telalovic and Ennis, in my view. That's even with our lowly budget.

[Andy]

1 hour ago, glen9mullan said:

JDT was identified prior to GB, though he was involved interview process.

That's interesting; I'm positive that GB has publicly stated that the club was heading in a completely different direction (eg an Ainsworth) until he caught JDT just as he was preparing to accept another European offer.

I'll try and dig something out, sure I've read this online - but the implication was that GB was solely responsible for bringing JDT to the club.

Overall though, depressing read (the meeting with SW). Just existing in the Championship benefits nobody.
Venky's lose money, no player or manager with any ambition would look at us and the fans have nothing to be optimistic about.

We really do need fans in key parts of the club; people who give a shit and want the best for the club.
Whatever the next stage of the club looks like, this has to be a priority.

[glen9mullan]

4 minutes ago, Andy said:

That's interesting; I'm positive that GB has publicly stated that the club was heading in a completely different direction (eg an Ainsworth) until he caught JDT just as he was preparing to accept another European offer.

I'll try and dig something out, sure I've read this online - but the implication was that GB was solely responsible for bringing JDT to the club.

Overall though, depressing read (the meeting with SW). Just existing in the Championship benefits nobody.
Venky's lose money, no player or manager with any ambition would look at us and the fans have nothing to be optimistic about.

We really do need fans in key parts of the club; people who give a shit and want the best for the club.
Whatever the next stage of the club looks like, this has to be a priority.

Just repeating what SWAG said, 

I didn't think we learned an awful lot more tbh, than what we already knew and what was publicly said by Waggott and GB regarding the lack of expectations on JDT in September.

The India issue is also well reported.

Putting decent transfer kitty's in, has been lacking for a number of seasons.

Until the route cause leaves, the club can't truly push on.

Everyone from top to bottom are literally on survival mode, balancing the books.

That dare to dream , and rovers does not go together.

It's been depressing since the V's came and its going to take a hell of a lot of work for Rovers to get back to the position they were in 12 years ago.

 

Edited December 6, 2023 by glen9mullan

[AllRoverAsia]

Reading this hasn't done my mental health any favours. I should know better.

[martonrover]

2 hours ago, islander200 said:

Telalovic was quite clearly a development signing

So why the social media fanfare and the cringeful paper throwing video?
He was a desperation signing from a middle ranking civil servant, I mean Director of Football, who was still removing the last pieces of egg from his face after January 31st.

[simongarnerisgod]

8 minutes ago, martonrover said:

So why the social media fanfare and the cringeful paper throwing video?
He was a desperation signing from a middle ranking civil servant, I mean Director of Football, who was still removing the last pieces of egg from his face after January 31st.

add clinton mola,george hirst and the lewis o`brien fiasco and you have broughtons level

[J*B]

I don’t think there’s too much to be read into the Brittain, Hyam and Szmodics successes of life before GB vs. the Mola, Hirsts, Telovic failures of life after GB. 

The reality is the three previously were proven championship players which we’ve spent legitimate budget on. It doesn’t take a genius to be quietly confident their form would continue here.

GB has had the luxury of time, but hasn’t had the luxury of money. His signings when he did have budget - Moran, Ennis, Tronstad and Sigurddson look like good ones, Ennis obviously has injury issues but from what I’ve seen when he is on the pitch he looks as good as any other striker we have and in my opinion was brought in as back up to a main striker pre funding cutbacks from Venkys. 

[roversfan99]

To be fair, even if it was pre budget cuts, and based on this assumption that he came as a back up, Ennis simply shouldnt have been signed. The very fleeting appearances he made had flickers of promise but with continued absence perhaps make him seem better than he actually is. His injury issues make him totally pointless and he certainly cant be seen as a "good one."

But its very difficult to really judge Broughton. Its not as clear cut as with Waggott as to whether he is out of his depth, but like with Waggott, the problem doesnt lie here. Any DOF would struggle to work under these conditions. Its not only the budget cuts which are beyond uncompetitive. We couldnt even afford an extra loan as a body for when Buckley left. Its the fact that everyone seems to be totally in the dark as to what is happening and if and when these vague issues will ease/go away. Its the fact that Venkys occasionally stick their nose in and make random decisions which have long term ramifications, ie turning down a considerable bid for Brereton with a year left.

Edited December 7, 2023 by roversfan99